The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS ** — Page 88

I don’t want Rey related to anyone and I hope JJ keeps it.

SteveE said:

Rask40 said:

Has it not occurred to anyone that Kylo Ren might have been bullshitting Rey about her parents?
Why should we trust anything that Kylo Ren says?

I pondered this too and I kinda hope JJ Abrahams advises this in Episode 9. Basically states and reminds us that the Sith are deceitful. If anyone can do it then JJ can. Maybe he’ll bring Laurence Kasdan back on board.

When reading quotes from Rian Johnson he just seems to totally miss the point. He advises that he didnt’t want Rey to be part of the Skywalker blood line. Well duh, neither did most people…but how about making her Obi-Wan’s daughter. Thus linking up to a potential new spin off. Maybe JJ an swing the new script into that ark.

One other thing that Johnson said was that he wrote the script for The Last Jedi before TFA…and it shows sadly 😦 Cause every plot point in TFA is well and truly pissed up the wall.

He wrote it before TFA was released, not after TFA itself was written and filmed.

Anchorhead said:

Valheru_84 said:
It was a dose of the medicine he’d just given Dre. If he can give it then he can take it as well.

DominicCobb said:
Next time you act like a dick to another poster, that’s exactly what I’ll do.

That’s not going to end well for either of you.

I’m not sure if I understand, are you saying if I report Val for attacking another member I’ll get in trouble?

Mithrandir said:

Leia has been more diminished as a character that Luke could possibly be in this movie. And totally inconsistent with his TFA self.

I assume you mean “her TFA self” but why has Leia been diminished in any way?

SteveE said:

how about making her Obi-Wan’s daughter. Thus linking up to a potential new spin off. Maybe JJ an swing the new script into that ark.

Because Obi-Wan died 15 years before Rey was born. To make her a Kenobi, you’d need to give Obi-Wan a lover AND a child offscreen. I suppose you could give him a secret kid with Satine from TCW, but they can’t expect a general audience who isn’t super familiar with the cartoon to follow or care about all that. Besides, Johnson’s whole point is that it’s time to stop focusing on bloodlines. Making Rey a nobody democratizes the Force. Making her a Kenobi keeps it aristocratic.

One other thing that Johnson said was that he wrote the script for The Last Jedi before TFA…

Incorrect. Johnson wrote much of TLJ before TFA was released, but the TFA script was definitely finalized and production well underway before he started his own screenplay.

Mrebo said:

@ TV’s Frink

I responded to your friend’s passage that you posted. I think it apparent that he is generalizing. I think that generalization is wrong. The main point is that I think there is nothing wrong with the vast majority of negative expressions concerning this movie and we needn’t paint with a broad brush to question motivations.

I disagree with your read on the situation and that’s all that probably needs to be said.

joefavs said:

Making Rey a nobody democratizes the Force. Making her a Kenobi keeps it aristocratic.

Careful, now. No political talk.

^Lol.

SilverWook said:

Frank your Majesty said:

Yes. If Kylo would have lied to her, he wouldn’t have said that she already knows it and then be surprised that she didn’t.

I don’t buy that her parents are dead and buried on Jakku. Why did she have this flashback in the middle of her experiecning visions after touching Luke’s saber in TFA? It’s the only thing she recognizes and has nothing (seemingly) to do with Luke.

I think it’s just because the trilogy wasn’t planned out. JJ thought that Rey’s parents should be important, Rian felt differently.

The lack of cohesion between the two movies has become a bit of a problem to me. It’s clear that the movies don’t know where they’re going. Plotlines are set up in TFA that are completely abandoned in TLJ, or just subverted in the laziest way. I do like the idea that Rey’s parents are nobodies, but it just doesn’t fit with what we were shown in TFA. This cohesion problem isn’t exclusive to the ST, it’s prominent in the OT as well; I suppose it just never bothered me since I grew up with the trilogy already existing. Leia was always Luke’s sister, in my mind.

Jeebus said:

SilverWook said:

Frank your Majesty said:

Yes. If Kylo would have lied to her, he wouldn’t have said that she already knows it and then be surprised that she didn’t.

I don’t buy that her parents are dead and buried on Jakku. Why did she have this flashback in the middle of her experiecning visions after touching Luke’s saber in TFA? It’s the only thing she recognizes and has nothing (seemingly) to do with Luke.

Honestly, I think it’s just because the trilogy wasn’t planned out. JJ thought that Rey’s parents should be important, Rian felt differently.

I disagree, the trilogy definitely wasn’t planned out but I think all evidence points to JJ having the “nobody” thing in mind.

Since I don’t feel like going over it again, this is my take on the TFA force back (I should repost myself more to save my sanity):

I’m not saying the “force back” as they call it is perfectly done. I think it’s a little messy and lacks a solid flow. But I have no problem with what it represents - the force. The light, and the dark. The ship leaving Jakku is part of the dark side, tapping into Rey’s fears of abandonment and isolation. TLJ makes this connection explicit.

I guess call me crazy but I just legitimately don’t understand the “lack of cohesion” complaints. The two films are different, sure, but not anymore so than a second part should be. I feel like the ST is well on it’s way to being a very cohesive set of films telling one story across three films.

I think, for example, the difference between TFA and TLJ is far less drastic than, say, the difference between Batman Begins and The Dark Knight. And I think it’s about on par with the differences between the original Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back (this is something that can be really hard to wrap your head around if you only ever knew them together - I can attest to this from experience).

SilverWook said:

Rey’s parents can still be potential nobodies who abandoned her for unknown reasons on a planet even former farmboys from Tatooine think sucks. 😉

You mean you think he was just lying about them being dead? I think that’s possible.

