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13-Dec-2011
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18-Feb-2019
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249

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Post
#1243943
Topic
Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo
Time

moviefreakedmind said:

I don’t care about getting rises out of people. I don’t see how being antagonistic is unproductive. That’s how shit gets changed. I also don’t really like “exchanging ideas” in the calm, tepid sense.

You’re never going to change someone’s mind by being antagonistic toward them. I think diplomacy and compromise are far more effective means of change. But I keep forgetting that nobody compromises anymore.

I have things to say and I’m very passionate about them and when I see things that I disagree with or that I think are uninformed or unreasonable, then I call it out.

Fine if that’s your thing. I just wouldn’t expect to make very many friends.

Post
#1243279
Topic
Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo
Time

“In federally regulated workplaces, services, accommodation, and other areas covered by the CHRA, it will constrain unwanted, persistent behaviour (physical or verbal) that offends or humiliates individuals on the basis of their gender identity or expression.”

Wait, so maybe I wasn’t completely off-base. The CBA seems to take a broader interpretation of the law that I would oppose. I don’t think we need laws to protect people from being humiliated or offended. Am I reading that correctly?

“The distinction between the expression of repugnant ideas and expression which exposes groups to hatred is crucial to understanding the proper application of hate speech prohibitions. Hate speech legislation is not aimed at discouraging repugnant or offensive ideas. It does not, for example, prohibit expression which debates the merits of reducing the rights of vulnerable groups in society. It only restricts the use of expression exposing them to hatred as a part of that debate. It does not target the ideas, but their mode of expression in public and the effect that this mode of expression may have.”

And I really don’t see the distinction they are trying to make here. It’s okay to express hateful views, but if a member of a protected class is exposed to those hateful views, then it’s not okay? This seems vague and confused.

Post
#1243262
Topic
Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo
Time

moviefreakedmind said:

pleasehello said:

But his main contribution, I think, has been helping young men take responsibility for their lives through his lectures and his book, which actually makes some use of his expertise in psychology.

I don’t understand how he’s helping young men take responsibility. I’ve read excerpts of his book where he tells his readers to cut off their friends because people that need help are usually exploiting you. He also says that our culture needs to allocate enough women to satisfy all the creepy men that are bitter that no one wants to fuck them. He blames sexual harassment at least in part on women wearing makeup to work. He says that men can’t deal with “crazy women” because they’re not allowed to use physical force against them, which he says is a prerequisite for respecting someone, which implies that you can’t fully respect women.

I haven’t read his book, but I’ve never heard him say any of the things you claim he’s written and I can’t imagine the book being as popular as it is if it did say those things. Can you provide a couple of excerpts?

I don’t even like calling him an expert because, as you pointed out, he either ignorantly or fraudulently misuses words all the time. Everyone’s a nihilist to him, or post-modernist, or a neo-Marxist, or some other term that he’s using completely dishonestly. He conflates nihilism and post-modernism all the fucking time and he seems to believe that post-modernism is inherently communistic, which is the most imbecilic take on the term I’ve ever heard. He has no understanding of recent human history. He claims that Nazism was an atheist and anti-theist doctrine, which is an abject lie, and he seems to think that the U.S.'s behavior during the Cold War was justifiable if no humanitarian, which is incredibly absurd. Those are just my problems with his dishonesty, I could write a whole book about all the problems I have with his self-help philosophy.

I do think he has some interesting insights into psychology, but the rest I agree are kind of inane ramblings.

Post
#1243256
Topic
Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo
Time

moviefreakedmind said:

pleasehello said:

Censorship by the university, no. I think he has a good argument against the Canadian government.

Not at all. Canadian Bill C-16 only added transgenderism and gender identity to the list of characteristics that you aren’t legally allowed to discriminate against. The same law had already been on the books in the province that Peterson lived in for years before C-16 hit the federal stage. Needless to say, nothing bad happened to Peterson. He claims that the bill is too vague and could lead to all manner of horrifying things happening to him, including people being censored for “criticizing someone’s fashion,” which is not true at all. The lawyers of the Canadian Bar Association even came out and debunked all of the claims that Peterson made about this bill. The beautiful irony is that not one time was Jordan Peterson’s freedom of speech inhibited in any way by the Canadian government or his university, and now Jordan Peterson is the one that is trying to put a stop to people’s freedom to speak out against him. He is the only character in this story that has actually taken strides to hinder free expression.

