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Zachary VIII

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26-Jan-2018
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22-Feb-2019
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87

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Post
#1270571
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

Creox said:

DrDre said:

I view the ST thusfar as a somewhat failed experiment, not unlike the PT. In my view the OT is a self-contained story with a clear beginning, middle and end, with clear character arcs. That story has gotten lost somewhat with the addition of the PT, and ST. Both the PT and ST are superfluous imo, and cannot stand on their own. They both add something to the overall narrative, and lore, but at a hefty price. To me the overall narrative of the six part “tragedy of Anakin Skywalker” is significantly weaker than the three part “adventures of Luke Skywalker”, and the thusfar eight part “Skywalker saga” is weaker still. However, in the case of the PT, aside from the poor execution of many elements, the faults were built in from the get go, where the story’s outcome was a foregone conclusion, and it’s self-referential nature part of it’s DNA. It was therefore self-evident that story choices in the PT, might clash with the previously established self-contained story of the OT. It might have been better to have the PT be set in a much earlier time, or an earlier conflict to provide more of a disconnect between the PT and OT timelines, thus ensuring the OT’s narrative is not significantly impacted by the addition of episodes 1 to 3.

With the ST however the creators were free to forge their own path, to create new settings, new aesthetics, and a new conflict to drive the story forward. In my view this did not happen. The ST and Disney’s additions to the franchise in general have been self-referential to a fault, whether it’s by copying the OT’s settings, aesthetic, and general plot, or whether it is by using the OT’s story threads, and set pieces to misdirect, and subvert expectations, the ST at its core thusfar has failed to provide us with a new setting, and new story. It’s the current generation’s updated and modernized OT, where history seems destined to repeat itself ad nauseum:

The big question for me will be, whether episode IX can break through this cycle? If not, I fear for the future of the franchise, where in a worst case scenario Disney Star Wars will forever be a cover band playing Lucas’ greatest hits, changing the order of the verses with some newly updated (and in some cases inappropriate) arrangements, rather than to take Lucas’ style of music, and create some genuinely new songs.

I would also like Disney to push the envelope and I think they have plans to do exactly that with spinoffs and Rian’s planned trilogy. He did say the characters would have nothing in common with the PT, OT or ST.

I hope Rian’s trilogy is set in the Old Republic.

Post
#1270404
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

nl0428 said:

DominicCobb said:

Zachary VIII said:

Valheru_84 said:

The only difference is that I don’t take any enjoyment out of it but definitely a fascination I guess of how from my perspective, Star Wars has gone so wrong from what initially looked like such a promising start to the ST.

Fair enough. The ST definitely has parts that could bother some fans. Hopefully the future spin offs and TV shows will have a more unified appeal.

Probably the opposite, the spin-offs will likely have specific appeal while the future films will be the big tent SW content.

As much as everyone loves Dave Filoni’s shows, I’m not really a fan of his work. Clone Wars was very hit and miss to me, and Rebels, while I thought it was good, could’ve been much much stronger. Dave Filoni seems like he knows Star Wars well, but I feel like I’m watching someone try to make Star Wars, rather than making Star Wars. And that has nothing to do with the show’s being animated, I LOVE animation, I just don’t think it worked out with what Filoni was doing. However, I really loved the original Clone Wars micro-series. With the sequel trilogy, I felt that Abrams and Johnson knew how to write, direct, and make Star Wars. Filoni’s content just seems watered down in comparison, not necessarily by its target audience, but by its tone and elements.

I like TCW, but it feels like a simplified version of the Clone Wars Multimedia Project. And there’s certain aspects like Anakin’s personality that make the series feel like it’s in a completely different universe from the films. Tone wise, Dark Horse’s Republic comics feel much closer to the movies and larger Legends timeline. Rebel’s feels like a downgrade from TCW and Resistance is even worse.

Post
#1270376
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

Valheru_84 said:

The only difference is that I don’t take any enjoyment out of it but definitely a fascination I guess of how from my perspective, Star Wars has gone so wrong from what initially looked like such a promising start to the ST.

Fair enough. The ST definitely has parts that could bother some fans. Hopefully the future spin offs and TV shows will have a more unified appeal.

Post
#1270015
Topic
Rey and Jedi Training
Time

OutboundFlight said:

Zachary VIII said:

I’m not annoyed by Rey being competent at lightsabers, I am annoyed by her being able to fly the Falcon. Is there an explanation for this?

Not my knowledge- Rey says it is her first time.

