The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released) — Page 96

There wouldn’t be confusion if you have a sentence in the crawl. The Mustafar minute raises more questions when you watch the movie with its crawl since it is so rushed without any narrative.

If you have a sentence at the end of the crawl that says Kylo obtained the thing to lead him to a place is far less confusing then what is presented in the movie as is.

Did the original movie cause confusion when it said the rebellion obtained the plans to the Death Star and then see a ship being chased? Was the audience like "How did they get it? What are the Death Star Plans? How hard was it?

No, we didn’t. Why? We got a simple explanation. The Mustafar minute, without any real context or good explanation still is just a lot of stuff happening. It would be better if there was more deleted scene stuff to help it out … but I don’t know if we will get it to help add to it.

The removal of it is an eloquent solution, personally.

jarbear said:

There wouldn’t be confusion if you have a sentence in the crawl. The Mustafar minute raises more questions when you watch the movie with its crawl since it is so rushed without any narrative.

If you have a sentence at the end of the crawl that says Kylo obtained the thing to lead him to a place is far less confusing then what is presented in the movie as is.

Did the original movie cause confusion when it said the rebellion obtained the plans to the Death Star and then see a ship being chased? Was the audience like "How did they get it? What are the Death Star Plans? How hard was it?

No, we didn’t. Why? We got a simple explanation. The Mustafar minute, without any real context or good explanation still is just a lot of stuff happening. It would be better if there was more deleted scene stuff to help it out … but I don’t know if we will get it to help add to it.

The removal of it is an eloquent solution, personally.

To be technical an entire movie was made around that part of ANH’s crawl… maybe we’ll get an entire Mustafar movie from our crawl lol

Oh my God, you guys, how much do you expect me to be able to read during the cracks in my day? lol

I could only skim the last THREE pages for the moment, but I guess I’m of three minds about Mustafar.

I really don’t mind the film as it is, as we get a sense of “Ah, he’s chasing a thing to get to a place but they aren’t stopping to tell us about it because we infer what we need to know.”

I am okay with adding other shots to the Mustafar scene because people feel that it would be a good idea, provided it comes across well and fits in.

Since I like Mustafar just fine, I’m reluctant to remove it completely, but there’s a solid point to doing that, since it’s been eviscerated of the meat that we know was originally there.

Poppasketti, would a pan UP from the crawl fit better? The camera would then continue to to go up to follow the TIE, rather than changing directions. I wonder if another second or two could pass before his TIE enters frame, too. But that’s some good work, per usual.

I know other things were brought up, too, but I only have a couple minutes. I don’t particularly care to rescore Han or Leia’s moments on the Death Star, personally. John Williams is the best part of TROS.

I agree with Nev. The fundamental issue that underlines this film is that the treasure is found before the heroes even go on the treasure hunt, effectively killing all mystery and tension in the film. The reveal of the fleet rising from beneath the surface should have been saved for later on in the film, as well as Kylo finding Palpatine. In my view there needs to be a restructure of the film where palpatine’s broadcast initiates a race to Exogol between The First Order and the Resistance, with Kylo getting there first.

Palpatine and/or the Wayfinder would need to be included in the crawl.

I think this movie just fundamentally failed at “show don’t tell…” it would appear whatever route we take we’re going to have to use exposition in the crawl (I guess that is what all crawls tho).

jonh said:

idir_hh said:

I agree with Nev. The fundamental issue that underlines this film is that the treasure is found before the heroes even go on the treasure hunt, effectively killing all mystery and tension in the film. The reveal of the fleet rising from beneath the surface should have been saved for later on in the film, as well as Kylo finding Palpatine. In my view there needs to be a restructure of the film where palpatine’s broadcast initiates a race to Exogol between The First Order and the Resistance, with Kylo getting there first.

🙄🙄 if there was an opening in which the wayfinder was in coruscant, that would be great !!!hahahh

Maybe we can put our collective powers together and just recreate Episode IX: Duel of the Fates hahha

smpearce1981 said:

stevepaynter said:

Man, hard too keep up on the discussion, but I’m with Dominic on this on. It would be a damn shame to lose that musical score when Kylo is flying through the Nebula. I think it’s need to be established that Exogel is completely hidden planet early on and the Wayfinder needs to show the audience how Kylo found it.

Here’s an excerpt from a hypothetical piece of crawl to compensate:-

Meanwhile, Supreme Leader KYLO REN journeys to the hidden Sith homeworld, EXOGOL using an ancient artifact that once belonged to his grandfather DARTH VADER, as he searches for an emergent presence in the force that whispers of forging a dark alliance…

Doesn’t have to verbatim, but you get the jist?

If an edit was to use Mustafar, Hal’s (+ plus a few edits) latest crawl is perfect, it explains the where and the why pretty effectively I think.

Episode IX
THE RISE OF SKYWALKER
Hope is reborn. To suffocate a growing uprising, the tyrannical First Order has silenced communication between neighboring systems.

While Rey, sole heir to the Jedi, continues her training, General Leia Organa has dispatched her brave agents across the galaxy to unite the disparate worlds in the name of Resistance.

