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topdawg193

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Join date
28-May-2008
Last activity
19-Jul-2022
Posts
128

Post History

Post
#1492570
Topic
OLD BEN: An Obi-Wan Kenobi Fan Edit [ABANDONED]
Time

This edit is shaping up to be a really terrific interpretation of the Obi-Wan story! I can’t wait for its release!

Having watched the preview with the Inquisitors, I found the sudden appearance of the Grand Inquisitor in the saloon too abrupt - jarringly so. Also, the spatial logic of our characters’ placement becomes confused; we see the ship’s shadow pass over Obi-Wan’s face, and yet we then have cutaways to Obi-Wan during the confrontation in the saloon implying that he can see these events. But given the lack of any establishing shot that places Obi-Wan near the saloon, and the ship’s shadow implying that Obi-Wan is further away from the saloon (as the ship did not park straight outside), it feels very odd and unnatural to this viewer.

My suggestion would be:

1.) Retain the Inquisitors’ march from the ship to the saloon; it serves as an effective introduction to these characters, and the slower pace that it creates is more in-keeping with the BB/BCS sensibility.
2.) Remove all Owen and Ben cutaways during the saloon confrontation. These feel clumsy and introduce spatial illogic; besides, when we cut to Owen and Ben looking up at the hanged Jedi afterwards, and when Owen says to Ben to “keep his distance” (genius!), we gain their observations on the saloon events here and achieve all that we need in terms of character motivation.
3.) Allow the Grand Inquisitor’s speech to play out in full (again, very in-keeping with BB/BCS) before cutting away when Reva kills the fugitive Jedi (a master stroke!).

Just my two cents; this edit really is going to be something special though, the editing choices are incredibly clever (love the new opening, and the transition from the toy being gifted to the toy being thrown back at Obi-Wan - really great stuff!).

Post
#1491255
Topic
KENOBI: A STAR WARS STORY [The Radical "Help Me Obi-Wan Kenobi" Cut]
Time

I’m still trying to make my mind up about Obi-Wan letting Vader live; I do think it was an intentional thematic decision, because it dovetails with Obi-Wan’s remark to the escapees that “You’re what needs to survive now” and his reassuring Reva that our choices in the here and now, and not the past, are what define us. My interpretation was - Obi-Wan is done with the old fight, and he’s no longer going to allow himself to be haunted by Anakin; instead, he has finally embraced Qui-Gon’s teaching of the “living Force”. At the end of his arc, Obi-Wan has become altogether more passive; accepting; fatalistic - which coheres with the character’s actions in ANH, when he chooses to sacrifice himself as opposed to fight Vader tooth and nail.

But!..

If an edit was to be attempted that gave Obi-Wan a more explicit reason NOT to kill Vader; could Obi-Wan sensing Luke in danger not be used? Bring Obi-Wan’s visions of Luke’s peril further forward, so that he senses this soon after Vader is defeated and so rushes away more immediately after their duel? It would probably entail losing the “So long, Darth” line - which is shame!

Post
#1453398
Topic
Star Wars: A New Hope DEVASTATOR EDITION (V.1 RELEASED)
Time

That guy with no name said:

Houston we have a problem.
So today I was removing all the lighsaber/explosion jumpcuts, It’s been going great except for one shot in the movie: the Ben hut ignition. I’ve been yanking my hair out trying to figure out a way to fix that, I’ve tried everything! how did Adywan do that one? all the other shots will be fixed except for this shot, But I will still fix threepio’s shift in that shot.

Even in the ‘fixed’ shots, I’ve always felt that a more natural flow would be achieved by having a flash of light occur when the lightsaber is ignited - to draw the eye and mask any residual jumpiness or stiffness in the shot. The flash could occur at the hilt of the lightsaber, or else occur over the entirety of the frame; and despite not being visually continuous with how lightsabers are otherwise ignited across the saga, the flash could be explained away by the fact that Anakin’s lightsaber hadn’t been used in nearly two decades (and so was operating irregularly, as a result).

This project looks great - all the teaser clips and images look fantastic!

Post
#1103858
Topic
STAR WARS: EP VI -RETURN OF THE JEDI &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - ** PRODUCTION HAS NOW RESTARTED **
Time

gazzatrek said:

  1. 'not sure if this is even ‘fixable’ but it has ALWAYS bothered me:
    in ANH Threepio says he’s
    "just a translator,and not very good at telling stories…'or at least at making them interesting…"
    yet in ROTJ he regales the Ewok village with stories of our heroes adventures to date-with sound effects and everything! did he get a 'storyteller upgrade?? 'As I said I’ve not a clue how you’d fix this but it’s always stuck out as a huge contradiction…(?)

Ah, that has always been my favourite moment in ROTJ! I read that scene as deliberately harkening back to Threepio’s line in ANH. This reference serves to illustrate just how much the droid has experienced since ANH - far beyond typical protocol! - and at the same time mythologises our heroes; cementing their exploits in legend. Witnessing the Ewoks rapt, enthralled by Threepio’s tale, reinforces the exceptional journey of our heroes; and this makes plausible Rey’s regard of Luke Skywalker as “myth”, in The Force Awakens.

Post
#1024604
Topic
Rogue One crawl
Time

Having taken some time to consider the crawl, I’ve worked up a second draft:


The Jedi are all but extinct, the Republic has crumbled, and the Galactic Empire’s terrible reign falls like a shadow across the stars.

Daring to oppose the imperial battalions, a bold REBEL ALLIANCE seeks to unite planets against the Empire. Division is rife, and conflict threatens to engulf the galaxy.

Meanwhile, deep in the Outer Rim, the ruthless Director Krennic has discovered the location of an old ally - one who holds the key to securing the Empire’s terrifying rule…


I’ve included this redraft in my original post, too. I reckon it’s my preferred version.

Post
#1024333
Topic
Rogue One crawl
Time

My first swing at a Rogue One crawl, contouring #1:


The Jedi are all but extinct, the Republic has crumbled, and the Galactic Empire’s terrible reign falls like a shadow over the stars.

A bold REBEL ALLIANCE dares to defy the imperial forces; but as fractures widen and hostilities escalate, conflict threatens to engulf the galaxy.

Deep in the Outer Rim, the dastardly Director Krennic has discovered the location of a long lost ally – one who holds the key to securing the Empire’s terrifying rule…


With my amendments, I wanted to:

1.) Communicate the precarious state of the galaxy at this juncture. The Rebels are scattered and disorganised - yet to become a unified opposition to the Empire - furthering unrest in the galaxy, and threatening any hope of peace.
2.) Cast Galen Erso as an old ally of Krennic’s, and not as an old friend. Secondary sources aside, there is scant evidence in the film of much friendship enjoyed between the two.
3.) Omit mention of the Death Star or any sort of imperial weapon, for the sake of aligning the audience’s discovery with that of the characters.

EDIT - Having taken some time to consider the crawl, I’ve worked up a second draft:


The Jedi are all but extinct, the Republic has crumbled, and the Galactic Empire’s terrible reign falls like a shadow across the stars.

