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Regicidal_Maniac

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29-Jul-2004
Last activity
3-Oct-2005
Posts
345

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Post
#60435
Topic
AVP
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60435/action/topic#60435
Time
Quote
Originally posted by: GundarkHunter
He is right. The Bishop in Alien3 bleeds white after being hit by the pipe.


I'm going to have to correct that one.



He actually bleeds red blood in the final scenes of Alien3. Which was always pretty cool as he's far more interested in securing the specimen than he is in his own personal well being. Yes, his ear is hanging off, but if you've seen what I've seen you'll know that the human body can sustain an awful lot of trauma and still function as the mind slips the various systems (respiratory, circulatory, etc) into shock and shuts them down.

This is more apparent on the recent DVD release, which is one reason that I'd hoped they'd use his character from this film and set AVP after the events of Alien3. That way AVP would sit between A3 and AR as an Interquel and Michael Bishop would end his days in his Ahab-esque quest for the Alien.

In various places the character is credited as Michael Bishop, and employee of Hyperdyne Systems, cybernetics and bioweapons, itself a subsidiary of Weyland-Yutani aka "The Company".

I don't really mind so much though as I have ancestors who look a lot like me so I guess it's feasible, I mean the movie is about fantasy science fiction creatures as it is so it's not so big a stretch.

Still it does bug me a little.
Post
#60412
Topic
Does anyone have any Deleted Scenes for the Original Trilogy?
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60412/action/topic#60412
Time
Bravo Luke.

That's precisely what made the Empire the dominant force in the Galaxy. The fact that they were all but the only prevailing ideology in the Galaxy meant that if you wanted a government job you joined the Academy and became a part of the Empire. Kevin Smith's characters talk at length about this in one of his films, Clerks I think.

Plus to suggest that the troopers are still clones would be to imply that the 'clone wars' were still going on. But Luke and Ben clearly state in the film from 20 years ago that those wars took place around the time that Obi-Wan and Anakin were friends.

Never mind what some revisionist, plaid-clad, bearded, shut-in says now on an audio-commentary, the fact is that the screen story itself reveals the truth.
Post
#60398
Topic
Does anyone have any Deleted Scenes for the Original Trilogy?
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60398/action/topic#60398
Time
Quote
Originally posted by: jimbo
Lucas stated in the commentary for Attack of the Clones that the stormtroopers are clones of Jango.

George Lucas stated in the commentary for the Attack of the Clones DVD that they were clones.

In the Attack of the Clones commentary he referes to them as stormtroopers.


Well I can see there's no point trying to debate with Rainman here.

Definitely, yeah, definitely clones, definiely, yeah definitely.
Post
#60338
Topic
MagnoliaFan Edits: Ep I "Balance Of The Force", and Ep II "The Clone War" (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60338/action/topic#60338
Time
Originally posted by: MagnoliaFan
I considered a re-edit of T3, but there was little in the way of deleted scenes on the dvd, despite the fact that much was cut to shorten the film and speed up the pace. If the additional deleted scenes were made available, I would certainly consider it.

When I get what I need I'll forward to you the scenes I'm going to try to integrate. I'm sure you'll do a better job than I can, and your 'take' on the film will definitely be different.

And to answer your question concerning the possibility to create photorealistc digital actors by the decades end...
We may be closer than you think...


On our desktop Macs and the like?

Cool. A whole new world of 'garage' filmmaking awaits.
Post
#60328
Topic
MagnoliaFan Edits: Ep I "Balance Of The Force", and Ep II "The Clone War" (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60328/action/topic#60328
Time
Originally posted by: DanielB

Take out the night-club completely, who cares where he gets his clothes from? It was interesting the first 2 times, and a bar/nightclub has already been done in T2.


That's interesting, I had done a paper edit of that scene just to tighten it up and bring the tone down to an acceptable approximation of 'serious'.

However your suggestion has some merit, hmmm... just leave it out in its entirety. The Terminator does just mysteriously show up the next time we see him anyway so the plot (such as it is) would not be affected greatly.

I was trying to just turn it into the best version of itself that it could be and no more. It'd be very tempting to throw the whole thing out and start again but the software for that has yet to reach my desktop. Side note: I believe the time is coming, by the end of the decade I'd say, when anyone with patience, skill and computing power will be able to create 'better that VG CG cutscene quality' for whatever they want on their home desktop set.

T3 is NOT the film I expected, nor wanted, and it is NOT the film I would have make given all that came before. Mostow was in an unenviable position and was not the man for the job. T2 needed no sequel but if we were to have seen one I'd have taken us inside Cyberdyne Systems labs in SACNORAD as SKYNET became selfaware. It would have been cool to see how these governmental types dealt with the reality of the doomsayer Connor's prophecy fulfilled.

