logo Sign In

Episode VIII : The Last Jedi - Discussion * SPOILER THREAD * — Page 55

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Lord Haseo said:

Anchorhead said:
Everything comes across as a bit too much.

The only thing that I can think of is the space slug but aside from that the story telling, character portrayals, themes etc. were elevated as any continuation should.

No arguments here. Fact is, I never wanted a continuation or any character growth. As I sat in the theater every week in 1977, Star Wars was perfect. It had a beginning, a middle , and an end. I never once gave any thought to a continuation of the story. It only makes sense that the continuation (eventually) disappointed me. It’s the same reason I’ve never seen the sequels to ALIEN, Jaws, or Back To The Future. Those weren’t stories that needed to be continued. They were closed when I walked out of the theater.

Rogue One, on the other hand, also works as a stand-alone. It’s familiar, but it doesn’t change the 1977 characters. When I’m watching it, I imagine Luke and Co showing up in the Death Star and Yavin only a couple of weeks later. I didn’t expect that emotion, but it’s been a really nice surprise. For me, the two films fit together perfectly.

In the interest of “getting it”, the disappointment you feel with Rogue One is the same disappointment I’ve been feeling for 37 years.

Forum Moderator
Author
Time

Anchorhead said:

Lord Haseo said:

Anchorhead said:
Everything comes across as a bit too much.

The only thing that I can think of is the space slug but aside from that the story telling, character portrayals, themes etc. were elevated as any continuation should.

No arguments here. Fact is, I never wanted a continuation or any character growth. As I sat in the theater every week in 1977, Star Wars was perfect. It had a beginning, a middle , and an end. I never once gave any thought to a continuation of the story. It only makes sense that the continuation (eventually) disappointed me. It’s the same reason I’ve never seen the sequels to ALIEN, Jaws, or Back To The Future. Those weren’t stories that needed to be continued. They were closed when I walked out of the theater.

Rogue One, on the other hand, also works as a stand-alone. It’s familiar, but it doesn’t change the 1977 characters. When I’m watching it, I imagine Luke and Co showing up in the Death Star and Yavin only a couple of weeks later. I didn’t expect that emotion, but it’s been a really nice surprise. For me, the two films fit together perfectly.

In the interest of “getting it”, the disappointment you feel with Rogue One is the same disappointment I’ve been feeling for 37 years.

For TESB, there were three years since the previous film in real time and in story time. All the characters had changed int the process. Yes, Han had lost that edge, but perhaps that is what spending three years with Luke and Leia will do. As for Vader, he was always higher ranking than any starship commander. He was under Tarkin and answered to the Emperor, but in TESB, he is hunting rebels and is in command of a starfleet. There is an admiral, Vader is over the admiral. Pretty much where we see him in the opening of ANH before he joins Tarkin on the Death Star. I have never seen anything about TESB that made it not fit with Star Wars. The dialog even indicates that Hoth is not the first place they went after Yavin IV, providing for a lot of untold adventures. I can see if you find the story less enthralling than ANH and I really like how you find Rogue One to be the closest to the original, but your stated reasons for not liking TESB are pretty weak.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

DuracellEnergizer said:

Anchorhead said:

For me, Rogue One is the installment that best fits with Star Wars77.

I think you just broke Alderaan’s brain.

Anchorhead doesn’t bother me. He doesn’t try to pretend the films are anything other than what they are, and he just likes one kind and doesn’t like the other. Anyone is free to like what they like, how can I argue with that? I also have no beef with people who readily admit the prequels are bad movies but they still like them anyway.

But if you come in here and want to debate that a poorly made, flawed film was actually well made or didn’t have plot holes or whatever, then sure we will have a lively discussion.

Author
Time

Well I doubt very much Anchored would agree that Rogue One is a poorly made film so…

Author
Time

Well, if Anchorhead or anyone else wants to discuss the film, you know me, I’m always happy to oblige. I don’t think this is the thread for that discussion, however.

Author
Time

Haha yes I also just realized I walked into a thread I’m trying to avoid… whoops

Author
Time

yotsuya said:
I have never seen anything about TESB that made it not fit with Star Wars…

I didn’t say it didn’t fit. In fact, I specifically said I see where it was in line with the original. The story, in whatever way it’s written to clarify the in-story passage of time, doesn’t interest me, nor do the characters at that point in their lives. Well made for sure and far more often than not it’s shown to be the high water mark of the franchise.

yotsuya said:
I can see if you find the story less enthralling than ANH…but your stated reasons for not liking TESB are pretty weak.

With regard to my opinion, those two statements are one and the same. I find the story & characters less enthralling than Star Wars, so I don’t care for the movie. People’s opinions are not strong, weak, right, or wrong.

The Last Jedi may end up being more of the same. We may be catching up with our new heroes a few years after we last saw them. If that’s the case and Rey is a departure from what I found so interesting about her in TFA, I might feel the same about it as I did about TESB.

