ValenStudios

And I thought I was the only one who noticed this shit 😭

Long overdue UPDATE

~ I’ve gotten ahold of 2 ISOs of the 2003 Platinum Edition DVD release, which includes the 5.1 audio of both the “theatrical” mix and the Enhanced Home Theater mix, which according to an extra on Disc 2, is derived off of the 2002 IMAX mix but optimized for a home theater setup. TonyWDA, I can confirm that the 5.1 theatrical track on the DVD is a very close match to the 1995 Laserdisc 5.1 like you’ve said, which is a huge plus. Speaking of which…
~ New rips of the 1995 Deluxe CAV Letterboxed Laserdisc tracks, both the PCM stereo, and the AC-3 5.1, have been precisely ripped by Archive.org user, Noogai3, or more familiarly known elsewhere as Infomaniac95, are publicly and readily available for use under their permission, which is pretty great to have.

With these sources, I could theoretically get back on track and continue the project, yet due to personal life going on generally, along with Christmas being on the way in a few weeks, I can’t exactly do so as soon as I’d prefer. Even putting that aside, I’d now need to seek out video sources for optimal visual parity, mainly the 2011 Diamond Edition or the 2017 Signature Collection Blu-ray, although other alternatives would be acceptable if they’re rendered and encoded well like a decent HDTV rip pre-dating 2011.

It is, just wanted to know just in case

Take as much time as you need to get ahold of that release, though with this in mind, I now wonder…

Will the project now be utilizing any type of HDR or will it stick to SDR?

I’m listening

SlashMan said:

I just stumbled across this thread, and it’s never dawned on me that the film master represented a unique version of the film. My only gripe previously was with the few changes made by the re-rendered version of the film in 2010. To which I will re-iterate: the worst part is the new Disney logo that clips out part of the original film. Then there’s little animation errors. One that I found on my own is that they swapped out the textures for Janie so her dress will randomly change colors in one scene (another example of color grading as well):

I know, 4 years late, but um… that error with the doll having different clothing can also be found on the 2000 Ultimate Toy Box Collector’s Edition DVD transfer, which pre-dates the re-render seen on the Blu-ray by 10 years
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1019804101682405386/1232759026501292143/Screenshot_20240424-1122592.png?ex=662b488f&is=6629f70f&hm=c64c08eafd05c93af3697263a0805cc33601fd0fda711aa4ea6986f4fa9057f9&

Doctor M said:

Something to throw out there.
Here is screenshots from the UHD 4k release and the Central-Eastern European standard BD.
As I mention in the first post, Aladdin had enhancements/reanimation done for an IMAX release that never happened. I THOUGHT there was no digital release of the original master, but now I’m wondering:

What do you mean by the original master exactly? Is there any differences I’m supposed to notice outside of the colors and aspect ratio, just curious?

Hello there. I came here from the Archive.org link of version 1.0 and was curious if I could be allowed to PM you for the most up to date Laserdisc version

ThePeragusPrune said:

Has there been any progress on this?

Not in a long while

Interesting project you got there and I certainly agree the new color grading from the WEB version looks off, but also, we can’t act like the original DVD is perfect either in that regard, especially when it comes to shadow detail and black crunch. If possible, is there anyway you can adjust the shadows and such to make it easier to see backgrounds and some details while still appearing dark and warm?

TonyWDA said:

MonkeyLizard10 said:

Going back to the other topic of 5.1 audio, another option, although unfortunately not for a lot of movies, is to use the Cinema DTS audio. 1995 would be far enough back for this film to have one.

I’m almost certain that Toy Story never played anywhere with Cinema DTS audio in '95, but it did receive a DTS LaserDisc. If someone can arrange a bit-perfect capture of the soundtrack, it’d be a terrific addition to this project.

Wait a minute, after checking the credits, you’re fucking right. Still less weird then the fact that Happy Gilmore getting a DTS Laserdisc period, but still though…

I’m interested in seeing this. Though I wonder how long will this hiatus go seeing as the last update was 2 years ago

Charles Threepio said:

For film-out, they would most likely have sped up the footage slightly to fit within the 24fps rate of 35mm film.

No they wouldn’t If so, the original VHS and Laserdisc would’ve also ended up being sped-up

Hi, the UHD version have better compression and more detail than the BD 2D version. The colors are also better.
For make an “ultimate” version, this is the best version to use despite the flaws that UHD has.

I would combine UHD with Blu-Ray 3D scenes which have more visible image.

And I have a 35mm scan project that will allow me to share (for donors) a 35mm grindhouse version, but also to recover 2 scenes that have been modified on BD/UHD/3D and integrate them into my custom UHD project .

The modified UHD version is intended to be shared with everyone, but if people participate in the 35mm project, the modified UHD version will move faster too 😃

I see where you’re coming from and just hoping this all goes well. Also, kinda unrelated but since you have “French original dub” in the title, which implies this got redubbed, what’s the difference between the two French dubs?

