kk650

DrDre said:

In the mean time, I managed to improve the color matching method. There appears to be some color noise hidden in the raw scan, that was difficult for the algorithm to handle. The new algorithm is less sensitive to the color noise. Once again the reference is the Semi-Specialised Edition V2.2 frame posted earlier:

The results are as follows (raw/rough correction/correction with algo):

DrDre, I have to say that your colour matching is pretty fantastic, the accuracy with which you recreated the Semi-Specialised Edition V2.2 colors on the print with all that lovely filmic grain and detail is amazing. Bravo!

I agree that the JSC colors look great in certain scenes but then in others, the yellow tint just comes across as too much IMHO, like in this scene below:

Its certainly a very distinctive look but not the most balanced colourwise. The yellow tint can be quite overwhelming and not let the other colours get a look in, especially the blues.

kk650 said:

poita said:

RU.08 said:

poita said:

What! It doesn't look like this?

 Well, I am sure a team could take the scans and make it look just like the correct lower image :)

This is how the Empire Strikes Back Semi-Specialised Edition V2.2 looks in that scene:

For those interested, here's the same shot from the print taken from althor1138's fantastic The Empire Strikes Back "COLD" edition:

althor1138, I can't thank you enough for creating these "COLD" editions, they have been incredibly helpful in working out how to go about regrading the Original Trilogy. I hope that they'll be of as much help to everybody here working on colour correcting these prints as they have been to me.

AntcuFaalb said:

kk650: ESB came after they stopped making IB Technicolor prints and before Kodak started making LPP prints. Basically, all ESB prints are on shitty likely-to-fade film stocks.

So we have IB Technicolor for SW and LPP for RotJ. ESB was made in the transition period with no stable fade-free options available.

Ah I see, thanks for the explanation!

There's definately something about ESB because all the prints i've seen on ebay have also gone reddish/pink, while the colours of ROTJ and especially the technicolor Star Wars prints have fared much better:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-2-x-35mm-Film-Cells-Vintage-Star-Wars-Empire-Strikes-Back-1980-C3PO-/121710751764?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c5686b014&nma=true&si=06F%252F9Mi%252BcLpUJm2rItrF9QGoN2Q%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Makes me wonder if George Lucas himself didn't remember what ESB looked like theatrically and had to improvise a new colour scheme on the fly for the lowry master. It would explain why ESB has always felt like the odd one out of the OT blu-rays, at least to me.

poita said:

RU.08 said:

poita said:

What! It doesn't look like this?

 Well, I am sure a team could take the scans and make it look just like the correct lower image :)

This is how the Empire Strikes Back Semi-Specialised Edition V2.2 looks in that scene:

Based on those scans I get the impression that fleshtones have been more affected overall by the red fade on the print than anything else.

Does anybody know why its the Empire Strikes Back prints that seem to be more affected by red fade compared to prints from the other two OT films, at least from what i've seen? I'm curious.

Great news guys! The Return of the Jedi Semi-Specialised Edition V2.15 with both endings, Yub Nub and Victory Celebration, is now done! :)

I should have them both up on tehparadox in the next few days, then i'll get them up on myspleen.

MrToad883 said:

kk650, are the video aspects changing at all for your 5.1 mixes or keeping anh 2.2, esb 2.2 and rotj 2.15 as the video sources?

The video sources are staying the same, it doesn't look like any higher definition sources for Lapti Nek, Yub Nub or the Jedi Ghosts are going to become available before the release of The Force Awakens so those three scenes will remain GOUT sourced.

That said, i've manually gone through those scenes frame by frame cleaning them of spots, scratches and dirt and modified the colour and image dynamics on a shot by shot basis so they look very nice IMHO, certainly much better than the GOUT itself.

I've always felt that the colours of the US DVD release shown on caps-a-holic looked the most 'right' to me:

Blanket blue tints seem more like a modern digital grading phenomenon. Is there any evidence or images out there on the internet, apart from the Robert Harris thread, that supports that Sparticus on the original IB film print looked as blue as those remastered screencaps suggest?

TServo2049 said:

IMO, an improperly colored 4K version with grain is better than a more correctly-colored 2K version with DNR. We can change the color if we want. We can't reverse DNR.

Can't agree more!

I'd love the upcoming Leon: The Professional 4k release to have both great colours and lovely natural fine grain with lots of detail but if push comes to shove whats most important to me is the latter, I just hope that they give as much attention to Leon in terms of maintaining fine grain, overall detail and fixing the boosted contrast of the previous Leon release. I can only hope.

Wow, loving all that grain and extra detail in the new restoration, with more image in the frame and much improved colour seperation!

The only issue I can see in those screencaps are the overall colours and fleshtones that lean too much towards blue, removing the blue tint would definately make this look better colourwise IMHO.

The improvement in detail really is amazing, I just hope the leon 4k remaster coming out gets treated as well as this has, that really would make my year!

The german hdtv transport stream I used as the main source for AOTC is 16-17gb so yeah, IMHO the difference between a 22gb version and a 50gb version wouldn't be noticable to the eye.

ROTS I used the blu-ray as the main source but there isn't really much grain in that release so i'd expect the difference to be barely noticable between a 22gb and 50 gb version.

TPM had the additional grain that I added which is very bitrate hungry so when I did tests comparing the 22gb bitrate to the 50gb bitrate, I could quite clearly see that the 50gb bitrate reproduced the grain structure more faithfully so I felt it was worthwhile creating a 50gb release.

For both Return of the Jedi V2.15 releases, the one with the Yub Nub ending and the one with the Victory Celebration ending, i'll be using the 2 channel uncompressed PCM audio tracks, like I did with Star Wars V2.2 and The Empire Strikes Back V2.2.