So I did some more research and I concede to you on this point. The Canadian “civil rights” code protects certain classes of people only against speech that advocates genocide, which I don’t have a problem with. I thought they had broader hate speech laws.

Post
#1243219
Topic
Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo
Time

moviefreakedmind said:

The book came after him pretending to be under attack by the government and his university even though all evidence pointed to the contrary.

Censorship by the university, no. I think he has a good argument against the Canadian government.

But his main contribution, I think, has been helping young men take responsibility for their lives through his lectures and his book, which actually makes some use of his expertise in psychology.

Then he inevitably comes back to censorship and Marxism and how it’s everywhere and it’s going to end the world. At which point I tune out.

I guess what I’m trying to say is that he’s a mixed bag for me.

Post
#1243213
Topic
Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo
Time

moviefreakedmind said:

Arch-hypocrite pseudo-intellectual Jordan Peterson sues university over comments made in private by employees of the university “in order to make academics more careful about what they say about him.”

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-laurier-university-asks-court-to-dismiss-jordan-peterson-lawsuit/

What a litigious, hypocritical fraud. For those of you that don’t know, Jordan Peterson’s claim to fame is that he pretended that his freedom of speech was under attack, even though he was never fired, disciplined, or censored in any way by his university.

He also has a #1 bestselling book.

I thought his claim to fame was that he said his freedom of speech was under attack by the Canadian govt. bill C-16, which I kind of agree with. And then later he went on to say how all universities are post-modernist Marxist institutions, yada yada yada and all that crap.

He’s a whiny hypocrite at times, but I don’t understand why people are so vehemently opposed to him. His views don’t seem all that controversial to me.

Post
#1239318
Topic
Dealing with People Selling Fan Projects
Time

poita said:

CatBus said:

Frank your Majesty said:

The question was never wether fan-edits were legal. They are not. So any way of distributing fan-edits, no matter if paid or for free, is technically a copyright infringement.

Technicality–making a fan edit is legal, distributing it without a license from the copyright holder is not.

Sadly, not if the blu-ray is used as a source. By removing the copy protection you have breached the DMCA.

I learned that recently making my TLJ fan edit. I think that’s complete trash. If I’ve purchased the official blu-ray, I should be able to do whatever I want with it as long as it’s for private use.

I know it’s not really an issue since it’s impossible to enforce, but I take exception on principle.

Post
#1239211
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

nightstalkerpoet said:

Incredibly odd thought, but maybe Ep 9 could use a CGI Recreation of Sebastian Shaw as Anakin’s force ghost, who has been trying to contact Kylo Ren but has been consistently pushed away by Snoke. Who better to tear down Vader idolization than Vader?

Or to be perfectly honest, Hayden Christensen is only 8 years younger than Anakin when he died…

If that’s true, it’s hilarious just how bad the prequels are in keeping continuity with the OT. Hayden Christiansen is 37 now, which would make Darth Vader 45 when he died. And Sebastian Shaw was in his mid-late 70s when they shot ROTJ.

But to be honest, I wouldn’t mind seeing Christiansen as Anakin Skywalker in IX. Perhaps he could be more convincing with a better director and a better script.

Post
#1237885
Topic
Where should Lucasfilm go after Episode IX?
Time

The Skywalker Saga is done, so hopefully they put a fork in it after IX.

And then here’s an idea that will never happen. Go back to the 70s movie model whereby Disney can produce interesting scripts from up-and-coming writer/directors on more modest budgets instead of announcing a $200MM Boba Fett movie with no script that will just become a big bloated mess.

Post
#1237242
Topic
Episode VIII : The Last Jedi - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

DominicCobb said:

pleasehello said:

DominicCobb said:

Would you say ROTJ undermined ESB with its retcon of the “there is another” sequel hook?

I would say yes. It’s not really dealt with in a way that is satisfactory or satisfying.