Anyway back on topic I look forward to seeing the MF edits BOTF and TCW when they arrive in the mail. Until then I have a question related to my side note, who else here thinks it will be possible to create photorealistc digital actor Prequel remakes, or films in any style, on their home systems (whatever they may be by then) by decade's end? Or am I way out?
Post
#60337
Topic
Does anyone have any Deleted Scenes for the Original Trilogy?
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60337/action/topic#60337
Time
Quote
Originally posted by: jimbo
Quote


"Aren't you alittle short for a stormtrooper" because there all the same.


Luke is not tall, it was a gag. You obviously didn't get it.

Aren't you a little short, fat, young and stupid to be a soldier/cop/fireman/Secret Service Agent?

I'm sure it may surprise you to learn that there are certain height requirements that potential applicants must meet in order to become one of the above. Even in times of conscription unsuitable height is still one of the reasons for rejection. They seek physical and mental uniformity in these services and then re-enforce conformity to set standards by the enforcement of the wearing of uniforms.

Are they all clones?

Quote
Lucas stated in the commentary for Attack of the Clones that the stormtroopers are clones of Jango. In the movies they appeared to follow orders without any humanity and had no fear of death. You can't train that. There genetically born that way.


Bullshit.

Are militant Jihad suicide bombers clones? They fear not death and, right or wrong (wrong), they will fight to the death for the cause that they believe in. So too do the brave US and Coalition soldiers sent off to parts unknown by corrupt administrations to fight to the death for the cause. They are to follow orders unquestioningly and as part of their training they are broken down from individuals and rebuilt as essential parts of a whole unit, but none more important than the whole. Of course they fear death, only sociopaths and people who believe in fairytales do not but those people are usually vetted out in the selection process.

Surely these brave soldiers are not also clones of Jango?

Quote
If they are not clones then why are they all human. Why not have a variety of races recuitted.


Because the Empire is run by racial supremacists who believe that there is one perfect race and that all others are of lesser worth and therefore must be ensalved and subjugated pursuant to the will and desires of The Empire. Haven't you ever wondered why there weren't more Negros and Jews in the Nazis?
Post
#60318
Topic
MagnoliaFan Edits: Ep I "Balance Of The Force", and Ep II "The Clone War" (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60318/action/topic#60318
Time
Originally posted by: buddy-x-wing
you're a brave man for attempting to salvage anything worthy from T3, Regicidal, my first edit would be cutting the dialogue that explains Sarah Connor's death from cancer, what a lame way to explain her absence!


Yeah that's definitely a curly one.

That section requires, for me at least, the omission of all references to the death by cancer and scattering of ashes in Mexico etcetera.

However then you have a logic gap (not the only one in the pic so it wouldn't be lonely) as to why go to the mausoleum in the first place?

If I was any good in photoshop I might change the name of the coffin to Enrique Salceda as a reference to the arms store in T2. At the very least there are multiple dates that need to be 'shopped.
Post
#60331
Topic
Episodes 7,8,9?
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60331/action/topic#60331
Time
Interesting theory about the concept of an all digital sequel trilogy, and one I believe we'll see, knowing Lucas' famous distain for working with live human actors.

On another note does anyone know when/if Advent Children will be coming to DVD and not just that crazy new PS2 CD movie format?
Post
#60316
Topic
MagnoliaFan Edits: Ep I "Balance Of The Force", and Ep II "The Clone War" (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60316/action/topic#60316
Time
Originally posted by: DanielB

-also, MF... do you think it would be possible to make T3 into a half-decent film and remove all the story errors from it?


I'm actually attempting this very thing right now.

I just bought cheap versions of the materials I need to incorporate and subjected myself to a recent drunken viewing of T3 to prep a paper-edit list.

I talk more about it over at the Corona Terminator board.

As I say there I don't think there's much that can save that film but it will certainly be a challenge to try.

Once I have ripped the necessary scenes/SFX/score I was going to forward a copy of the edited version along with the raw materials on DVDr to MF to see what he can do if he's interested.

Sorry for the tangential off topicness of this post.
Post
#60320
Topic
Does anyone have any Deleted Scenes for the Original Trilogy?
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/60320/action/topic#60320
Time
Quote
Originally posted by: buddy-x-wing
are the Stormtroopers in the original trilogy clones?

