McFibb

Nice work everyone. Just a heads up tho, that outro is about 2 versions older than the current version! Here’s the most recent “published version, with additional tweaks still in the works c/o @EddieDean feedback: https://vimeo.com/499092432

Edit: Tweaks are mostly around duration of the credit sequence. The version above is fairly long (for credits), so figuring out where best to trim down each musical motif. That said, I quite enjoy the entire piece, but also recognize it’s not everyone’s preference. Would love to hear the groups thoughts!

Well, this just shows my ignorance. I didn’t know he was Sidious’ secret weapon. I always thought he was simply his Sith apprentice. Good point though about the mandos- they probably wouldn’t even know he he was. That said, is it common knowledge that his species is largely unknown?

I feel like I should have known all this… maybe I’m not the fan I thought I was. 😕

Maybes:

• Remove the Maul cold open and make it the stinger at the end of Death Watch (where it makes sense in context) rather than at the end of the season (which will already end on Maul’s face). Still a bit on the fence on this one, putting myself in the place of an absolute newbie. I think I’ll make this change based on feedback to my (production) season one finale, which we’re two episodes away from.

Could this be solved by adding additional context, perhaps through different dialogue elsewhere in the series? Would be easily accepted by the viewer since everyone is in helmets. And the actual voice of Pre Vizla really shouldn’t matter at this point, since we have no IDEA who this character is at the outset (and chances are, we aren’t going to go back once we meet PV and compare this opener’s vocal performance. If we accept that, then perhaps we could find some other audio introduction to Maul that makes more sense for the first time viewer? There’s gotta be someone, somewhere in the 7 seasons of TCW who says something to the effect of: “I thought you/him was dead!” vs the existing “What ARE you…?” dialogue, which serves the PV/mando character more than it does us as a viewer anyway. Add in a telephone/hi-pass filter to the audio (for the helmet) and boom, it might work for a cold open.

Thoughts?

NFBisms said:

Maybe my tolerance for this sort of thing is just super high, but I do miss the “Snips and Skyguy” exchange in ep 1. I get that some people have a cringe reflex, or would rather like Ahsoka than not at first, but I think there is value in having Ahsoka act smug and petulant at this point in her character arc.

Its absence kind of messes with the progression between her and Anakin in the episode. The bickering establishes why they aren’t getting along as well as they should be, so without it, she just comes off as a harmlessly enthusiastic girl that Anakin is being a dick to for no reason. By the time she is firing back, it’s because she’s had enough of his shit. But I just think Anakin needs to see a lot of himself in her for the whole “You’ll make it as mine” moment to work. She needs to be a headache, but one he understands being. It’s a perfect line robbed of its weight here.

idk, it was just really noticeable to me how harmless and inoffensive Ahsoka was. It didn’t jive with important character moments and dialogue in the episode.

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Pretty much everything else I’d have to say about the episodes I saw has been said. I think these are really well done overall! My only real technical (if even) gripe is that it’s noticeable to me when we’re coming into a scene from the titles with the music already halfway through a track. Maybe it’s something you plan to polish, but I wouldn’t mind if you rescored the beginning of those moments.

We’re on it. Promise. 😃

Going to watch Malevolence today. Will post feedback shortly after.

EddieDean said:

Well, either/or. Let’s discuss this offline so we don’t leave all the to and fro in this thread! But this all sounds great.

Deal. Starting a PM thread.

I think if we got it down to a science, with a production line that doesn’t change drastically, it could become rather efficient with minimal editing. For example, we agree on a standard duration for the credits, with every episode having X pieces of concept art lasting X seconds, with X credits per piece of concept art. It then makes editing our respective pieces that much more streamlined.

But the final cut would come from you, correct? We’d send you our respective files, with execution instructions, and then you’d replicate? Or am I getting ahead of myself? I guess I’m thinking about 3 different import/exports from different systems with different settings potentially impacting final quality (crushing blacks, frame rate drops, compressed audio, etc).

Chase Adams said:

EddieDean said:

Holy shit, that’s amazing. I mean, if you fancy doing that 250-300 times, please be my guest 😉

If I was going to commit to doing that many, I would definitely make each of them way more subtle than that.

Speaking of which, I have several other ideas on how to polish up those credits a lot more. But I’ll take another good look at them again and get back to you on that. 👍

The three of us should talk more in order to maximize the quality of the credit sequence. I love the movement, and totally agree that it should absolutely be more subtle.

I’m wondering if a workflow between the three of us could be achieved for each episode… I don’t know if I could fully commit, but I’m intrigued by the idea of custom outro credits/music for each episode. All centered around the current (to me and @EddieDean, not everyone else… we’re still getting it just right) outro music, of course, but uniquely tailored to the thematic elements of each episode, with custom in/out points depending on dialogue at the end of each episode.

Perhaps we could shoot for version 1.0 of each episode produced to have the same outdo music, and then as a new workflow emerges with v1.1, I could remix new outros for each?