“Leia’s a Skywalker. 'Nuff said.” We don’t get to see her character grow and develop her powers after the revelation that she has some in Empire. We get to see her in a gold bikini and she plays with teddy bears.

I would say that undermines her character and how it was established in Empire and hence the film itself.

I agree that Leia is underutilized in ROTJ (and that the bikini undermines her character) but I don’t think making her a Skywalker is the root of that problem. And retconning Yoda’s line doesn’t undermine all of ESB, it just reorients a one-off line. It’s far more blatant a redirect than anything people claim of TLJ, but it’s still kind of a “who cares” change, it doesn’t matter all that much in the grand scheme of the story.

I think most people’s problem with Leia being the other is more a problem of Leia being Luke’s sister, which serves to shrink the universe and make the love triangle of SW and ESB squicky. I can’t think of anything in TLJ that does anything like that at all.

I’m not going to try and argue that TLJ completely undermines TFA, because I don’t think that’s the case at all. But one such example (which is the only one I can really think of) is how TLJ picks up the final scene (the final few shots, really) of TFA.

In TFA, that final moment is treated with complete seriousness and has real gravity to it, enforced both by the score and by Mark Hamill’s small, but effective performance. TLJ unabashedly pulls the rug out from under it, treats it flippantly and plays it for a laugh, which to my mind undermines the seriousness of that scene in TFA. It also undermines Hamill’s performance in TFA. No wonder he didn’t like Johnson’s vision for Luke.

Aside from that example I wouldn’t say that TLJ undermines its predecessor. But there’s definitely a tonal dissonance between the two films. It’s not hard to spot and I think that’s part of why so many people were turned off by TLJ.

Post
#1237102
Topic
Episode VIII : The Last Jedi - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

DominicCobb said:

Would you say ROTJ undermined ESB with its retcon of the “there is another” sequel hook?

I would say yes. It’s not really dealt with in a way that is satisfactory or satisfying.

“Leia’s a Skywalker. 'Nuff said.” We don’t get to see her character grow and develop her powers after the revelation that she has some in Empire. We get to see her in a gold bikini and she plays with teddy bears.

I would say that undermines her character and how it was established in Empire and hence the film itself.

Post
#1237049
Topic
Episode VIII : The Last Jedi - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

The Mr. Plinkett review was far less critical than I was expecting. It sounds like the more he watched and analyzed the movie, the more he found to like about it, which has been exactly my experience.

The most interesting point they made was that many of the obstacles the characters faced in the film were completely of their own making and very avoidable. Finn and Rose’s whole plan goes south because they parked their shuttle on a public beach? I find that very frustrating as a viewer and not terribly satisfying. Also there’s Poe’s loose lips leading to the destruction of all their shuttles. Kind of just general incompetence.

Post
#1237035
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

DominicCobb said:

pleasehello said:

DominicCobb said:

For that to be true, TLJ would’ve had to “undermine” TFA, which is not even remotely the case.

One could (many have) easily make the argument that TLJ undermined or at the very least disregarded a lot of what was set up in TFA. So what you say is not even remotely “not even remotely the case.”

I can’t think of a single example.

It’s plan is to make good movies. It’s worked so far.

That’s a completely subjective statement. I think their output has been a very mixed bag. Also “make good movies” isn’t a very good plan when you’re making three films that should be supporting each other as a cohesive trilogy.

I don’t see how they aren’t.

Post
#1237017
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

DominicCobb said:

For that to be true, TLJ would’ve had to “undermine” TFA, which is not even remotely the case.

One could (many have) easily make the argument that TLJ undermined or at the very least disregarded a lot of what was set up in TFA. So what you say is not even remotely “not even remotely the case.”

It’s plan is to make good movies. It’s worked so far.

That’s a completely subjective statement. I think their output has been a very mixed bag. Also “make good movies” isn’t a very good plan when you’re making three films that should be supporting each other as a cohesive trilogy.

