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schizopolis23

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Join date
7-Nov-2019
Last activity
2-Dec-2020
Posts
16

Post History

Post
#1364084
Topic
Info: Has anyone heard more about Star Ep9: Rise of Skywalker’s The J.J. Abrams Cut??
Time

Broom Kid said:

Acknowledging that there are bad fan-edits (and a lot of them) isn’t cynicism, nor is it lack of imagination or “belief in possibilities.” It’s just… how it is. There are bad fan-edits. There are great ones too. And many of those great ones were concieved of and executed right here on this forum. And a lot of the “amazingly great” leaps in VFX and sound also happened here, and are happening almost daily anymore. That has nothing to do with my belief system or my imagination (or lack thereof) either.

Anyway: there’s no secret cut of The Rise of Skywalker. Never has been. And if there are deleted scenes, there’s no guarantee (until we see them) that they’ll be good, or usable, and even if they are, it’s up to whoever is making the new edit to implement them well.

The idea that fan-editors are somehow infallible or not susceptible to the same sort of bad decisionmaking professional filmmakers are just as prone to doesn’t make any sense to me. Fan-editors can get lost down rabbit-holes and lose the forest for the trees and make bad calls based on poor instincts just as easily as any of the people who turned out Rise of Skywalker or Batman v. Superman.

It’s what makes the successes (of which there’s been many) that we see here that much more enjoyable. If it was so easy to do, and so regularly done, it wouldn’t be as exciting and rewarding to watch a good one get made. That’s appreciating imagination, not evidence of lacking it.

Of course there are some not-so-great fan edits, I was pointing out how negative your post was and you still keep going. No one said that “fan editors are infallible”, etc. But whatever makes you feel better, bro. Peace out.

Post
#1364077
Topic
Info: Has anyone heard more about Star Ep9: Rise of Skywalker’s The J.J. Abrams Cut??
Time

Broom Kid said:

I don’t think Justice League has actually changed any games at all. It’s an exception, and probably one that won’t pay off the way WB hopes, either.

Whatever unfinished scenes got cut from The Rise of Skywalker would likely need fans to do a lot of heavy lifting on the VFX and sound side of things - which is fine (fans have gotten amazingly great at that in the past 20 years) but there’s a huge, huge difference in someone saying “there’s a secret cut they’re not letting you see” and “there’s probably semi-usable odds & ends on the cutting room floor that fans could incorporate into their homemade projects.”

That’s a huge gulf. And as many a fan edit has proven, just because fans CAN edit stuff back into a movie doesn’t mean they should, or that they did it well. Plenty of fan-edits have just as many bad decisions put into them as the original films do.

Damn…I take it back, you’re not skeptical, you’re downright cynical. Your last post ^^ says it all. It indicates that you lack imagination or the belief in possibilities.

Post
#1364075
Topic
Info: Has anyone heard more about Star Ep9: Rise of Skywalker’s The J.J. Abrams Cut??
Time

Broom Kid said:

George Lucas didn’t “get involved,” and multiple endings weren’t shot. Multiple versions of the same ending were shot, (multiple takes, really. Again - just normal everyday moviemaking stuff) but the ending was always essentially the same. It’s a thing with Star Wars - a ton of the trivia everyone “knows” about Star Wars is basically just guesswork and rumor repeated enough that everyone accepts it because it’s easier to win online arguments that way.

The multiple endings thing especially - that was some guy on Twitter incorrectly reporting a story he saw via some other guy on Twitter, IIRC. Or Reddit, probably. Part of why it’s so easy for all this to become a YouTube scam for ad money is because even the “upstanding insiders” or whatever are just faking-it-til-they-make-it. People want to believe they know something other people don’t, it makes all the time spent chasing this stuff feel sort of worthwile, and at that point it’s just a matter of figuring out which flavor of fandom you prefer, the angry stuff or the blindly hopeful stuff. If you’re starting with a story pre-tainted with misinformation because the people volunteering for their insider “job” - however well-intentioned they might be - don’t know how to do it, it’s really easy to then further twist that misinformation to fit your chosen grift. Once everyone involved tacitly agrees facts don’t really matter, the game is on!