I dunno, just spitballing.

You are all too kind! I’ll take another pass tonight for smoothing out the edges, tightening up some parts, and adding some additional instrumentation. While I like the overall length and “story” of the remixed score, it has a moment in the middle where I feel like it should just move on to the next movement. I think it’s the part that drops into the low-pass filtered piano order 66 theme. While I like that motif, especially expressed in this melancholy way, I think it draws out the “sadness” a little too much, bordering on maudlin. I’d like to see us move into the Maul motif a bit quicker, since the end is a bit prolongued as well, and that’s where the emotional hit really comes.

Happy for other feedback too. And @EddieDean, whenever you get a chance, can you mock-up over an ending/credits? Seeing it visually might help clarify some final tweaks.

And of course, now that I’ve done this, it makes me want to go back and keep working on the intro… 😃

Alright. Judgment time. Here’s a prelim cut. It’s rough around the edges and needs some additional instrumentation to get it sitting right, but I think all the components we’re looking for are there: emotion, contemplation, reflection, nostalgia, melancholy, resolve, etc. Having never seen TCW, my hope is that this is reflective of the entire viewing experience, of which I’ve gathered bits and pieces from this thread.

All feedback is welcome. And keep in mind, this runs on the long end so that @EddieDean can cut and merge different musical motifs for the different episode endings. The whole piece of music should work as a single composition, but slicing and dicing will work too, so long as the cuts/cross-fades are decent.

For context, all the music up until 00:44 would be behind the last bit of dialogue/end of the episode (if it ends neutrally or happy), at which point, we cut to black and credits roll.

Here’s the link: https://drive.google.com/file/d/12jLhNAYepIVsJ3W5kOgqa3WZsEKwkWKy/view?usp=sharing

Also, HUGE thanks to Samuel Kim on YouTube. This massive remix wouldn’t be possible without his phenomenal arrangements!

That’s what I thought. I’m working on a version that should be able to cover the spectrum of emotion, making it a little longer so that @EddieDean has the freedom to pick entry/exit points accordingly, merging the different “movements” as needed.

Should have a draft by tomorrow evening ready for review!

@EddieDean – I know the show changes tonally midway through. Is that true of episode endings too? That is to say, do some episodes end with, “And everything is well and good, yay for adventures!” and others with, “Holy crap. What just happened? Noooo!!” and others with “Uh oh. That’s not good.”?

Impacts my music choices. 😃

EddieDean said:

Noted, thanks guys. Knight, I agree on the music. I definitely want there to be ONE closing theme tune, ideally Clones (Sad). My hope is that so long as it starts on the right note it’ll merge with whatever tracks used to lead into the original ending theme, and that McFibb can wizard it up. I’ve got a lot of faith in him, so let’s see how it goes!

If it works, I’ll take all the credit, if not, can I blame it on the prequels? 😉

@EddieDean – check PMs.

EddieDean said:

Check the sheet in about ten minutes McFibb - I’ve just added a tab called ‘other stuff’ and put in a video with lots of examples for you. It’s uploading as we speak.

Fantastic. Thanks dude.

Also, your parenthetical joke made me laugh aloud. Well done.

EddieDean said:

CMMAP said:

Don’t get me wrong the clone sad theme (liked you joke about being you sad) is a wonderful choice for the end credits but not necessarily for the first 20-30 seconds. depends on the other theme, might be possible even at 10 seconds in.

Yeah. If McFibb can work some magic so that the majority of Clones (Sad) is preserved, but that it transitions out of the episode body properly, that would be the best case scenario. I accept that we might have to lose the lovely choral stuff and maybe even the minor key, though.

Don’t fret yet. I have some magic up my sleeve to try an idea or two out!

As for the “drop”, I literally meant the logo. I’ve seen some shows do that before, where it’s a hard cut, matched to a crescendo in the music, going straight to the logo, followed by a fade into the credits.

Not saying that’s my preference, but that’s what I was trying to clarify.

Looking forward to your vid snips!

EddieDean said:

McFibb said:

EddieDean said:

Knight of Kalee, just spotted your edit.

I agree on tightening up the text shadow a little.

I’m going to struggle with the outro credits in this and every episode, since it always builds up then drops into the bombast of the original.

Unless @McFibb has an idea to draw out the opening of the music track I’m using any further? More of a build then drop into the operatic singing? It’d need to be about 20/30 sec before the current start, with the peak just before where the start is.

But even then, it’s not something I’d be able to use in every episode, I don’t think.

Yup — that’s what I meant by helping out. Love the music too, but happy to take a swing at getting the timing/tone right for the entirety of the outro. Can you clarify a bit more about what you’re looking for?

I’ll try:

So we’re talking about extending the start of ‘The Clones Theme Order 66 Sad Version’.

Currently, it begins with a little hum, then some choral singing, then the brass comes in.