Post
#1236025
Topic
Please fix Leia in Rogue One
Time

yotsuya said:

Yes, real actress on set, face replaced digitally. Probably actual ANH dialog from Carrie herself. I have some minor issues with the CG with these two characters, but I emphasize minor. I have more of an issue with Tarkin’s voice. It was not crisp enough. Too muddled. Both faces have the same problems and it is very common for all cg humans. We notice it less with non-humans. They got the movement of the face close, but not quite and our minds pick up on that. They did a much better job with the animation of Rachel in Blade Runner 2049, but they did a crappy job of making it look like Sean Young. I thought it was a look-a-like actress when I saw the film in the theater. But no, they intended it to be Sean Young and in that respect it was bad. So at least they go the faces right in Rogue One. But have you checked out Superman in the last movie? Caville had a mustache that for some reason he couldn’t shave off and regrow and the CG work they did is horrible. He looks more fake because of his upper lip than Tarkin or Leia do, and he was virtually all real.

I can’t see how you could mistake Rachel in Blade Runner 2049 for a look-alike actress. I thought it was a very close likeness of Sean Young. Closer than Carrie Fisher in Rogue One. Though it still didn’t look real.

But again, both of these problems could have been mitigated by only showing the characters from behind. The audience already knows who they are.

Post
#1235848
Topic
Taking a stand against toxic fandom (and other )
Time

screams in the void said:

Then I see disparaging remarks about this being a " safe space " ,I can’t see these behaviors as anything but harassment and it seems like some people are reinforcing the case that the issue indeed exists . If this is not toxicity , then I don’t know what is .

That seems a little over-the-top to me.

Discussing the purpose and purposefulness of this thread hardly qualifies as harassment or toxicity. Many are legitimately confused as to this thread’s purpose. I was at first, too. So it stands to reason that when you get newcomers to this thread you’re going to be met repeatedly with the same questions and confusion.

Post
#1235804
Topic
Taking a stand against toxic fandom (and other )
Time

chyron8472 said:

pleasehello said:

chyron8472 said:

luckydube56 said:

So wait…I was right the first time? This is a safe space thread?

No. Hush.

This is a thread where we discuss toxicity in the Star Wars fanbase, fanbases in general, and by extension society in general. What is wrong with that?

“Safe space” indeed. -.-

I would classify this as a safe-space thread that doesn’t really encourage discussion. We’re really only allowed to discuss “toxicity” as narrowly defined by the original poster, which is fine if that’s what he wants, but makes the thread pretty limited in scope.

OP: “if you are of a mind to take a stand and stick up for the aforementioned people making the movies and the people that like them that ARE being harrassed, then this is the place for it.”

I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with “safe spaces”, but let’s call a spade a spade, shall we?

Suffice it to say, complaining about this thread being a “safe space” feels to me like a complaint about not being given license to be an asshat.

In luckydube’s case, possibly. But I have been disappointed by this thread in that it doesn’t let one discuss fan toxicity from any perspective save the one indicated in the OP.

Post
#1235799
Topic
Taking a stand against toxic fandom (and other )
Time

chyron8472 said:

luckydube56 said:

So wait…I was right the first time? This is a safe space thread?

No. Hush.

This is a thread where we discuss toxicity in the Star Wars fanbase, fanbases in general, and by extension society in general. What is wrong with that?

“Safe space” indeed. -.-

I would classify this as a safe-space thread that doesn’t really encourage discussion. We’re really only allowed to discuss “toxicity” as narrowly defined by the original poster, which is fine if that’s what he wants, but makes the thread pretty limited in scope.

OP: “if you are of a mind to take a stand and stick up for the aforementioned people making the movies and the people that like them that ARE being harrassed, then this is the place for it.”

I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with “safe spaces”, but let’s call a spade a spade, shall we?

Post
#1235698
Topic
Taking a stand against toxic fandom (and other )
Time

Warbler said:

pleasehello said:

Great article. Glad to see KMT push back against online trolls in a way that is strong, measured, but also humanizes her by allowing her to open up about her struggle.

Should we be referring to her as KMT? She said her real name was Loan. So maybe LMT or LT would be more appropriate? (assuming Tran is her real last name)

Seeing as how “Kelly Marie Tran” is at the very least the professional name she chooses to go by–and likely incorporated into her legal name as well–I think it’s completely reasonable to keep referring to her as such.

