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The Matrix 35mm (Released) — Page 6

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yotsuya said:

Well, I can’t say that I caught the green when I saw The Matrix in the theater, but when I saw the two sequels in the theater, I very much noticed it. I can’t say that the extent of tint in the blu-ray is accurate, but I would say the DVD is accurate. And it is possible that the prints were not done as accurately as they wanted and what you are seeing on the print is actually an error rather than the correct colors. But I absolutely did notice it the theater when I saw the third movie. In my experience and knowledge, distribution prints are not done with the care and accuracy of color that the many talented people on this site tend to have. I’m more inclined to believe the scanned print is in error than there was some drastic change in artistic direction between the first and third movies.

You are right that one print isn’t a definitive record of the director’s choices, but there’s no reason to suspect it’s radically wrong. The print has a cohesive style, in that the scenes in the Matrix have a bleached out look compared to the real word (and quite a bit of green as well). It also has normal contrast and looks good, while the first DVD is weirdly washed out with it’s green-browns, which I think were quickly introduced during the telecine.
The two sequels (which were shot and produced together) do have a different style. They were also mastered on a Digital Intermediate, giving them a greater control of color, while the first one was colored optically.
I think the Wachowskis wanted to make the Matrix scenes more blanket green then they could satisfactorily do for theaters (or they changed their mind in time for the DVD). When the DVD/Laserdisc came out they took the opportunity to tint it during mastering. They then used a more blanket green for the sequels and then further revised the first film’s color to better match the sequels (The blu ray/2nd DVD is a full regrade with better contrast and control than the brown-green of the first dvd).

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As the following two images are from two distinct prints, I think there is something wrong in at least one of them; which one, I can’t say.


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Right, but they are pretty close. The scanned project print overall is biased toward yellow compared with the other (which is the result of the scans or print variance.) It matches with those Angelfire images much more than it does the DVD.
A quick contrast adjustment of the Angelfire one gets you to this:
Angelfire contrast
Which looks like a greener version of the scanned project. A push in the greens can match one to the other from there.
Compare with the dvd, which has weird gamma and a different tint:
dvd
Simply adjusting the DVD’s contrast won’t get you close to the prints.
The 35mm print does have a ton of green in many scenes, but not the brown-greenish wash the DVD has. The DVD looks very different from what was in theaters.

The scanned print is actually more green than the DVD in many places. (And it’s greener than the VCD that NeverarGreat was color matching to).
DVD:
dvd
Print:
35mm

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yotsuya said:

I guess I’m confused why you would want to scub out the green tint in this film when it was original to the production and not added for the home video release. All the scenes (and only those scenes) within the Matrix are supposed to be tinted green. None of the scenes outside the Matrix have that green tint. It was an artistic choice the filmmakers made and it is really cool when you can instantly know whether you are in the real world or the matrix by the tint of the image on screen. It is like that for every Matrix installment. It really seems more fan edit than preservation to make such a major change to the movie.

No, it was never in the original film. If you’re going by what the sequels do then why not scrub out all the guns that Neo uses and loves in The Matrix? But, if you prefer the way the BD looks then just watch that. 😃

yotsuya said:

Well, I can’t say that I caught the green when I saw The Matrix in the theater, but when I saw the two sequels in the theater, I very much noticed it. I can’t say that the extent of tint in the blu-ray is accurate, but I would say the DVD is accurate.

The DVD is a traditional Telecine, it’s not accurate to anything.

In my experience and knowledge, distribution prints are not done with the care and accuracy of color that the many talented people on this site tend to have.

Prints are certainly the result of a careful color grading process. It’s true you can find obvious examples where this was overlooked, but you can also find examples where the film score is grossly overlooked as well.

And it is possible that the prints were not done as accurately as they wanted and what you are seeing on the print is actually an error rather than the correct colors.

Without an LUT the scan is not necessarily projection-accurate. This is unfortunately a limitation we have to deal with. The best way to get a proper grading to the print is to project the film and re-grade it, but this is often beyond the abilities of fan-level restorations.

I’m more inclined to believe the scanned print is in error than there was some drastic change in artistic direction between the first and third movies.

Well you’d be wrong there. The scanned print may well be in error, but the sequels had DIs and were digitally regraded to green - the original was not. That’s two very different methods. They may well have intended all the Matrix scenes to look green, but there is only so much you can do with on-set lighting, especially as many Matrix scenes occur outdoors.

