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Nibcrom

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16-Dec-2019
Last activity
11-Feb-2021
Posts
38

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Post
#1399783
Topic
Is the 1997 Special Edition important?
Time

For the eventual Blade Runner-esque “Final Cut” boxed set we’ll never get but I’d like to see:

Star Wars (Original Theatrical version)
97 Special Edition
2019 Special Edition
Special Edition-Lite version (mostly just recomposited special effects, no new scenes, etc.)

I can live without the 04 and 11 Special Edition versions as they are already readily available on disc.

So to answer your question, yes the '97 Special Edition is important. It was the way many people saw it in the theater for the first time.

Post
#1392541
Topic
Despecialized or the Special Editions; Which do you prefer - and why?
Time

ray_afraid said:

Nibcrom said:

I watched… 4K Blu-ray recently and… It was great to have a clean-up version of the film.

Disney said:

Not sure why you edited my quote but…

I’m well aware that the 4K Blu-rays are not perfect as they were meant to be masters for the 3D conversion, but I did enjoy A New Hope on 4K Blu-ray. The color timing is vastly superior to the old Blu-rays (obviously).

When I say “cleaned up” I was mostly referring to the removal of garbage mattes and the superior compositing of elements related to work done on the Special Edition. 😃

I’m also a huge fan of the filmic look of 4K77 as I stated in my previous post.

It’s a shame we didn’t get definitive box set with all the different versions of the films without unnecessary digital processing. But hey, they’ve got to give us some reason to keep this site going…

Best,

Post
#1392538
Topic
Why I Love Prequel Yoda (and what I think people get wrong)
Time

G&G-Fan said:

SparkySywer said:

What changed between when Yoda’s talking big to Palpatine and when he says “Failed, I have”?

Nothing to do with the Jedi or the Republic, or the Sith or the Empire. What changed is he lost a fight. That’s kind of what we have to go on, and that’s really the only real interpretation I think you can get from the movie itself.

Not to mention, why does he realize he’s failed then of all times, if he’s talking about some grand centuries-long, galaxy-defining failure? I’d say even before the fight, even if Yoda won, Palpatine getting as far as he did shows that something at least had failed. If this was all actually in the prequels, why wouldn’t he say this right when it became obvious that Palpatine was a Sith?

What changed was that he lost the duel, and that loss made him rethink everything that happened before then. Like thinking, “Where did it go all wrong?”

He didn’t say that immediately because it took him some time to realize that the Jedi failed the galaxy. He didn’t just lose the fight, he failed to prevent Palpatine from rising to power from the beginning. Sometimes it takes time to process such an immense amount of grief and loss. You immediately blame the thing right in front of you instead of the deeper things, the former being the Sith and the latter being Jedi complacency.

Nibcrom said:

So the full quote is:

“Into exile, I must go. Failed, I have.”

Yes?

I don’t think that line is necessarily a confession of failure over hundreds of years, but it’s MORE than “I lost a lightsaber fight.” If Yoda had beaten Palpatine in that duel, I’m guessing Yoda and Kenobi would stick around and try to restore the Republic instead of going into exile.

Why would they need to go into exile if they defeated Palpatine? They would just build a better Republic and a new Jedi order that’s less complacent and corrupt.

BedeHistory731 said:

I’d argue that Yoda should never have appeared in the PT. Establishing that he was exiled from the order in TPM would’ve been a nice subversion, demonstrating how far the Jedi had fallen since its “golden days.”

Mocata said:

Ahh but there’s the real problem, and keeping all of the ESB twists intact would require far more creativity.

Or maybe because it would contradict more lines from the original trilogy? Like Yoda knowing who Luke’s father was enough to say “Powerful Jedi was he” and “Much anger in him… like his father”. How else would he know to “Not underestimate the powers of the Emperor”? And how else would he learn “Wars not make one great” without having experienced that first hand.

That’s another thing that a lot of people miss. When he says “Do not underestimate the powers of the Emperor” that obviously means he faced him before. Obviously he was witness to the Emperor’s power first hand. That actually becomes a plot hole for anyone who removes that duel from the movie, because now how else would he know the Emperor’s power? It fits into the original trilogy perfectly.

I said “instead of going into exile.” I am saying that if Yoda killed the Emperor, Kenobi and Yoda could have stuck around and tried to rebuild the Republic.

I agree that Yoda’s participation in the Clone Wars makes his line in Empire about “wars not make one great” stronger.