Interesting project you got going, though if I had to make a suggestion, if you’re converting the 4K footage from SDR back to SDR, why not just use the regular 2D Blu-ray footage which can save you the trouble?

Also, I’m curious as to which sources you’re using for this project in order to see how close to accuracy that can be achieved here.

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So… Even though a ton of movies from Disney Animation (primarly the one’s released from 1937-1997) are easily accessible nowadays via Blu-ray, 4K, and streaming, many of these movies have numerous alterations and/or revisions over the years that have stuck on without an option to see these movies as how they were originally seen in theaters (at least, as close as you can).

For some of these movies, there’s more then one major version with extra changes to them that are a pain to do and should be acknowledged more than you probably think they need to.

This is why I plan on hunting out several versions of these movies either on home media or through higher quality and/or HDTV airings of them to provide definitive (at least in your guys’ eyes) versions along with additional versions for people to decide on their preferred version of these movies.

Here’s a rundown on the one’s that need to be looked for:
~ Snow White and The Seven Dwarfs (either the 1994 Laserdisc release or any decent quality release official or unofficial pre-2001)
~ Bambi (any pre-2011 Diamond Edition release or TV airing is appreciated)
~ Alice in Wonderland (any pre-2011 Blu-ray release or airing or any materials are appreciated if found and sent over via PM)
~ Peter Pan (same applies from the predecessor)
~ Lady and The Tramp (This one’s tricky as any non-widescreen release has been either in pan-and-scan or reframed and edited for the academy ratio. Just in case, any and all pre-2011 Diamond releases regardless of the aspect ratio they’re in are welcomed as long as you clarify which release or version they’re in)
~ Sleeping Beauty (Any pre-2008 DVD or Blu-ray release or airing is appreciated)
~ The Jungle Book (Any pre-2007 Platinum Edition DVD release is appreciated)
~ The Aristocrats (Any pre-2012 release is appreciated
~ Robin Hood (Any home media release or TV airing pre-2012 is appreciated)
~ The Many Adventures of Winnie The Pooh
• individually as it’s a packed film of previously released shorts, “Winnie The Pooh and The Hunny Tree”, Winnie The Pooh and The Blustery Day", and “Winnie The Pooh and Tigger Too” (any pre-2013 release or airing is appreciated)
~ The Little Mermaid (any and all home media releases or airings, aside from the 2019 4K Edition, are appreciated
~ Beauty and The Beast (this one is an entire beast of itself, no pun intended, but any and all non-4K releases and their extra cuts are appreciated)
~ Aladdin (same as the last two)
~ Lion King (same as follows)
~ Hercules (any pre-2013 release or airing is appreciated)

TristAndShout64 said:

AwesomeJ said:

zerocool said:

im 100% sure it will too. just gotta find someone who can do a CC 😉

He mentioned that the thing has a pinkish tint to it, I’m sure there’s probably some way to fix that using Adobe Premiere or something possibly, but I don’t use Premiere so I’m not entirely sure.

Yeah, it’s noticeable but pretty slight and I imagine we can color correct it if we have to. That’s assuming it really is pink, one person who DM’ed me suggested it might just be the person’s camera lighting, though I’m not too sure how likely that is.

Anyways, here are the pics from the eBay listing where you can see what I’m talking about (you can also see these in the link I included in the FAQ). Make of them what you will!

Oof, I can definitely tell there’s a pink tint, though it doesn’t seem that aggressive.

TonyWDA said:

A friendly reminder that with any mix— Dolby Digital or analog— on the actual print itself, you’re likely getting the “far field” version of the soundtrack, with mixing choices and dynamic range better suited for listening in large auditoriums. In contrast, that same mix is typically adjusted for “near field” listening in significantly smaller environments for the film’s home video release. The former mix is prepared knowing it will play from speakers a considerable distance from the listener(s); it also considers the architectural impact of the soundtrack in that room to give the audience a full, reflected acoustic effect. The latter is more direct and sometimes may even sound more detailed— or, at least, unmarred by the aural impact of a large auditorium because you’re sitting much closer to speakers with smaller drivers in a smaller room.

Neither is necessarily better or worse than the other (not always, anyway…). Still, it’s always best to consider the differences between what’s on a print and what typically ends up on the home video release. An excellent example of everything mentioned here can be heard in Aladdin’s theatrical and home video versions. In the scene where the Cave of Wonders begins to fall apart, the differences in the intensity of the sound effects are night and day. Pay particular attention to the moment when the lamp shrine bursts into flames. Not even the LaserDisc audio, an otherwise fine track all around, sounds that aggressive. You can hear the DVD/35mm audio comparison here:

All this is to say yes, you will want to include the analog track— for posterity if nothing else. =)

HOLY SHIT, THE 35MM MIX IS AGGRESSIVE AND DETAILED AS HELL!! Sorry for that freakout, but God damn, that mix sounded amazing on my headphones right now.