I suppose she learned the skill with speeders on Jakku? That’s probably where she learned to be fluent in Droid and Wookiee too.

I guess so. But speeders and freighters are way different. This same problem is in ANH, but it can kind of be explained by Luke piloting speeders with a similar cockpit configuration to an X-Wing. I guess the whole thing can be chalked up to “the force wills it”.

EDIT:

DominicCobb said:

She says something to the effect of “I’ve flown some ships but never left the planet,” so maybe not the Falcon specifically, but she has flown before, and is familiar enough with the Falcon to know about its various upgrades.

Ok, that makes more sense. Thanks for clarifying.

Post
#1269073
Topic
The Sequel Radical Redux Ideas Thread (Radical Ideas Welcome).
Time

NeverarGreat said:

Anakin Starkiller said:

Can something be done to totally overhaul Han’s death? In the movie, he just walks into it when it’s bloody obvious he’s gonna die, and Kylo has no reason to kill him beyond being the villain and Han being a mentor figure.

Imagine if we knew in advance that Ben was more light side than dark, but kept up the charade to kill Snoke and unite the Republic and First Order in peace. Snoke would suspect that his student was false, and would demand proof of his devotion - the killing of someone he loved. Ben would be forced to choose between his vision of a unified galaxy and his own father, and in the moment he chooses his father. But at that moment the Starkiller fires and destroys the Republic capitol, killing many people whom he knew and secretly admired. The disturbance is so great that he ignites the saber without realizing it, killing his father and assuring him the trust of the Supreme Leader.

That would be the movie I’d like to see.

I like this. It would definitely be more tragic, and more consistent with Kylo’s characterization in TLJ.

Post
#1268845
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

RogueLeader said:

I personally think the perspective people have on the B Plot, with Canto Bight and everything, is going to depend if those lessons carry over into Episode IX. How will we see Poe handle being a leader, will Finn act on the lesson of “saving what we love”, and will there be some kind of resolution to this original sin of war that TLJ sort of paints? Will they break the cycle? As the second act in a trilogy, I wonder if these things could be set ups that have pay offs in Episode IX.

And if they do, it could add value to all of those scenes. I could change my mind after Episode IX comes out, but atm that is personally why I disagree with cutting any important scenes of the B Plot.

I understand that the space chase feels slow (I’ve heard others suggest looking at it more as a siege rather than a chase), and the Fathier chase feeling pointless. Maybe the chase would’ve been more visually interesting if they were jumping in and out of hyperspace, or I can understand wanting to trim or cut the Fathier chase. I just think a lot of the conversations between characters add value to the story, and it might be important for what’s to come, too.

Even if the themes from those B plots carry over to IX, the way those plots are implemented is still flawed and bogs down the movie IMO. All it needed was some tighter writing. But I know it’s impossible to perfectly fix those kinds of things in an edit, just like you can’t 100% fix how convoluted rescuing Han from Jabba in RotJ is, or how ridiculous the 100+ Jedi running around in the arena in AoC looks.

Post
#1268819
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

RogueLeader said:

I mean, I hate that some people don’t enjoy these films. Not saying people are wrong for their own opinions. Just sharing my own because I want people to enjoy them like I do! That’s all.

I feel very mixed about TLJ. I like the Luke, Kylo and Rey interactions. I don’t understand most of the complaints about Luke not wanting to help the Resistance. I think it would have been a painfully predictable movie if Luke just packed his things and left with Rey, fought and killed some Knights of Ren with his green lightsaber, and sacrificed himself in a big explosion or something. At the same time, all of Canto Bight, and most of the snail paced chase between the First Order and Resistance fleet are boring and have some glaring plotholes.
Overall I think TLJ and RotJ are comparable in that the high points are really good but the low points are hard to watch. It’s a better film than TFA, but I wouldn’t really have any desire to casually watch an unedited version.

Post
#1268694
Topic
Most Baffling Complaint of a Star Wars Movie
Time

fmalover said:

For me the most baffling complaint about Star Wars has been one brought up by Jeremy Jahns about Mace Windu’s lightsaber. He was bothered about Mace’s lightsaber being purple, and that lightsaber blades should only be blue or green for the good guys and red for the bad guys. I see nothing wrong with lightsaber blades being whatever colour people want them to be. Hell, I myself would like to see an orange-bladed lightsaber introduced in the Disney canon.