Forum Moderator
Author
Time

Anchorhead said:

Lord Haseo said:

Anchorhead said:
Everything comes across as a bit too much.

The only thing that I can think of is the space slug but aside from that the story telling, character portrayals, themes etc. were elevated as any continuation should.

No arguments here. Fact is, I never wanted a continuation or any character growth. As I sat in the theater every week in 1977, Star Wars was perfect. It had a beginning, a middle , and an end. I never once gave any thought to a continuation of the story. It only makes sense that the continuation (eventually) disappointed me. It’s the same reason I’ve never seen the sequels to ALIEN, Jaws, or Back To The Future. Those weren’t stories that needed to be continued. They were closed when I walked out of the theater.

Honestly I can’t wrap my brain around this way of thinking even if I were omniscient.

In the interest of “getting it”, the disappointment you feel with Rogue One is the same disappointment I’ve been feeling for 37 years.

I have said certain aspects of Rogue One (mainly the paper thin characters) disappointed me but never have I said that the film as a whole disappointed me.

Author
Time

Lord Haseo said:
Honestly I can’t wrap my brain around this way of thinking even if I were omniscient.

I’ll try not to take that personally.

Forum Moderator
Author
Time
 (Edited)

I can definitely understand that line of thinking. Star Wars was in reality designed as a singular film without any real intention for sequels. And this really was because no one could have predicted it would become the second highest grossing film of all time. You aren’t going to set people up for sequels that wouldn’t come out.

Now I mean I like a ton of SW stuff across all the movies, shows, games, etc. as many know on here but Star Wars is still far and above my favorite film and piece of the whole franchise. I’ve seen it vastly more times than ESB and ROTJ. It’s only one I could fully quote scenes from. Rogue One easily became my second favorite because it played to that original, along with offering some innovative cinematography and some more refined acting performances.

That said, I’m thinking that if any film could be my new favorite, it would be TLJ, simply because of how much I love Rian Johnson’s previous works, and that I do take some liking to the super mystical aspects of Star Wars that have been missing from the films, something that’s sort of the opposite end from what SW and RO are like.

EDIT:
And also yes, glad you haven’t watched the sequels to Jaws or BTTF, they don’t at all compare.

Author
Time

NeverarGreat said:

So many people on social media are saying that TLJ teaser was boring, but that’s what people said of ESB, so I’m looking forward to a more thoughtful, more mystically tuned entry. Also, Skellig Michael has the very real potential to be my favorite Star Wars location of all time.

The teaser should have gave away the whole plot and had 4 more explosions. That would have made a good teaser.

Author
Time

NeverarGreat said:

So many people on social media are saying that TLJ teaser was boring, but that’s what people said of ESB, so I’m looking forward to a more thoughtful, more mystically tuned entry. Also, Skellig Michael has the very real potential to be my favorite Star Wars location of all time.

I’m hoping Rian can intercut the more action-oriented Poe/Finn plot with the introspective Rey/Luke scenes. I think Empire kinda drags in the middle a bit (blasphemy!)

I I had any artistic skill whatsoever I would recreate the Empire poster with Poe and Finn as Han and Leia and that picture of Mark on Daisy’s back where Luke is.

It seems like people are really embracing the new characters. In fact, the big question people ask me now about Star Wars is, “Are Finn and Poe gay lovers?” And really how the f*ck would I know? My second husband left me for a man, so my gaydar isn’t exactly what you’d call Death Star level quality. ----Carrie Fisher

Author
Time

lovelikewinter said:

NeverarGreat said:

So many people on social media are saying that TLJ teaser was boring, but that’s what people said of ESB, so I’m looking forward to a more thoughtful, more mystically tuned entry. Also, Skellig Michael has the very real potential to be my favorite Star Wars location of all time.

I’m hoping Rian can intercut the more action-oriented Poe/Finn plot with the introspective Rey/Luke scenes. I think Empire kinda drags in the middle a bit (blasphemy!)

I I had any artistic skill whatsoever I would recreate the Empire poster with Poe and Finn as Han and Leia and that picture of Mark on Daisy’s back where Luke is.

I’d be careful about doing that, since people could misinterpret that as complaining about TLJ being a (Frink trigger warning) rehash.

You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)

Author
Time
 (Edited)

NeverarGreat said:

So many people on social media are saying that TLJ teaser was boring

That’s because people are dumb and expect trailers that give away the entire movie plot.

Author
Time

Eh, I dunno. I think they devoted more time to sweeping landscape shots than they needed to. If you’re going to spend a third of the trailer lovingly running the camera over Skellig, at least go past where the Falcon is parked or something. The TFA teaser had a similar rhythm, but all of those early shots included enough signifiers from the SW universe to be more exciting (downed Star Destroyer, melted Vader helmet, Skywalker lightsaber).

Author
Time

Every movie is a rehash of every other movie. Duly noted.