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Episode IX: The Rise Of Skywalker - Discussion * SPOILER THREAD * — Page 147

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Wanderer_ said:
The force isn’t a magical gift giving plot device,

But that’s exactly what it is. The Force does what it needs to do for the story to go where it needs to go. It only seems to make sense within a well-written story because the people executing it are better at hiding its magical gift-giving nature.

It’s literally a “mystical energy field” - it’s not a progression tree like a video game. If “training” does anything, it’s that it teaches you to stop doubting yourself and what you can do in the Force. But if you don’t doubt yourself and what you can do, the will of the Force works through you a lot more easily.

The “rules” of Star Wars are never as concrete as we love to think they are. They shift with every movie, for the sake of getting that film’s story executed correctly, and those stories are often pretty different from movie to movie, too.

(to clarify: This is not excusing any of the many problems I have with The Rise of Skywalker - it’s simply rebutting the idea that you have to be trained up in a specific way in order to “unlock” Force abilities. That’s a video game, not a movie, and video games are often not the greatest example of storytelling. Frequently, they’re almost the diametric opposite).

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It’s not just the Force that feels off. The movie seems to be saying, that light speed travels take virtually zero time now (either that or all of the locations in TROS just conveniently happen to be in the same neighbourhood of space). Also, mad props to Kylo’s team for being able to figure out the origin of Rey’s necklace in like fifteen seconds.

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Absolutely. “Lightspeed moves at the speed of plot” was a phrase created to explain how Empire Strikes Back’s timeline made any sense (it still doesn’t, really. Neither does the ‘12 parsecs’ retcon they made w/ Solo’s boast) and the thing I keep coming back to is that none of these logic gaps and nitpicks would matter if the story was good at distracting you from them. Or if the story was good (and executed well on top of that) at all.

It’s not as if these problems were explicitly addressed IN the story that it’d make the story better. That’s the real problem. Even if Merry’s whole point in the movie was to stand over someone’s shoulder and explain how Lightspeed Skipping made sense, or how the necklace got located so quickly, it wouldn’t make those scenes any better. Sure, they’d be more logically sound, but that’s not worth much if you’re not emotionally engaged, and Rise of Skywalker isn’t great at that, so all the logical leaps being made just become all the more glaring.

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The logic problems are exactly dead last in the list of concerns for me.

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Broom Kid said:

Absolutely. “Lightspeed moves at the speed of plot” was a phrase created to explain how Empire Strikes Back’s timeline made any sense (it still doesn’t, really. Neither does the ‘12 parsecs’ retcon they made w/ Solo’s boast) and the thing I keep coming back to is that none of these logic gaps and nitpicks would matter if the story was good at distracting you from them. Or if the story was good (and executed well on top of that) at all.

It’s not as if these problems were explicitly addressed IN the story that it’d make the story better. That’s the real problem. Even if Merry’s whole point in the movie was to stand over someone’s shoulder and explain how Lightspeed Skipping made sense, or how the necklace got located so quickly, it wouldn’t make those scenes any better. Sure, they’d be more logically sound, but that’s not worth much if you’re not emotionally engaged, and Rise of Skywalker isn’t great at that, so all the logical leaps being made just become all the more glaring.

Well said, I don’t need everything to fall into place perfectly into place. It never did, not even in 1977. However, moments like that in TROS don’t feel like a case of bending the rules in order to get the point across. More like lazy storytelling.

Ultimately, I think the new elements that the Disney Trilogy added to the Star Wars universe are simply not worth much. It really didn’t add that much of importance besides concluding the story of the original main trio of Star Wars characters and leaving the galaxy at a point of uncertainty for the future of the New Republic, the Jedi and the Sith. But Rey has a yellow lightsaber, how cool is that?

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Wexter said:

But Rey has a yellow lightsaber, how cool is that?

Not very, for two main reasons.

  1. Yellow is hardly a unique lightsaber colour. TCW established it as a less common tertiary lightsaber colour for the Jedi Order, and a number of Force users have appeared with yellow lightsabers since.
  2. Even if it was, Rey of all characters doesn’t deserve it.
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DuracellEnergizer said:

  1. Yellow is hardly a unique lightsaber colour. It’s been a less common tertiary lightsaber colour for the Jedi since TCW.
  2. Even if it was, she of all characters doesn’t deserve it.

What kind of character “deserves” what kind of color? What’s the criteria behind this? I’ve never heard anyone suggest the colors are “Deserved” or not.

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Broom Kid said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

  1. Yellow is hardly a unique lightsaber colour. It’s been a less common tertiary lightsaber colour for the Jedi since TCW.
  2. Even if it was, she of all characters doesn’t deserve it.

What kind of character “deserves” what kind of color? What’s the criteria behind this? I’ve never heard anyone suggest the colors are “Deserved” or not.

Well-rounded maverick characters, like Luke was in the OT. Not overpowered, underwritten Mary Sues like Rey or non-entities like Windu.

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Oh. You were talking about that.

OK. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

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DuracellEnergizer said:

Wexter said:

But Rey has a yellow lightsaber, how cool is that?

Not very, for two main reasons.

  1. Yellow is hardly a unique lightsaber colour. TCW established it as a less common tertiary lightsaber colour for the Jedi Order, and a number of Force users have appeared with yellow lightsabers since.
  2. Even if it was, Rey of all characters doesn’t deserve it.

That’s not the point, I was being sarcastic.

It is just super weird that someone figured that at the conclusion of this nine film saga, this specific detail is what the audience needs to learn before the credits roll.

