Here is a bit of Reel6 for anyone who is interested.
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It’s interesting how Luke’s Lightsaber on the falcon is pale green like it ended up in the 04 dvd. Like Lucas said about the original negative after cleaning it up and adding the S.E stuff to it. Makes me wonder if the print they were working with when converting to DVD was like what you ended up with when you finish?? Being the reputation George was known for if you tell him something is off or wrong if Lowry decided not to tell him about it and went along with it???
All my life as I looked away to the future, to the horizon. Never in my mind did I know where I was, what I was doing.
I’ve never noticed this before. How the hanger shot is duplicated in the distance.
That was fanTAStic, Poita, thank you for sharing reel 6! This was exactly what I saw in the theater as a little kid all those years ago and was the genesis of my admiration and fondness for this epic franchise! It brought back so many memories and excitement at seeing this for the first time. THIS is what started my Star Wars journey, and it was so good to see the genuine article once again! Thank you!
I’ve never noticed this before. How the hanger shot is duplicated in the distance.
Yeah, originally they wanted to use an actual hangar for the shot, but they ended up using the sound stage at Shepperton Studios in England. It wasn’t anywhere near as big as what they wanted, it was only 250ft deep, so John Barry and the crew faked the back half of it by building a forced perspective set, and they used large cardboard cutouts of the fighters at various scales in the background, and then left a space for the shots of the two actual fighters in the foregorund to be repeated via an optical comp after the scene was shot.
I think there is only one full size X-Wing and one Full size Y-Wing in the shot. I have a photo somewhere of them being dropped into position on the sound stage.
Originally the fighters were meant to be lined up outside of the rebel hanger, but they ran out of money, so the shots were re-written to take place inside the ‘hangar bay’.
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I then used the colormatching results and Neverar’s Technicolor Recreation as color references and made a correction for the scan that’s most likely innacurate, but derives from good intention–and boy is this thing CLEAN. Thank you poita!
Jesus, this is BEAUTIFUL looking. It indeed is clean, and the colours look pretty good too.
It’s interesting how Luke’s Lightsaber on the falcon is pale green like it ended up in the 04 dvd. Like Lucas said about the original negative after cleaning it up and adding the S.E stuff to it. Makes me wonder if the print they were working with when converting to DVD was like what you ended up with when you finish?? Being the reputation George was known for if you tell him something is off or wrong if Lowry decided not to tell him about it and went along with it???
The colour isn’t on the original negative, as the effect was composited in later.
If you look at the original prints, rather than the SE, the sabre is definitely blue.
Here is a shot from a 1977 IB print of the same scene.
SE 1997
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Thanks poita!
It’s really silly how the 97 SE print looks better in every way from the 77 IB Tech in that shot, other than the glaring green sabre.
I’ve never noticed this before. How the hanger shot is duplicated in the distance.
Yeah, originally they wanted to use an actual hangar for the shot, but they ended up using the sound stage at Shepperton Studios in England. It wasn’t anywhere near as big as what they wanted, it was only 250ft deep, so John Barry and the crew faked the back half of it by building a forced perspective set, and they used large cardboard cutouts of the fighters at various scales in the background, and then left a space for the shots of the two actual fighters in the foregorund to be repeated via an optical comp after the scene was shot.
I think there is only one full size X-Wing and one Full size Y-Wing in the shot. I have a photo somewhere of them being dropped into position on the sound stage.Originally the fighters were meant to be lined up outside of the rebel hanger, but they ran out of money, so the shots were re-written to take place inside the ‘hangar bay’.
I recall a shot of the set without any opticals or foreground matte paintings got published somewhere back in the day. You could easily see the Y-Wing in the foreground was three pieces not really attached and a smooth dome where an R2 unit should be!
I’m kind of surprised Lucas didn’t have them SE this shot.
Where were you in '77?
I found the reference in one of my books:
"Massassi hangar, interior: “Thet had one complete X-Wing, a Y-Wing and some bits and pieces, painted ships. SO I took the plate, reduced it, and then put it down in the left centre; then I took the same plate, reduced it even more, and put it in the background on the right hand side of the frame; then I painted around it, just lots of little lights in the back, a couple of shapes, a few hoses hanging down. Youd be amazed how little is on that painting”
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Help get The Original Trilogy preserved!
Wait - did they keep the original 1977 subtitles for the Greedo scene, but make new subtitles that didn’t match the originals for the Jabba scene?! That’s kind of hilarious.