DominicCobb said:

I guess call me crazy but I just legitimately don’t understand the “lack of cohesion” complaints. The two films are different, sure, but not anymore so than a second part should be. I feel like the ST is well on it’s way to being a very cohesive set of films telling one story across three films.

I think, for example, the difference between TFA and TLJ is far less drastic than, say, the difference between Batman Begins and The Dark Knight. And I think it’s about on par with the differences between the original Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back (this is something that can be really hard to wrap your head around if you only ever knew them together - I can attest to this from experience).

I personally feel the bigger issue with the ST is it’s lack of cohesion with the other six films in the saga. I think the ST even with TLJ struggles to find its own voice. As much as I can enjoy the three Disney films, even if I’m more critical of TLJ than TFA and RO, I struggle to see the added value of episodes VII and VIII in the overarching narrative. I think RJ’s trilogy may be more interesting going forward, as it apparently will be unrelated to the “main saga”, but thusfar the ST feel more like franchise extension than anything else, recyling many elements of the previous films (with some twists) and the aesthetics. Returning to Empire versus rebels still feels like a huge cop out, as if Star Wars is destined to repeat itself ad nauseam.

I’m confused when you say the ST has a lack of cohesion with the other six films and then say ST feels like a franchise extension with recycling of many elements.

TV’s Frink said:

I’m confused when you say the ST has a lack of cohesion with the other six films and then say ST feels like a franchise extension with recycling of many elements.

In my view the ST should feel like a natural progression of the six film saga, whilst respecting it’s underlying themes.

The ST thusfar feels like a big reset of the OT Empire versus rebels set up. TLJ is still almost completely driven by OT story points, as TFA was. In my view it tries too hard to distuingish itself through story twists, specifically tailored to elicit a “look they’re doing it different from the OT, because the OT did A in this situation, and they’re doing B” response, rather than just telling it’s own story.

The reality is, that ROTJ was the natural ending of the saga, and ultimately was set up as such. IMO it would have been better if they would have just told their own story from the get go, as RJ hopefully will do in the near future. Of course the fans wanted to see more adventures of our classic heroes, and financially it made perfect sense, but story wise the ST, whilst entertaining, weakens the saga and it’s underlying themes in my view by not being driven by an overarching story and common themes, but by the demands of franchise extension.

Well I am seen the movie. I still not sure what to think. It had good moments and bad moments. One thing that shocked me was the Leia survived. I thought for sure she was going to die in the movie, due to the death of Carrie Fisher. It looked like that was what happened when the bridge blew up and she went into space. But she survived. Now, I have no idea of that was what was originally planed or not. If it was not originally planned and they added that in to take advantage of everyone expecting her to die, I think it would be in poor taste. You don’t take advantage of a real life death like that. Anyway, it is now a guarantee that she will die in the next movie(perhaps off screen before the events of the next movie) I didn’t like what they did with Luke. The Rebellion is near death and the only fully trained Jedi(unless you want to somehow argue that Leia was fully trained) is just going to sit on his rear end and do nothing about it and whine about his failure with Ben Solo. Consider also that his own sister is going to be killed as well. So he is just going to sit there on the island while Leia and the rebellion are wiped out? Sorry I don’t think they gave enough of a reason for Luke to be acting the way he was. I bet some are upset that Luke started the fight with Ben Sole. It bothers me a little, but I am not that upset. What was the heck was that scene when Rey when into the hole? I don’t it. I am surprised that Snoke was killed. I thought for sure he was going to meet his end in the last movie. *shrugs shoulders* With Snoke dead, I guess we will never find out where he came from. Too bad. I didn’t know force users could have discussions at long distances, I guess they can. Of course it makes a bit more sense when you find out Snoke was behind it. So Rey’s parents were nobodies, just ordinary people? Then how did she before force sensitive? Wouldn’t it make more sense for at least one of her parents to be force sensitive? One think I am confused about is did or did not Luke cut himself off from the force? I think I heard him say that he had. If that did happen, how does he have his force abilities back at the end. Could someone please explain Luke’s death? (btw that was spoiled for me by inadvertently clicking on this thread before seeing the movie). What was happening with Luke at the end? Was he using the force to be in two places at once? Was that some sort of force projection or something? It didn’t make sense. Why did the killing of whatever it was, cause Luke himself to die? I don’t get it. Why did he stand there and let Kilo Ren kill him? I mean when Obiwan did it in ANH, it made sense. Obiwan was sacrificing himself so that Luke, Han, and Leia would get the heck out of there and no longer delay to wait for him. Also could argue that Vader was going to kill Obiwan in the end anyway due to Obiwan being so old at the time of the fight. What was Luke’s reason? He was trying hold up Kilo Ren and the rest to allow what was left of the resistance to get away. Sacrificing himself doesn’t accomplish that. Making the fight take as long was possible would have been more beneficial for that. Why didn’t he make the fight last as long as possible, giving the resistance more time to escape and why didn’t he try to kill Kilo Ren right there? Rey beat him in the last movie, so surely Luke a Jedi Master should stand a reasonable chance against Ren. Yet Luke didn’t even try. If whatever it was could be killed by a light saber, why didn’t the blaster shots kill him? It didn’t look like Luke was reflect or anything. The whole scene just doesn’t make sense. Who was the boy at the end?
Where the heck is Lando?

I guess that is all I have for now. I guess I am a bit let down. Of course it may have a little to do with my bad movie experience while watching the film. (see the b****ing in the off topic section of the forum).