I always thought that by the time of A New Hope the Empire was using conscripted armed forces ( In the ANH radio drama Luke was applying to the Imperial Academy) , and that the use of Clones ended back in the days of the clone wars, I doubt they could constantly churn out Jango clones forever, and the clones from AOTC would only have a limited shelf life, what happens to Clones when they are too old to fight? Old Clones Home? and surely all the Imperial officers in the original trilogy rose up through the ranks of Troops and none of them look like Jango Fett.

I think this will probably be explained in episode 3


Old clones are turned into Soylent Green which the Empire distributes to the rim territories.

I subscribe to the conscript theory ala TROOPS.

I always figured the clones were all dead by the time of the OT. Though it's not explicitly mentioned anywhere I assumed the cloned soldiers had shorter lifespans or something. And since I choose to ignore any changes which bastardise the OT and for the most part I also choose to ignore the PT films until I see MF's versions of them, I can still hold this view without any contradictions being enforced upon me by LFL.
Post
#59487
Topic
George Lucas supports this site and its cause...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/59487/action/topic#59487
Time

…in word if not in deed.

In a current debate over the colourisation of classic films and television series versus film preservation.

The Flanneled One was thusly quoted:

Quote

"I am very concerned about our national heritage, and I am very concerned that the films that I watched when I was young and the films that I watched throughout my life are preserved, so that my children can see them," said Star Wars creator George Lucas, who doesn’t mind tinkering with his own classics for special edition re-releases.

So you see, he actually believes that we’re doing what’s right, protecting our childhood memories, preserving film history and national (galactic?) heritage, not just for ourselves but for our children.

 

Mod Edit: a working link for the article above can be found here:-

https://web.archive.org/web/20050405080736/http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1092186524995_87595724/?hub=Entertainment

Post
#57501
Topic
A Picture is worth a thousand words...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/57501/action/topic#57501
Time
To be honest, even after the 1997 SE releases I kind of expected an emphasis on story and effects that matched what had been seen before rather than trying to outdo them.

How blindly trusting I was.

I would rather have seen films that emulated the filmic style of the era in which they drew their inspirtation than these things that play like videogame cutscenes edited together.

If the time period seen in the OT was the late seventies and early eighties then the time period seen in the PT should have emulated the style of the forties and fifties. I'm not saying that Lucas should have restricted himself to 50 year old FX technology, although that would have been admirable but too much CGI is overuse of the technology.

CGI is a tool and should be made to serve the story, not vice versa.

The original films have never been about the effects for me, I always cared more for the story.

I guess Lucas did not.
Post
#57405
Topic
Star Wars - The Edits and DVDr releases thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/57405/action/topic#57405
Time
Originally posted by: oojasonIt would be interesting to find a fan of the OT Star Wars - who had NOT seen GL's Ep1 & 2 films, and show them the MFE first, and then GL's version - to gauge their perspective...


Well I am an OT fan from way back and with the exception of the DeathStar blastwaves and the new celebration song in place of the YubNub song I really disliked the 1997SE versions. I was given the SE videos but because of things like the Luke girl-scream and the Greedo fiasco, plus the CGI Jabba that just looked arse I could only bring myself to watch them twice.

I only saw TPM once, in the cinema and that was enough for me. I did get to see the Phantom Edit (West Coast) a while ago and much preferred that version to what I had first seen. So burned was I that I did not go to see AOTC in the cinema at all and have not seen it on DVD, I caught most of it on a VCD and was fairly disgusted with what I saw in terms of the editing as it looked like it had been slapped together the night before.

I would be interested in seeing the MagnoliaFan edits, I have made my selections with Rikter, and then maybe renting the official PT DVDs and giving them a fresh look.

I'll let you know when I do.
Post
#56810
Topic
Episode III: Revenge of the Sith (official)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/56810/action/topic#56810
Time
Ooh an opportunity to talk Terminator and time travel, I can't pass this up.

Changing the past is impossible.

Time Travel.

The time-theory at work in the first two Terminator films is the very antithesis of the "No Fate" credo. And I'm quite certain that James Cameron was being intentionally ironic in leading his characters to believe that they could avert their fates.

T1 and T2 both operate as a causality loop brought about by a predestination paradox.

I'm not going to attempt to reconcile the events of T3 with The Terminator and T2 because T3 breaks the series' internal logic and time loop theory as laid down by James Cameron with the simple fact that it has moved Judgement Day. That isn't possible in James Cameron's Terminator films as the past cannot be altered only caused.

I'll explain why.

The great irony of the first two films is that as much as the characters would like to believe that "the future is not set" they are wrong.

Cameron's causal loop begins in T1 with the arrival of Terminator and Kyle Reese. Looking at the timeline from a linear and objective standpoint things progress as normal until 1984 when suddenly two travellers, or chrononauts, from 2029 show up.

