cyclista

Bingowings said:

5.Having Ren take his mask off before that scene with Han. The reveal that the mask is essentially cosplay because he wants to copy his poweful grandfather who needed to wear a mask is a character note that should go with that scene.

Oh, holy crap. I hadn’t even begun to envision edits that would work with the existing material, but this one nails an issue completely. It might be unpleasant to the audience who will probably always be expecting a genuine horror underneath the mask at such an apex moment, but structurally it makes so much more sense, especially explaining in that same moment why Han still regards him as his son.

Wow. Good job.

Smoking Lizard said:

• Kylo Ren and the First Order round up the innocent villagers and are setting the village on fire. When Kylo comes to question Poe, Poe deems it appropriate to crack jokes at Ren. No, Poe, don’t, you know, maybe BEG for mercy for the villagers and insist that they’re innocent. Nah. Crack jokes instead.

Am I the only one who remembers someone mentioning Poe being the son of someone important? I could have sworn it was implied he was Han’s son, making this a snarky remark in defiance of his little brother’s attempt at being a badass. Someone correct me on this, I haven’t seen it more than once.

• Oh, yeah! What about Poe Dameron? Why did he just leave Jakku without finding BB-8 first? It was a critical mission AND HE JUST LEFT?! When he got back to the Resistance planet did Leia come up and say, “Well?” and he said, “Well, what?” and she said, “Did you get the message I sent you to retrieve?” and he said, “Oh, snap!”?!

lol yeah busted

• So in 30 years Luke trained ZERO new Jedis? Ren somehow killed them ALL?!

Yeah seems implausible to me too 😕

Ideally we find there’s a bit more nuance than that in future.

Alderaan said:

That stromtrooper sabre scene was cringeworthy. Just brutal.

I actually thought it was cool, tech should have evolved somewhat. And clearly specialized troopers are a fixture of this new empire group. It was startling that a lightsaber wasn’t just magically lethal, I think deriding it just because it was obviously cool is kind of paranoid. Not everything that is cool is inauthentic 9_9

Smoking Lizard said:

And the scene is even made sillier when you think of this: Why would a stormtrooper even be armed with a melee weapon that can CONVENIENTLY deflect lightsaber blades? Before you say, “So they can fight the Jedi!”, the Jedi are extinct (except for Luke). So they pose no threat. Why would your foot soldiers be armed with such an impractical weapon?

This is just yet another case of, “Let’s throw a lot of really ‘cool’ sh!t on the screen!” without any regard for whether or not the “cool” sh!t makes any sense.

This is just BS. Military units carry specialists often. A sniper might be attached to a combat group even not knowing for certain long distance targets will be present. This isn’t an excuse either; again, it is clear that this new empire has invested more in its troopers, which is good, because previously they were fodder junk, and we’ve mocked them for years as a result.

Smoking Lizard said:

TV’s Frink said:

Let me know when you can link to a video explaining how quicksand works on Jakku.

This is where we get into the ugly realm of what is possible vs. what is plausible. Unfortunately, it seems that some folks here aren’t able or aren’t willing to discern the difference.

You either read nothing of what we even at this crude time know of geology on other planets or you are just leaving it out of the discussion. Do we even know that the desert on Jakku is silica? How? Do all deserts behave the same regardless of the mineral content? And in any case, the fact that these sands are treacherous was mentioned earlier in the film. Come on, man, your tone assumes an air of critical remove but most of us are smart enough to see that you’re just here to stir things up, because your arguments are transparently stupid. You are a very poor critic.

By the way, I just want to make it understood that most of Smoking Lizard’s complaints were disgruntled nonsense. It isn’t even a matter of opinion, most of those comments just demonstrated a lack of attention span watching the events of the story. Not to mention a bias that was astronomical. And the fact that Smoking Lizard wrote such a stupidly long list will virtually guarantee that no one will take the enormous quantity of time to refute all of the points, especially considering that given their disposition, it is unlikely that any point will be conceded.

