moviefreakedmind said:

All three of the Star Wars movies were very much George Lucas films. He nearly went bankrupt trying to get Empire made. The idea that he had little to nothing to do with the creation of Empire is inaccurate. He didn’t have complete creative control on the first two, but he was definitely the driving force.

George Lucas contributed his part and that’s what he was good at. Not more. Anyone who thinks he actually had a clue what was going on in that movie, well just look at the '97 Special Edition release. He changed it to make Luke scream when he jumped ffs. The man didn’t even have a basic understanding of the story.

As Carrie Fisher said in an interview once, the actors and the story often just got in the way for George, who wanted to focus all of the attention on the creatures and robots he made up.

imperialscum said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

Alderaan said:

[Haarspalter said:]
If you want to find out what George Lucas was thinking when he made the PT

He was thinking the same things he was thinking when he made the OT if you ask me. But there were no longer any constraints or people to reign him in.

I think if George could have, he would have made the originals exactly like he made the prequels.

I doubt that. He had practically no constraints in ESB and ROTJ as he held the rights to the sequels and was doing them with his own company. Even in ANH he had mostly free hands since the studio did not seem to care about the film prior to the release.

I would say it is mostly that in OT he actually had good ideas and was open to feedback from his collaborators.

Irvin made ESB what it was.

End

I love people who think the director is the only person responsible for the success or failure of a movie.

Well depends on the film. But in ESB Kershner was a hired actor director while Lucas was basically the creative director of the film.

You’re sadly mistaken if you think all he did was direct actors.

imperialscum said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

That is a misconception I would say. When you read the transcripts from meetings between Lucas, Kasdan and Kershner during the ESB pre-production, it is obvious Lucas dismissed many feedback and ideas coming from either of them. Many of those ideas were not good in my opinion anyway. However, he did keep the good ones, which shows that he actually had a different mentality back then. And judging from his absence in these transcripts, Kurtz wasn’t even involved in these sessions.

Saying Kurtz and Kershner were in charge of ESB is rather silly. Lucas had pretty much everything under control. Even during the principal photography when minor changes were made to the script, Kershner actually phoned Lucas and he approved them.

And anyone would panic when time and cost of principal photography is doubled. Even major studios would freak out, let alone newly founded independent film company. I think Kurtz was quite rightfully fired for that.

Alderaan said:

and so it’s clear to me at least that George Lucas has the mind of a child and always had the mind of a child.

Maybe you should go watch THX1138.

Then you’ll see just how much of a fluke ANH was haha

You are entering the silly zone my friend.

Are you saying thx is a ‘good film’?

imperialscum said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

That is a misconception I would say. When you read the transcripts from meetings between Lucas, Kasdan and Kershner during the ESB pre-production, it is obvious Lucas dismissed many feedback and ideas coming from either of them. Many of those ideas were not good in my opinion anyway. However, he did keep the good ones, which shows that he actually had a different mentality back then. And judging from his absence in these transcripts, Kurtz wasn’t even involved in these sessions.

Saying Kurtz and Kershner were in charge of ESB is rather silly. Lucas had pretty much everything under control. Even during the principal photography when minor changes were made to the script, Kershner actually phoned Lucas and he approved them.

And anyone would panic when time and cost of principal photography is doubled. Even major studios would freak out, let alone newly founded independent film company. I think Kurtz was quite rightfully fired for that.

Alderaan said:

and so it’s clear to me at least that George Lucas has the mind of a child and always had the mind of a child.

Maybe you should go watch THX1138.

Then you’ll see just how much of a fluke ANH was haha

You are entering the silly zone my friend.

Are you saying thx is a ‘good film’?

That is right boy. That is the truth.

Subjective and I’m probably older than you pal

Oh god, every time I think this place can’t sink lower, something happens like me having to watch an argument between IP55 and impscum.

IP55 said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

Alderaan said:

[Haarspalter said:]
If you want to find out what George Lucas was thinking when he made the PT

He was thinking the same things he was thinking when he made the OT if you ask me. But there were no longer any constraints or people to reign him in.

I think if George could have, he would have made the originals exactly like he made the prequels.

I doubt that. He had practically no constraints in ESB and ROTJ as he held the rights to the sequels and was doing them with his own company. Even in ANH he had mostly free hands since the studio did not seem to care about the film prior to the release.

I would say it is mostly that in OT he actually had good ideas and was open to feedback from his collaborators.

Irvin made ESB what it was.

End

I love people who think the director is the only person responsible for the success or failure of a movie.

So the exec producer is. Yeah hitchcock, Sergio leone, coppola films etc weren’t down to direction!

The only people I love more than those who think the director is the

only

person responsible for the success or failure of a movie?

People who can’t be bothered to read.

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

Alderaan said:

[Haarspalter said:]
If you want to find out what George Lucas was thinking when he made the PT

He was thinking the same things he was thinking when he made the OT if you ask me. But there were no longer any constraints or people to reign him in.