There was no 'original' and alternate timeline where someone other than Kyle Reese was John's father. There is only the one timeline, the one they're in, and when that timeline hit 1984, these two chrononauts simply show up having been displaced from 2029. The events of the first film take place and Sarah Connor is impregnated, Kyle is killed and the Terminator is destroyed. Then the microprocessor chassis is recovered from the Cyberdyne factory floor and the research into neural-net computers begins, Cyberdyne builds an empire and secures defense contracts including the SkyNet program for SACNORAD. Meanwhile Sarah goes into hiding and gives birth to John who will grow up to one day lead the human resistance to victory against the machines.

The damaged T-800 chip left at the Cyberdyne factory was always the genesis for neural-net processors. Kyle Reese was always John Connor's father and Judgement Day was always August 29th 1997.

Time travel in this universe cannot change the past it can only cause it. Travellers to the past become the cause for events whose effects have always been.

In the T2 Extreme DVD Cameron states that this concept of effect coming before cause, a popular conception of time travel in metaphysical circles, was his intention with both films. The causal loop prohibits change to the past because the traveller travels to their own past. Their OWN past. THE past. The past that has already occurred.

Since the past has already occurred any travel to the past has already occurred. Any 'changes' made by the traveller have already occurred and so the traveller can have no effect on the past.

In T2 (script) we learn that SkyNet has sent a new model Terminator right after it sent the first one, or possibly right before, just before the rebels took out the Cheyenne Mountain SkyNet mainframe and stormed the L.A. based complex.

So the forty-five year old John Connor of 2029 chooses and sends a specific CSM101 T-800 back through time because he remembers its brutal features and the events of 1994 when he was a ten year old kid. He is doing that which he was always going to do. It was predestined, the future may not be set but for adult John meddling with time travel means that it's not over even when it's over. He's caught, not irrevocably, in a causality loop. For his forty-five year old self the unknown future has only just begun.

The Terminator he met when he was a ten year old kid was sent back through time BECAUSE he remembered meeting it when he was a kid, he sent it because he had to, because it had always been sent. The Terminator that he sends was always sent to the past to stop the T-1000 and it always stops the T-1000 from killing young John.

SkyNet should really know better, it should realise that it cannot change the past because the past has happened and it wasn't changed. Sending something back in order to stop something which has happened from happening in this universe is a futile effort. There can be no changes to the timeline only effects whose causes are yet to happen.

Because John is alive and giving SkyNet hell in 2029 his past is safe because he is alive. John knows that when he sends Kyle to 1984 his comrade will become his father, he knows this because his mother told him. Both he and SkyNet are using the Time Displacement Equipment to bring about the causes for events which have already happened. SkyNet has to send the CSM 101 T-800 Terminator to 1984 because there was a CSM 101 T-800 Terminator that arrived in 1984. It failed, but it still had to be sent because it had already arrived, as evidenced by the existing order of past events, aka history. John has to send Kyle because Kyle is his dad.

Apart from Dyson's death in T2 neither the T-1000 nor John's pet Terminator have much effect on the timeline, rather intentionally from Cameron's P.O.V. I'd wager. But since Both CSM101 T-800s, Kyle and the T-1000 all come from a 2029 where Judgement Day occurred, and have all travelled to their own past, aka THE past, the past of their future, that means that Dyson always died in this way on that day in an explosion at the Cyberdyne building.

Unfortunately for his family, his death, although it was always destined to occur the way it did, was a futile death as SkyNet still bombed the world to hell on August 29th 1997.

T3 messes with this timeline. Not just by delaying the date of Judgement Day but whereas in the T2 Extreme DVD commentary Cameron states that T2 takes place at the beginning of 1994 while T3 tries to convince us that John Connor was 13 during the events of the film.

T3 changes the timeline and the very physics laid down in the previous two films by the creator, ("all hail the mighty Jim"), and in order to be consistent you must play by the rules. T3 plays by its own rules and is at odds with the two REAL Terminator films.

This also applies to the changed future coda in the T2 special edition, since the past cannot be changed and everything before the timetravellers began their chronoportation sequences is consideredd the past for them, the 'unwritten future' only truly begins when John finally defeats SkyNet in 2029.

So there you go, I hope this helps.

EDIT: Whoops I just saw Bossk's post about the off-topicness of this discussion, sorry. is there any way to move all the Terminator related responses into a new thread so we can continue on with it elsewhere?

Ummm... about "Revenge Of The Sith" it's a good title, it fits, I like it.
Post
#56738
Topic
Star Wars - The Edits and DVDr releases thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/56738/action/topic#56738
Time
Save me from George Lucas.

