What I like the most about the PT (and the SE for that matter) is that their awfulness expose Lucas for the talentless hack he is. If they hadn't existe, I'd have likely never knew who Kershner,Marcia Lucas, Kurtz, etc. were and how many of others' contributions went into making Star Wars something that was actually special.
Lucas doesn't need to regain his prestige. What needs to happen is more people need to be educated on just how overrated Lucas has always been. How he's a hack who got lucky in 1977.
Easterhay said:
Heero Yuy said:
Then I'd advise not taking cues from the apologists and autists from TF.N like you've been doing in your posts. I'm the one being level headed, objective, and analytical here. Demonstrably you've not been anything of the sort.
Do better next time.
Do better next time? I'd relish the opportunity to give you a smack in the mouth. Don't refer to people as "autists" just because you don't like what they have to say. Nothing I have said amounts to that level of offense and your remark is completely uncalled for.
LOL, watch it guys! We got a badass over her
Relax, boy. I've been nice to you so far. Once again, you rely on emotional points in lieu of anything substantial.
No need to get uppity just because I hit you close to home.
Easterhay said:
darklordoftech said:
Furthermore, if I want to say that the world is flat, I have the right to do so. Nobody's going to stop me. Also, what I call a movie isn't an "intellectual argument", it's a choice of words.
I didn't tell you what you should call it. I simply said it's idiotic to do so when the film was only titled that for three or four years.
Almost as idiotic as trying to retroactively make Star Wars all about Darth Vader.
Eh, I find him amusing. It's like he's every bad TF.N poster rolled into one. I hope he calls us Anti-Lucas Warriors next.
CO said:
Easterhay said:
Lucas won't be releasing any Star Wars films, OOT or otherwise, anyway, so that's another stupid question you've asked today.You realize the website's purpose is to get the Originals released??? I hate the movie Forrest Gump, but I wouldn't go to Forrest Gump Message Boards and shit all over their fans.
Eh, I don't really mind differing opinions. We don't want this place to become a mindless circle jerk like Lucas apologists are trying to turn TF.N into, do we?
Then I'd advise not taking cues from the apologists and autists from TF.N like you've been doing in your posts. I'm the one being level headed, objective, and analytical here. Demonstrably you've not been anything of the sort.
Do better next time.
As is usual with the Lucas apologist side of things, you have nothing of substance to offer up in response.
Easterhay said:
Wow, that's the worst kind of partiality I've ever seen.
Jackson wanting to go back and alter his old films to tie in with his new ones is EXACTLY the same as Lucas's revisions.
No, it's really not the same thing. As I said in my post and as others have mentioned, Jackson isn't trying to replace his films the way Lucas has. This Middle Earth version or whatever would just be yet another alternate cut. But you already knew the difference. I know it. Everybody knows it. You've not been fooling anyone. You know what the difference is, so why are you being such a dishonest, emotional argument making coward?
Easterhay said:
Yes, I wondered about Wiesman leaving too. How long before Filoni and the rest of the crew from The Clone Wars also leave or get shown the door?
It saddens me that it's turned out this way but, as I've said about the new films, the Disney-effect is what's going to ruin this franchise, not make it better.
It's interesting that you think this, but let's be real here, shall we? As bad as Disney can get, there's literally no way things in Star Wars under the mouse's command can get anywhere near as embarrassingly awful as Lucas' prequels. Nor can they be as disgustingly insulting as Lucas' special editions. Seriously, not unless they bring in GL himself to write and direct the ST after all.
I'll take Star Wars becoming a bit Disneyish if Lucas' incompetence will stay as far away as possible.
Haarspalter said:
generalfrevious said:
You could say that George was doing the same thing with the PT, but I wanna say he is worse than Jackson because the LOTR is not being reedited to fit in with the Hobbit trilogy.
You should listen to the audio commentary of the AUJ EE. At one point Peter Jackson and Philipa Boyens are discussing the possibility of a Six Movie Middle-Earth Box Set AND ... ... that some shots of the opening scene from 'Fellowship' have to be replaced with Hobbit scenes (think Bilbo = remove Ian Holm, insert Martin Freeman) and that Thranduil could be digitally inserted into the battle scenes along with Elrond and Gil Galad.