Daring to oppose the imperial battalions, a bold REBEL ALLIANCE seeks to unite planets against the Empire. Division is rife, and conflict threatens to engulf the galaxy.

Meanwhile, deep in the Outer Rim, the ruthless Director Krennic has discovered the location of an old ally - one who holds the key to securing the Empire’s terrifying rule…


Post
#978432
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

ray_afraid said:

Someone makes a lighthearted joke and you all bust out the torches and carry it for over two pages. Good grief.
Does anybody enjoy coming here anymore? I’m asking seriously.

Yup, I took Nick66’s first comment as obviously playful. And surely his subsequent comments have clarified that beyond all doubt!? I know it’s taken as read that tone can be hard to glean online, but I think this is as clear as it could ever get!

At any rate, I laughed!

Post
#944578
Topic
The Force Awakens : Fan Edit Ideas
Time

So I figured I’d throw my hat in the ring!


A fledgling REPUBLIC struggles to keep peace. The sinister FIRST ORDER, an imperial remnant, has seized territory and threatens to envelop the galaxy in chaos.

General Leia Organa leads a brave RESISTANCE inside enemy space. But Luke Skywalker, the last Jedi, has vanished – and without his help this fight is futile.

Desperate to find her brother, Leia has sent her most daring pilot on a secret mission to Jakku. There, an old ally has discovered a clue to Luke’s whereabouts…


With this crawl, my prime objectives were:

1.) Clarify the sociopolitical context of the film.
2.) Reestablish the convention of ANH’s and ESB’s crawls - which open with an explanation of the wider situation (“It is a period of civil war”, “It is a dark time for the Rebellion”).

In respect to 1.), I think that the film’s events only make sense if the war between the Resistance and the First Order is interpreted as a proxy war - with the Resistance merely supported by the Republic, but nevertheless operating autonomously and in non-Republic space. General Hux, himself, states that the Republic is a “government that supports the Resistance” - and Maz Kanata mentions that the First Order is an expansionist project, “spreading its shadow across the galaxy”. So, the conflict would appear to be one of containment - the Republic subscribes to a domino theory, and seeks to limit the First Order’s influence in the galaxy by pushing back territorially via guerrilla means. The crawl should express this as best as it can.

And with 2.), while “Luke Skywalker has vanished” does make for a dramatic opening line, the Star Wars movies have always been about personal journeys projected against a larger struggle. They’re war movies - the state of war hangs over everything, and propels both characters and narrative. Emphasising wartime at the start of the crawl, then, lends this epic quality - broadening the film’s scope.

For this reason, among others, I also rewrote ROTJ’s crawl:


The Alliance is doomed. Retreating to the outer rim, the Rebels prepare for a final strike against the tyrannical Empire.

Sensing victory, Lord Vader has overseen the construction of a new Death Star – this ultimate weapon, once completed, will secure the Emperor’s spiteful reign.

With hope fading, Luke Skywalker journeys to Nal Varr in an attempt to rescue Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt…


Post
#944284
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

It’s hard to believe that I’ve been lurking around OT.com since 2008! I’m by no means a massive participator on these boards – and I never allow myself to become overtly social on any online forum, perhaps a failing on my part – so it’s a little surprising to me that Ady’s leaving has come as a real gut punch.

Pontificating in the Revisited threads has been an absolute pleasure. Ady’s projects introduced me to the art of fan editing – and to fandom, generally. His work spiked my enthusiasm for Star Wars when it had flat lined. So, this feels like the close of a personal journey. As hokey as that might sound!

At its best, this was a terrific sounding board. Ady is a fan edit auteur - extraordinaire. Unarguably! Revisited is his, and his alone. But it wouldn’t be undue to claim that the debates waged on this forum – the suggestions given and feedback offered, to such a depth as only true fanatics can provide (I used to think I was alone! What an outlet I found here!) – came to shape Revisited for the better. I believe, absolutely, that the final outcome of Ady’s hard work will have been improved by the countless thoughts expressed here.

Going forward, I hope that Ady will make use of a platform that could recapture OT.com’s spirit of collaboration. Otherwise, without the fluid communication enjoyed here, future Revisited projects will suffer in the end.

I don’t spend enough time on this forum to really offer any valid opinion on where-things-went-wrong. I honestly never noticed an influx of undesirables – and I don’t intend that as a put down to the regulars! (With a wretched hive such as this, what’s one or two more villains!?) Personally, I find it beyond easy to just scroll past daft comments; I’ve never gotten super vexed by anything I’ve read online, but I concede that it can become distracting when such posts are too numerous and too frequent. Moderation has always seemed a bit loose, here. What I can speak to, is the forum’s UI. This is by far the least user-friendly forum I’ve encountered - especially as regards navigation.

But hey ho. I’d hope that it’s not too late for OT.com to turn things around.

‘Cause I’m a creature of habit, man. Dig – I’m Pavlov’s dawg. I hits the bookmark, I gets my fix. I don’t wanna be hittin’ up no strange URL. I ain’t gots no time for that Googlin’ jive. Ain’t nobody teachin’ this dawg new tricks, sahn.

Church.

Post
#907833
Topic
The Unofficial Complete REVISITED SAGA Ideas and Random Discussion Thread
Time

ray_afraid said:

^Love every bit of that. Except that I can’t see the post you linked to because I’m not a member at fenedit.

Here’s links to the specific images I found; concept art for Nal Hutta that broadly captures what I would envision for Tatooine’s replacement planet in ROTJ:

http://www.hauntedgamecafe.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/edge-of-the-empire-lords-of-nal-hutta-04.jpg

http://img.xooimage.com/files42/e/a/7/nal-hutta-3-17e5bd6.jpg

http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/0/4881/889035-swtor9.jpg

http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/0/4881/896249-swtor.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/massively.joystiq.com/media/2009/02/ss_20090213_002small.jpg

^ And one of the creatures in this last image could make a suitable replacement for the goofy, burping alien in that establishing shot of Jabba’s Palace.

Apologies for the excessive linkage! I’m a bit of a dolt, and haven’t yet sussed how to embed images…

TavorX said:

What about Nar Shaddaa? It’s supposedly the moon of Nal Hutta. I don’t have issue with Nal Varr (I presume you’re mimicking “Rhen Varr”), but just thought it wouldn’t hurt to use a planet from Legends that has history. I agree not to use Nal Hutta. For one, always found the name kinda stupid, and second, due to the reasons you already brought up, topdawg.

Ah, I’m largely ignorant of the EU! So that was just coincidence - I borrowed the “Nal” from “Nal Hutta” (which I only discovered by googling “Hutt homeworld”), and came up with “Nal Varr” by loosely playing on the sound of “nowhere”. I do like two word planet names - Nal Hutta, Nar Shaddaa. But I thought it might be best to have ROTJ’s new planet remain EU-neutral. While I don’t really care much for the EU, and have only a passing knowledge of wider Star Wars lore, I appreciate that other fans are very well steeped. So, having Jabba’s planet become an established EU world could make it harder for EU fans to get on board - especially as the environmental demands for this new planet would be quite specific.

