Darth Tremor

rocknroll41 said:

I woulda done away with the whole “fear of loss leads to evil” or whatever. Instead, I’d rather that Anakin have a god complex and think that he needs to inherit as much power as possible to maintain order across the galaxy. I think that aligns more with the Empire’s values anyways. I would also probably have Obi-Wan be the central character of the PT, rather than Anakin, and have Anakin’s downfall happen at the end of the second movie, and then the third movie is all about Obi-Wan coming to terms with things.

A god complex would be intriguing, there is a foundation for that in AOTC with Anakin conversation with Padme:

Padme: You are not all powerful Ani.
Anakin: Well I should be. Someday I will be. I will become the most powerful Jedi ever! I promise you. I will even learn how to stop people from dying.

In those lines Anakin says he wants omnipotence like a god, and to control death is god like too.

Is wondering if the Alien Series will be postponed because of the writers and actors strike in Hollywood.

Indie films and shows are getting a waiver like The Chosen, which can keep filming despite the strikes.

My favorite EU is:

Tales of the Jedi
-Ulic Qel Droma
-Exar Kun
-Aleena Keto
-Vima Sunrider

The Emperor’s Hand
-Mara Jade Skywalker

The Jedi Knight Series
-Kyle Katarn
-Jaden
-Cal Kestis
-Merrin

Knights of the Old Republic
-Revan
-Darth Marr
-Satale Shan
-Bastila Shan

The fear of loss is the path to the dark side… and yet the Jedi feared the loss of their dominion via The Republic. Which raises the question, are not the Jedi bound by fear? They fear the fall of the Republic, they fear the Sith and their return, and they fear letting systems fall; are they not suppose to adopt “let go of all you fear to lose?” (Yoda, ROTS)

It seems a true Jedi has to step back from conflict completely because it leads to fear of loss, and “fear is the path to the dark side.” (Yoda, TPM). While the Sith in contrast use conquest and thrive via Conflict and fear.

Anakin being trained as a Jedi Knight doomed him to fall, the Clone Wars put the thirst for combat and power in him. It was inevitable he would become Darth Vader, because he was already conquest oriented thanks to the Clone Wars.

Palpatine did a stroke of genius, the Clone Wars transformed Jedi into potential inquisitors and made Anakin his disciple.

Servii said:

I really like your version of events. Especially how Anakin dabbles with Sith knowledge for a while before fully committing to it. It fits better with the idea of Anakin being seduced by the Dark Side rather than just being duped into it.

For a while, I considered cutting out Anakin’s discovery by the Jedi altogether, and just having him start as a padawan or knight at the beginning of Episode I. But I decided it is still important to show Obi-Wan meeting him for the first time, so I’ll have their meeting occur very early in the movie. And midway through, Anakin will already be Obi-Wan’s padawan, at least in an informal sense. Anakin will be nineteen, and an indentured servant living on Tatooine, when Obi-Wan meets him. Anakin ends up saving the day at the end of the movie, and is celebrated on Coruscant as a hero of the Republic.

Anakin can be knighted early in Episode II. Make it clear that a lot of people look up to him, but that the pressure of that is starting to get to him. He tries to put up this front of a stoic, selfless hero, but privately, he’s wracked by self doubt and PTSD. He tries to hide his problems, but the stress of the Clone Wars and all the death he’s surrounded by is keeping him up at night. Despite that, the soldiers under his command have great respect for him, and Anakin is shown to have a stern, commanding presence and a strong tactical mind.

Anakin’s mother dies near the end of Episode II, in a way that Anakin narrowly fails to prevent. Anakin goes into a whirlwind of emotion, and almost massacres the people responsible, but is stopped and calmed down by Obi-Wan.

Either at the end of II or the beginning of III, Coruscant is attacked and large swathes of the city are destroyed. Anakin and Padme work to rally the planet’s defenders, but Padme is then injured in the attack and is bedridden in a hospital. This throws Anakin further off balance. Anakin fights Darth Maul in the Chancellor’s office, and Maul taunts Anakin about how everything the Jedi have fought for is crumbling around him. Maul then senses Anakin’s distress about his wife, and taunts him about how she will be dead soon. This causes Anakin to finally snap and overpower Maul in a fit of rage, killing him as he begs for mercy.

From this point onward, even though Anakin isn’t technically a Sith yet, he’s already essentially on the Dark Side. When we see him again in III, he’s leading a bloody campaign of vengeance against those responsible for Coruscant. He’s soon expelled from the Jedi Order for committing war crimes and being driven by hate and revenge. Instead of Anakin becoming more unstable or fiery as he turns to the Dark Side, he becomes callous and cold. A ruthless general of the Republic/Empire.