[ Scanning stuff since 2015 ]

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That’s right, “The Matrix” was released in 1999, in the pre-digital color grading era. Actually, just one year before as, if I remember correctly, “O’Brother, Where Art Thou?” (2000) was the first movie to be digitally color graded. Now, the two sequels were color graded in the digital era, and then, the Wachowskis went back to color grading the first movie to match its sequels. The second film scan, from which we can see some pictures above, is probably from a rerelease for trilogy marathons. During production of “The Matrix”, the way the green was introduced in the Matrix scenes was done on set: lighting, set designs, green paint on the walls, green fruits on the street market, etc. Even if the Wachowskis had this idea from de beginning, they just couldn’t do it the way they wanted in the pre-digital era.

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On one if the documentarys someone talks about how they were able to digital grade some scenes in the first movie, and they were trying to convince the Whatchalskis at the time to grade the whole film like that.

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http://originaltrilogy.com/topic/Episode-1-TPM-game-sounds-files/id/15201/page/1

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Just watched this through. The insane contrast on this print cant possibly be correct? Is this really what the negative looked like? I cant imagine this film being projected like this without some complaints. There’s so much detail missing.

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Just a heads up. It appears that on Amazon Instant Video UK that The Matrix is now using a different transfer from the original DVD and Blu-ray. There is much less green tint now, and it seems they have gone for a more slightly cooler/bluer look. Big changes I have seen so far are in the first interrogation scene with Neo which is less green than before, as well as the rooftop scene where the sky is more visible than before and less green. There is probably more but I have only had a quick check through.

What led me to finding this was I had recently noticed that Amazon was changing the cover art on their instant video library of Warner Bros movies. I had already purchased The Matrix previously, and saw they had changed the cover art on the icon, so curiously checked to see what else had changed, and low and behold the transfer appears to have as well. I noticed they also changed the cover art for Se7en so I’d be curious to know if the transfer has changed for that as well (Unfortunately I don’t own that one on Amazon).

It is also worth considering whether these changes may tie in to the rumoured upcoming Warner Bros. 4K UHD releases.

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That’s interesting, Rockin, as I’ve seen a 35mm print in Paris, France, most likely from back then in 1999 since there never was a rerealease in France, and as it turns out, the 35mm print was lookking like the Blu-ray with less green here and there, and definitely the interrogation scene. So this Amazon version you’re talking about might be the good stuff.

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Rockin, may you post some screenshots? Thanks!

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Apologies, I could be wrong about this. After checking on my tablet and phone and computer, it appears as though it is still very green. My TV for some reason has decided to change this without me changing the settings. I think this is more likely a TV fault than a genuine change. Sorry guys.

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The trilogy is on Netflix in the US… I wonder if they are different masters than the blus…

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nafroe said:

The trilogy is on Netflix in the US… I wonder if they are different masters than the blus…

Just compared them, and the Netflix is definitely the same master, to my eyes.

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Hey guys, long time lurker here:

I was searching for the Jurassic Park 35mm when I stumbled upon something called The.Matrix.1999.35mm.1080p.Cinema.DTS.v2.0

What do we know about this release? I haven’t been able to find who made it. Maybe it was Team Blu?

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^It’s by the same group as the available Jurassic Park. I don’t think their group has a name yet.

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They really ought to make a name.

she/her
mwah

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Looking for these as well. No access to them on private trackers sadly.

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Ohh I see.

I was under the impression it was on Blutopia or something.

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There’s no reason it shouldn’t on Blutopia… maybe ask the uploader of “Aladdin” if he can upload this there? 😉

[ Scanning stuff since 2015 ]

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RU.08 said:

There’s no reason it shouldn’t on Blutopia… maybe ask the uploader of “Aladdin” if he can upload this there? 😉

The one who uploaded that there is a shitcunt mate but V 2.0 of The Matrix has been on BLU for about a full term pregnancy 😉

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Sorry I didn’t fact-check, perhaps I should have checked Trump’s twitter feed first? 😉

[ Scanning stuff since 2015 ]

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Hahaha fake news fo’ sho when it comes to that racist scrotum dipped in Cheeto dust my good man!

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Anyone has the link for the file of the 35mm film print version of The Matrix (1999)?