To illustrate - I actually am aware of Nar Shaddaa, because of the Jedi Knight PC games I played as a kid! It’s literally the only non-movie planet I could name off the top of my head! And so I know that it’s an urban, cityscape world - similar to Coruscant. Seeing as Jabba’s planet in ROTJ couldn’t feasibly be transformed into such an evironment, I figured that calling the planet “Nar Shaddaa” would be confusing for those viewers familiar with Nar Shaddaa’s aesthetic in the EU.

Of course, the movies aren’t beholden to the EU - and definitely shouldn’t be; if anything, it should be the other way around. And I realise that large swathes of the EU are now “Legends”, anyway. But regardless, if we can avoid any and all contradictions with previously established mythology by making Jabba’s planet an innovation, then I think that would be the way to go.

Post
#898574
Topic
The Unofficial Complete REVISITED SAGA Ideas and Random Discussion Thread
Time

ray_afraid said:

I’m with topdawg193 all the way. I’ve always thought it would be interesting if Jabbas palace was on a tropical jungle kinda planet.

WheresBlackhawk said:

Since Jaba is a big slug anyway… what about changing Tatooine into a marshland? Since Dagobah is already a swamp, you don’t want to go THAT far, but it would probably be easier to turn the desert-scape into a marsh than anything else.

I started a thread over at FanEdit Forums, to discuss this new structure for ROTJ in more detail; a member of that forum, DigModiFicaTion, made a great point about Jabba’s hideout on Tatooine - along the same lines as you, Blackhawk:

I think Jabba’s base of operations should be on a planet that is more uniform with his physical make up. It doesn’t make sense that a slimy slug creature that, I assume, needs to stay wet and mucousy resides on a planet that is so inhospitably dry and devoid of moisture.

Before now, I hadn’t thought about how Jabba’s physiology doesn’t even fit with his surroundings on Tatooine! Slugs need moisture, so it absolutely makes sense that Jabba’s preferred habitat would be somewhere dank and soggy - hardly a desert world!

I’m imagining a marsh planet, too. And in fact, I stumbled on some Nal Hutta concept art which, as it so happens, really captures what I’d envision for Jabba’s bog. I wonder if the artists thought along similar lines, matching Jabba’s physical constitution to the environment which would best support that? And ray_afraid - the art definitely conveys a colourful, tropical aesthetic; so although fundamentally a marshland, the colours would lend a nice variety to the film.

You can check it out in my post here:
http://www.fanedit.org/forums/showthread.php?15380-Return-of-the-Jedi-New-Structure-Space-Battle-Opening/page2.

After fielding suggestions on that forum, I was able to put forward a new crawl draft:

The Alliance is doomed. Retreating to the outer rim, the Rebels prepare for a final strike against the tyrannical Empire.

Sensing victory, Lord Vader has overseen the construction of a new Death Star – this ultimate weapon, once completed, will secure the Emperor’s spiteful reign.

With hope fading, Luke Skywalker journeys to Nal Varr in an attempt to rescue Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt…

I swapped out “Nal Hutta” for “Nal Varr”, which I thought sounded suitably Star Warsy! Although I like the Nal Hutta concept art, and would imagine Jabba’s planet in ROTJ to look like that, I wouldn’t want Jabba’s locale to actually be the Hutt home world. Because again - if our heroes know, by the end of ESB, that Han is to be delivered to Jabba the Hutt, then the first place they’d check out would presumably be Jabba’s home planet of Nal Hutta. And if that’s where Han was indeed taken, then the passage of time between ESB and ROTJ wouldn’t make sense. Or at least, it would make our heroes look dense, if it took them so long to check out Jabba’s place of origin - the most logical place to look, in the first instance.

Post
#895142
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

I’m throwing all sorts of spanners in the works lately, but this idea came to me and it might be something to consider - especially if audio is the current focus of ESB:R.

The new look Emperor hologram for ESB:R is fantastic, and visually ties in well to ROTJ. But in ESB:SE, Ian McDiarmid’s line delivery is also wildly different compared to ROTJ. And it’s not really the delivery, so much as it is the register - his voice is far lower in ESB:SE, which is understandable given how much older he was at that point compared to his first appearance in 1983.

So I wondered if it would be effective to gently pitch McDiarmid’s dialogue up a notch. And perhaps some light EQing could bring him further in line with how he sounded in ROTJ. His voice is just so low and boomy in ESB:SE. Now sure, there might be an in-universe explanation for this discrepancy - the Emperor is chatting to Vader using an intergalactic communications device, and he’s been magnified (and amplified) to fill a large chamber. Those factors could definitely contribute to him sounding ‘boomier’ than in ROTJ, when we meet the Emperor in flesh.

But still - his voice is incredibly low by comparison. And so it might be worth considering a minimal re-pitch.

I’ve mocked this myself, by pitching the Emperor up by two semitones. I wasn’t working with an isolated dialogue track, so that meant pitching everything up by two semitones; background music and all. This makes it somewhat jenky - well, very jenky! But I think it’s fine as a proof-of-concept; just forgive any artefacts, and that slight ‘helium’ effect which creeps in!

To allow for comparison, I’ve included links below to the original, untouched ESB:SE Emperor audio; my pitched up Emperor audio; and audio from the Emperor’s first conversation with Vader in ROTJ. The aim was to try and achieve the closest match with the latter. Although it sounds somewhat wobbly - definitely wobbly! - I’d be hopeful that you could get a far closer result with an isolated dialogue track. “We have a new enemy: young Skywalker” and “He could destroy us” sound reasonably good, which gives me hope that a better result is possible.

EMPEROR DIALOGUE - ESB:SE - UNTOUCHED:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xzx86suesd9hbcs/Emperor Dialogue - ESB - Normal Pitch - Normal EQ.mp3?dl=0

EMPEROR DIALOGUE - ESB:SE - PITCHED UP TWO SEMITONES:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ho4mihxy5xii2mg/Emperor Dialogue - ESB - Pitched Up.mp3?dl=0

EMPEROR DIALOGUE - ROTJ - FIRST CONVERSATION WITH VADER:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1fz3oszukhpf48g/Emperor Dialogue - ROTJ - First Convo with Vader.mp3?dl=0

Post
#893609
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

I don’t know if any other UK members caught Sky Movies’ “Greatest Star Wars Moments”, but in that programme Anthony Daniels revealed a flub in ESB which I don’t recall mentioned on the forum before (and so don’t know if Adywan’s fixed for Revisited). But when Han and Leia’s kiss aboard the Falcon is interrupted by 3PO, who taps Han on the shoulder, a piece of 3PO’s hand falls off and can, in fact, be seen falling - a flash of gold appears near the bottom of Han’s jacket, right about when 3PO says the word “coupling” (roughly at the 1 minute 52 seconds mark of this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMk0-pZfx5Q&t=1m52s).