Post
#1235682
Topic
Taking a stand against toxic fandom (and other )
Time

Great article. Glad to see KMT push back against online trolls in a way that is strong, measured, but also humanizes her by allowing her to open up about her struggle.

I did have one comment about the following quote:

“It reinforced within me rules that were written before I was born, rules that made my parents deem it necessary to abandon their real names and adopt American ones — Tony and Kay — so it was easier for others to pronounce, a literal erasure of culture that still has me aching to the core.”

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with voluntary cultural assimilation (in fact I think it’s desirable to a certain extent) as long as you don’t let it erase your native culture. It is possible to have both.

Post
#1229930
Topic
Episode VIII : The Last Jedi - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

screams in the void said:

pleasehello said:

screams in the void said:

Jay said:

Chewielewis said:

DrDre said:

Yes, except for the fact that Anakin went through a decade of Jedi training, and still failed to become the Jedi, he was supposed to be. The prequels put the entire concept of believing in prophesies in doubt, and reinforce the idea, that allways in motion is the future.

Sure, but like Rey he was pretty gifted when we first met him.

I think there is a question that people aren’t asking, which is “What exactly is Jedi training”. I don’t think Jedi training is about moving rocks or lightsaber technique. I think Jedi training is more about indoctrination. The Jedi are a religion, and like most religions, you have to start them young so they understand the world they way you need them to, because Jedi in the Jedi Order are basically celebate monks. Thats why the council rejected Anakin, too old to indoctrinate, and they were right. The jedi don’t spend 10 years learning how to fight and move rocks. Their lessons are basically learning about the force and how to understand it better, but understand it the way the Jedi want them to.

You could also say that things like moving rocks or deflecting laser bolts are pretty much the Jedi traning 101, in EpII we see kids deflecting blaster bolts, they probably can lift brooms as well with not much traning. Anakin didn’t need training to use his force powers to Fly Pods. Luke didn’t get much training to learn how to grab his saber and to use the force to blow up the death star.

Some good points about Jedi training and indoctrination, and I agree with you to a certain extent. However, everything we saw in the first six films indicates that guidance and meditation are required in order to maximize a Jedi’s powers and fully exploit the Force.

The extent of Anakin’s emergent powers in TPM is his ability to see into the future and anticipate things, and only to the point that it makes him appear to have superhuman reflexes. That’s it.

The extent of Luke’s powers in ANH are a few minutes against a remote where he “reaches out” and senses it, and the trench run where he’s told to “let go” and allow the Force to guide him while targeting the exhaust port. That’s all we got from Luke in his first go-round. He didn’t blow up the Death Star with the Force.

In TLJ, Rey successfully controls a trooper’s mind and holds her own in a lightsaber duel against a much more powerful, albeit injured, opponent, despite never having used a lightsaber before.

Lukes training in Degoba wasn’t about lifting rocks, he could do that without much of an issue, but to understand why he could lift rocks. What he needed to learn about the force and how it connects to the universe.

Luke failed to extract his X-Wing from the swamp and didn’t complete his training, and while he demonstrated some impressive maneuvers in his fight with his father, Vader toyed with him until he got his hand cut off and was forced to surrender. Whether that was a function of a lack of combat training or lack of proper meditation—probably both—he wasn’t adequately prepared.

After receiving a few lessons, Rey assaulted her teacher and got the drop on him with a lightsaber, then fought Snoke’s guards alongside Kylo and lifted a bunch of boulders like they weren’t even there, thus saving the day.

Is Rey faster and more powerful than Luke and Anakin? sure, but I don’t see this being without precident.

Not without precedent, but without training?

Rey gets her trainig the same way you teach a child to swim, throw them in the deep end. Kylo’s probing of her mind taught her how to fight back, which taught her how to influence that storm troopers mind. She’s as powerful as the narrative needs her to be. It would have been nice for her to stay longer on the island, sure but I think she gets everything she needs to know for the narrative.

This is the crux of the problem. She’s not a character with an arc; she’s floating along and being handed her abilities by the universe in order to suit the narrative. No work, no progression, no setbacks, no loss. It’s a boring hero’s journey.

