Omni said:
Stardust1138 said:
StarkillerAG said:
Stardust1138 said:
BedeHistory731 said:
I’m in the Bionicle fandom, so I’ve learned to be reticent to demand all the answers from the creators about things they probably never even considered too deeply. Too many people pestered Greg Farshtey (Bionicle’s head writer) for answers about characters’ appearances during the canon contests.
Creators don’t owe you all the answers to minutia.
Exactly. They don’t owe you anything in general. This is where we are alike in slightly differing ways.
George said it best:
“I make my movies for myself. People will say, “When you release it, it belongs to the public.” No, it’s mine. I’m leasing it to you. $10 at a time. It still belongs to me.”
Sorry if this sounds a bit too interrogative, Stardust, but I’ve been wondering: What are your opinions on the original theatrical versions? Because with both your love of George Lucas, and with your recent talk about creators not owing audiences anything, it sounds like you’d be fine with the Special Editions being the only versions available. It’s fine if you are, I’m not trying to shame you, but it feels a bit weird on a site devoted to releasing the original versions. Maybe I’m completely wrong, though.
I’ve really avoided giving my opinion on this for a long, long time but I’ll take the bait.
My opinion is simply that if George approves then I’d be more than happy to have them like when he gives his blessing towards the Academy to show A New Hope at their museum’s cinema. I’d love seeing the Original Trilogy unaltered again as I grew up with it that way too as they were the versions that my dad’s friend burnt me copies of on tape if I recall correctly. I genuinely appreciate the dedication of everyone who works to capture the feeling of what they feel Star Wars was when they first saw it with their various versions but at the end of the day I think only George himself can decide what it truly means.
It’s not ours to tamper with and it’s the artist who gets to choose what they wish us to view. They have a reason for alterations. I think trying to understand why is a more interesting question than asking what were they thinking. I also don’t see the level of distain towards George to be all that productive or fair. I mean other artists have changed their work but I rarely see the level of vicious hate George gets thrown at them. I mean he made changes and a trilogy you may not enjoy as much as the original unaltered or otherwise three films but maybe it’s better to understand him and his intentions if you’re still going to devote time to Star Wars.
However I suppose that’s not neccessary anymore since Disney owns it now and it has run off into a different direction than what it means to him but it may help with viewing his films as Episodes I-VI. Star Wars was always very personal to him. He was what he wrote and he was very concerned about being responsible with what he said in his films. It’s why he made certain changes like cutting back frames with the Imperial Bridge Officers getting shot or having Greedo shoot first or even limiting blood shown in the later films. It may not be something fans as they’re older think about in this way as we really or hopefully know the difference between right and wrong but he was thinking about the current generation children viewing them but also the children that will be here after we’re gone. He’s a futurist and forward thinker. These films are for children but can be enjoyed by all ages.
[…]
Ulimately trying to alter it to how we wish to see it might be personal to us but we should also try thinking about it from the other side too. It’s not always about us the fans as much as I think we’d like it to be. I’ll never discourage anyone from watching the films how they intend or desire to but truly remember at the same time I think that George Lucas Is Star Wars.
[…]
I’m sorry Stardust, but this is all crazy to me. I’m a huge fan of George’s the biggest amongst my group of friends by far. I love all of his movies to varying degrees and in particular his writing. But as his fan - and I know you are one, too - you have to respect George more. Not current age George, but 1977 George. And 1980 George. And 1983 George too. They were just as amazing, if not more, than 1997, 2004 or 2011 George.
He called all the shots in the original movie and he did everything he could at the time, but he saw it as completely fit for release and proudly put it out. The movie was always meant to be for children, and none of them got upset at seeing 10 extra frames of imperial officers getting hit or Han shooting Greedo. That scene was straight out of old westerns Lucas saw as a child and you and I will both agree he turned out alright, even seeing that. Which is why he made something similar for the children of that time and it’s still just as effective.
I don’t think the SE is a travesty of any sorts at all. The absurdity is the fact that current age George does not respect his past self, a guy who made one of the best trilogies ever made. And honestly that’s very normal. Most Lennon interviews from the 1970s have him trashing on his Beatles work, or dismissing all or most of it as shit, even songs he was proud of like Strawberry Fields. It’s how artists are. But where most of them respect where their minds were at when they made the movie/album or whatever, George doesn’t.
When you dive into his psyche a little more with stuff like Skywalking or even more surface-level stuff like Rinzler’s books, you get a good sense of why he’s more like that than others. But it’s no excuse to supress his past self’s work and obviously many others as well. The SE should always, on every occasion, be presented as an extra next to the movies that 70s and 80s George made. Those are the hit movies, those are the acclaimed movies.
You make some valid points. I really want to read Jonathan Rinzler’s books. I actually bought both books for A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back last year but unfortunately they came damaged. I had to send them back. I’m definitely going to try again buying them but first I want to get The Ingmar Bergman Archives book from Taschen since it’s out of print.
I think where we differ is that I truly don’t think George changed all that much. I think the difference between where we see him at with making the Original Trilogy and the Prequel Trilogy comes down to the technology. He had to reel himself in more so with the Original Trilogy as he couldn’t possibly make everything he dreamed of achieving.
https://youtu.be/aOknduJ6Rmk
This video with Jonathan Rinzler and Pablo Hidalgo really shows how much the initial idea of THX 1138 and ulimately Star Wars has lots of seeds to what came about in the Prequels. However like all stories they evolve and grow but I think George’s stories in particular always dealt with the same core issues. You can see a lot of parallels between THX 1138 and American Graffiti with Attack of the Clones for example. He’s also always loved history and anthropology. You can see these things in all of his films.