So that troll gets fed just these tiny crumbs (and will probably go frantically raving around for more, but that would happen anyway).

Alderaan said:

One of the worst parts of the film was when the CGI prequel monsters got loose on Han’s freighter. That whole part of the film was not Star Wars. The tone was wrong. Anyone else feel the same?

Yeah. I think it can be edited better though, and lost total minutes replaced with some deleted footage. The concept wasn’t wrong at all, but the execution was off. I think more than anything it was the bad guys, their scene was like some shitty scene in a SciFi network schlock show.

luckydube56 said:

I didnt like how Chewie walked right past Leia after returning from their mission where Han dies. Are they strangers?

THIS. So much.

TV’s Frink said:

Before anyone goes ape over that statement, it’s absolutely fine to not like TFA, and I have some issues with it myself. But my god some of the bending over backwards just trying to justify hating TFA by some (not all) here is amazing.

+1000. I didn’t know this was… oh wait. This is the hater’s honeypot. Bosk basically made this to attract Smoking Lizard.

Oh my god. They’re both lizards. This is their breeding ground.

WE HAVE TO GET OUT

TV’s Frink said:

Scratch that, no problem exists.

First off, if you use an automated downloader like jdownloader2, you shouldn’t get captchas. Having said that, I tried downloading one file manually through chrome and I got the same captcha request. I entered the four numbers and hit the “reactivate passport” link." It thanked me, and then I was able to download the file no problem.

So… crappiness REVEALED. After taking the last couple of days to dl all of the Slumberland ep.1 files up to pt. 20, I discovered pts. 21 and 22, the last ones left, are down.

So Slumberland’s Rise of the Sith: effectively is not up.

Obviously should check all links before doenloading, I spaced on that.

Yeah, for some reason JDownloader doesn’t work ( I mentioned this earlier I believe). It keeps suggesting that the megashares plugin is out of date (though the message is a bit more ambiguous than that). I also have the latest version available for my platform, which is Linux, and searching the internet it looks like the last time anyone complained about the megashares plugin was years ago - but it was probably on Windows. And no, I haven’t contacted the developers at JDownloader yet to ask them about it.

May the Force be with you ^_^ !

Smoking Lizard said:

And so, rinse and repeat. Here we are today, with an equally bad movie. As critics point out the laughably ridiculous flaws, defenders rush in with contrived ad hoc reasoning to “explain it all away,” and, even better, launch all sorts of ad hominem attacks against the critics.

Sigh

Smoking Lizard said:

TavorX said:

Finally, all these years later, when we see TFA, I couldn’t believe it. He was laughing, tearing up, and genuinely looked like he was having a blast! So I dunno man, for as long as I’ve known my dad, he never bought into that hype of the prequels. Did he recognize the flaws of TFA? Sure. But overall, we were geeking out over the film of how fun it was!

Emphasis added. I suspect your father is in his 40s. That’s when us older guys really start getting overwhelmed by the awareness of our own mortality. Our children are now adults. The fun times of our own childhoods are long gone. Old age is fast approaching us. When we were young, two years seemed like an eternity. Now, we remind ourselves, “I really need to get a new battery for my watch,” and then suddenly realize, “Holy crap! My watch went dead two years ago!”

Your father was suffering the cruel tugs of nostalgia. Nothing more. And that’s what so terribly gratuitous about this movie: It’s nostalgia for the sake of nostalgia.

contrived ad hoc reasoning to “explain it all away,”

and, even better, launch all sorts of ad hominem attacks

hmmmm

Swazzy said:

I just found the line they used to have Alec Guinness say Rey’s name

“Come here, little one! Don’t be afREYd.”

[And here it is in TFA @57]LINK REMOVED

I find it so amusing how they pulled this off. It’s such a fanedit-y thing to do.

I’m sure they were excited about all of the fan points they were going to get for this. And boy, did I give them. This was just beautiful. In fact I doubt they ever would have thought of it without /giving themselves/ fan points for doing so.