This is great to see you're all doing all this work to 'fix' the Prequels and make the Originals available on DVD.

I have lurked in the past but I just joined the forums last night with the intent of finding a passionate bootlegger and Star Wars enthusiast with the knowledge to help me find the OT on DVD seeing as how the New OT is so far from it's original form which I watched on the cinemas all those decades ago that it disgusts me.

A few years ago I bought the Star Wars Definitve LaserDiscs on eBay, 'twas an expensive ship to Sydney Australia, and my aim was to burn copies of these original versions for myself, friends and anyone else who was interested.

Unfortunately, life got in the way and I was never able to pick up a laserdisc player or a DVD authoring/burning equipment or more importantly learn just what the hell would be required to undertake this mammoth task.

But now that's all history as I see that quite a few more talented people than I have succeeded where I could not.

I have PM'd Rikter about the Star Wars Trilogy Definitive DVDs in Anamorphic Widescreen with commentaries and the fourth disc loaded with extras as this seems to be the version of choice. And now that I hear about the brilliant sounding MagnoliaFan edits I think I'll have to get those also.

This is great work from you guys I'm impressed that purists and revisionaries are getting political about the preservation of a film in its original form and the restoration of narrative structure and character arcs to the films of today. Keep it up.
Post
#56744
Topic
MagnoliaFan Edition Episode III-VI Titles
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/56744/action/topic#56744
Time
Quote
Originally posted by: Obi-Wan Spicoli
Quote
Originally posted by: MagnoliaFan
Urgh...
Just saw the new version of Jedi...
Well, I sure know one thing I'll be changing back to the original version for my edit...

That's what I figured you'd be doing all along. Righting Lucas' wrongs.


Yessss!!! Righting Lucas' wrongs, so we can all be happy to be Star Wars fans again.

Wow, I was just going to suggest a MagnoliaFan edit of the OT in the edits thread but I was somewhat afraid of being shouted down.

I love the original Original Trilogy, which is why I'll be buying the Anamrophic versions from Rikter.

However there were some, very few, good shots inserted into the 1997SE like the blastwaves from the Deathstar explosions and the 1997 celebration theme with galaxywide celebrations at the end of ROTJ. If you do a new version of these sacred texts then I hope you include these elements. I'd probably keep Biggs darklighter in ANH as it adds to Luke's character arc.

But from the looks of the 2004DVD New Original Trilogy there are a great many horrible new changes which I hope you don't include, like Hayden's head and Temuera Morrison's woeful new Kiwi Boba Fett etc. Actually I'd hate to hear KiwiTrooper dialogue anywhere in the OT so I'd hope that you'd keep the original audio for that.

I think the newly filmed Palpatine scene in TESB could stay but I think you'd have to dirty up the hologram so it was similar to how it used to be and you'd HAVE to restore the dialogue to excise the new exposition as much as possible.

Even though CGI has come along way in the last seven years and the new ANH Jabba is a vast improvement over the old one I'm still up in the air as to whether the scene belongs in there from a narrative standpoint. On the plus side we get slightly more Boba Fett, but do we need it?

I also prefer the simplicity of the old Mos Eisley spaceport, it was more like a frontier town. But I think that the interiors of the Cantina should probably come from the NOT editions as they reportedly have added blinking and whatnot to the creature masks.

In TESB I think that the new Cloud Cityscape really opens it up and looks quite good so I'd keep that.

In ROTJ the Sarlaac was always scarier as just a hole in the ground and the 1997SE looked a little dodgy so if it looks better again in the 2004 NOT versions then I guess I could handle its inclusion.

You'd have to restore the order of Han Shoots First, that is without question.

I think you'd also have to restore TESB's "Bring My Shuttle".

Is there any way of fixing Han's alternating 'vest no vest' situation in TESB? Assuming Lucas has neglected to fix that yet again.

Would you keep the new CGI song and dance number in ROTJ or leave it with the simplicity of the loungemusicesque Max Reebo Band? Flirty Boba Fett or serious Boba Fett?

New Wampa or old Wampa?

Can we get the sandstorm scene inserted into ROTJ if it exists in a workable format?

The overall picture quality of the SE and the NOT films is vastly improved over the OT versions however I think that all new additions to the dialogue in the SE and NOT versions have sucked and should be restored. So wherever possible it would be good to use a cleaned up shot, provided it was not edited laserblast hits or whatever and keep the original dialogue tracks.

I'm definitly going to put in a bid to reserve a copy of these new MagnoliaFan edits as they really do sound like a great idea.


I'm sure you've all seen these but these sites helped to inform my opinions of the SE changes to the OT and the NOT changes to the SE.

SE Changes
NOT Changes