History repeats itself. A director should never touch the same material a second time.
Eh, it's not really the same thing objectively speaking. Jackson has been talking about a super edit of these movies since before The Hobbit trilogy came out. In all honesty, its less comparable with the water head antics of Lucas and more like Coppolla's Godfather Saga. The Godfather Saga is the first two GF films re edited with newly added deleted scenes so it flows together in chronological order. Its actually kind of interesting in that sense and, unlike with the SEs, it wouldn't be trying to replace the originals.
I don't know where you get your info, but TCW didn't have a low budget. At all. Unlike TCW, Rebels doesn't have an eccentric billionaire throwing money at it left and right. SWR is the one being made cheaply (or cheaper anyway). Another point to add is that TCW had a much longer creation process for each episode than SWR.
The rest of your points are entirely subjective.
EDIT: Not to mention TCW's visual style isn't even all that unique when you consider the character designs were mostly lifted from the Micro series' look. Especially Anakin and Count Dooku.
SilverWook said:
Are they even using the same animation house they set up for TCW?
You'd think they had a well oiled machine on that end, even though it's a new show.
Actually, I'm pretty sure they're not. They're using a lot of the same team, but many people were also let go. Keep in mind as well that when you're using a new style in 3D animation, it takes time to get into the groove with a new style. Not to mention they don't have an extensive library of stock characters to give more life to the scenery.
Frankly, I like SWR's art style WAY more than TCW's wood block, stilted look. It already looks better than TCW did when it started, so I don't know what the big deal is since it's only going to get better as they get more experienced with these models.
I think that had more to do with Ahsoka being Filoni's waifu than anything else. Lucas said she should die by TCW's end after all. It's only Filoni's favoritism combined with TCW's cancellation that let Snips live.
Beatleboy99 said:
I thought "Rebels" was ok, but I expect the series to get significantly better as it goes on. I'd really like to see Leia introduced near the end of the series, and I think it would be really cool if the series ends right where "Star Wars" starts.
I like the idea of the final episode ending with Leia going to pick up Kenobi on Tattooine and the Ghost crew going off to meet Bail Organa on Alderaan. Then we all know what happens. . .
What really makes the dewbacks (Tsss why not cokebacks or sumthin? Tssss) look like crap isn't necessarily the dewbacks themselves. Rather it's the awful looking CGI stormtroopers that ride them. They looked like shit in 1997 and they look even worse now.
Granted cgi almost never ages well as a rule, so it should come as no surprise.
Tobar said:
Heero Yuy said:
The term Padawan doesn't even make sense. Kanan himself was barely a Padawan himself when the purge went down. It's as I said, a noob leading a noob.
Where has it been established that Kanan was a Padawan during the purge?
Also keep in mind the character who is calling him that doesn't know the characters, he's just seen a Jedi and what appears to be his apprentice so obviously he's going to call him a Padawan.
I'm pretty sure in a Filoni interview it was said the purge happened during his formative years. He could have been less than a Padawan for all we know now. My point is this isn't gonna be some overpowered PT Jedi.
The term Padawan doesn't even make sense. Kanan himself was barely a Padawan himself when the purge went down. It's as I said, a noob leading a noob.
I heard 3-5 years before ANH. I think they said that they plan the series to segue directly into the beginning of the original film.
And let's be honest. The whole bit with Yoda and Ben as the last of the Jedi was pretty much always a load of bunk. Even in some of the earliest EU, we saw Jedi who survived the purge. That old, homeless woman from Dark Empire for instance.
and as for Yoda seemingly not noticing Ezra? You're talking about the dude who chatted it up with the Dark Lord himself yet couldn't sense him. Sorry, but Yoda IS fallible. Plus Ezra may not even become a proper Jedi. Kanan wasn't even a Jedi. He was a Padawan at best by the time of the purge. It'll be a noob training a noob.
Unfortunatly I don't think kiddies would be all that keen on a cartoon show where the heroes constantly lose to the bad guys. I think that kind of storyline would be better suited to a more adult oriented, live action series than SWR.
All signs point to the Ghost crew having victories, albeit minor ones in the grand scheme.
imperialscum said:
Tobar said:
I have no problem with Jedi in the Dark Times era. What I take issue with is that it's supposed to be Vader's job to hunt down and destroy the Jedi. Not these dark suited weirdos.