ZkinandBonez said:

SpilkaBilka said:

To me, it kinda felt like “well, we have to put a Cantina scene in the movie.” It felt shoehorned in and not necessary. Maz could’ve been based anywhere, really. Didn’t have to be a bar.

Not huge things, but I also wasn’t really a fan of 1) First Order spies being there, 2) a Resistance spy being there, and 3) Finn seeking transport with a couple guys like Ben and Luke were trying to do in ANH.

I actually thought that was a really clever way to show us that the Resistance and the First Order are on a pretty equal footing in the galaxy at this point in history. That is as apposed to the OT where the Rebels were a small group of freedom fighters, and the Empire spanned the galaxy. Now, thirty years later, they are two more or less equally sized military forces, each with their own spy-network.
(It’s also a decent plot-reason for having the Resistance show up to save the day during the FO attack.)

SilverWook said:

A seedy den crawling with spies for both sides was a thing when sound movies were new.

We might get a Casablanca planet in Star Wars yet.

All of this. One of the interesting things the movie does is take what is obviously the ANH plot template, but then fill each element with something original. And this might not even qualify as one of the copied elements - where the hell else are smugglers going to congregate and meet contacts? Their moms house? If this was a Tarantino film maybe.

Although I did almost roll my eyes when they showed the band.

m_s0 said:

Warbler said:

Jay said:

5/10.

Meh.

is it any better that the PT movies?

It’s a mastepiece of filmmaking in comparison.

Drastically.

msycamore said:

Not a fan of ranking films, but here goes…
Star Wars: 4,5/5 - Groundbreaking classic. A celebration of film and the ultimate feel good (fantasy) film. Only a weak middle act (Death Star) keep it from a perfect score. (best film score ever produced)
The Empire Strikes Back: 5/5 - Perhaps the boldest sequel ever made. A dark fairytale so beautifully conceived it hurts. A masterpiece in the genre on every level.
Return of the Jedi: 2/5 - Huge disappointment. Stupid and poor conclusion that only gets worse the more the years go by. Great puppetry (Jabba) and costume design (royal guards) but the magic was gone.

The Phantom Menace: 1/5 - Sterile test-tube baby
Attack of the Clones: Never seen it, and probably never will
Revenge of the Sith: Never seen it, and probably never will

The Force Awakens: Not yet seen. And have not yet decided if I’m going to. Please, convince a grumpy old fart if he should?

I’d say do it. Don’t expect it to restore your faith completely, but it might.

My verdict is definitely above RotJ (even though I like that film more than I hate it), unquestionably far and away above the prequels (even RotS, which isn’t revolting) but below ANH and ESB, though I think it definitely tried to hold itself more to the standards of those two than any of the others.

Without giving any qualifications that would be spoilers, I’d say yes, just go see it, and in the theater definitely. Especially if they release an extended version 😉

At the risk of undermining the credibility of my exhortation to you entirely, I’d also give at least one each of the fanedit prequels a viewing. They may not make the films on par with ANH and ESB, but the changed story tones in several edits make a real difference.

MULLET

WHY DIDN’T I THINK OF THAT

I’M ADDING MULLET TO THE LIST

BRILLIANT

Alderaan said:

cyclista said:
I’d say Rowling definitely intends that the Good side is the right one, whereas Lucasfilm seems conflicted

This is a thing that I’m tired of. The prequels should have taken a noble man, Anakin Skywalker, and given him some kind of hamartia, and allowed that to lead to his downfall and ultimate turn to the dark side of the force.

I figure you’re referring to the “Lucasfilm seems conflicted” part of that statement, and I think there is another way I mean 'conflicted". First of all, I am with you 100% about several of the things you say. Kylo Ren: fuck that guy. I don’t care about his redemption. When Han touched his face before falling, it was sad in a pathetic kind of way, the emotional connection of a father to his revolting serial-killer son. The tragedy was there on so many levels. And if Leia tries to “save” her son in the future, I understand, but I will in no way be rooting for her to succeed. I want him gone, like I wanted Geoffrey from GoT gone. He’s a whiny scumbag and I don’t care about what he wants.