Meanwhile, Supreme Leader Kylo Ren has traveled to Mustafar, chasing whispers of a hidden power that would allow him to eliminate any threat to his rule…

If using Exogol, we would def have to trim that last passage down to fit the mid-70 range crawl average word count:

Episode IX
THE RISE OF SKYWALKER
Hope is reborn. To suffocate a growing uprising, the tyrannical First Order has silenced communication between neighboring systems.

While Rey, sole heir to the Jedi, continues her training, General Leia Organa has dispatched her brave agents across the galaxy to unite the disparate worlds in the name of Resistance.

Meanwhile, Supreme Leader Kylo Ren travels to a mysterious planet using a Sith relic, chasing whispers of a hidden power that would allow him to eliminate any threat to his rule…

Something like that would probably work. A minor edit to Hal’s great crawl

Neerb said:

jonh said:

just adding in the opening, something that kylo has found the wayfinder …

Don’t even do that. Just keep the crawl ideas already going around about him searching for power or whatever. All we know initially is why he goes to Exogol, not how.

On Ajan Kloss, Rey learns that a wayfinder is needed to get there, beginning the search.

On Pasaana, Lando says that two were made, and he and Luke were just tracking one of them.

On the Death Star II, Kylo destroys Rey’s wayfinder and says “The only way you’re reaching Exogol is with me.”

Finally, on Ach-to, Luke tells Rey she already has what she needs, and Rey digs Kylo’s wayfinder out of his ship, repeating “two were made.”

I never got why that last part seemed so odd in the theater, but I’m just now realizing it’s because the audience knew from the beginning that Kylo had a wayfinder, and Rey never knew until Luke suggested it to her. I didn’t realize while watching that Rey didn’t know, and so my reaction was “how did Rey not think of this earlier?”

By removing Mustafar and Kylo’s nebula navigation, however, now the audience learns Kylo had one at the same time that Rey does, making it a twist reveal, although not too cheap of one since there are hints for the audience to guess scattered in the dialog throughout the movie.

How exactly Kylo got the wayfinder may seem confusing to people, but it’s a Sith artifact and we know Palpatine’s been talking to Kylo in his head, so it’s not hard to use your imagination. And really, the original movie never explains how he learned:

• the wayfinder’s location
• what a wayfinder even is
• why exactly he even needed it

so we’re really just moving the goalposts and sparing the audience some extra headache.

Bringing this back in, because along with starting the film with Kylo either arriving at Exogol or navigating there, I think these are excellent points. We should find out about the 2nd wayfinder when Rey does.

Additionally, the shot of the fleet rising from the water or whatever absolutely needs to be later in the film. At the start all we need to know is Kylo found Palps and Palps has promised him more power, which Kylo grudgingly accepts. Maybe we know he wants Rey dead, maybe we don’t yet. But the fleet reveal at the start is what killed the tension for me. We shouldn’t know exactly what Palps plans for the galaxy are quite yet.

idir_hh said:

I agree with Nev. The fundamental issue that underlines this film is that the treasure is found before the heroes even go on the treasure hunt, effectively killing all mystery and tension in the film. The reveal of the fleet rising from beneath the surface should have been saved for later on in the film, as well as Kylo finding Palpatine. In my view there needs to be a restructure of the film where palpatine’s broadcast initiates a race to Exogol between The First Order and the Resistance, with Kylo getting there first.

If this were to be implemented, this is the first restructure that came to mind:

1. Open on Mustafar fight and Kylo’s finding the wayfinder. As he touches it he is transported via vision to Exegol where Palpatine reveals the Sith fleet and all the rest. In this context the Sith fleet literally rising out of the ground could be dramatic flair on the part of Palpatine and not strictly what is happening. The vision ends and Kylo is back on Mustafar surrounded by dead cultists.

2. That’s it.

This turns Mustafar Minute into Mustafar/Exegol Vision and justifies its place in the film. It also establishes that the Wayfinders can facilitate vivid illusions as shown with Rey and Evil Rey.

I hadn’t considered when Rey learns that Kylo had a Wayfinder. I know Lando tells her “only two were made” in his RV, but I wanted Luke to slap her and say, “Hey be careful before you just burn things!”

Makes sense that she didn’t know he had one. Opening with Exogol would actually make that moment feel better.

That’s a good point about Rey’s point of view. Thinking about it, it’s not impossible to combine that idea with the Mustafar vision idea. How about:

Kylo kills the cultists and comes to a stop. Before him is the stone container inserted via VFX (cut the shot of him turning). He opens the box and places his hand on the square item inside. Use shot of him turning and then his environment dissolves into the interior of the cultist’s base on Exegol. After the Exegol scene it returns to the shot of Kylo standing over the box, this time with it open and the Wayfinder still upside-down inside.

This allows for the audience to put the pieces together as Rey does.

NeverarGreat said:

That’s a good point about Rey’s point of view. Thinking about it, it’s not impossible to combine that idea with the Mustafar vision idea. How about:

Kylo kills the cultists and comes to a stop. Before him is the stone container inserted via VFX (cut the shot of him turning). He opens the box and places his hand on the square item inside. Use shot of him turning and then his environment dissolves into the interior of the cultist’s base on Exegol. After the Exegol scene it returns to the shot of Kylo standing over the box, this time with it open and the Wayfinder still upside-down inside.

This allows for the audience to put the pieces together as Rey does.

I like this idea but would you still use the Kylo traveling to Exegol sequence?