Exactly. I hate these stupid force-sensitive enforcers (Starkiller, this Inquisitor). Why the hell can't they just make a series or a video game about Vader hunting down the Jedi?
The problem there is that making Vader the main adversary in SWR, they run the risk of making Vader look like a chump if he keeps losing to these guys. Original villains won't have the same sort of expectations that the fans would have for Vader.
aNtoNny haZ nOte bN fiRed
APPREL FHALLS!
https://mobile.twitter.com/AnthonyCumia/status/485045848032546816
Seriously though, a sad day for radio. Thanks for the laughs, Ant!
^ To be fair, they're mainly supposed to alter posts that are flaming, trolling, etc. However, the mods at TFN are way, WAY too uptight to where they'll alter an entire thread for one minor infraction. One poster there was accused of baiting when her post was made 100% in jest.
I can link you the thread, but most of my posts there had been mod edited.
ETA: here ya go, what you can still see anyhow. http://boards.theforce.net/threads/pt-fans-feelings-on-st-news-so-far.50020544/page-7
ETA2: Oh, lucky me! Because one of my posts was misquoted as bring from someone else's, the text escaped a mod edit!
"The thing is, aside from some Bronies, I've never seen a segment of a fandom that is so insecure and oversensitive. They see pop culture mocking of the PT as a personal slight when really the consensus of our culture is that they're lesser films at best. I've never heard Bayformers or X-Men 3 fans get upset when their movies are trashed again and again. That's because they accept that they have an unpopular opinion and so have nothing to prove.
I think a lot of the recent animosity has to do with the ST. This shan't be a populat view, but I'm going to say it; Many PT fans feel tricked. PT/Saga fans truly bought into Lucas' nonsense about there being no story after ROTJ and the Saga being all about Anakin that was planned out all along. Well, that's been exposed as BS and so Lucas loyalists have had difficulty reconciling the "Tragedy of Darth Vader," with the new ST. Despite GL's involvement in the story, PT fans have a scapegoat in Disney, JJ, etc. to naysay and desperately find fault. Not all PT fans mind you, just certain types.
I sincerely believe they want the ST/Rebels to fail so they can turn about and yell, "Y'see? I told ya so? Miss Lucas yet?!" Just so they can feel better about themselves for being, "right," about Star Wars.
Tis quite embarrassingly pathetic, really."
ETA3:
"I've mentioned this in another thread, but it's very relevant here.
When the PT came out and OT fans expressed dismay over how their trilogy was being altered and retconned in ways they didn't care for, the gushers came out of the wood work with, "u must unlrn wat uve lrned. Lulz," and we were apparently expected to take it. Because #LucasOriginalVision or some such BS. Now that it's the ST coming out and changing their perception about what Star Wars is truly meant to be (spoilers: NOT the Tragedy of Darth Vader), all of a sudden many PT fans are all, "WAAAAAAAH! Why can't u leave us alone to view Lucas' SAGA as we want?! WAAAAAAAAH!" Welp, now you know how the OT fans have felt for years.
The only difference is the OT fans' worries are actually valid, for you can still watch your beloved PT the way you want it. I can't watch the OOT without buying inferior official copies or resorting to illegal means."
darklordoftech said:
I think this is a laugh:
Somebody said that when ROTS was first released, people left the theater wondering whether or not Plagueis is dead. Does that person realize that nobody knew about episode 7 until October 2012?
Yeah... When most people left the theatre, they likely didn't remember who Plagueis was. He was mentioned in one fucking scene!
Anyway, I was recently banned from JCF myself. It seems to be permanent this time. I was accused of trolling and baiting. I don't think it's either to accurately deconstruct and expose the insecurities of many PT fans in light of the ST. They babble on about how worried they are that the new trilogy will undo and alter their perceptions of their beloved, "Saga." They're fearful there shan't be any references to the PT in the ST and that it'll be brusher aside by Disney's Star Wars.
Is it really trolling or baiting when an OT fan accurately states, "well, now ya know how we feel!"?
Watching the apologists flounder and humiliate themselves while trying to debate with me is always hilarious.