I also agree about Anakin’s arc in the prequels. He was also a whiny loser (though not a scumbag) and I don’t see why we should care about his turning to the good; does he get a pass on the millions he’s killed if he does? What?! Hell no.

I’m glad he saw the light before he died, and I think that was a fine turn of events. There’s no Christian-like God or Hell that we know of in Star Wars, and I think in that case even if he is beyond social redemption, cosmically speaking he can be sort of a flipped bit from 0 to 1 (or the reverse, whichever) if his soul is immortal (but not destined for Heaven or Hell), which in the SWU does seem to be the case. But this isn’t the same as the ridiculous suggestion that everything is ok now, and that if Vader had lived he’d be hanging out with the Rebels at their base and shit. Nope.

Thanks for introducing me to he word “hamartia”, by the way.

Yeah, I agree about these characters having personal responsibility required of them, in the final analysis. But leading up to that analysis there does need to be considered the fact that these kids (Kylo and Anakin) are damaged and full of more power than they can handle - think Tetsuo. Great power requires great control and a stable foundation, and this is something Harry Potter has, despite his crappy childhood. Anakin and Kylo are just too fucked up to resist their own power - and they both have cunning opportunistic handlers all too willing to manage it for them. So they have responsibility, and they are accountable, and we are justified in hating them, but they are victims of circumstance (part of which is the sly ambitions of others) as well. In a lot of ways I think Mace Windu’s scorn could have hurt Anakin’s chances of being able to do good, in that Mace could have been one more influence encouraging his wisdom and better judgement rather than just giving him suspicious looks and discouraging comments, though I doubt he could have fixed the problem alltogether.

As for “conflicted”, I simply refer to the “balance to The Force” aspect of the SWU, which I think goes back to ANH and ESB. And also why I invoked The Dark Crystal. I don’t think it refers to it being ok to destroy Alderaan or murder people, more to a presence of passion without corruption, rational thought without sterility, temperance without inertia.

Visually I could see that. I’m more talking about the essence of what Snoke is supposed to represent. Harry Potter himself is in some ways a kind of Luke Skywalker character, a person of immense latent power forced to choose “light side” or “dark side” with avatars of good and evil pulling him in both directions, and the evil avatar scheming to usurp his power toward its own end. I’d say Rowling definitely intends that the Good side is the right one, whereas Lucasfilm seems conflicted (balance), but the dynamic is similar and I’ve heard it said elsewhere as well. So we have a art imitates art which then imitates art, kind of situation, an homage being acknowledged as meaningful in its own right by the originator of the idea. I think it’s cool - except the name being too childish etc.

Alderaan said:

There is a science to the way names sound. I forget what it’s called. Vader was not only a great villain, but his name sounded perfect. Vader. Intimidating. Succinct. Hard to forget, and very appropriate.

Another great example I can think of is Anne Stanton in All The King’s Men.

Unfortunately, it seems this science is being lost on younger generations. Snoke doesn’t do it for me. I can’t really explain it, and I wonder if anyone can help out here. But even besides the terrible CGI design, the name just doesn’t elicit fear. And as we all heard, it sounded pathetic when Leia and Han said it in TFA.

I felt it was an attempt to borrow from Harry Potter. “Snape” for instance. In that universe it would sound more correct, but in this one, yeah, it sounds a bit cute-ish. I might name a mischievous kitten Snoke.

I’ve previously thought they might be trying to invoke a kind of Voldemort-ish dynamic, which is a somewhat appropriate comparison, naming conventions aside.

TavorX said:

As for Leia and Chewie not consoling each other: I took as Chewie not realizing Leia already knew Han was dead. I thought maybe it was too difficult for Chewie to bring himself to tell her. Put yourself in Chewie’s shoes. If your best friend died, would it be easy for you to be the one to tell his/her spouse? As for Chewie taking off with Rey to find to Luke, I had no problem with it. Even with Han dead, Chewie would still want to do his duty.