The purple lightsaber makes perfect sense. Mace has a super unorthodox fighting style, so he has an unorthodox lightsaber. In my ideal canon, purple would be a rare neutral color that both Jedi and non-Sith Dark Side users would wield. IIRC Legends sort of had that with Mara Jade using a purple blade even when working for the Emperor, unless I’m completely misremembering and she only got that lightsaber when she became a Jedi.

Post
#1268494
Topic
The Mandalorian - Star Wars Live action TV series
Time

Half of the humor had this smartass self aware vibe to that rubbed many people the wrong way. I think they were trying to imitate the OT style of humor, but it felt more like the MCU and Joss Whedon school of comedy, which is becoming dated and repetitive from a decade of overexposure.
The other half was BB-8 slapstick and Finn being a clown. I didn’t mind most of the BB-8 comedy, but I don’t think Finn’s dialogue should be as lighthearted, considering his backstory and character arc is pretty serious.
I personally think maybe about a third of the jokes in the Sequels landed. That’s certainly better than the Prequels (unless you retroactively count the dozens of quotes that have become memes), but the ANH, TESB and even Solo do it better imo.

Post
#1268384
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

nl0428 said:

Zachary VIII said:

I don’t see anything wrong with someone disliking the Sequels, or any of the Star Wars films, as long as they’re respectful about it. These disagreements cause a lot of good debates and can inspire people to try to create fixes for perceived problems. There are plenty of people here that like the Prequels, and those that don’t. There’s no reason why it should be any different for the Disney films.

I totally agree with you. It all comes down to approach, behavior, and attitude. We all have our likes and dislikes.

Yeah, that’s how I see it. The people who say stuff like “TLJ is the worst film of all time” are not being constructive or even explaining their criticisms in a coherent. I think the backlash will calm down after IX is released, and people will have more calm discussions about why they like or don’t like the trilogy.

Post
#1268378
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

I don’t see anything wrong with someone disliking the Sequels, or any of the Star Wars films, as long as they’re respectful about it. These disagreements cause a lot of good debates and can inspire people to try to create fixes for perceived problems. There are plenty of people here that like the Prequels, and those that don’t. There’s no reason why it should be any different for the Disney films.

Post
#1268288
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

Hal 9000 said:

If Tony can still do it (or at least a voiceover) whenever they get around to an Episode X-XII trilogy, I would hope that it involves R2 and 3PO several decades or perhaps a century following this trilogy. If not, just R2.

I’m not too hyped for a “post sequel” trilogy. But if it has to be made, it should come out at least in the early 2030’s so that there’s some breathing room between trilogies. And yeah, it should take place firmly in whatever the Disney canon’s Legacy era will be.

Post
#1267325
Topic
The Worst Scene/Sequence in Any Star Wars Film
Time

Creox said:

OutboundFlight said:

snooker said:

OutboundFlight said:

snooker said:

I feel like the Death Star existing at all ruins all of Star Wars, from a certain point of view.

The Americans have built (and used) the nuke, what does everyone else do? They build their own, of course! Why doesn’t the Republic start building Death Stars after VI, or, better yet, why doesn’t the Empire build like 20 after their rise to power? Realistically the sequel trilogy should be about two sides having nuclear bombs pointed at each other yelling.

But it’s Star Wars, so it doesn’t need to make realistic, logical sense. The expanded universe tells us all the reasons that this doesn’t happen. Moviegoers don’t get that info, but they don’t care because the story is about the characters.

The Atomic Bomb is different because it has never been used by bad people. It’s two proper uses were the lesser of two evils at a time of world war. But if North Korea started decimating cities with no weapons, I’d bet the entire world would illegalize nukes once North Korea’s dealt with.

My sweet summer child…

Geneva Convention?

There is good evidence the bombs did not have to be dropped and that the US did so to let the USSR know they had them.

I agree that the U.S had an ulterior motive for using the bombs. But it’s not like Operation Downfall was a great looking alternative, and that’s what it would come to if much of the Japanese army leadership had their way.

Post
#1267125
Topic
Solo - A Star Wars Edit (Released)
Time

I like it a lot. You cut L3 just right, where her personality is still similar, but she’s not so annoying. The color correction is subtle, but works pretty well.
Cutting so much of the beginning felt kind of strange at first, but I see why you did it. It makes Han’s past more mysterious as it doesn’t show why he has to leave Corellia or who exactly is chasing him. The title card seems to go a bit too quick though, where you’ll almost miss it if you blink.
Overall I’d say this is pretty good, especially for a first edit, and fixes some of the problems with, what I think is, an underrated Star Wars movie.