Compare that to existing episodes (like my S01E02), where the final dialogue to close out the episode normally plays over some music which builds slowly for about 30 seconds, giving the sense it’s wrapping up the story, then drops into the BA-BAHHH of the Clone Wars logo / closing credits.

As it stands now, because I’m cutting the BA-BAHHH, we end up with a track slowly building, but then fading out so that I can drop into the choral music of ‘Clones Sad’.

I feel like the best way to achieve the same effect with this track would be to allow the brass drop to replace the original credits’ BA-BAHHH, in which case the choral part becomes our build up.

I’ve quickly mocked this up (VERY ROUGH, excuse quality) to give you an idea of what I’m thinking makes sense.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JwpM7ATxqbDAlMh_6ggOWkFntD0Y_3SE/view?usp=sharing

The top yellow track in this video is the episode’s video, the bottom yellow track is the music channel, and the bottom blue track is the voice/sfx.

You can see that, to replace the existing track entirely, I’ve had to pull the beginning of Clones Sad back 30 seconds into the episode proper.

I’ve extended the choir to do this, which I think is neat, but it’s probably way too dominant. I don’t know if you could achieve something more subtle. Or something which achieves the same emotional effect, but with different sounds - but which still launches nicely into the brass drop. And I’d prefer not to lose the choir altogether since I think it’s a nice part of the anticipation.

There’s also a risk that other episodes start their build as early as maybe 40 seconds in, in which case I’d need maybe 40 seconds of neutral/choral build before we get to the brass drop.

Nice mock-up. Helpful! Do you know if the ending build up in the original episodes is always the same, or at the very least, in the same key each time?

Also, do you want to drop right to credits or to logo again?

Finally, could you send me the video track + dialogue + no music for the last 30 seconds, then your full credit sequence, sans music?

@EddieDean — Thanks for the clarification! I can screw around with it the next day or two and give you a few versions. That work?

EddieDean said:

Knight of Kalee, just spotted your edit.

I agree on tightening up the text shadow a little.

I’m going to struggle with the outro credits in this and every episode, since it always builds up then drops into the bombast of the original.

Unless @McFibb has an idea to draw out the opening of the music track I’m using any further? More of a build then drop into the operatic singing? It’d need to be about 20/30 sec before the current start, with the peak just before where the start is.

But even then, it’s not something I’d be able to use in every episode, I don’t think.

Yup — that’s what I meant by helping out. Love the music too, but happy to take a swing at getting the timing/tone right for the entirety of the outro. Can you clarify a bit more about what you’re looking for?

@EddieDean — Happy to help with outro music stuff too if you like.

And in terms of not having enough art for the credits, I think you could spend more time per piece of art and slow down the movement for greater effect. That might buy you enough time. I think they are slightly too fast as is anyway.

EddieDean said:

##FIRST EPISODE RELEASED - S01E02 THE DEATH WATCH

Comprising original episodes s02e12 The Mandalore Plot, and s02e13 Voyage of Temptation.

It’s in the tracker.

McFibb, I’ll look into the timing when I’m more sober and/or when I’ve had more feedback, and I’ll fix up the community credits shortly too, for a v1.1. But I’m happy to call this RELEASE VERSION v1.0 , which makes this, finally, the first output after a long period of planning.

Thank you all for your help in getting this over the line. ❤️

Well done, buddy! And major props to your correct usage of “comprised”. So excited to sit and watch!!

@EddieDean – intro looks awesome! Thanks for the opportunity to contribute.

A few nitpicks (feel free to disregard if you/the community disagree):

• The title cards feel a bit too long, with the timing seeming disproportional for the last sentence on each card, particularly the first one.
• In building the new music, I actually had a different broad vision of the timing. Using your video on Vimeo, timestamps below were my initial intention for the music to be matched to the associated “action”:

Pre-intro text music: 0:26 (no prob)
1st line: 0:31 (no prob, since 1st line is so short…)
2nd line: 0:34
3rd line: 0:40
Fade to black: 0:46
1st line, 2nd card: 0:49
2nd line: 0:54
3rd line: 1:00
Logo, growing: 1:05
Logo stop growing: 1:16
Logo cuts immediately to black: 1:20
Chapter title: 1:25 (no prob, but I could cut/crossfade a good 2-3 secs between 1:20 and 1:25 to tighten)

(EDIT: Happy to do a mock-up if the above doesn’t make sense.)

Of course, this is your edit; do what feels best!

Hey @EddieDean – would mind PMing me a link to that spreadsheet. I could have sword I had it from weeks ago, but I don’t have a record of it in my history.

Thanks!

Alright, my turn for an update. Here’s a new version of Intro Music. @EddieDean, you want to download the mp3 and sync it up for an intro and see how it looks? The whole thing is about 1:13.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nRdyWaGve9AtEiPen7igflGSszQGzYU3/view?usp=sharing

Totally makes sense and agree on all points! 😃