the ugnaught

Well I have some good news and bad news about my set.

Bad news: I am starting over from scratch.

Good news: The reason for this is because I just got a JVC HR-S9600.  Generally considered to be one of the best VCRs ever made.  Even the guy that runs digitalfaq.com uses it as his own personal VCR.

I just got it today and have run some test captures and they look GREAT! I think it is about as good as these NTSC tapes are going to look.

I hope to start flying through these episodes now ASAP.

pittrek, I will try and just get my stuff out there as the NTSC set.  My sources will be...

1-8 = Japanese video + UK audio

9 = Original recording from ABC in 1985 with original commercials (quality 5/10).

10-13 = Japanese video + UK audio

Great Heep = UK PAL tape all the way.  I may need to use your guys recordings for this if they turn out great.

I have no real plans for Ewoks right now.

Moth3r said:

retartedted said:

Here is an untouched example of the NTSC tape.  http://www.sendspace.com/file/nxlmqn

Do you know of any good methods for IVTC that don't make the footage choppy with Avisynth?  

The only good methods I have found have been Virtualdub filters, and I would rather get the majority of the load done with Avisynth if possible.

But if push comes to shove I guess I could just use Virtualdubs IVTC.

For some reason, AviSynth was reading the file as bottom field first, when it should be TFF. Insert a AssumeTff() command in your script before the IVTC, and the frame order is correct.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/f6ev2h

This is just a quick manual IVTC using DoubleWeave().Pulldown(0,2); automatic methods such as decomb or TIVTC would be more appropriate if there are any cadence changes in the video.

(I've applied a levels tweak as well, this is my preference but of course YMMV)

thanks!

MattMahdi said:

retartedted said:

Do you have the Ewoks 'On the Run' DVD set?  All I want off of that is the 'Ewoks and Droids Adventure Hour' Intro.  Kind of hard to spend 30 bucks just for that though.

Interjection from a lurker: I'd never heard of the "On the Run" DVDs. Just found them via Google. Is it in any way a legitimate outfit?

I assume that the answer is NO, otherwise you folks wouldn't be doing all this work (which, from the samples, looks just amazing).

Just pondering...

The source for all 'OTR' episodes are the PAL tapes.  You can see the same frame blending on the episodes.  Not sure where they got their version of Coby but it is the best I have seen so far.

If you go back to post #95 in this thread you will see the logo there in the bottom right corner of literally every second of footage on their DVD set.  It will pretty much drive you insane trying to watch the episodes.

And I agree with Video Collector, both of the sets being produced will be superior to their set because of this reason alone.

MattMahdi said:

A less random question.

How faithful to the original broadcasts are the four Ewoks and Droids spliced-together "movies"?

The story-line is exactly 100% the same.

What was changed from the original airings to the DVD sets are:

• Original Cartoon openings with music theme removed, replaced with reused or new footage to make it feel like a movie opening as opposed to a tv opening.
• Music has been changed almost across the board throughout the episodes.
• New sound effects.
• Scenes in front of and after a commercial break and shortened to make it feel as if there was no cliffhanger during the commercial break.
• No title cards before episodes.
• Credits have been completely changed as well with different music.

Things that remained the same:

• Voice acting
• plot
• pacing/editing of the scenes not described above.

All of the changes really gives it the feel of a straight to video movie release, as opposed to TV episodes.

Video Collector said:

retartedted said:

Video Collector, what are you guys using for the Coby episode?

The "missing" Ewoks and Droids episodes are all sourced from the On the run NTSC DVDs. They are markedly inferior to the PAL captures, but better than nothing. *shrug*

What are you using for Great Heep?

I will be using the PAL UK VHS, as there is really no better source.  There was a Mexican VHS released for the Great Heep but that is virtually impossible to find.

For Coby I actually have a recording of the original ABC airing with the original commercials.  The quality is about a 6/10 though.  But it could be a cool little bonus episode to include I guess.

Do you have the Ewoks 'On the Run' DVD set?  All I want off of that is the 'Ewoks and Droids Adventure Hour' Intro.  Kind of hard to spend 30 bucks just for that though.

Moth3r said:

retartedted said:

I have read time and time again on places like videohelp, doom9 and digitalfaq that if you have an originally interlaced source (VHS) and you plan on displaying it on an interlaced device (dvd + tv) then don't de-interlace. 

This is good advice, as you say for interlaced sources.

However this material is not interlaced, it's telecined. For telecined sources it is preferable to IVTC, if you can.

Here is an untouched example of the NTSC tape.  http://www.sendspace.com/file/nxlmqn

Do you know of any good methods for IVTC that don't make the footage choppy with Avisynth?  

The only good methods I have found have been Virtualdub filters, and I would rather get the majority of the load done with Avisynth if possible.

But if push comes to shove I guess I could just use Virtualdubs IVTC.

Video Collector, what are you guys using for the Coby episode?

Personally I have restarted my project so many times from either finding new sources or just a new way to capture/encode/restore.  It really is like peeling an onion. But I think that I am finally at the end game.  

I have decided to just do a slightly cleaned up, interlaced, 30fps DVD set. More of a straight up preservation than anything.  And then if people want to rip the episodes and IVTC, denoise and warp sharp the heck out of them then that is up to the particular person.  