Knowing what actually happened is almost always secondary to attaining the feeling of knowing what happened. This isn’t just a Star Wars thing, either. But as with all things fandom, you see it in Star Wars “communities” because that same phenomenon happens in places where it’s actually important, too. This is just the safer, less consequential version of it.

I’m just as skeptical as you, but my point is that ZSJL was the game changer. The only difference here is that JJ was not fired and didn’t leave the project. So unlike Snyder, JJ had to agree with the final theatrical version. He would have to publicly admit that an alternate cut EXISTS like Snyder did. Either way, I don’t doubt there could be a longer version that had to be edited down for a theatrical release. Almost every film has this, but it’s only in demand when the theatrical version is unsatisfying to the audience or filmmaker. And there certainly is deleted footage and most likely alternate footage. Does it make the movie better? I doubt it. But that footage is invaluable to fan editors.

Post
#1364069
Topic
Info: Has anyone heard more about Star Ep9: Rise of Skywalker’s The J.J. Abrams Cut??
Time

idir_hh said:

I don’t know about studio meddling, but there was definitely meddling with TROS. George Lucas got involved, multiple endings were shot, even internet fan theories were on the table, etc. It sounded like a mess, which is completely antithetical to what we saw in that documentary The Skywalker Legacy released by the studio. Regardless, I’d love to see all that deleted/alternate footage.

IMO, it’s just crazy that JJ’s best film and his worst film ended up being in the same trilogy.

The source for the alternate ending and George Lucas involvement is non other than master Doomcock, the internet’s Galactic overlord…

Wait a sec, are you telling me that you don’t consider “Doomcock” Grade-A journalism?? lol

Apple news published this last week: https://movieweb.com/star-wars-rise-of-skywalker-lucas-cut-rumor/

Post
#1364065
Topic
Info: Has anyone heard more about Star Ep9: Rise of Skywalker’s The J.J. Abrams Cut??
Time

Octorox said:
Let’s be clear, the cut of Justice League released in theaters didn’t represent Zack’s vision, but it’s not like he had a finished alternate cut just waiting in the wings. Otherwise, WarnerMedia wouldn’t be spending 20-30 million dollars so he can finish his version. The Snyder cut never “existed”, it’s a new cut being created now.

Similarly, there’s no finished alternate cut of Rise of Skywalker lying in a vault somewhere, and unlike with Snyder, there’s been no indication that Abrams doesn’t stand behind the movie he made. The problems with Rise of Skywalker are honestly pretty typical of Abrams filmmaking style, the guy is notoriously bad at endings, and we know the production was rushed. I don’t see this being a case of studio meddling.

I don’t know about studio meddling, but there was definitely meddling with TROS. George Lucas got involved, multiple endings were shot, even internet fan theories were on the table, etc. It sounded like a mess, which is completely antithetical to what we saw in that documentary The Skywalker Legacy released by the studio. Regardless, I’d love to see all that deleted/alternate footage.

IMO, it’s just crazy that JJ’s best film and his worst film ended up being in the same trilogy.

Post
#1364035
Topic
Info: Has anyone heard more about Star Ep9: Rise of Skywalker’s The J.J. Abrams Cut??
Time

Broom Kid said:

The cut that was released was his cut.

There is no secret cut. He put out exactly what he wanted to put out. Nobody made him edit the movie the way he did. He did that on his own.

Almost every movie ever made has a 3-4 hr cut at one point. It’s usually referred to as the Assembly Cut, and then there are cuts past that point that are sometimes almost as long as that initial Assembly Cut. And all “Assembly Cut” means is “Everything we shot, put it in the edit, and then we can see what we don’t need.”

The same logic that YouTube liars and grifters use to con viewers into subscribing to their channels (“There’s an ORIGINAL cut THEY’RE HIDING FROM YOU”) could have been applied to basically every movie you’ve ever loved. Jaws. Star Wars. Jurassic Park. Back to the Future. They all had super-long initial cuts that had a bunch of story elements that got deleted along the way. It’s not a conspiracy, or evidence of meddling executives. It’s just editing. That’s how stories are told and movies are made.

