MaestroDavros

Super stoked for this! ROTJ was my favorite film of the trilogy growing up, and still has a place in my heart (the Emperor is my favorite villain) but with maturity came an understanding of its flaws. I feel this will be the most complex of the trilogy to Revisit, but knowing what Ady has accomplished already with the previous edits I know it can be done.

One small thing that I would like to recommend. Even though the “Palace Musical Number” scene is being reverted back to the 1983 cut (Lapti Nek forever), I always liked the added scenes of Oola in the rancor pit; I think they worked surprisingly well by expanding on the scene but still leaving the rancor largely a mystery. I personally would prefer to see those scenes remain, but it’s not the end of the world if they go.

Best of luck, and I hope to be helpful and constructive on my part.

Jesta’ said:

MaestroDavros said:

Jesta’ said:

yotsuya said:

The Doctor Who restoration team had a fantastic frame interpretation process. But if it is one frame, that would be easy enough to do in Photoshop. I looked and I didn’t see it. What is the GOUT frame number?

VidFire has some major limitations. If I recall correctly all of the Time Meddler, some shots from Tomb, and episode 5 of The Ambassadors of Death couldn’t be vidfire’d do to frame rate issues. Then again, 30mm isn’t a pal 16mm telerecording with NTSC color!

I’m a bit of a VidFIRE nerd, and a fan of the Restoration Team’s work, so I think this post might be of some interest.

Regarding Ambassadors 5, I have never seen the VHS in person (saw a poor quality copy years back), but my understanding is that 2-4, 7 did not undergo the process (Ambassadors 1 still exists in its original format), but 5 & 6 did, simply because of time constraints caused by uncertainties regarding which scenes in the other episodes would be in color, and in the end those were presented in a hybrid B&W/Color format. That being said, the DVD release is presented in full color, and 2-7 have all undergone the VidFIRE process.

Tomb of the Cyberman, excepting an easter egg, was not given the VidFIRE process on the original DVD release, which to my understanding was due to uncertainties that the process would work correctly once the masters underwent MPEG-2 compression (it worked of course, and the story later received a special edition with the full process).

The only stories to not undergo VidFIRE for the DVD range were The Crusades: Episode 1 (The Lion) and all of The Time Meddler. This was because of the poor quality of the telerecordings available, and as a result a belief that the illusion of it being from a tape/electronic source would be broken.

That being said, the VidFIRE process CAN be used on film sequences, and rather convincingly apparently, even if not intended. The original DVD release of The Seeds of Death accidentally VidFIRE’d everything, causing it to receive a special edition to correct this (and add more bonus features of course). Typically the process only touches the studio scenes; the film sequences are left alone as they would have originally been at the lower frame-rate anyway. Also, another rule utilized was in essence, if it originally was shot with an electronic camera, it gets VidFIRE’d, regardless of whether it was originally printed to film or tape (some 60s episodes were actually shot with electronic camera’s to 35mm film, not tape, either because of unavailability of tape machines that week, complex editing, or both).

So VidFIRE is a powerful tool*, and many of it’s weaknesses come more from it’s purpose of application rather than flaws in its process, although there are some dodgy areas on rare occasions, especially in the earlier days of its use.

*VidFIRE is actually a combination of many different tools, although the identities of which are kept a “trade secret” of sorts

You should check out Ambassadors on DVD, sure it’s a bit pricey for a region 1 copy, but it’s well worth the price.

Heh, sorry if I didn’t clarify myself, but I already am a proud owner of that DVD. I was lucky enough to get all of the B&W and some of the color stories before they went out of print here. Now it’s just a long slog to grab the remaining R1 Classic Who DVD’s; out of print or otherwise.

Anyways, in regards to fixes, one error I noticed long before I joined the forums, and still exists in v2.7 is the shot starting at about 13:07 (the long shot of the Jawa’s carrying R2-D2 to the sandcrawler). The error in question is that the furthest-most mountain in the shot in the 1977 version has a stunning reflection/shadow of the light of the sunset hitting it. This was altered (in '97?) to crush it out as part of the effort to make the shot look like it was set at twilight. Unfortunately, this hasn’t been restored in any of the version of Despecialized, and would be great to see restored to its former glory in v3.0

Jesta’ said:

yotsuya said:

The Doctor Who restoration team had a fantastic frame interpretation process. But if it is one frame, that would be easy enough to do in Photoshop. I looked and I didn’t see it. What is the GOUT frame number?

VidFire has some major limitations. If I recall correctly all of the Time Meddler, some shots from Tomb, and episode 5 of The Ambassadors of Death couldn’t be vidfire’d do to frame rate issues. Then again, 30mm isn’t a pal 16mm telerecording with NTSC color!

I’m a bit of a VidFIRE nerd, and a fan of the Restoration Team’s work, so I think this post might be of some interest.