I agree that when Yoda says “Failed, I have” he is speaking about more than just losing a lightsaber duel. He is saying I have failed to kill the Emperor. If he had killed the Emperor, Kenobi and Yoda would NOT have had to go into exile. I think the clones could be defeated (without their secret master) and the Republic could have started rebuilding much sooner. Order 66 would have been a huge tragic setback instead of a catastrophic loss of power.

I don’t think he is necessarily saying that his failure is the culmination of hundreds of years of failure. I think it’s more of the span from Attack of the Clones to Revenge of the Sith.

I’m mostly agreeing with you. 😃

Post
#1392327
Topic
Why I Love Prequel Yoda (and what I think people get wrong)
Time

So the full quote is:

“Into exile, I must go. Failed, I have.”

Yes?

I don’t think that line is necessarily a confession of failure over hundreds of years, but it’s MORE than “I lost a lightsaber fight.” If Yoda had beaten Palpatine in that duel, I’m guessing Yoda and Kenobi would stick around and try to restore the Republic instead of going into exile.

Post
#1392322
Topic
Blade Runner 2049 the Joi-less edit (I removed Joi entirely to trim the run-time) (Released)
Time

Sounds like an interesting project!

I haven’t watched your edit, but I think Blade Runner 2049 is perfect as-is. I don’t think it’s too long (and I’m a proponent of 90 minute films). I think K’s relationship with Joi is important. Spoilers:

Joi insists that K is special in regards to finding the matching dates on the tree and the horse. It reinforces his false discovery that he was born, not created. Which strengthens his disappointment when he realizes that he is not the offspring of Rachel.

It’s also interesting to see how Joi is treated by others. Humans don’t like replicants and treat them poorly (i.e. K’s fellow officer calling him a skin-job at the police station). And then replicants treating AIs like Joi poorly (Mackenzie Davis’ character disparaging Joi, Luv destroying Joi).

I think removing Joi also weakens K’s character development. He has more interaction with Joi than any other character. And his interaction with the billboard at the end of the film is part of a catalyst for him running off to find/“kill” Deckard. Joi seemed almost human (calling him Joe instead of a serial number, telling him that she loved him despite K telling her she didn’t have to say those things). Then after her demise he interacts with the billboard that calls him Joe. So did the AI have actual feeling for him? Or was it just her programming? Does K have actual feelings? Or is he just a product like Joi?

Best,

Post
#1389776
Topic
Why I Love Prequel Yoda (and what I think people get wrong)
Time

Agreed. To go along with Yoda’s failure line from Episode III, I remember this conversation from Episode II:

Yoda: “Blind we are, if creation of this clone army we could not see.”
Mace Windu: “I think it is time we inform the senate that our ability to use the Force has diminished.”
Yoda: “Only the Dark Lord of the Sith knows of our weakness. If informed the senate is, multiply our adversaries will.”

Post
#1387920
Topic
Despecialized or the Special Editions; Which do you prefer - and why?
Time

I really appreciate Harmy and the rest of the gang for all of their work on Despecialized. It’s nice to have another option for watching the Star Wars Trilogy.

That being said, the Despecialized versions are a strange beast in that they are an “undo” of a “redo” as opposed to just going back to the original. I realize 4K77/4K83 were made available after Despecialized, but I much prefer those versions as they are closer to the original, unaltered movies.

I enjoy the Special Editions and the original versions as well. Now that I have 4K77, Despecialized, etc, the Special Editions aren’t a version of the film holding the original version back (yes, I am still clamoring for an official release of the original, unaltered trilogy).

I watched A New Hope on 4K Blu-ray recently and enjoyed it immensely. It was great to have a clean-up version of the film.

I also watched 4K77 recently and it was great to see the film in it’s original form. I loved the grain from the 35mm print.

Post
#1387918
Topic
Opinion: Return Of The Jedi is Very Underrated. Do You Agree?
Time

I really don’t like the term “underrated” (or “overrated”) for that matter.

Calling something underrated without any context is not useful. What is it’s current rating? Are we assigning a numerical value for it? If it’s currently rated 8.1 but I think it’s an 8.2 is it still worth calling it out for being underrated? If we constantly call something underrated does it then become overrated?

I would prefer to just rate the film and keep it at that.

That being said, Return of the Jedi is my second favorite Star Wars film (behind the original) and is in my top ten films of all time.