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Wexter said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Wexter said:

But Rey has a yellow lightsaber, how cool is that?

Not very, for two main reasons.

  1. Yellow is hardly a unique lightsaber colour. TCW established it as a less common tertiary lightsaber colour for the Jedi Order, and a number of Force users have appeared with yellow lightsabers since.
  2. Even if it was, Rey of all characters doesn’t deserve it.

That’s not the point, I was being sarcastic.

Ah.

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I definitely think it was a weird decision that after TLJ broke the saber in two, that JJ decided to just repair it offscreen rather than allow Rey to build a new saber from it. I thought for sure she would build a double-bladed lightsaber using the two crystals.

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RogueLeader said:

I definitely think it was a weird decision that after TLJ broke the saber in two, that JJ decided to just repair it offscreen rather than allow Rey to build a new saber from it. I thought for sure she would build a double-bladed lightsaber using the two crystals.

Well, I think repairing it was a fair way to continue the meaning, though they way they did it they essentially just had it be ‘same saber, but not broken now.’

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 (Edited)

I mentioned this in an edit thread I think (or here?), that it would’ve been interesting if the Hero Saber had some kind of effect on it. Maybe it could pulsate or oscillate regularly, which would’ve played nicely in opposition to Kylo’s unstable blade.

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Rumors are starting to circulate about an extended cut being released to theaters toward the end of the month:
THE 192 MINUTE J.J. ABRAMS RISE OF SKYWALKER CUT IS COMING SOONER THAN YOU THINK

It breaks down to this:

  • An extended version of The Rise of Skywalker will be announced in the coming week, releasing near the end of January, and including 3-5 additional sequences fit into the narrative. This should bring the cut up from 142 minutes to about 165 minutes.
  • Rumored sequences to be included in this cut involve an extended Endor sequence that occurs before the final shot in the current film, Lobot and Lando in a sequence that predates the chase in the desert, and a slew of ghost Jedis returning alongside Luke and Leia and participating in the final sequence to unseat the Emperor.
  • This new cut will be simply treated as an Extended Cut, and will include a post-credits sequence highlighting additional sequences that will be released with the official Blu Ray release of The Rise of Skywalker which will have a special J.J. Abrams Director’s Cut version of the film at 185 minutes.
  • When The Rise of Skywalker enters the streaming window exclusively on Disney Plus it will include an additional 7 minutes of extra footage that didn’t get finished in post production as a part of its exclusive run on the streaming upstart.
Forum Moderator
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Gentle nudge to discuss those rumors in this thread I made about a possible extended cut…

“The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force.” - DV

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Ah, good call.

Forum Moderator
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I really don’t want to get my hopes up but I can’t help it.

Peace is a lie
There is only passion…

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Tobar said:

Rumors are starting to circulate about an extended cut being released to theaters toward the end of the month:
THE 192 MINUTE J.J. ABRAMS RISE OF SKYWALKER CUT IS COMING SOONER THAN YOU THINK

It breaks down to this:

  • An extended version of The Rise of Skywalker will be announced in the coming week, releasing near the end of January, and including 3-5 additional sequences fit into the narrative. This should bring the cut up from 142 minutes to about 165 minutes.
  • Rumored sequences to be included in this cut involve an extended Endor sequence that occurs before the final shot in the current film, Lobot and Lando in a sequence that predates the chase in the desert, and a slew of ghost Jedis returning alongside Luke and Leia and participating in the final sequence to unseat the Emperor.
  • This new cut will be simply treated as an Extended Cut, and will include a post-credits sequence highlighting additional sequences that will be released with the official Blu Ray release of The Rise of Skywalker which will have a special J.J. Abrams Director’s Cut version of the film at 185 minutes.
  • When The Rise of Skywalker enters the streaming window exclusively on Disney Plus it will include an additional 7 minutes of extra footage that didn’t get finished in post production as a part of its exclusive run on the streaming upstart.

Interesting! Considering that most criticisms were leveled at the fast pacing, and lack of moments of reflection, the extended/director’s cut should make for a better movie.

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DrDre said:

Tobar said:

Rumors are starting to circulate about an extended cut being released to theaters toward the end of the month:
THE 192 MINUTE J.J. ABRAMS RISE OF SKYWALKER CUT IS COMING SOONER THAN YOU THINK

It breaks down to this:

  • An extended version of The Rise of Skywalker will be announced in the coming week, releasing near the end of January, and including 3-5 additional sequences fit into the narrative. This should bring the cut up from 142 minutes to about 165 minutes.
  • Rumored sequences to be included in this cut involve an extended Endor sequence that occurs before the final shot in the current film, Lobot and Lando in a sequence that predates the chase in the desert, and a slew of ghost Jedis returning alongside Luke and Leia and participating in the final sequence to unseat the Emperor.
  • This new cut will be simply treated as an Extended Cut, and will include a post-credits sequence highlighting additional sequences that will be released with the official Blu Ray release of The Rise of Skywalker which will have a special J.J. Abrams Director’s Cut version of the film at 185 minutes.
  • When The Rise of Skywalker enters the streaming window exclusively on Disney Plus it will include an additional 7 minutes of extra footage that didn’t get finished in post production as a part of its exclusive run on the streaming upstart.

Interesting! Considering that most criticisms were leveled at the fast pacing, and lack of moments of reflection, the extended/director’s cut should make for a better movie.

Notably, the post makes a very time-based prediction

An extended version of The Rise of Skywalker will be announced in the coming week

So, we have a week before we know if this is true?

ROTJ Storyboard Reconstruction Project