Ha! Nice catch. The font and placement are correct, but indeed the size of the font has been reduced in the Jabba shot. I guess it would have come out correct if they cropped/masked the scene a little more. So who knows maybe it was intended for different cropping then what ended up in the release?
[ Scanning stuff since 2015 ]
SilverWook said:
I recall a shot of the set without any opticals or foreground matte paintings got published somewhere back in the day. You could easily see the Y-Wing in the foreground was three pieces not really attached and a smooth dome where an R2 unit should be!I’m kind of surprised Lucas didn’t have them SE this shot.
He was busy putting CG rocks in front of R2. Priorities.
Well, you know the old saying, around here:
Pfft, that’s not a contraction, it’s just evidence that Greedo’s species is more resistance to blaster shots than humans! Also it explains why Han shot first - he knew Greedo would recover quickly, but if Greedo shot him he would have died. 💀
[ Scanning stuff since 2015 ]
SilverWook said:
I recall a shot of the set without any opticals or foreground matte paintings got published somewhere back in the day. You could easily see the Y-Wing in the foreground was three pieces not really attached and a smooth dome where an R2 unit should be!I’m kind of surprised Lucas didn’t have them SE this shot.
He was busy putting CG rocks in front of R2. Priorities.
Almost ten years later, sure!
Where were you in '77?
Thanks poita!
It’s really silly how the 97 SE print looks better in every way from the 77 IB Tech in that shot, other than the glaring green sabre.
I beg to differ.
I found the reference in one of my books:
"Massassi hangar, interior: “Thet had one complete X-Wing, a Y-Wing and some bits and pieces, painted ships. SO I took the plate, reduced it, and then put it down in the left centre; then I took the same plate, reduced it even more, and put it in the background on the right hand side of the frame; then I painted around it, just lots of little lights in the back, a couple of shapes, a few hoses hanging down. Youd be amazed how little is on that painting”
What book?
It doesn’t hurt to offer help, but it always hurts to disregard those that do.
I found the reference in one of my books:
"Massassi hangar, interior: “Thet had one complete X-Wing, a Y-Wing and some bits and pieces, painted ships. SO I took the plate, reduced it, and then put it down in the left centre; then I took the same plate, reduced it even more, and put it in the background on the right hand side of the frame; then I painted around it, just lots of little lights in the back, a couple of shapes, a few hoses hanging down. Youd be amazed how little is on that painting”
For a long time I actually thought they took the painting with them on set.
Thanks poita!
It’s really silly how the 97 SE print looks better in every way from the 77 IB Tech in that shot, other than the glaring green sabre.
I beg to differ.
Yeah, the SE print looks quite a bit softer than the Tech, which makes sense since the SE went through at least one more film generation.
You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)
I found the reference in one of my books:
"Massassi hangar, interior: “Thet had one complete X-Wing, a Y-Wing and some bits and pieces, painted ships. SO I took the plate, reduced it, and then put it down in the left centre; then I took the same plate, reduced it even more, and put it in the background on the right hand side of the frame; then I painted around it, just lots of little lights in the back, a couple of shapes, a few hoses hanging down. Youd be amazed how little is on that painting”
Do you have the art of star wars - revised 1997 edition? In the back there are some stills for some of the 1997 special edition shots…
I am guessing you do have it after posting that concept art trailer 😃
People often want to bash me when I talk about stuff like this “Why did they not special edition this scene?” and so on but practically destroy mos-eisley space port with comedy dinosaurs…
Actually I am curious what your plan is? are you coloring this to be the special edition or Technicolor?
Either Way I accept the Special edition as a version but the main problem is, is that the footage just looks different and does not Gel well with the model shots and I like the model shots but I also like some of the special edition stuff. Some shots it would seem were intended to be extended versions of shots but ultimately the decision was made to drop the original model shots and just have the CGI version.
Couple examples of extensions that were if you like called off…
I know this is a preservation but could it be that there was some sort of error made, that made the CGI stick out more than it should of done in the 1997? Especially considering loss of luminance? Or is it more that the model shots stick out more against the CGI? I am basing this off the fact that if they were planning on extending some bits they would have matched the look… But it all must of went out the window at some stage I guess…
Thanks poita!
It’s really silly how the 97 SE print looks better in every way from the 77 IB Tech in that shot, other than the glaring green sabre.