This is honestly the BEST answer I’ve seen for this criticism. I never could quite pinpoint why Chewie didn’t, but after reading this, I fully back this.

Not bad as far as imaginary justifications go, but this still isn’t visible onscreen, and ultimately this would only be satisfactory if it was referenced or constructed in some way in extended footage or the next movie. If Leia knows there’s something to console Rey about, she knows there is definitely something to console Chewie about.

My guess is that it was a not-exactly-successful attempt to show that “Leia knows something”. So fine, maybe we will see exactly what in the next film. But the aggregate is still that whether we are discussing Leia and Chewie or some other events succeeding Han’s death, the effect of his death was really flat onscreen. Which sucked because he proved himself compelling for the entire prior part of the film. I’m not demanding a ten minute funeral scene or something, I’m just saying that we needed to see way more emotional fallout, somehow.

And I stand by the following that I wrote earlier, just because it would be cool and expand Chewbacca’a character:

Chewbacca should for the most part leave the rebellion as a consistent soldier and become a sort of bounty hunter specializing in collecting sith heads, or if that is too NC-17, then sith lightsabers, which Luke or Rey or Finn modify to produce white, blue, or green blades. Chewie can show up at some point in a room that everyone is in and drop an armload of sith lightsabers onto a table while everyone in the room stares at them and goes pale. The modified lightsabers can be given to new jedis in training, and the combo of sith hardware and jedi colors can be a small symbol of the light and dark sides beginning to find balance.

And Chewie’s look should definitely change to reflect his state, maybe more weapons, dirtier fur. Maybe some of the war leaders on Kashyyyk could be used as stylistic references as well, for cultural consistency.

lluukkee said:

as i said earlier , it is like …come on i cant wait 3 years to learn that kylo is the son of han , also cannot wait for rey to be trained like luke , give me all that now , today , asap …like in my real life …facebook , twitter etc instant information at your service , so jj understood that

Try using the quote button at the comment you mean to reference so everyone knows which comment you are referencing.

(that came off snarky, sorry didn’t mean it that way)

You’re retconning. This movie was just finished, and this is a review thread, not a fanfic or fanedit brainstorm thread. There was no evidence for either of those conditions visible.

Also maybe this community uses their imagination a little too much out of necessity because so much after ESB was shit and the only way to suspend disbelief was with a frigging crowbar. Lets apply higher standards to this round of films.

He doesn’t want it. He considers his ministry to the new Jedi a failure because it resulted in the perversion of his best friend’s son. This is also why he removed himself from civilization. He may even know his lost student just killed his best friend. He retired in shame, which means removing himself from activity - activity for a Jedi is wielding that thing she wants him to take.

SilverWook said:

There really wasn’t time to mourn Han, they still had to finish the task at hand and get the hell out of there. In the original film, there was but a moment for Luke to mourn over Ben’s death and then the TIE fighters attack.

There was more time than that here. And it still explains zero about wtf did not happen between Leia and Chewie and DID happen between Leia and “Oh look some girl I’ve never met! She looks prime to share my grief over the horrifically sad death of my best friend and lover of many decades with!! not like any other old friends who I wouldn’t know were around BECAUSE I TOTALLY IGNORED THEM AS THEY BOTH APPROACHED AND WALKED PAST”

“But YOU… random stranger… HUG TIME!!”

Alderaan said:

The editing in this film was seriously the worst. People rarely talk about editing when they discuss movies, but if I ever criticize anything in this film, the editing surely has to be at the top of the list.