I have read time and time again on places like videohelp, doom9 and digitalfaq that if you have an originally interlaced source (VHS) and you plan on displaying it on an interlaced device (dvd + tv) then don't de-interlace.  You aren't doing yourself any favors. Not to mention that it can make certain scenes stutter, as the frames are reduced.  For instance a scene where it will pan from left to right or zoom in/out. It can be very noticeable with cheap animation as there wasn't many frames drawn to being with. 

Obviously you would want to de-interlace if making an mp4/mkv/avi set, but for a DVD set it isn't needed.  Now the PAL set where there is some pretty nasty frame blending I could see IVTC as necessary too. But with the NTSC sources it isn't as big of a problem.

In the end I am going to try and fit it all on two dual layer discs.  

These were recorded with my personal PAL vcr.  It is kind of an old piece of junk (Panasonic NV-SD25, with mono only audio).  My NTSC captures are nicer.

The captures that we had professionally done were not all that great.  They introduced a number of frame blending problems, as well as quite a bit of pixelation. 

I have NTSC tapes for episodes 1-8 and 10-13.  Here are raw captures of the Japanese NTSC tapes untouched with any editing other than an IVTC to do some decombing.

Where your captures could come in really handy is if you are able to get a good capture of The Great Heep.  As there is no NTSC tapes of that (that I am aware of). 

This particular instance may just be the noise on the CRT screen that is being filmed, no?  Are there other examples of this noise throughout the laserdisc?

Wow.  That turned out pretty good Moth3r.

Moth3r said:

retartedted said:

There is some terrible frame blending going on with the horrible NTSC-> PAL conversion.  Although the audio tracks are the best out there for english.  And it is one of the only versions of The Great Heap on tape.

Can you post a short sample? The blending may be partially repairable with AnimeIVTC or Srestore.

But the Japanese video may still end up looking better.

Here is a link to a short clip of the UK tapes.  It is being played as 25fps PAL and recorded as 25fps PAL so no conversion taking place. From what I understand from sites like videohelp.com etc.. is that there were some terrible NTSC->PAL conversions done back in the day with hardcoded frame blending done on the conversions.  So it is what it is more or less. 

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=MDGX13V5

I actually have a recording of the ABC airing of Coby.  The quality is about a 6/10.  If anything the mexican tape could provide a nice clean audio track for Coby!  I am still keeping my eyes open for it too.

I am still gathering all of my sources together to see if I can produce a quality set.  Not giving up yet!

FYI, I think that I have moved on from using the UK tapes as the video master.  There is some terrible frame blending going on with the horrible NTSC-> PAL conversion.  Although the audio tracks are the best out there for english.  And it is one of the only versions of The Great Heap on tape.

The Japanese tapes have proven to be much better video masters.  It is very easy to perform an IVTC on them resulting in blend-free progressive video.  The only problem being that the video and UK audio don't always match up (commercial breaks and what not) so you have to keep going in and cutting up the audio track all over the place.

I am thinking about getting together what I have and releasing an MKV/MP4 set just to get something out there.  Not sure if I have the energy for a DVD set as this project has already taken me almost 2 years.  I am beginning to understand why so many people have attempted to make a Droids set and quit before releasing anything :(

I think that this is the tape that has Coby on it.  As you can see on the back cover it says that it is subtitled. 

I actually bought a copy of this off of ebay for a hundred bucks and then the guy fell through on delivering it.  oh well :(

Droids 3 was the tape the had Coby on it.  Although, from what I can gather it appears that the Mexican tapes may have hardcoded Spanish subtitles.  :(

Do you have any of the Droids or Ewoks stuff on VHS?  Not the edited versions?

Ok, after some further digging, it looks like Maclord is now Panasonic.  So I think this may be related to some of the marketing that Lucas did in Japan in the late 80's.  Still a very odd VHS tape if I do say so myself. 

Stuff like these commercials...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHwhg8xpnyA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWY54u-EA2Y

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jfuY685b08

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-T95f9ctsVw

I was wandering around on the Yahoo Japanese Auction site and found this video for roughly $250 US dollars.

So it must be somewhat rare, as I can’t find anything on it.

http://page4.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/d115306311

Here is a link to the photos in case the auction disappears.

http://imgur.com/a/OknJG

The Panasonic AG-1980 is generally considered to be the best player at salvaging old tapes.  Whether SP, LP or EP.  Apparently you can throw just about anything at it.  And it has a built in TBC.

The JVC decks are generally thought to be better at already crisp SP tapes.

I usually point people at slyck.com

That site has been a good resource for newbies for years.  Nice and quick and to the point.

Their list of index sites is about 3-4 years old, but the general description of bitorrent and how to get started is solid.

http://www.slyck.com/bt.php

I miss the days when MySpleen was full to the brim with Star Wars related content.  As well as hard to find cartoons and what not.  

The past couple years have just sort of felt like the only new content was Adult Swim stuff and a few comedians everyone liked (David Cross, Patton Oswalt a Zach Galifianakis).

I would love to see a return to form.

I actually may have a Star Wars related project of my own to upload there soon.

aaand the copy of the Mexican VHS tapes are a no go ;(

Good news, I may have a copy of the Mexican VHS in hand soon!

Thanks boondockmickey, we may be in need of your services later!

But for now we are just waiting on our raw captures and to take a look at what we got.

Do you have much experience with video cleanup?

Yeah, I gotta see this pic.  I remember negatives project from a while ago, and getting the link to the private board, and then nothing ever happening.

Would love to know of any progress.