He didn’t blow up the Death Star with the Force ? Did we see the same movie ?!..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuKqcfO31is

He uses the force in the most abstract sense. The “trust your feelings” sense.
It’s not as if he guides the torpedoes into the exhaust port using telekinesis.

"use the Force Luke "

Yep. That seems pretty abstract to me.

Post
#1229921
Topic
Episode VIII : The Last Jedi - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

screams in the void said:

Jay said:

Chewielewis said:

DrDre said:

Yes, except for the fact that Anakin went through a decade of Jedi training, and still failed to become the Jedi, he was supposed to be. The prequels put the entire concept of believing in prophesies in doubt, and reinforce the idea, that allways in motion is the future.

Sure, but like Rey he was pretty gifted when we first met him.

I think there is a question that people aren’t asking, which is “What exactly is Jedi training”. I don’t think Jedi training is about moving rocks or lightsaber technique. I think Jedi training is more about indoctrination. The Jedi are a religion, and like most religions, you have to start them young so they understand the world they way you need them to, because Jedi in the Jedi Order are basically celebate monks. Thats why the council rejected Anakin, too old to indoctrinate, and they were right. The jedi don’t spend 10 years learning how to fight and move rocks. Their lessons are basically learning about the force and how to understand it better, but understand it the way the Jedi want them to.

You could also say that things like moving rocks or deflecting laser bolts are pretty much the Jedi traning 101, in EpII we see kids deflecting blaster bolts, they probably can lift brooms as well with not much traning. Anakin didn’t need training to use his force powers to Fly Pods. Luke didn’t get much training to learn how to grab his saber and to use the force to blow up the death star.

Some good points about Jedi training and indoctrination, and I agree with you to a certain extent. However, everything we saw in the first six films indicates that guidance and meditation are required in order to maximize a Jedi’s powers and fully exploit the Force.

The extent of Anakin’s emergent powers in TPM is his ability to see into the future and anticipate things, and only to the point that it makes him appear to have superhuman reflexes. That’s it.

The extent of Luke’s powers in ANH are a few minutes against a remote where he “reaches out” and senses it, and the trench run where he’s told to “let go” and allow the Force to guide him while targeting the exhaust port. That’s all we got from Luke in his first go-round. He didn’t blow up the Death Star with the Force.

In TLJ, Rey successfully controls a trooper’s mind and holds her own in a lightsaber duel against a much more powerful, albeit injured, opponent, despite never having used a lightsaber before.

Lukes training in Degoba wasn’t about lifting rocks, he could do that without much of an issue, but to understand why he could lift rocks. What he needed to learn about the force and how it connects to the universe.

Luke failed to extract his X-Wing from the swamp and didn’t complete his training, and while he demonstrated some impressive maneuvers in his fight with his father, Vader toyed with him until he got his hand cut off and was forced to surrender. Whether that was a function of a lack of combat training or lack of proper meditation—probably both—he wasn’t adequately prepared.

After receiving a few lessons, Rey assaulted her teacher and got the drop on him with a lightsaber, then fought Snoke’s guards alongside Kylo and lifted a bunch of boulders like they weren’t even there, thus saving the day.

Is Rey faster and more powerful than Luke and Anakin? sure, but I don’t see this being without precident.

Not without precedent, but without training?

Rey gets her trainig the same way you teach a child to swim, throw them in the deep end. Kylo’s probing of her mind taught her how to fight back, which taught her how to influence that storm troopers mind. She’s as powerful as the narrative needs her to be. It would have been nice for her to stay longer on the island, sure but I think she gets everything she needs to know for the narrative.

This is the crux of the problem. She’s not a character with an arc; she’s floating along and being handed her abilities by the universe in order to suit the narrative. No work, no progression, no setbacks, no loss. It’s a boring hero’s journey.

He didn’t blow up the Death Star with the Force ? Did we see the same movie ?!..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuKqcfO31is

He uses the force in the most abstract sense. The “trust your feelings” sense.
It’s not as if he guides the torpedoes into the exhaust port using telekinesis.