It’s then that, per Palpatine’s subtle suggestion, he begins to dabble in Sith knowledge, looking for ways to destroy the enemy and end the war. He learns that Palpatine is planning to have the Jedi killed to solidify his power, and he decides that this is a necessary evil to restore order to the galaxy, and that the Jedi have become a liability, so he agrees to go along with it. When he confronts Obi-Wan on Mustafar, neither of them wants to kill the other. Obi-Wan begs Anakin to come back with him, while Anakin demands that Obi-Wan stand down. So with that impasse, they’re forced to fight. And you know the rest.

I agree, seduced by the dark side not duped. That is the problem with The Prequels, all the Jedi including Anakin are to quote Lord Malgus, “deceived.”

In a way Anakin could be both like Paul in Dune, how the Bene Gisseret were trying to creatw their messiah to manipulate and the Fremen were looking for The Mau’Dib. The Sith have The Sith’ari, and the Jedi have The Chosen One. GL definitely took inspiration from Dune, hence Tatooine and the Dune Sea. It is possible that Anakin could be like Paul, one or the other, one forged by Plagueis and the dark side, the other The Will of the Force.

fmalover said:

Darth Tremor said:

Kotor I is a classic. Sadly Kotor II I never could get past the first world.

The first world is a chore, no doubt about that. But the rest of the game is totally worth it. Be sure to install TSLRCM and give the game a second chance, you won’t regret it.

Is the app version smoother? I had a glitch where I could not complete the main story quest.

G&G-Fan said:

According to GL, Vader and Palpatine planned it out in advance. They wanted him and Vader to fight each other and use that to finish his turn. If Vader didn’t block the blow, Palps would’ve done so himself with the Force and gone, “Bruh did you miss your cue?”.

So… “it was a trap!” 😄

Peter Pan said:

Darth Tremor said:

Though I still like the idea of Palpatine using lightning on Vader to make him submit to the dark side, it would add gravitas to Vader’s line, “you don’t know the power of the dark side! I must obey my master.” You would then understand Vader to basically be saying, “I obey or die,” that he lives under tyranny.

However that is something that could be achieved, or at least hinted at, through fan editing. There is a moment after Anakin’s turn, before Palpatine tells him to rise, where we cut away to Yoda feeling the catastrophe through the force. One could add Palatine raising his hands and shooting Anakin with lightning just before the cut, continuing the sound effect through Yoda’s moment, add an evil laugh for the atmosphere and return to palatines office, where Anakin thanks his new master. This would retexture the function of force lightning, not just as a weapon but as a tool for control and dominion, essentially like a burn sign. It would show how Anakin is broken after his betrayal. He is paralyzed by his dependence on Palpatine, induced by his fear of loss. Furthermore he might very well want the punishment as a mean to numb his conscience, after all he just unleashed the ultimate horror on the galaxy.

I think something like that could serve the function of reinforcing Vader’s line in episode six, unless I misread your meaning here.

On an unrelated note. It just occurred to me, that Anakin’s redemption, which is essentially tied to the birth of the twins is ultimately dependent on Obi-Wan winning their duel on Mustafar.
That does not fit with an redemption arc, because it is no conscious decision to do good, which would signify hope for him. Instead it is his overconfidence to get the jump on his former master, which allows Obi-Wan, the droids, Padmé and by extension the twins to escape.

The Force Lightning burning would also nicely harken to when The Dark Lord Marko Ragnos burned the foreheads of Exar Kun and Ulic Qel Droma; showing it as a form of annointing.

How do I subscribe to a thread I have posted in? I want to be be able to check in on topics I am in discussion over.

When Luke levitated his lightsaber into his hand and swings, is he aiming to strike down Palpatine? If so, why did Vader block it? Vader wanted in ESB, “join me and together we can rule the galaxy as father and son,” and his words to Padme, “I am more powercul than The Chancellor, I can overthrow him…”

Is Vader trying to prevent Luke from:

a) striking Palpatine down and his journey to dark side being completed

or

b) knows Palpatine can do essence transfer and will possess Luke’s body as The Emperor claims in TROS?

Superweapon VII said:

Darth Tremor said:

The issue is Ahsoka. I like her, but Vader’s line, “when I left you I was a learner, now I am the Master,” indicates Vader was never a Jedi Master as Anakin.

Or a full knight for that matter. Just another bit of OT continuity Lucas either forgot or ignored when writing the prequels.

Indeed, a good place to have had Anakin fall was The Tuskan Slaughter in AOTC. For then was still a Padawan Learner.

Peter Pan said:

Darth Tremor said:

I would have him fall trying to prevent the take over of the Sith, that he is not Palpatine pal, but is seduced when Sheev kills Jedi Masters in front of him and damages Anakin with Force Lightning; that its the burns from The Emperor’s bolts that makes Anakin have to don the mask and black mantels. That would make it poetic in ROTJ that he dies being hit by bolts again.