Regarding Ambassadors 5, I have never seen the VHS in person (saw a poor quality copy years back), but my understanding is that 2-4, 7 did not undergo the process (Ambassadors 1 still exists in its original format), but 5 & 6 did, simply because of time constraints caused by uncertainties regarding which scenes in the other episodes would be in color, and in the end those were presented in a hybrid B&W/Color format. That being said, the DVD release is presented in full color, and 2-7 have all undergone the VidFIRE process.

Tomb of the Cyberman, excepting an easter egg, was not given the VidFIRE process on the original DVD release, which to my understanding was due to uncertainties that the process would work correctly once the masters underwent MPEG-2 compression (it worked of course, and the story later received a special edition with the full process).

The only stories to not undergo VidFIRE for the DVD range were The Crusades: Episode 1 (The Lion) and all of The Time Meddler. This was because of the poor quality of the telerecordings available, and as a result a belief that the illusion of it being from a tape/electronic source would be broken.

That being said, the VidFIRE process CAN be used on film sequences, and rather convincingly apparently, even if not intended. The original DVD release of The Seeds of Death accidentally VidFIRE’d everything, causing it to receive a special edition to correct this (and add more bonus features of course). Typically the process only touches the studio scenes; the film sequences are left alone as they would have originally been at the lower frame-rate anyway. Also, another rule utilized was in essence, if it originally was shot with an electronic camera, it gets VidFIRE’d, regardless of whether it was originally printed to film or tape (some 60s episodes were actually shot with electronic camera’s to 35mm film, not tape, either because of unavailability of tape machines that week, complex editing, or both).

So VidFIRE is a powerful tool*, and many of it’s weaknesses come more from it’s purpose of application rather than flaws in its process, although there are some dodgy areas on rare occasions, especially in the earlier days of its use.

*VidFIRE is actually a combination of many different tools, although the identities of which are kept a “trade secret” of sorts

ZaneFlare92 said:

Forgive me if I sound crazy about this, I swear I’m not lol. I remember a couple years ago watching breath smoke test for the the first few minutes of dialogue on Hoth. I thought it was a cool new effect and added a sense of coldness to Hoth. It was on Youtube. I assume it got taken down due to copyright. I was expecting when first watching ESB:R then nothing. So I was just wondering if anyone know’s why this didn’t make the cut, or maybe it was for another fan edit ? Other then that it was amazing through and through. 9 years of work defiantly paid off and it showed.

I vaguely remember Ady addressing this a couple times years ago. Essentially, the gist of it was that after deliberating on it for a bit he felt that the effect wasn’t realistic enough, and subsequently felt it was too distracting and dropped it. I certainly recall that the YouTube video noted it was an FX test that may or may not be used in the final product and nothing more.

Of course, stuff like this is always interesting to track IMO, especially with a project with such a long gestation as ESB:R.

In the spirit of Blu-Ray fixes, something I noticed: the shot of R2-D2 is reversed (like I assume it always has been) at around 1:01:03. Knowing that Ady seems to despise reversed shots I was wondering if that was intentionally left alone or if that is an error.

To Ady and all who made this possible, thank you. Watching this edit was everything I dreamed of and more. Just like ANH:R a decade ago, it accomplished what three Lucas helmed attempts never could: make a Special Edition with changes that were not only enjoyable and logical, but fun as well. This will be my go-to version from now on, and I can’t wait to see what the future will bring. It may have been 9 long years, but it was DEFINITELY worth the wait. Again, thank you, and may the force be with you, always.

Possessed said:

I think since suggestions have been closed for a long time we should just take what ady gives us.

In the end I wholeheartedly agree. Even if nothing is done, the end result promises to be stunning.

ray_afraid said:

I gotta say, this is what has me thinking this could be a hoax.
I just can’t see Ady sayin’ “Well, the costume didn’t work. I give up.” and just leaving this flaw unchanged.
But, maybe that’s the best option. I certainly don’t have any ideas on how to fix it without the new suit.

I might agree (especially as it wouldn’t be the first time Ady has done this), but I took the winking as more of an emphasis on “The Curse of the Wampa”.

Regardless I will admit that I was quite surprised to learn that Ady was attempting a full body suit rather than just using the head as a puppet. Surely a puppet would be a lot easier, and considering how brief the 3 shots of the wampa that Ady is trying to replace are would be more doable especially considering how well the puppet in the original version was pulled off.

I’m not really here to give suggestions at this late in the game, but here I go anyway: there are two realistic options if replacing the shots is still a go. 1, use the head as a puppet for the new shots (and I would assume realistic movement could be pulled off), or 2, take one of the two original puppet shots, insert the cave background, maybe digitally manipulate it a bit (speed, digital morphing, etc.) and call it a day.

Of course he could be pulling our leg, but we’ll find out soon enough.

I’ve been a long time lurker, but wanted to say how much I have admired what Ady has done with this fan edit. It truly is a work of art as well as a labor of love and has been worth all the delays. From everything we’ve seen it seems to “ask the impossible”: take a beloved, nearly perfect film and bring it closer to true perfection than anyone else likely could. Congrats on your hard work Ady, and I think I speak for all of us in that we are immensely looking forward to the finished product.