Similar to Luke’s head popping back up after he jumps down to continue the duel with Vader, once seen it’s very hard to unsee! So I was just wondering if Adywan’s already aware of this, and whether or not it’s been fixed for Revisited.

Post
#890415
Topic
The Unofficial Complete REVISITED SAGA Ideas and Random Discussion Thread
Time

Bingowings said:

For me real universe shrinkage isn’t constantly visiting and finding out more about the same place. It’s hopping around places with different names that look the same and not finding out much about them or their cultures or customs. If you were to merge all that sand into one pile you would have one interesting and well explored place. Instead of three almost identikit places where only one is really explored.

To be clear - I definitely wasn’t advocating a Jakku type situation, where the planet’s aesthetic remains the same and only the name is changed. I’m really very ignorant about the technicality of such, but what I was proposing was a radical redesign of Tatooine in ROTJ - such that the exterior shots are unrecognisable, and the planet then becomes wholly new. That portion of the film is largely contained in Jabba’s Palace - save for the droids’ trek to the gate, one establishing shot of the palace, and the barge sequence. So what I would hope for, is a thorough re-imagining of those exteriors. Of course, the barge sequence occurs on “the Dune Sea” - so it will get sandy at some point. But the desert climate in this portion would just add to the ecological variety of whatever the new planet is to be. And I imagine a colour shift for the barge segment, along with new backgrounds, to clearly differentiate this area from Tatooine.

I take your point about depth of exploration, as opposed to breadth. Less can be more - and limiting the planetary lineup might be beneficial if it means that we can better develop the one planet. But I suppose I just don’t buy Jabba’s Palace being on Tatooine; it doesn’t make sense to me in light of ESB’s conclusion. And far from deepening our understanding of Tatooine, I think it actively contradicts the planet as established in ANH. If Jabba is such a powerful figure, who desperately wants Han Solo (and is able to offer an inordinate bounty to guarantee his acquisition), then surely Han wouldn’t dream of trying to drive up business in Jabba’s backyard. Jabba should thoroughly own the muscle on whatever planet he bases himself - so Han should’ve been dead meat as soon as he touched down on the surface in ANH; or at least, as soon as he wandered into Mos Eisley. But nope; only Greedo puts in an effort. And this is because, in ANH, I never imagined Tatooine as the fixed abode of an intergalactic crime lord - rather, I imagined the planet as more of a terminal; thoroughly removed from any power player.

Surely best, then, to situate Jabba’s Palace on a new planet - which would derive its character from the Rancor, the Sarlaac, and all the rest. We don’t spend an incredible amount of time on Bespin or Dagobah - and we only visit the former once, in the whole saga. Yet those locales are undoubtedly rich; so there’s no reason to think that transforming Tatooine into a new planet for ROTJ would necessarily result in a more frivolous setting than either Bespin or Dagobah. It falls to the design elements; and so we’re off on the right track from the get-go, in virtue of the ingenuity on display in this portion of ROTJ. Effort would have to be spent to ensure that the new exteriors are equally as inventive.

And it shouldn’t be overlooked that film is a chiefly visual medium. Each Star Wars film aspires to an epic sweep - from the sandy dunes of Tatooine to the metallic corridors of the Death Star and the lush greenery of Yavin IV; from the snow drifts of Hoth to the swamps of Dagobah and the cloud fields of Bespin. ROTJ appears undeniably bland in comparison. Augmenting Tatooine in ROTJ goes beyond universe expanding, then - it also broadens the film’s palette.

Post
#890374
Topic
The Unofficial Complete REVISITED SAGA Ideas and Random Discussion Thread
Time

Bingowings said:

My problem with renaming the desert planet in Return of the Jedi is we already know from watching The Empire Strikes Back that Luke and Lando are planning to meet on Tatooine.

Quite right. We know that the rendezvous point is Tatooine; and so I always took the end of ESB to imply that Lando and Chewie would conduct reconnaissance, determine where Han is being held, and then report back to Luke on Tatooine; or else, report back to Luke and then meet on Tatooine to formulate or action their plan. But this doesn’t come to the same thing as Han, himself, actually being on that planet. Upon watching ESB, there’s really no expectation raised of this; and quite the opposite, I’d argue. Because what are the odds that the rendezvous point - which seems somewhat arbitrarily chosen (“I’ll meet you at the rendezvous point on…[pauses to consider] Tatooine”) - would also just happen to be where Han is located. “It’s always the last place you look, right Chewie?”.

And if the rendezvous point was to be Tatooine because they already knew that Han was there, then why did it take three years or so to precisely locate him? Okay, sure - so Tatooine is a planet; and that’s a large surface to cover. But they have access to spaceships and presumably scanning equipment; and they know that Jabba’s the one to whom Han is being delivered. Given how “illustrious” Jabba the Hutt is - and how ostentatious; the dude’s rockin’ his own palace! - it really wouldn’t take too long to find out where Jabba’s holing up on that desert world.

The only way that the ending of ESB makes any sense, in fact - with Lando and Chewie setting off on their search, and ROTJ then taking place years later - is if Han is not on Tatooine; if Han is actually on some unknown planet, which Lando and Chewie must find.

Bingowings said:

Indeed if you are going to use Ben’s haunted house it too is on Tatooine.

Oh, I definitely wouldn’t mind returning to Tatooine if it’s narratively or symbolically earned - as it would be in the case of having the conversation between Obi-Wan and Luke play out back in Obi-Wan’s hut. Tatooine as the centre of the Star Wars galaxy is all well and fine, providing that by centre of the Star Wars galaxy you mean that the planet hosts pivotal moments or turning points in the overarching story. If Tatooine is the planet from which each trilogy’s protagonist emerges, then so be it - there’s a somewhat fairy tale quality to that notion. But when Tatooine is also the planet of choice for tertiary events which aren’t integral to the development of the main character or the central thrust of the narrative, then universe shrinkage threatens.

Post
#890180
Topic
Info &amp; Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist
Time

topdawg193 said:

Finally, we cut to the scene where Leia is injured on Endor – tight on her, so we can’t make out the backdrop or discern the situation fully; a flash fills the frame, and we see Leia hurt.

After Leia’s “death”, we then cut to…Luke, from the deleted lightsaber construction scene.

^ On reflection, it might be inappropriate to include any scene of Leia here - and perhaps best to keep the opening space bound, like the other episodes, for uniformity’s sake. Besides, it may be more powerful to have the sequence conclude with the Falcon apparently burning up. So of course, if this was to be the case, we would segue to Luke’s close-up after the shot of the Falcon - which would become the final image in the opening vision.

Post
#890178
Topic
The Unofficial Complete REVISITED SAGA Ideas and Random Discussion Thread
Time

topdawg193 said:

Finally, we cut to the scene where Leia is injured on Endor – tight on her, so we can’t make out the backdrop or discern the situation fully; a flash fills the frame, and we see Leia hurt.

After Leia’s “death”, we then cut to…Luke, from the deleted lightsaber construction scene.