I beg to differ.
Yeah, the SE print looks quite a bit softer than the Tech, which makes sense since the SE went through at least one more film generation.
It actually isn’t really softer than the tech, the tech is softer in some places and the SE is softer in others, sometimes different areas are sharper on one or the other within the same frame.
The grain structure is different, but once you match the contrast settings on both, the SE in most cases has a better dynamic range, more shadow detail and in 90% of cases is just as sharp, which surprised me. The exception is the CGI shots, they are definitely soft.
The SE scan is still ‘flat’ at this stage, which is so we can capture all of the range of the film. Once you put the dynamics back in, it looks much, much sharper.
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Help get The Original Trilogy preserved!
Are all three movies being worked on at the same time, or are you doing them in order?
Reading R + L ≠ J theories
Doing Star Wars first, and yes, Empire will likely be next.
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Help get The Original Trilogy preserved!
As poita has posted these images, I will share one of my discoveries.
Poita’s scan:
PAL broadcast (“TB release”):
Poita’s scan colour-matched to TB release:
Japanese Laserdisc (Jetrell’s rip on Myspleen):
Poita’s scan:
PAL broadcast (“TB release”):
Poita’s scan colour-matched to TB release:
Japanese Laserdisc (Jetrell’s rip on Myspleen):
Pay particular attention to where the lightsaber blade meets the handle. The rotoscoping has been changed. I used Dr. Dre’s tool to colour-match the scan to the PAL broadcast, all screenshots are taken in AvsPmod (resize to 1080p) and are frame-accurate.
This was a previously unknown change. Everyone knew that the 1997 SE has done some new rotoscoping - but not that there two different versions done in 1997 - one that appears on home video and broadcast, and one that appears on the release prints. I could post some more screenshots if poita gives the OK, but these screenshots show the difference in rotoscoping quite clearly as it is. This is very exciting and shows there is still more to discover about the 1997 SE that has remained unknown to this date that poita’s scans are going to help uncover!!
[ Scanning stuff since 2015 ]
Pay particular attention to where the lightsaber blade meets the handle. The rotoscoping has been changed. I used Dr. Dre’s tool to colour-match the scan to the PAL broadcast, all screenshots are taken in AvsPmod (resize to 1080p) and are frame-accurate.
This was a previously unknown change. Everyone knew that the 1997 SE has done some new rotoscoping - but not that there two different versions done in 1997 - one that appears on home video and broadcast, and one that appears on the release prints. I could post some more screenshots if poita gives the OK, but these screenshots show the difference in rotoscoping quite clearly as it is. This is very exciting and shows there is still more to discover about the 1997 SE that has remained unknown to this date that poita’s scans are going to help uncover!!
Could you highlight the exact spot you’re comparing? Maybe I’m just not seeing it, but I’m not entirely convinced of a rotoscoping change.
It brings to mind the look of the first good quality film scans we got of the OOT version of this shot, and how they looked compared to the hazily defined blade in the GOUT. That almost looked like alternate rotoscoping as well (more so, even).
But again, I may just not be seeing what you mean to point out.
As poita has posted these images, I will share one of my discoveries.
Poita’s scan:
PAL broadcast (“TB release”):
Poita’s scan colour-matched to TB release:
Japanese Laserdisc (Jetrell’s rip on Myspleen):
Poita’s scan:
PAL broadcast (“TB release”):
Poita’s scan colour-matched to TB release:
Japanese Laserdisc (Jetrell’s rip on Myspleen):
Pay particular attention to where the lightsaber blade meets the handle. The rotoscoping has been changed. I used Dr. Dre’s tool to colour-match the scan to the PAL broadcast, all screenshots are taken in AvsPmod (resize to 1080p) and are frame-accurate.
This was a previously unknown change. Everyone knew that the 1997 SE has done some new rotoscoping - but not that there two different versions done in 1997 - one that appears on home video and broadcast, and one that appears on the release prints. I could post some more screenshots if poita gives the OK, but these screenshots show the difference in rotoscoping quite clearly as it is. This is very exciting and shows there is still more to discover about the 1997 SE that has remained unknown to this date that poita’s scans are going to help uncover!!
I think you should also consider DNR was applied to the home video versions, that probably affected some of these shots.
I’m not seeing it either. They look like three different versions of the same thing. The LD does look a little bit stretched horizontally though.
If I had some gum, I’d chew a hole into the sun…