Or maybe they just say “eh, who cares, the general public just wants some flash and bang and anyone who really cares is over at ot.c or fe.o and they’ll just make whatever cut they want”

9_9

lluukkee said:

personal opinion :

We all live in a society that is fast , we have learned to seek speed but not quality , that is why episode vii fits to the needs of the people of today , for example , rey becomes a jedi way too soon , we learn that kylo is the son of han way too soon , an unexperienced stormtrooper almost makes it against kylo and then in an instant kylo is almost being defeated by amateur rey , also rey does not know how to fly the falcon but after 10 seconds she can fly it low and curve it in a way that fin can actually destroy a tie fighter…it all makes sense because this is the internet generation , you download apps every second to your phone and after few seconds you expect it to be installed and working , you go out using your turbocharged car to go faster to your destination ( examples of such cars fiat 500 turbo , golf tsi , yrl turbo , colt czt , astra turbo , audi turbo , mini cooper s , etc etc …there is a great amount of rushing into things nowadays ( fast food , fast coffee , fast transportation , etc etc and that spoils the movies too , so i believe the appropriate title for this movie could very well be ( star wars the force speeds up) , lol , i am a great fan but i would expect a new trilogy , not a trilogy zipped in a 2 hour film. Also very predictable , i bet you that luke is going to die in the next film and then reappear as a ghost.

Blorrrghhh, I hope this is not the case. People being too busy or ADD to digest or care about information cannot be good for the world.

Yoda Is Your Father said:

Disney, if you’re listening, I’d buy an unlimited TFA pass in a heartbeat. And I’d also pay to see an extended cut in the theater.

+1 FTW

I don’t agree it was “the worst” but I will +1 that it seemed slapped together at times. I’ve certainly seen far, far worse.

You know what would be super cool? Remember when Interstellar did a special thing and sold unlimited viewing tickets? Not the same, a different special thing, but it would be cool if a longer version of TFA with more detail and scenes got released in theaters in a month or so for hardcore fans. I think that hasn’t ever been done before - just added in the dvd or whatever. This would be way cooler.

It would just be cool in general if movies were released (again. in theaters) in long and short versions sometimes, where applicable. We have 3D and non-3D versions now, not too different.

Yeah - I’m very much hoping for an alternate take or a deleted scene, or a new scene in the next movie.

ZkinandBonez said:

Alderaan said:
Remember Han telling Chewie to take care of her after he was gone in Empire? How the fuck did that get missed?! That’s just another bullshit example of Disney trying to force new characters on us. They want to pass the torch from Leia to Rey, and that’s fine. I’m all down for that. But make it happen naturally in the fucking story universe. Don’t give us a lazy, incompetent plot, and then just put two characters together at the end who don’t even know each other.

That was three decades ago, in a very, very different situation. When he said that she was a prisoner of Vader in Cloud City and Luke was running into a trap. It was a moment of great hopelessness.
Thirty years later in TFA Leia is general, and I don’t think she needs a Wookiee to follow her around while all the time at this point, especially now that she’s surrounded by hundreds of soldiers 24/7. Also Han came “back-to-life” in ROTJ so I think that “deal” stopped counting then.

You’re forgiven for not actually reading my absurdly long post. The topic wasn’t some guardianship debt or other; it was the utter disregarding of friendship ties between Leia and Chewie specifically regarding what would certainly have been a sharing of grief over Han’s death. Chewbacca and Leia loved Han more than anyone else did, and the movie just completely blanked on what without question would have been a strong bond - unless we hear later from Leia something like “yeah, I never actually liked Chewie, I just hung out with him because of Han” which would be FUCKING AWFUL.

Alderaan said:

Cyclista, that was an opus that could have benefited from some editing, but I’m often guilty of that too. I always enjoy reading someone’s heartfelt feelings on this forum.

Anyway, I agree about Han’s death being handled very poorly. I said the same thing to my family about Chewie, that it was like he screamed for a couple of seconds and then whoops, guess life goes on and he’s back in the copilot seat taking off with Rey.

I also wondered why on earth Leia and Rey were hugging each other at the end. The two didn’t even know each other. I failed to notice as you did, however, that Leia and Chewie should have been together. You’re absolutely right. They should have been. Remember Han telling Chewie to take care of her after he was gone in Empire? How the fuck did that get missed?! That’s just another bullshit example of Disney trying to force new characters on us. They want to pass the torch from Leia to Rey, and that’s fine. I’m all down for that. But make it happen naturally in the fucking story universe. Don’t give us a lazy, incompetent plot, and then just put two characters together at the end who don’t even know each other.

lol I’m still editing it now.