^ On reflection, it might be inappropriate to include any scene of Leia here - and perhaps best to keep the opening space bound, like the other episodes, for uniformity’s sake. Besides, it may be more powerful to have the sequence conclude with the Falcon apparently burning up. So of course, if this was to be the case, we would segue to Luke’s close-up after the shot of the Falcon - which would become the final image in the opening vision.

Post
#890175
Topic
The Unofficial Complete REVISITED SAGA Ideas and Random Discussion Thread
Time

^ I’m 100% with Bingowings, here. ROTJ could benefit immensely from a drastic recut. And it’s on that thought, that I offer the following structural suggestions. I had posted this on the “ESB and ROTJ Wish List” thread – but it’s relevant here, too.

STRUCTURAL IDEAS #1 – SPACE BATTLE OPENING

ROTJ’s opening always struck me as the weakest of the original trilogy. It’s incredibly static, and very much like TPM’s opening – a ship docks inside a station, after laborious communications between the pilot and station crew, and then further dialogue goes back and forth (the saving grace being that Vader’s dialogue serves to build anticipation for the Emperor’s reveal). Ultimately, though, it’s nothing we haven’t seen before – it’s terrifically uncinematic, and we learn nothing that we haven’t already gleaned from the opening crawl (except, of course, that the Emperor will be paying a visit). The start of ROTJ just doesn’t move – as opposed to those opening sequences in which a Star Destroyer attacks the Tantive IV, or dispatches numerous probe droids across the galaxy.

So what I propose is this. We overhaul the crawl – which reads like a TV guide synopsis – to propel the narrative from the get-go. I’ve read numerous fan rewrites of ROTJ’s crawl, but I think the draft found on doubleohfive’s blog (https://doubleofive.wordpress.com/rotj-fanedit-wishlist/) is the most appropriate – and very in keeping with the previous crawls. I’ve edited it somewhat, to make the text more economical – I think it reads better:

The Alliance is doomed. Hunted by the Imperial Star Fleet, the rebels have retreated to the rim world of SULLUST to mount a final strike against the tyrannical EMPIRE.

Sensing victory, LORD VADER and his cruel EMPEROR oversee construction of a new battle station – even more powerful than the first dreaded DEATH STAR.

Meanwhile, Luke Skywalker has journeyed to NAL HUTTA to rescue Han Solo from the vile gangster JABBA THE HUTT…

And as an aside, I include “Nal Hutta” only because it’s my greatest wish that Tatooine not feature in this film – ROTJ marks the start of the franchise’s lazy reliance on this planet, and similarly sandy worlds. Along with a more exotically rendered Endor, I think it’d be great if Tatooine could be reimagined as a unique world – a wholly different planet, home to Jabba the Hutt. And while I’m ignorant of the technicalities of achieving such, I imagine that it wouldn’t be impossible – given that this part of the movie largely takes place inside Jabba’s Palace, cutting to the one establishing shot. Redoing the environmental backgrounds for C3PO and R2D2’s trek to the palace gate, along with the barge sequence, would be far more difficult I’d assume. If it were achievable, and with a rewritten crawl, the only other reference to Tatooine that would have to be cut would be “I used to live here, you know…”. The prior line, “There’s nothing to see”, could be kept – and straight after that, you could cut away to a desolate shot of Nal Hutta (or whatever the new planet is), so that the joke plays out.

And final digression…I’m also totally in favour of cutting Boba Fett, for the justifications given by many before me: he’s underutilised in ROTJ, his death is wildly lame, and it makes no sense for his character to remain at Jabba’s after delivering Han. Let Boba remain a unique element of ESB; his final appearance ought to be flying off into the sunset – the conqueror! Now, if Boba were to be removed, I would actually suggest that a reedit of ESB’s conclusion would be merited. Specifically, the dialogue at the end of ESB should be edited along the lines of the 1980 70mm theatrical cut – where Lando promises Leia just that he’ll find Han, and makes no mention of “that bounty hunter” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmbl8tLOfFE). This way, at the end of ESB, not even the slightest expectation would be raised of our heroes facing off with Boba again.

OKAY! Back to my revised opening for ROTJ.

After the crawl, we pan down – and fall upon the final space battle, with the rebels attacking the Death Star II. Specifically, a sequence should be cut together which disproportionately showcases the rebels’ losses – pilots dying, scenes of their ships crashing and of the Death Star II firing on the rebel cruisers, etc. We then cut to the rear shot of the Falcon being engulfed by flames. Finally, we cut to the scene where Leia is injured on Endor – tight on her, so we can’t make out the backdrop or discern the situation fully; a flash fills the frame, and we see Leia hurt. Played over this opening, we hear the Emperor’s words – reverbed, and partially edited: “Your fleet is lost, and your friends…will not survive”. The editing should be frenetic – very much akin to Rey’s vision in TFA, upon touching the lightsaber. Although initially, the sequence should play out conventionally – after the pan down from the crawl – so that the audience believes the opening to be occurring in real time.

After Leia’s “death”, we then cut to…Luke, from the deleted lightsaber construction scene. The opening space battle was a Force premonition, received by Luke. So after the final scene in the opening “montage” – for want of a better word; because it should play as one long, terrible vision – we then cut to (or utilise the premonition effect from ROTS, when Anakin dreams of Padme dying, to dissolve to) Luke’s face, tight; with Vader’s “Luke…Luke…” overlaid. We don’t, however, see Luke ignite his lightsaber – which happens shortly after the close-up on Luke’s face, here. Rather, we hold on Luke – with him presumably mulling over the vision – and then cut straight to Luke reaching out to R2D2, with C3PO in the background. We then cut to C3PO looking out over the ridge, before R2D2 joins him. All of C3PO’s dialogue should be cut, here. After the establishing shot of Luke’s X-Wing and the Falcon in the clearing, we then wipe to C3PO and R2D2 trekking to Jabba’s Palace – and the opening continues from there.

The advantages of this recut are thusly:

1.) The film starts with a much needed bang. We get a taste of the impressive space battle finale – and the surprise twist of this sequence actually being a Force premonition.
2.) The stakes are raised from the get-go. Is this the future? Will the Falcon really be destroyed? Does Leia die? The audience is primed for tragedy – which makes the film’s true denouement a relief. One common complaint is that the film’s ending is too convenient; a bittersweet conclusion is often said to have been preferred, in which a hero or two dies. But by teasing the deaths of our heroes at the start, the ending then becomes subversive – “difficult to see; always in motion is the future”.
3.) A definite gravity is given to certain moments in the film. Han’s inkling that he won’t see the Falcon again; the Emperor’s remarks aboard the Death Star II that he has already “foreseen” the Empire’s victory – is what the audience saw at the start of the film precisely what the Emperor has anticipated, and what Han suspects?