Sometimes they’re good, and sometimes they’re bad.

I guess Zack Snyder’s Justice League is the only exception to this rule 😃 Back in early 2018, everyone said the same thing you are saying now and they ended up being wrong. I guess since JJ is not saying anything about a JJ Cut, then it probably doesn’t exist. But, we know there were major reshoots and he shot different endings. Obviously, fan editors would love to get a hold of that footage via blu-ray with deleted scenes!

Post
#1357172
Topic
The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released)
Time

Hal 9000 said:

Yeah, I don’t mind those lines either, but I think it’s worth it to more cleanly remove the lightspeed skipping thing.

Good edit! I think it would be even cleaner if BB-8 said something when you cut to him after Rey’s says, “you know what you are, you’re difficult”. Right now, it’s just the sound of BB-8 turning his head, then cuts to an inaudible line from Finn, then Rey says “what happened?”. A BB-8 line would also allow you to cleanly remove that Finn inaudible line.

Post
#1356101
Topic
The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released)
Time

Movies Remastered said:
I cut the tug of war but if you cut the lightening then you’ll need to cut the following Rey chat with Finn and Chewies rescue?

Yep and all references to Chewy’s death has to get cut too. You can make a case for leaving in the moment in Kijimi when Rey realizes Chewy is still alive. They know he’s captured and could have been killed.

Post
#1356076
Topic
The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released)
Time

Hal 9000 said:

I like the scene where Chewie supposedly dies, I just don’t like that it was a cheap fakeout! However, it’s a little beyond the scope of this project to just remove. Now, we see Rey sense Chewie’s alive, and see him a bit later when the crew rescue him. Damn, it’d be good to have that Kylo Chewie scene to work with.

I think another added benefit of removing Chewy’s “death” and the force tug of war is that it removes Rey’s Sith lightning. Isn’t she OP enough?? Her learned heritage and desire to kill Palpatine is enough to sway her to the dark side.

Post
#1355780
Topic
The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released)
Time

I finished watching a few TROS fan edits and it was a pleasure to watch all the technical skill. The Jedi force ghosts appearing at the finale and helping Rey defeat Palpatine was quite a marvel. And I really enjoyed HAL9000 putting the chess match at the end. Here are some notes I’d like to add in general that I think would improve a TROS fan edit.

  • I think Leia should be removed from the story entirely. It’s unfortunate, but TFA unused footage of her makes her come off as an automaton reducing her presence in the film as artificial. Mentioning her death in the opening crawl would be the best work around. You’d have to cut out the “we had each other” scene between Poe and Lando or re-create something where Poe is looking at a picture of Leia in order to keep the scene. You can still keep the flashback training with Luke and her force ghost appearance with Luke at the very end. Removing Leia does affect Kylo’s “transformation” at the end of the second act. But, I think Rey healing him and the Han scene might be enough.

  • I think Chewbacca’s fake-out death is problematic on many levels. I may be able to tolerate non-stop fetch quest macguffins, but not this. Faking his death came off contrived and manipulative. I’m for removing it. The edit is do-able. Cut from when Fin says “they got Chewy”. Remove Rey and Kylo force tugging the ship, etc. Cut in Kylo walking from his wrecked ship and Poe signaling approaching enemy ships. The scenes after that refer to Chewy’s death can be edited down as well (eg. cut Poe’s line “then Chewy’s died for nothing”). But, the scene between Finn and Rey about seeing her on the Sith thrown with Kylo will be hard to edit down and keep.

Since there is little to no thematic relevance to these scenes, I think removing them helps streamline the narrative. Keep the story focused on the hero’s journey of both Rey and Kylo and them converging towards a confrontation with Palpatine.

Also, I prefer no kiss and no “Rey Skywalker”. And if I had my way, I would put everyone at end. All four Skywalker ghosts on Tattooine looking upon Rey. Then Rey, Finn, Poe, Chewbacca, C3-PO, R2-D2 and BB-8 at the Tattooine sunset. J.J. gets his all-inclusive Star Wars finale.