I like the link to episode 6, although I wouldn’t try to recreate the exact scene.

Instead I would change the platform scene before the duel on Mustafar. In this version Anakin doesn’t choke Padmé after Obi-Wan’s reveal, but attacks him with force lightning, Obi-Wan defend himself with his lightsaber, but the rebound attack hits Padmé. Anakin is devastated, he is now at his lowest point, he wants revenge, Obi-Wan must die. But first Padmé needs medical help, however neither Obi-Wan nor Anakin can leave, so Anakin lets go of Padmé and allows 3PO to fly her out, thus opening the door to his redemption. On board the ship Padmé hands 3PO the coordinates to Bail’s asteroid base. They leave the system and the duel begins.

What do you think?

I like that, since we have seen Kenobi knows how to deflect Force Lightning in AOTC, and that in ROTS and TROS the channeling of bolts can be reflected back on the conjurer.

Yeah I would be fine with that alternative too.

Though I still like the idea of Palpatine using lightning on Vader to make him submit to the dark side, it would add gravitas to Vader’s line, “you don’t know the power of the dark side! I must obey my master.” You would then understand Vader to basically be saying, “I obey or die,” that he lives under tyranny.

NeverarGreat said:

In my opinion, there has never been a truly satisfactory name for users of the Dark Side.

Darth was originally Vader’s first name, and giving every darksider a “Darth (Evil Adjective)” name is dumb.

Sith is slightly better, but even though it was conceived for the Original Trilogy, it has generally been associated with the prequels and their baggage concerning the “rule of two” which makes it practically worthless for general practitioners of the Dark Side. Sith has ironically become a very limiting term for a group of practitioners who reject limitations almost as a rule.

Finally, even calling someone a ‘darksider’ or a ‘Dark Side user’ uses the Jedi’s doctrinal dichotomy between light and dark sides of the Force, whereas many so-called ‘darksiders’ would probably view themselves as agnostic in their use of the Force, only recognizing it for the power it provides. This is why it bugs me that the Emperor describes his power as coming from the Dark Side, since it feels like bowing to the Jedi terminology.

If it were up to me, I’d just call non-Jedi practitioners of the Force ‘Force Users’ or ‘Force Wizards’. It should be a neutral term which doesn’t stoop to the Jedi dichotomy. There would probably also be truly committed darksiders in the galaxy, just as there are Satanists in opposition to popular religious sects, whose choice of name is often performative and intended to provoke. But these darksiders would probably be a minority, as are Satanists among the vast array of religiously unaffiliated people who nevertheless have some religious or spiritual beliefs. Some of these Force users may use the Dark Side exclusively and yet not be affiliated with the Sith doctrine, some may use the Light Side exclusively yet not be called Jedi, and others may not differentiate between the two sides at all.

Sith is the Old English word dor “Journey” which did fit with The Emperor’s, “strike me down and your journey towards the dark side will be complete.”

One of problems with Sith is in the EU it ws who the dark siders conquered, hence dark lords of the Sith. The reason Darth works is it essentially is Dark Lord in Sith and Rakatan.

The Sith is not a great name for dark siders. I would have been content for Darth to be their monniker, and use Rakata term Daritha when referring to them plurally.

The issue is Ahsoka. I like her, but Vader’s line, “when I left you I was a learner, now I am the Master,” indicates Vader was never a Jedi Master as Anakin.

ThisIsntTheNerdYoureLookingFor said:

Which version of the OT do you watch ? Despecialized, special edition, etc

Special Editions. I really am not a fan of Vader’s added noooooooo! In ROTJ. It was perfect enough with him turning and lifting Palpatine with The Jedi Theme ringing loud.

HansiG said:

Movie, videogame, audio drama, toy, novel, anything. What is, according to you, the worst Star Wars thing ever made?

For me its the Jar Jar Binks Lollipop

Same. As a kid I had one, but in hindsight its disgusting.

I would have him fall trying to prevent the take over of the Sith, that he is not Palpatine pal, but is seduced when Sheev kills Jedi Masters in front of him and damages Anakin with Force Lightning; that its the burns from The Emperor’s bolts that makes Anakin have to don the mask and black mantels. That would make it poetic in ROTJ that he dies being hit by bolts again.

I am honored to join you.

Been a Star Wars fan for decades. My passion is The Expanded Universe (Legends), The OT, and The Prequels. While I do enjoy aspects of The ST, and the Disney+ shows, I am not a fan of the retcons and alterations to sacred characters, particularly Master Skywalker.

That being said, I am Warsian through and through.

Kotor I is a classic. Sadly Kotor II I never could get past the first world.