JF_Sanderson said:

Yes I could be wrong but I thought that one or more movies were re-rendered for fullscreen with characters repositioned accordingly to suit the framing, not just the camera reframed in general. If it’s true then I’m sure it varies by shot with the minimum amount of work possible. Feel free to post any caps.

Edit. Also in this vein, were any releases actually done from film prints or were they all done from master digital files to NTSC? If they can put it on film they can put it on video, I don’t see why they’d use the in-between.

Okay, the only one officially confirmed by Pixar themselves where they reposition objects or characters to fit the screen was for the 4:3 versions is for Bugs Life (optional on the 2003 2-Disc DVD). On Disc 2 for the 2003 DVD, they made a bonus feature about it and compared it next to the Theatrical widescreen version. The only other movie where I’ve noticed repositioning is for Cars but only for like the opening like for the front graphic effects like when they’re showing clips of the characters alongside the race and that news scene where McQueen is missing. Otherwise, I haven’t seen any repositioning for any of the other Pixar movies.

Also, to answer your other question, all of these 4x3 releases on DVD are from the digital files, not film reels. If we were talking in general though, the only one that wasn’t from the digital files was Toy Story for the original 1996 VHS release, instead based off a film element for it’s source.

JF_Sanderson said:

Am I misremembering or are there unique 4:3 and 16:9 versions of some Pixar movies?

I’m not sure what you mean by unique specifically, but I’ve noticed with many Pixar movies from 1998-2006 (with the exception of The Incredibles), the 4:3 versions only on DVD would be reframed to be closer to the left or right, show more of the top and bottom image, pan and scan here and there, etc. Took some screenshots of the Fullscreen version to the 2001 (reprint of 2000) DVD to Toy Story 2 to compare it to the normal widescreen version for comparison if you’d like to see.

ThatPixarGuy said:

jay2chill1 said:

The Decimator said:

jay2chill1 said:

jolennon said:

The Toy Story change was made before the first DVD release. The original opening never made its way to digital home video, only laserdisc/vhs.

Did they reainmate the movie or restore it because it looks different from the Laserdisc

When they first released it on DVD, they did a fresh transfer from the original files. Most prints before that used the 35mm film print as seen in theaters (including the VHS that I have).

I Have the 2005 DVD which is the one I grew up with and the Laserdisc do you know what’s the difference between the 2005 Special Edition DVD and The Special Edition Blu-Ray by any chance just curious

The 2005 DVD and the Special Edition Blu-ray are very different.

The 2005 is a nearly identical transfer to the original DVD release, which was sourced from the original animation files, unlike the VHS and laserdisc. While the Special Edition Blu-ray is a re-render of the film made for the 3D release in 2009, which had a logo plastering (new Disney castle,) different colors, animation fixes, redone credits, etc.

This applies to both Toy Story 1 & 2. The 2005s are the best presentations of the original 95/99 renders (slightly higher bitrates,) while the Blu-rays are the 09 re-renders.

Hold up right here! What do you mean exactly by “animation fixes” specifically? I’ve reviewed many releases of this movie and haven’t seen a single piece of animation witin the movie redone, even animation goofs and mistakes. I’d like to see some photographic and video evidence of what you mean exactly between the pre-2010 and 2010 releases.

I saw it last night in a Discord server I’m in with friends and was surprised it actual looks decent for once in over 18 years. Berlin is so lucky to have a world Premire of Cinderella on 4K.

Just on a semi-correction on your list, we don’t exactly know how much the colors were regraded, if at all, for the 20002 IMAX/2003 DVD version. All we do know so far is converting CAPS files to 35mm prints in 1994 were always gonna look inaccurate to said CAPS files to begin with, add an extra layer of converting that 35mm print and reprint it multiple times and replayed multiple to where it will wear out over time, and convert the 35mm version they have to a composite signal laserdisc master, it’s not easy to say if the theatrical run was accurate to begin with. Although I will say comparing the 2002 IMAX/2003 DVD version (which is the first time we see the CAPS files as is) to the 1995 laserdisc and I gotta say a good chunk of the colors in that version match (with exceptions) and comparing those two versions to the 2011 Blu-ray, it seems the color regrading was really starting there.

1995 Deluxe CAV letterboxed Laserdisc
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/680384972527501314/955493693358485504/Screenshot_20220321-0836292.png
2002 IMAX/2003 Special Edition DVD (although through a TV airing)
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/680384972527501314/955493693681451058/Screenshot_20220321-0829394.png
2011 Diamond Edition Blu-ray
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/680384972527501314/955493694033789028/Screenshot_20220321-0826042.png

On iTunes? Do you got proof of that? And if so, has anyone ripped the iTunes version yet? Because I don’t have iTunes myself and I see no one talk about that version really. Sorry that I’m questioning this so much but iTunes is the least likely I’d expect to see as a source for the restoration and lack of recognition or documentation upon it. Hopefully I can see that version and see if that could be used if it really is in 1:66.1 uncropped.