I also would say I think George is more of a forward thinker. He’s not really one to bath himself in self praise. He doesn’t believe his own hype or at least let it get to his head. I’m sure he’s very proud of the work he did on the Original Trilogy but it was also a turbulent time in his life as he also had to set up Lucasfilm and contend with both The Empire Strikes Back going over budget when he was self financing himself and Richard Marquand’s limited experience in special effects forcing him to be on set more for Return of the Jedi than he wanted. Add all of this with the fact that his first marriage started to fall apart when Return of the Jedi was being made. He said in one interview he considers it to be the greatest failure of his life that things fell apart and in another Biography Channel special it was said that it caused him a seven year tail spin of deep depression. It’s also related in Howard Kazanjian’s book that Marcia always wanted to go to the Academy Awards but George didn’t want to. So she went with Howard and his wife. He also refused to take a writing credit on Return of the Jedi until Howard convinced him to as he doesn’t like taking too many credits. So I’m sure George is very proud of the achievements he had with the Original Trilogy but at the same time I don’t think he likes to sit around and think about achievements or I assume that time in his life too much. He’s always about what he can do next to push the medium of storytelling forward. That’s where his interests lie. I’ve started to read The Star Wars Archives: Episodes I-III and it really shows that. He really lights up when he’s talking about the Whills, Midi-Chlorians, and pushing storytelling forward. The heart of telling stories is always the most important thing to him. He never lost sight of that but he knew even before the Prequels came out that he was making films some fans wouldn’t like. He’s very self aware I think of why some fans don’t like the Prequels but that’s not important to him as he makes the films for himself as any truly great artist does. He wants to tell stories but expand the canvas that can tell them. He’s always tried pushing boundaries of what was possible for the time but the technology is a tool to him. He actually doesn’t even like technology that much.
It’s what I feel is missing in Disney Star Wars. The abilities of the creators to understand core contexts of George’s work but to not feel beholden to it at the same time. Yet also push the medium forward at the same time. Unfortunately I don’t see that as a lesson they’ll be learning anytime soon. They seem to on the technology side with The Mandalorian but story needs to come next in my opinion.
I’ll vouch for the Special Editions being the definitive way George wanted Star Wars to be viewed. This doesn’t mean I personally agree or like every change but I respect the artist. It’s like if I wrote a story I worked on with my own personal time for over thirty years. I made a successful first book but I didn’t feel I could deliver what my fans expect of me so I sold it with story treatments for the second and third story. The company decided they didn’t want to use my story. I’d take that personally as I devoted myself and nearly all my life to it. I think that’s how George must feel to some degree. He feels personally slighted that some don’t like what he did. The Special Editions like everything he did were personal to him and weaved together a tale that was as much personal as it was a way to tell entertaining stories. He was what he made and even changed. It’s interesting Ben Burtt said that George told him he would want to go back and change things right after A New Hope came out. So he was always wanting to go back. It may not be what we would do in his shoes but I do think we’d feel personally attacked if a company or someone else tried to take away authorship of our work we evolved over the course of years.
I would also add that kids may not have a problem with the Imperial Bridge Officers or even Han shooting first but that’s because they’re not conditioned to think this way. Kids are less ridged in their thinking than adults. They take things at face value more than we do. We become more narrow minded as we get older but for George it was a matter of what a kid could draw upon and the psychological effects it could have on them growing up as they tend to act out everything they love. I know my buddies and I would play chop each other’s heads off like Anakin does Dooku when we’d lightsaber fight. We weren’t thinking of the context and awfulness of it. I can see where George countered this now though by showing Anakin being burnt by lava to show the consequences of what doing terrible things leads to in the long run. Subconsciously I think we know but we’re still developing that mind as a kid. The changes though were to trim things to not glorify violence. That’s how he saw it and may seem contradictory. He was looking out for making sure kids were protected from becoming as to him anyone can do evil things. His stories are about the choices we have. I can see why he’d feel the way he does about Han shooting first as I admit I never liked Han much before The Force Awakens but I do wonder how my perception would’ve been if I saw things the way George envisions now with Greedo shooting first and saying “Maclunkey”. I can absolutely also see why these changes are problematical to some. There’s a couple of changes I like for example but think could be better executed. It’s all a matter of prospective.
In the end though he took things to heart by giving fans what he thought they’d want with a new chapter in the Disney era and because he assumed his legacy would be protected. He’s not a big fan of the Sequels but he does seem to be more or less at peace with everything else. He also does seem to have taken the high road when he’s around Kathleen Kennedy and everyone else with Disney. He knows the story has to grow beyond him but I’m sure it doesn’t make it any easier. It’s a lesson though I try to take to heart with the Sequels and the other Disney era content I don’t like. It’s not my Star Wars anymore but it is for someone. I suppose as well what Star Wars was always trying to teach us the whole time is we have to let go and act on instinct at some point. I’m taking that lesson step by step. Maybe one day I will fully.
I truly do understand why it can be personal to so many to have the unaltered Original Trilogy. I hope they get an official release but there’s always another side to the story that doesn’t get looked at nearly enough I feel when these things and Star Wars in general are discussed.