But yeah, it was fine that they wanted to show a torch being passed and a bond being formed - we all wanted that because Rey was a successful character. But the expense of Leia’s and Chewie’s relationship was unforgivable.

.

So this is still the review thread, and I just saw it for the first time tonight and have some strong issues, so I’m going to chime in. Apologies if I repeat something someone else said in the previous 16 pages most of which i don’t have the time to read.

I understand if no one wants to read my omnibus here. But you might want to at least skip to the end and read that.

Honestly, I loved it. But there were some serious flaws that shouldn’t be glossed over. First of all, it is indeed a mashup of mostly ANH plus a few elements of ESB and RotJ. I am definitely disappointed there. I like JJ Abrams enough to have expected more than that.

Thankfully, he did provide a bit more, by creating new and original characters. So I think the device at play was to use the old as the scaffold for the new. I don’t think any of this (yea or nay) will be evident for sure as “the vision for the entire new trilogy” until the next one. Let’s hope the next one invents more. BUT - what was done in this movie was done well enough that I’m in. I care about these characters. Now I have some new characters I’ll be demanding writers and directors do justice to in creative treatments - as well as the old ones.

Unfortunately, the “professions” of the characters are not a different case than the plot - basically using an old scaffold: the REALLY GOOD pilot, the hardscrabble desert child, the dangerously powerful dark force user being used in turn by a powerful emperor communicating via sinister holograms. But the personalities behind the characters are totally fresh - and I so appreciate that. The least of these is the new emperor, but even so, he is still new, behavior-wise.

I know that the producers probably deliberately set this formula in motion, as some kind of potion to syncretize old and new audiences, but it is underwhelmingly simplistic. They can do better, and I know this for a fact because I have seen how sophisticated some of the other elements they’ve used are, at least in the context of the Star Wars Universe, which traditionally is pretty simplistic. It is based on black-and-white ideology, after all.

[Side note; re: black and white: this brings to mind something: the greater quest in the story arc of all of the previous six films was bringing balance to the force. We see a universe torn between opposite manifestations of an ultimate power, and remember this - the Skeksis and the Urdu from The Dark Crystal, a Jim Henson vehicle no less. We see SWU directors spending an awful lot of time struggling to find stuff for the characters to do, and being so stumped in this pursuit that they’ve come up with the death star THREE TIMES, but a real balancing of the force could be a truly original event. Are we really doomed to watch a never-ending story about a quest for an event that will never happen, or will we get grey Jedi finally, the Skeksis and the Urdu merged into those tall “light beings”, and the world can actually evolve?]

Those other elements - the sophisticated devices - the enormous crashed star destroyer hulk, Rey as a solitary survivalist orphan on a planet that hates her, Finn as a mutation, whose deviation is pure compassion and/or jarring clarity in an insane world {in him we have inspiration from First Lieutenant John J. Dunbar of Dances with Wolves), new technology, new interpretations of how old technology would be realistically used, seriously old people as adventure heroes, new classes of stormtroopers, non-patronizing characters, Chewie displaying previously unrevealed personality traits while being treated in the med bay.

So! Just before I get into the total fails of this movie, I will re-state that the spirit is strong and ultimately it succeeds. But here are the UNFORGIVABLE flaws as I see them, in order of most petty to most heinous:

When Finn, Chewbacca, and Han are looking for Rey, first of all - how are they going to find her on an Order base so large that it is built into a death beam installation the size of 1/18th of a planet? Well- ok, so we suddenly see her scaling the wall opposite the side of an enormous chasm the aforementioned trio are on, and perhaps we can say the force brought them al to the same place at the same time, but HOW THE HELL do said trio IMMEDIATELY join her across said huge chasm and LOCATE THE EXACT ROOM SHE WAS IN with NO TROUBLE OR DELAY? That part - totally unbelievable.