I haven't actually started yet on the 5.1 Cinema DTS tracks, my sole focus has been on the colour grading. Once Return of the Jedi V2.15 is done and out there, i'll take a little break from Star Wars then start working on the three 5.1 tracks.

John Doom said:

kk650 said:

@John Doom: That shot looks fine to me, they're being hit directly in the face by a hot Tatooine sun during what looks like the middle of the day, i'd expect their fleshtones outdoors to reflect that.

As for the green fur, who knows? I remember reading somewhere that the colour of the sources they used to create the master for these releases were a bit iffy with colour shifts often happening in the same shot, which I've personally seen myself many times and what makes there Star Wars so difficult to regrade, and numerous other visual/colour inconsistencies. Perhaps the green fur is one of those things.

Thanks for the answer and keep up the good work! ;)

My pleasure and thank you for your feedback about their fleshtones being too yellow in that screencap, its ended up being very helpful!

The issue that you were noticing there was actually the overall saturation setting being too high rather than there being too much yellow, i'd gotten so used to the high saturation levels of the blu-ray that I wasn't seeing it, that's why its so useful having a fresh set of eyes looking over what you've done. I've reduced the saturation and the fleshtones across the whole film look much better now.

I think Return of the Jedi is now pretty much good to go colourwise. I just need to tweak some of the lightsaber colours. I should very likely have this finished and up by next weekend.

Hal 9000 said:

Just noticed that you had uploaded a 50GB version of your TPM regrade. That's some serious dedication, and something great to have archived. I wonder if you had planned on giving the same treatment to your AOTC and ROTS regrades?

Also, while the TPM regrade has no burnt-in subtitles, AOTC does. Would it be easily done to upload the handful of affected shots without the subtitles? 

JEDIT: Of course not; they're part of the source material!

I wasn't planning to, The Phantom Menace is my favourite of the prequels and the added grain looked noticably better at the maximum bitrate compared to the 22gb release, making it worthwhile in my book.

If you're interested in using my AOTC or ROTS V2 regrades for your edits though I could certainly create 50gb versions for you, these prequel films could use all the help they can get editing wise, especially the second film.

@MrToad883: Thanks! Return of the Jedi has a similar warm feeling colourwise to the Star Wars Semi-Specialised Edition V2.2 which I think fits perfectly because they are very similar films at heart, lighthearted space opera escapism.

The Empire Strikes Back has always been the odd one out both narratively and colourwise for me, its the most serious and dramatic of the three film and the one that looks the least bad on the official blu-ray IMHO because it seems a lot of the blue is actually meant to be there, which kind of fits the colder darker feel of the story unlike Star Wars and Return of the Jedi which are more lighthearted with more comedic moments.

@John Doom: That shot looks fine to me, they're being hit directly in the face by a hot Tatooine sun during what looks like the middle of the day, i'd expect their fleshtones outdoors to reflect that.

As for the green fur, who knows? I remember reading somewhere that the colour of the sources they used to create the master for these releases were a bit iffy with colour shifts often happening in the same shot, which I've personally seen myself many times and what makes there Star Wars so difficult to regrade, and numerous other visual/colour inconsistencies. Perhaps the green fur is one of those things.

There's been talk here of Return of the Jedi being kinda neglected when it comes to preservations which is true and a real shame, I think its a great film and my second favourite OT film after Star Wars.

With that in mind, I thought i'd remedy that a little by giving Return of the Jedi the limelight for once and putting up some preview screencaps of the up and coming Return of the Jedi Semi-Specialised Edition V2.15 :)

Get well soon Poita!

joefavs said:

Any chance of a DVD-9 release once the 5.1 mix is done? my setup is such that I can only get surround sound through my blu ray player, and my blu ray player is such that I can't play files larger than 4gb with it, and my computer is such that I can't burn blu ray. I get that my needs are pretty specific and I'm happy to do it myself if need be, but an AVCHD version would be much appreciated.

Yes I was planning to do dvd-9 AVCHD releases once those 5.1 mixes are done. I don't have any expertise when it comes to creating menus though so I was just planning to use tsmuxer to create an AVCHD with no menu. If somebody with knowledge of creating menus for AVCHDs would be willing to help me out in that regard that would be fantastic.

Definately!

No need to worry Cheebo, these Semi-Specialised Editions are still very much alive, just been busy with work and other projects like Fight Club and Pirates of the Carribean: The Curse of the Black Pearl so I haven't been around here for a while.

To answer your question MrToad883, I plan to start working on the 5.1 mixes once I finish Return of the Jedi, which will be very soon, like in 1-2 weeks. Return of the Jedi has always been my second favourite OT film after Star Wars so I'm very much looking forward to finally releasing it.

One thing you guys can be certain of is that all three Semi-Specialised V2 releases and the 5.1 mixes to go with them will be out before The Forces Awakens hits the cinemas.

Have you considered making a bd-50 release of this as well? I think the grain you add would probably really benefit and look even more natural and filmic. I found the difference between my 22gb and 50gb release of The Phantom Menace to be quite noticable.

Hmm, actually now that you mention it, generated grain does have a way of being more video bitrate hungry than normal grain, I know that from my own The Phantom Menace regrained edition. I've changed my mind, you shouldn't include it IMHO, your generated grain will need as much video bitrate as possible.

Great news Andrea! I think compressing the analog laserdisc track would defeat the purpose of including it. I would personally include it, I don't think losing 1.5gb from the video bitrate will make much difference to the image quality.

_,,,^..^,,,_ said:

Well, on fanres there are polls since the beginning...

I know but it requires anybody wanting to vote to register. In terms of convenience, setting up a poll that doesn't require registering to a site would be preferable.

I've never seen a poll here so I imagined it didn't. Didn't Andrea mention a site dedicated to setting up polls? Something like that would do the trick, even better if it didn't require any form of registration to vote.