There’s also no real casualty to the reedited opening, either – the scene where Vader visits the Death Star II could easily be moved to some other point in the film, as a break from the happenings in Jabba’s Palace (which can feel very drawn out). The most logical insertion point, to my mind, would be after the reveal of Han in carbonite. Instead of wiping to the droids being assigned their positions of servitude, we would wipe to Vader’s shuttle approach – and at the conclusion of that scene, we then wipe to C3PO (“What could possibly have come over Master Luke? Was it something I did?”). As well as my suspicion that this arrangement of scenes would flow nicely, there’s also a narrative connection which now underlies the scene transition – Han suffered his carbon freeze at the hands of Vader; and so by cutting straight to Vader after the reveal of Jabba’s “favourite decoration”, the looming threat of the Empire is reinforced.

STRUCTURAL IDEAS #2 - LUKE RETURNS TO BEN’S HUT

Another bothersome scene in ROTJ is when Luke confabs with Obi-Wan’s ghost. It’s a visually bland, shot-reverse-shot affair – with Obi-Wan squatting down on a log no less! Very un-ghost like! So one idea to improve this segment – which doubleohfive records on his blog – is to have Luke and Obi-Wan confer in Obi-Wan’s hut, back on Tatooine.

This would immediately lend the exchange gravitas, as it becomes a direct parallel of the conversation between Luke and Obi-Wan in ANH; when Obi-Wan first told Luke about his father. Visually quoting this scene in ROTJ, by having Luke and Obi-Wan’s discussion occur in Obi-Wan’s hut, is particularly fitting. For the conversation once again turns to Luke’s father – the truth about Luke’s father; that initial question, “How did my father die?”, is finally answered in full. “The circle is now complete”.

And with Luke sitting to screen right, and Obi-Wan to screen left, their positions are reversed from ANH. This would communicate that Luke is the wiser, here – and Obi-Wan the novice. Because there truly is light in Vader – even if Obi-Wan can’t see it. Far from banal exposition, then, by switching Dagobah for Obi-Wan’s hut the exchange takes on a whole new subtext. Also, the troubling notion that Obi-Wan’s ghost can interact with material objects (why couldn’t he spectrally manifest to assist Luke in fighting Vader, then?) can be explained away with Obi-Wan having an intimate connection to this dwelling – and so he has limited powers of interaction here; i.e. he can sit down.

I’ve given some thought about where and how this scene should occur in the runtime. After Luke and company escape Nal Hutta (or whatever Tatooine’s replacement becomes, for the opening), Luke informs the Falcon that he’ll meet them back at the fleet; Han tells Luke that he “owes [him] one”. We then cut to an exterior shot of R2 in the X-Wing, bleeping; and we see the translation appear on Luke’s cockpit screen. After that, we should cut to Luke putting on his glove – and responding that “I have a promise to keep; to an old friend”. We see the X-Wing soar leftwards and then, rather than cutting to the Emperor’s arrival, we wipe to the establishing shot of Luke’s X-Wing outside Yoda’s hovel.

Luke and Yoda’s interaction then plays as originally. But when Yoda dies, after his body vanishes, we now cut to the exterior shot of Yoda’s hovel (with the light fading) and hold on this scene until the music concludes. We now wipe to the Emperor’s arrival. After that scene, we wipe to an establishing shot of Luke’s X-Wing outside of Obi-Wan’s hut on Tatooine. But crucially – there is a sandstorm raging! Perhaps assets could be seized from the ROTJ deleted scene for such a phenomenon? Having a sandstorm occurring:

1.) Gives further reason for Luke taking R2 into Obi-Wan’s hut, as opposed to leaving him in the X-Wing. Recall that Luke’s dialogue with R2 is what Obi-Wan’s ghost first seizes on, and so R2 has to be present in the scene.
2.) Symbolises the turmoil raging in Luke, at this point.
3.) Lends environmental variety. If we are to return to Tatooine again in this film – and despite my misgivings about this, we really ought to return to Tatooine if it’s for the sake of this hut scene (and providing we’ve changed the opening locale to Nal Hutta or its variant) – then at least have Tatooine be somehow different. And a sandstorm would be dramatically different!

Technologically achieving this Hut scene would doubtless be difficult. So the easiest way of going about it, to my mind, would be to edit the sequence as follows. After the establishing shot, we cut to Luke kneeling in front of R2 – “I can’t do it, R2. I can’t go on alone”. We hear Obi-Wan’s voice, “Yoda will always be with you”, as Luke stands and looks towards camera – “Obi-Wan!”. We then remove the shot of Obi-Wan walking towards camera – and cut instead to the shot of Obi-Wan standing still and gazing towards Luke (at the 46 minute mark). Obi-Wan’s ghost should, in fact, be made to fade in here – as ghosts are wont to do!

We hold on this image of Obi-Wan for longer than before – so that we can have Luke’s “Why didn’t you tell me?” play over it, along with “You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father”. The initial question was originally asked by Luke as he walked through the Dagobah foliage – which obviously cannot happen here. This footage couldn’t be transplanted into Obi-Wan’s hut, and so its audio must instead play over the image of Obi-Wan’s ghost. Then, the scene could unfold as before; there aren’t any more long walks or bending to miss tree branches – the movements of Luke and Obi-Wan, edited to their bare minimum (Luke kneeling before R2 and then rising; Obi-Wan fading in to a standstill; then both moving back slightly to sit down), could all be feasibly mapped to the interior of Obi-Wan’s hut.

After Luke and Obi-Wan’s conversation in the hut, we wipe to the Rebel fleet as before. And it strikes me that, by having Luke hop from Dagobah to Tatooine, he’s been gone for longer; Luke returning to Tatooine and telling R2 that he “can’t go on alone” also implies, strongly, that he was considering not re-joining the Alliance – and perhaps, Luke was instead thinking of “staying here and not getting involved”. This makes the reunion which Luke enjoys with Leia and Han at the Rebel briefing all the more poignant. Luke’s finally back – the Jedi has returned!


So there you have it. I think that all of the above, combined with an enhanced bunker raid sequence (which utilises the deleted scenes) and an updated space battle finale, would go a long way towards structurally improving the film – and giving ROTJ some much needed heft.

…how feel you?

Post
#889749
Topic
Info &amp; Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist
Time

ROTJ could benefit immensely from a drastic recut. And it’s on that thought, that I offer the following structural suggestions.


STRUCTURAL IDEAS #1 – SPACE BATTLE OPENING

ROTJ’s opening always struck me as the weakest of the original trilogy. It’s incredibly static, and very much like TPM’s opening – a ship docks inside a station, after laborious communications between the pilot and station crew, and then further dialogue goes back and forth (the saving grace being that Vader’s dialogue serves to build anticipation for the Emperor’s reveal). Ultimately, though, it’s nothing we haven’t seen before – it’s terrifically uncinematic, and we learn nothing that we haven’t already gleaned from the opening crawl (except, of course, that the Emperor will be paying a visit). The start of ROTJ just doesn’t move – as opposed to those opening sequences in which a Star Destroyer attacks the Tantive IV, or dispatches numerous probe droids across the galaxy.