Post
#1387258
Topic
Richard Marquand's effect on Return of the Jedi
Time

JadedSkywalker said:

On one hand Lucas hated directing and that is why he gave it up. And on the other hand he hated to cede control of one of his films to anyone, except the exception being Steven Spielberg. He hated films going over budget, he hated the writing process and didn’t like the technological limitations in his way of achieving his vision.
Collaboration was a necessity but he didn’t like to do that either.

When it came to do the prequels he just decided the hell with it and wrote and directed them himself to avoid what happened on Empire and Jedi. Its his way or no way. It would have been the same for the sequels had he not sold to Disney.

That’s not accurate.

Dek mentioned Spielberg in the comment before mine.

Steven Spielberg, Ron Howard, and Robert Zemeckis were all offered the chance to direct Episode I and turned Lucas down.

Post
#1385715
Topic
Favorite VHS/Laserdisc/DVD/Blu-Ray covers
Time

I think those ’92 covers are probably the best.

I’ve got a soft spot for the Special Edition covers as well. Having the covers on display in my office, I’ve been noticing how many elements are borrowed from the other movies, some of which have already been mentioned:

ANH:
I don’t think Leia had that hairstyle in ANH. (crissrudd mentioned this).

ESB:
Vader’s TIE is on the cover despite only being in ANH.
As Chaotic mentioned, the RotJ Emperor.
Vader is from a RotJ publicity photo.

Rotj:
Duel is from ESB
Boba Fett is from ESB?

Post
#1385153
Topic
Richard Marquand's effect on Return of the Jedi
Time

Darth Dougal said:

Yoda wasn’t coming back originally? How on earth was that supposed to work story-wise?

I would need to check in the book (easier said than done, it’s pretty dense) but I think Yoda’s mention of the other Skywalker would just be folded into Obi-Wan’s dialogue - and the Luke/Obi Wan discussion would not happen on Dagoba. IIRC the idea was for Obi Wan to tell Luke that Yoda was now one with the Force.

I’m not sure if this script development took place before or after talk about the Force ghosts of Yoda and Obi Wan appearing during Luke’s duel with Vader. Not to mention the two Death Stars!

Back to the OP - I found an interview with Marquand that relates to your question:

https://www.denofgeek.com/movies/richard-marquand-interview-return-of-the-jedi-star-wars/

Wonderful! Thanks for linking this. I haven’t read the JW Rinzler book yet, but I think it’s pretty safe to say Marquand made his own contributions to Star Wars.

Post
#1385151
Topic
Complete Comparison of Special Edition Visual Changes
Time

That’s a great article, doubleofive. I would buy that set in a heartbeat (why not, I already have an entire media shelf full of Star Wars on VHS, DVD, Blu-ray, 4K Blu-ray…).

The Blade Runner set is an apt comparison. It’s a terrific set that sets the standard for home video releases.

On a personal note, I wouldn’t mind having an official release of something along the lines of D77+ or whatever it might be called currently. Basically the theatrical cut with redone/recomposited optical effects. I would absolutely not substitute the original theatrical cuts, warts and all, but it would be nice to have a “Special Edition-Lite” version where some of the more rough special effects were redone. If they could make everything just look “clean” (mostly getting rid of garbage mattes) that would be nice for an alternate version. I realize everyone would have a different opinion on what this would entail, but just figured I’d mention it.

Post
#1334230
Topic
Star Wars: The Skywalker Saga 4k UHD -- 27 DISC Boxed Set -- 3/31/2020
Time

StarkillerAG said:

Nibcrom said:

towne32 said:

Rodney-2187 said:

These new 4K HDR discs are the best I’ve seen these movies look and sound by several orders of magnitude.
I eagerly await the next Harmy Despecialized!

The D+77 and D+80 releases are quite great if you don’t mind less than 100% despecialization (some recomped shots, etc).

Where can I find more information on these releases (D+77, D+80)?

Create an account on forums.thestarwarstrilogy.com. The D+77 and D+80 releases are there, along with several other projects.

Yeah, I’ve created two accounts there but I’ve never gotten my account approved by an admin so I can browse the forums. 😦

Post
#1334014
Topic
Star Wars: The Skywalker Saga 4k UHD -- 27 DISC Boxed Set -- 3/31/2020
Time

towne32 said:

Rodney-2187 said:

These new 4K HDR discs are the best I’ve seen these movies look and sound by several orders of magnitude.
I eagerly await the next Harmy Despecialized!

The D+77 and D+80 releases are quite great if you don’t mind less than 100% despecialization (some recomped shots, etc).

Where can I find more information on these releases (D+77, D+80)?