I think if George could have, he would have made the originals exactly like he made the prequels.

I doubt that. He had practically no constraints in ESB and ROTJ as he held the rights to the sequels and was doing them with his own company. Even in ANH he had mostly free hands since the studio did not seem to care about the film prior to the release.

I would say it is mostly that in OT he actually had good ideas and was open to feedback from his collaborators.

Irvin made ESB what it was.

End

I love people who think the director is the only person responsible for the success or failure of a movie.

So the exec producer is. Yeah hitchcock, Sergio leone, coppola films etc weren’t down to direction!

The only people I love more than those who think the director is the

only

person responsible for the success or failure of a movie?

People who can’t be bothered to read.

"They can’t or they won’t?"

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

Alderaan said:

[Haarspalter said:]
If you want to find out what George Lucas was thinking when he made the PT

He was thinking the same things he was thinking when he made the OT if you ask me. But there were no longer any constraints or people to reign him in.

I think if George could have, he would have made the originals exactly like he made the prequels.

I doubt that. He had practically no constraints in ESB and ROTJ as he held the rights to the sequels and was doing them with his own company. Even in ANH he had mostly free hands since the studio did not seem to care about the film prior to the release.

I would say it is mostly that in OT he actually had good ideas and was open to feedback from his collaborators.

Irvin made ESB what it was.

End

I love people who think the director is the only person responsible for the success or failure of a movie.

So the exec producer is. Yeah hitchcock, Sergio leone, coppola films etc weren’t down to direction!

The only people I love more than those who think the director is the

only

person responsible for the success or failure of a movie?

People who can’t be bothered to read.

Did I ever say a director has sole responsibility? They certainly have a huge impact, if someone else directed the Shining or Blade Runner I’m sure they would have been very different beasts!

TV’s Frink said:

Oh god, every time I think this place can’t sink lower, something happens like me having to watch an argument between IP55 and impscum.

I’d much rather read your replies to everyone as if you are the fountain of knowledge? When clearly judging by some of your contradictory posts you clearly are not!

IP55 said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

Alderaan said:

[Haarspalter said:]
If you want to find out what George Lucas was thinking when he made the PT

He was thinking the same things he was thinking when he made the OT if you ask me. But there were no longer any constraints or people to reign him in.

I think if George could have, he would have made the originals exactly like he made the prequels.

I doubt that. He had practically no constraints in ESB and ROTJ as he held the rights to the sequels and was doing them with his own company. Even in ANH he had mostly free hands since the studio did not seem to care about the film prior to the release.

I would say it is mostly that in OT he actually had good ideas and was open to feedback from his collaborators.

Irvin made ESB what it was.

End

I love people who think the director is the only person responsible for the success or failure of a movie.

So the exec producer is. Yeah hitchcock, Sergio leone, coppola films etc weren’t down to direction!

The only people I love more than those who think the director is the

only

person responsible for the success or failure of a movie?

People who can’t be bothered to read.

Did I ever say a director has sole responsibility?

Yes, you did.

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

TV’s Frink said:

IP55 said:

imperialscum said:

Alderaan said:

[Haarspalter said:]
If you want to find out what George Lucas was thinking when he made the PT

He was thinking the same things he was thinking when he made the OT if you ask me. But there were no longer any constraints or people to reign him in.

I think if George could have, he would have made the originals exactly like he made the prequels.

I doubt that. He had practically no constraints in ESB and ROTJ as he held the rights to the sequels and was doing them with his own company. Even in ANH he had mostly free hands since the studio did not seem to care about the film prior to the release.

I would say it is mostly that in OT he actually had good ideas and was open to feedback from his collaborators.

Irvin made ESB what it was.

End

I love people who think the director is the only person responsible for the success or failure of a movie.

So the exec producer is. Yeah hitchcock, Sergio leone, coppola films etc weren’t down to direction!

The only people I love more than those who think the director is the

only

person responsible for the success or failure of a movie?

People who can’t be bothered to read.

Did I ever say a director has sole responsibility?

Yes, you did.

Are you thick? That says irvin was the making of it, not wholly responsible!

Fine. That’s not how it read to me.

“Made it what is was…END!!!” implies even more than that. But it’s probably just me being thick or something.

Was Irvin what made RoboCop 2 what it was, too?

I think the PT should be watched, atleast once. It gives backstory to our beloved Star Wars Universe.
Is it perfect, no, it’s not, but deserves a chance to be seen by anyone who wishes to watch them.
Should the PT be seen before OT? No, it shouldn’t, since it would ruin a spoil a lot of the key moments in the OT.

I’ll probably be destroyed for what I wrote, but whatever, it’s the Internet.

Sougouk said:

It gives backstory to our beloved Star Wars Universe.

Wholly unnecessary backstory, but sure.

imperialscum said:

It gives (to OT) damaging backstory,

I concur… A huge blemish

I’d go as far as one of the biggest cinematic fuck ups in history!