So what I propose is this. We overhaul the crawl – which reads like a TV guide synopsis – to propel the narrative from the get-go. I’ve read numerous fan rewrites of ROTJ’s crawl, but I think the draft found on doubleohfive’s blog (https://doubleofive.wordpress.com/rotj-fanedit-wishlist/) is the most appropriate – and very in keeping with the previous crawls. I’ve edited it somewhat, to make the text more economical – I think it reads better:

The Alliance is doomed. Hunted by the Imperial Star Fleet, the rebels have retreated to the rim world of SULLUST to mount a final strike against the tyrannical EMPIRE.

Sensing victory, LORD VADER and his cruel EMPEROR oversee construction of a new battle station – even more powerful than the first dreaded DEATH STAR.

Meanwhile, Luke Skywalker has journeyed to NAL HUTTA to rescue Han Solo from the vile gangster JABBA THE HUTT…

And as an aside, I include “Nal Hutta” only because it’s my greatest wish that Tatooine not feature in this film – ROTJ marks the start of the franchise’s lazy reliance on this planet, and similarly sandy worlds. Along with a more exotically rendered Endor, I think it’d be great if Tatooine could be reimagined as a unique world – a wholly different planet, home to Jabba the Hutt. And while I’m ignorant of the technicalities of achieving such, I imagine that it wouldn’t be impossible – given that this part of the movie largely takes place inside Jabba’s Palace, cutting to the one establishing shot. Redoing the environmental backgrounds for C3PO and R2D2’s trek to the palace gate, along with the barge sequence, would be far more difficult I’d assume. If it were achievable, and with a rewritten crawl, the only other reference to Tatooine that would have to be cut would be “I used to live here, you know…”. The prior line, “There’s nothing to see”, could be kept – and straight after that, you could cut away to a desolate shot of Nal Hutta (or whatever the new planet is), so that the joke plays out.

And final digression…I’m also totally in favour of cutting Boba Fett, for the justifications given by many before me: he’s underutilised in ROTJ, his death is wildly lame, and it makes no sense for his character to remain at Jabba’s after delivering Han. Let Boba remain a unique element of ESB; his final appearance ought to be flying off into the sunset – the conqueror! Now, if Boba were to be removed, I would actually suggest that a reedit of ESB’s conclusion would be merited. Specifically, the dialogue at the end of ESB should be edited along the lines of the 1980 70mm theatrical cut – where Lando promises Leia just that he’ll find Han, and makes no mention of “that bounty hunter” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmbl8tLOfFE). This way, at the end of ESB, not even the slightest expectation would be raised of our heroes facing off with Boba again.

OKAY! Back to my revised opening for ROTJ.

After the crawl, we pan down – and fall upon the final space battle, with the rebels attacking the Death Star II. Specifically, a sequence should be cut together which disproportionately showcases the rebels’ losses – pilots dying, scenes of their ships crashing and of the Death Star II firing on the rebel cruisers, etc. We then cut to the rear shot of the Falcon being engulfed by flames. Finally, we cut to the scene where Leia is injured on Endor – tight on her, so we can’t make out the backdrop or discern the situation fully; a flash fills the frame, and we see Leia hurt. Played over this opening, we hear the Emperor’s words – reverbed, and partially edited: “Your fleet is lost, and your friends…will not survive”. The editing should be frenetic – very much akin to Rey’s vision in TFA, upon touching the lightsaber. Although initially, the sequence should play out conventionally – after the pan down from the crawl – so that the audience believes the opening to be occurring in real time.

After Leia’s “death”, we then cut to…Luke, from the deleted lightsaber construction scene. The opening space battle was a Force premonition, received by Luke. So after the final scene in the opening “montage” – for want of a better word; because it should play as one long, terrible vision – we then cut to (or utilise the premonition effect from ROTS, when Anakin dreams of Padme dying, to dissolve to) Luke’s face, tight; with Vader’s “Luke…Luke…” overlaid. We don’t, however, see Luke ignite his lightsaber – which happens shortly after the close-up on Luke’s face, here. Rather, we hold on Luke – with him presumably mulling over the vision – and then cut straight to Luke reaching out to R2D2, with C3PO in the background. We then cut to C3PO looking out over the ridge, before R2D2 joins him. All of C3PO’s dialogue should be cut, here. After the establishing shot of Luke’s X-Wing and the Falcon in the clearing, we then wipe to C3PO and R2D2 trekking to Jabba’s Palace – and the opening continues from there.

The advantages of this recut are thusly:

1.) The film starts with a much needed bang. We get a taste of the impressive space battle finale – and the surprise twist of this sequence actually being a Force premonition.
2.) The stakes are raised from the get-go. Is this the future? Will the Falcon really be destroyed? Does Leia die? The audience is primed for tragedy – which makes the film’s true denouement a relief. One common complaint is that the film’s ending is too convenient; a bittersweet conclusion is often said to have been preferred, in which a hero or two dies. But by teasing the deaths of our heroes at the start, the ending then becomes subversive – “difficult to see; always in motion is the future”.
3.) A definite gravity is given to certain moments in the film. Han’s inkling that he won’t see the Falcon again; the Emperor’s remarks aboard the Death Star II that he has already “foreseen” the Empire’s victory – is what the audience saw at the start of the film precisely what the Emperor has anticipated, and what Han suspects?

There’s also no real casualty to the reedited opening, either – the scene where Vader visits the Death Star II could easily be moved to some other point in the film, as a break from the happenings in Jabba’s Palace (which can feel very drawn out). The most logical insertion point, to my mind, would be after the reveal of Han in carbonite. Instead of wiping to the droids being assigned their positions of servitude, we would wipe to Vader’s shuttle approach – and at the conclusion of that scene, we then wipe to C3PO (“What could possibly have come over Master Luke? Was it something I did?”). As well as my suspicion that this arrangement of scenes would flow nicely, there’s also a narrative connection which now underlies the scene transition – Han suffered his carbon freeze at the hands of Vader; and so by cutting straight to Vader after the reveal of Jabba’s “favourite decoration”, the looming threat of the Empire is reinforced.

STRUCTURAL IDEAS #2 - LUKE RETURNS TO BEN’S HUT

Another bothersome scene in ROTJ is when Luke confabs with Obi-Wan’s ghost. It’s a visually bland, shot-reverse-shot affair – with Obi-Wan squatting down on a log no less! Very un-ghost like! So one idea to improve this segment – which doubleohfive records on his blog – is to have Luke and Obi-Wan confer in Obi-Wan’s hut, back on Tatooine.

This would immediately lend the exchange gravitas, as it becomes a direct parallel of the conversation between Luke and Obi-Wan in ANH; when Obi-Wan first told Luke about his father. Visually quoting this scene in ROTJ, by having Luke and Obi-Wan’s discussion occur in Obi-Wan’s hut, is particularly fitting. For the conversation once again turns to Luke’s father – the truth about Luke’s father; that initial question, “How did my father die?”, is finally answered in full. “The circle is now complete”.