But the worst one, the very worst one by far, was the total lack of reverberations and fallout after the Death of Han. Sure, Leia got kind of verklempt at the console, and Chewie went berserk for a few seconds and later sat in a corner for a moment, thank you for that JJ. But of all the relationships in the SWU, Chewie and Han were the best and most intense example of best friends. They were inseparable for DECADES. Chewie would not be emotionally functional after Han’s death, he would enter a persistent traumatic state that either manifested as rage and bloodlust, or despair, shock, and crippling grief. Necessity of escape or no, he wouldn’t be dutifully sitting beside the new pilot of the Millenium falcon and interacting normally, or when they got back, interacting with other characters normally at all. Since Chewie can’t have a lot of expressions facially, we should have seen it in body language and actions. Slumped shoulders, unresponsiveness in social situations, spasms of (even more than usual) unreasonable anger, maybe even up to abandoning the rebellion. In short, something visible, persistent, and extreme. Instead we see him more or less shrug it off after a moment of outrage.

And the final thing is connected to the previous. When Rey and Chewie return to base after the starkiller is destroyed, they exit the falcon and Leia is standing, waiting, bittersweet. Chewie and Rey approach. Closer. LEIA COMPLETELY IGNORES CHEWBACCA, and HE IGNORES HER AND CALMLY WALKS PAST, and then - AND THEN - to share her grief, LEIA EMBRACES NEW GIRL SHE NEVER MET. WHAT THE FUCK. REALLY? We are supposed to believe that the two people who loved Han more than anyone else just pay no attention to one another at all after his horrific death? And instead Leia hugs some fucking stranger?

For me this severed the emotional thread of the entire film. Suddenly there was a total void made by sloppy negligence in what otherwise was a movie that thoughtfully invested in each and every character. They did go some way toward better development of Chewie’s character, but it looks like he still gets treated like a big non-sentient animal sometimes. Even dogs get hugged when someone in the family dies. And at least Adywan gave Chewbacca a medal!!

And before anyone says anything like “maybe Chewbacca and Leia haven’t been speaking to each other or some reason” or “maybe wookies deal with death differently” or “maybe Leia secretly knew Rey was some important family relation and this was BRILLIANT FORESHADOWING” or “maybe Leia and Chewbacca had their moment offscreen”, just no. This isn’t the fanfic or retconning thread. These things didn’t exist in this cut. And who cares if Leia had some secret knowledge - the Leia/Chewbacca interaction was still shit.

Here’s what I think should happen to fix this lame thing (this isn’t fanfic or retconning because it relates to future concepts): first of all, some moment where Leia and Chewie share some emotions, either somehow in a fanedit of this movie, or a scene in the VIII theater release. This is crucial. Secondly, Chewbacca should for the most part leave the rebellion as a consistent soldier and become a sort of bounty hunter specializing in collecting sith heads, or if that is too NC-17, then sith lightsabers, which Luke or Rey or Finn modify to produce white, blue, or green blades. Chewie can show up at some point in a room that everyone is in and drop an armload of sith lightsabers onto a table while everyone in the room stares at them and goes pale. The modified lightsabers can be given to new jedis in training, and the combo of sith hardware and jedi colors can be a small symbol of the light and dark sides beginning to find balance.

And Chewie’s look should definitely change to reflect his state, maybe more weapons, dirtier fur. Maybe some of the war leaders on Kashyyyk could be used as stylistic references as well, for cultural consistency.

I see. Still, this might be a better (less invasive) compromise. I mean, was the rope visible on deck beforehand or did it just magically appear? And did they remove Chewbacca and replace him with a rope, or was it Chewbacca plus rope?

Anyway here is the edited scene:

http://i.giphy.com/d2ZgKL99ocR8Nu0M.gif

Requires the viewer to have awareness of a wookie’s strength to be believable, but it at least works noticeably better.