And with Luke sitting to screen right, and Obi-Wan to screen left, their positions are reversed from ANH. This would communicate that Luke is the wiser, here – and Obi-Wan the novice. Because there truly is light in Vader – even if Obi-Wan can’t see it. Far from banal exposition, then, by switching Dagobah for Obi-Wan’s hut the exchange takes on a whole new subtext. Also, the troubling notion that Obi-Wan’s ghost can interact with material objects (why couldn’t he spectrally manifest to assist Luke in fighting Vader, then?) can be explained away with Obi-Wan having an intimate connection to this dwelling – and so he has limited powers of interaction here; i.e. he can sit down.

I’ve given some thought about where and how this scene should occur in the runtime. After Luke and company escape Nal Hutta (or whatever Tatooine’s replacement becomes, for the opening), Luke informs the Falcon that he’ll meet them back at the fleet; Han tells Luke that he “owes [him] one”. We then cut to an exterior shot of R2 in the X-Wing, bleeping; and we see the translation appear on Luke’s cockpit screen. After that, we should cut to Luke putting on his glove – and responding that “I have a promise to keep; to an old friend”. We see the X-Wing soar leftwards and then, rather than cutting to the Emperor’s arrival, we wipe to the establishing shot of Luke’s X-Wing outside Yoda’s hovel.

Luke and Yoda’s interaction then plays as originally. But when Yoda dies, after his body vanishes, we now cut to the exterior shot of Yoda’s hovel (with the light fading) and hold on this scene until the music concludes. We now wipe to the Emperor’s arrival. After that scene, we wipe to an establishing shot of Luke’s X-Wing outside of Obi-Wan’s hut on Tatooine. But crucially – there is a sandstorm raging! Perhaps assets could be seized from the ROTJ deleted scene for such a phenomenon? Having a sandstorm occurring:

1.) Gives further reason for Luke taking R2 into Obi-Wan’s hut, as opposed to leaving him in the X-Wing. Recall that Luke’s dialogue with R2 is what Obi-Wan’s ghost first seizes on, and so R2 has to be present in the scene.
2.) Symbolises the turmoil raging in Luke, at this point.
3.) Lends environmental variety. If we are to return to Tatooine again in this film – and despite my misgivings about this, we really ought to return to Tatooine if it’s for the sake of this hut scene (and providing we’ve changed the opening locale to Nal Hutta or its variant) – then at least have Tatooine be somehow different. And a sandstorm would be dramatically different!

Technologically achieving this Hut scene would doubtless be difficult. So the easiest way of going about it, to my mind, would be to edit the sequence as follows. After the establishing shot, we cut to Luke kneeling in front of R2 – “I can’t do it, R2. I can’t go on alone”. We hear Obi-Wan’s voice, “Yoda will always be with you”, as Luke stands and looks towards camera – “Obi-Wan!”. We then remove the shot of Obi-Wan walking towards camera – and cut instead to the shot of Obi-Wan standing still and gazing towards Luke (at the 46 minute mark). Obi-Wan’s ghost should, in fact, be made to fade in here – as ghosts are wont to do!

We hold on this image of Obi-Wan for longer than before – so that we can have Luke’s “Why didn’t you tell me?” play over it, along with “You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father”. The initial question was originally asked by Luke as he walked through the Dagobah foliage – which obviously cannot happen here. This footage couldn’t be transplanted into Obi-Wan’s hut, and so its audio must instead play over the image of Obi-Wan’s ghost. Then, the scene could unfold as before; there aren’t any more long walks or bending to miss tree branches – the movements of Luke and Obi-Wan, edited to their bare minimum (Luke kneeling before R2 and then rising; Obi-Wan fading in to a standstill; then both moving back slightly to sit down), could all be feasibly mapped to the interior of Obi-Wan’s hut.

After Luke and Obi-Wan’s conversation in the hut, we wipe to the Rebel fleet as before. And it strikes me that, by having Luke hop from Dagobah to Tatooine, he’s been gone for longer; Luke returning to Tatooine and telling R2 that he “can’t go on alone” also implies, strongly, that he was considering not re-joining the Alliance – and perhaps, Luke was instead thinking of “staying here and not getting involved”. This makes the reunion which Luke enjoys with Leia and Han at the Rebel briefing all the more poignant. Luke’s finally back – the Jedi has returned!


So there you have it. I think that all of the above, combined with an enhanced bunker raid sequence (which utilises the deleted scenes) and an updated space battle finale, would go a long way towards structurally improving the film – and giving ROTJ some much needed heft.

…how feel you?

Post
#770038
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

ray_afraid said:

If any change was to be made, my vote would be to have the spider standing still for the first few moments, looking like a rooted plant, then become more animated as the shot progresses. (from McQuarries paintings, that's how I always imagined they'd have been introduced in the film)

 
^ Definitely the way to go. I also got a botanical vibe from the McQuarrie work, and dig the idea of the spider being more plant-like.

Post
#768015
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

The McQuarrie spider looks fantastic - it's incredibly well animated, and has a definite heft; not at all fakey fake!

I do, however, share the concern that it's somewhat distracting and perhaps clutters the frame. I think it's that the spider is there, in the open and in motion, at the start of this establishing shot - so we are immediately drawn to it. It's even somewhat moving towards camera, emerging outwards. And then, the critter remains in motion throughout the rest of the shot - so it continues to hold our attention.

An alternative composition might be, if the bottom right corner was darkened and the spider stilled. Then, when the second avian creature (nearest the camera) reaches the halfway mark of its flightpath, the spider could become mobile and creep out from the shadows. This way, when the establishing shot begins, we initially register the X-Wing, and then the flying creatures, and then the spider - it's less of a jumble, and builds effectively.

This could further justify the longer hold on this shot, too, because it makes better use of the additional time - not revealing everything at once, in the beginning, but spacing out the reveals across the length of the shot. And, the spider showing itself at the end, crawling out from the dark, could evoke a greater sense of foreboding.

Just my two pence!

- EDIT -

^ yoda1138 beat me to it, with a similar suggestion that also involved obscuring the spider's corner (albeit with mist).

Post
#723718
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

On the topic of the canyon set piece - I was wondering if anything had been done, specifically, in regards to the issue which I raised here (concerning the rhythm of that sequence). Harmy contributed a really great mockup, making use of rotation, that went some way to addressing my concern; I had really hoped that something similar might be incorporated for ESB:R. Just figured I'd highlight this again, in case it got lost in the shuffle.

Post
#708029
Topic
STAR WARS: EP V &quot;REVISITED EDITION&quot;<strong>ADYWAN</strong> - <strong>12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW</strong>
Time

Harmy said:

I think the shots are fine as they are but if one did want to add a bit more dynamism to the camera movement, a bit of rotation could help. Here's a rough demonstration of the idea: http://uloz.to/xqKJtVAq/escape-from-hoth-revisited-mp4

 
Wow! That's it! Fantastic! I think this brings the sequence further in line with the original's lensing - and the best of both worlds is now enjoyed; the liveliness of the initial camera work, in consort with sterling new model and effects work. I really hope this will be taken into consideration!