Bingowings

Monroville said:

Darth Venal said:

Mrbenja0618:

Man, why did they kill him off? Would that not been amazing dramatic moment. If Qui-gon left the republic, what would that do to Obi-wan's mind! Dang you, Lucas! Wasted opportunity!

Well, Lucas is lucky he did kill off Qui-Gon, because there is no way Liam Neeson would have come back. He was pretty damn vocal about how much he hated the way Lucas made The Phantom Menace and that's why he declined to appear as Qui-Gon's ghost and we ended up with the Force ghost thing being slipped in so inadequately at the end of Episode III.

Being that this is a radical redux thread and all, would it be conceivable to replace Dooku with Qui Jon?  Qui gets wounded by Maul, and using scenes in TPM and maybe ROB ROY to edit him over Chris Lee's shots.  Again, I know it would be near impossible.... but an idea none the less.

Just thinking about how dramatic it would be to have Obi Wan fighting his old master on the seperatist ship in ROTS and Anakin lopping Qui Jon's head off instead of Dookula's.

Personally I think the nearest we can get to what you are looking for is to try a nudge Dooku into being an extension of Qui-Gon (still a Jedi, still thinking he's doing the right thing to save the galaxy from the Sith but going against the council and the Republic to do it).

The problem with using Neeson's other films to continue the character (beyond the obvious technical problems) is that those roles are very different from Qui-Gon.

There isn't enough for him to do in TPM as it is so trying to make a Frankenstein collage out of footage from other films and getting them to match up is possibly doable for a few Force ghost scenes but to extend it further I can't see it working but I'd love to see someone try it and prove me wrong.

Darth Venal said:

Bingowings,

I also like those seminal groups of people and it's work they produced which inspired me to do what I do now. But we are not those people here, and trust me when I say there is absolutely nothing we can do with our resources that hasn't been done already. Sure, we might make a creative choice that others may have considered and not pursued, but technically speaking, we have no means to be ground breaking.

I tell you what, why don't you humour us and  let's see what happens?

If nothing comes of it, it's just a fun hobby, if something comes from it that's just a little better it's an improvement and if something truly ground  breaking does emerge from the fun I promise (hand on hearts) not to make you eat any form of headwear ;-)

The time for pragmatism is when you have really tried to do something, you can't get it to work and there are other things to do if you are going to hit a deadline.

In a sense there is no deadline here.

Ady will, I'm sure make a great stab at improving ROTJ:SE and that will come out when he is satisfied he has done all that he can do but that's not the end of it for the rest of us.

There will be plenty of our ideas he won't want to do or just can't and maybe a few of his that not everyone will be happy with.

We have something that no Hollywood studio can hope for, all the time in the world.

The perfect Star Wars saga is, pragmatically impossible (you can't make everyone happy) but attempting to get there will lead to a lot more fun and success than not.

There are certain groups of people who get together that manage to do a lot simply because they don't know what they can't do.

One of the reasons why I love the early work of the BBC Radiophonic Workshop is they were stuck in a room with nothing but some pieces of junk, some clapped out tape recorders, a few electronic noise generators not designed for the purposes they put them to and the best bit of kit in the universe, imagination.

Ben Burtt was pretty much the same as were the early ILM guys.

I just spent the tail end of what we laughingly call summer up here watching all the Val Lewton films, they were masterpieces on a shoe string.

Ingenious Frinksta, now all I need is a length of tube that can reach to Australia :D

I used to lurk around the site for many years hoping the DVDs would include the original versions and finding out to my horror that they would not (so it must of been sometime in 2003 when I first read items here, I think it was just the petition and an update???).

Then I discovered the forums read the ta'dos regarding the SE and GOUT DVD sets, kept popping in to read about various fan edits after watching the magnoliafan edits and then I saw the comparison sheet for ANH:R.

The first time I saw the comparison sheet I thought it was a very good photoshop wishlist (like the one doubleofive has compiled for ROTJ) then I read it was an actual alternate version of the film.

I will never half-arsed scan read items like that again (when I finally got to watch it I was blown away).

I rarely register for forums and the like but there was so much creativity going on here I had to do it, death wouldn't stop me from posting here (I hope Jay doesn't).

TV's Frink said:

Darth Venal said:

You can't honestly expect them to show something like a vote from a Senate that big?

Actually that's exactly the kind of thing we have come to expect from Lucas LOL.

 I don't know, in TPM Amidala signing/not signing a treaty seemed to be very important but we never found out why.

Thanks for posting the link to the poster mag. I had a compilation edition (put out around 1984ish I think) which had articles from all three OT films including those in this one, which I also had.

Some things aren't going to happen (probably) but sometimes things happen beyond even the most ambitious expectations (sometimes by accident, sometimes by hard work paying off in unexpected ways).

There's a lot to be said for being unrealistically ambitious, because even failiure can be a useful learning experience.

What will not happen (yet) should be something discovered not something prescribed.

If the linear approach I suggested was employed they wouldn't need help getting to Theed because the Queen is off world when the blockade arrives.

The Jedi are sent to investigate the invasion when Amidala decides to return home to free her people.

While folding my smalls, I started thinking about the Wicket scene (which is redundant and largely removed in SSWR's Video mockup).

I visualised replacing Wicket with some deer like creature which Leia could befriend instead (arrr Bambi defuses arrr Teddy Bears):

It sniffs the air and runs.

The scouts attack Leia, she shoots one and out from the forest arrows shoot the other.

We don't know what happens to her next until we see her in the Ewok village.

Possibly impossible to do but it would have maintained the suspence because Leia would be in the power of unseen warriors who can silently kill Imperials and were watching her being both respectful to forest creatures but also fighting their enemies.

This would lead to the surprise that these warriors are small bear like creatures.

^That's nice and simple.

Some of Angel's ideas have already made it into ESB:R Lord V so while we may never see exactly these changes (well not yet) they serve as pointers towards what may be attempted.

As technology moves on perhaps the now impossible will one day be possible (like removing Harrison Ford's gurning in the scenes SSWR just put up, at them moment that couldn't be tackled even on a frame by frame basis).

^"Good luck, you're gonna need it".

If you could do it, it would be a valuable resource (like the Fettless ROTJ) for people who don't necessarily want to remove him entirely but want to change his character.

It would be interesting to see how and indeed if the film works without him (he has a lot more screen time and interaction with the major characters than Fett does in ROTJ).

Ady wants the first two prequels to be Threepio free.

It looks like by the time we are all through Star Wars will be a series of nice backgrounds with no one in them :-D

More Wicker Droid fun for the budding Matte artists to think about and hopefully improve on (He just keeps on getting bigger), presumably this could be realised as a model. Do you think they burn Stormtroopers alive in this thing (Damn they put Christopher Lee in the wrong Star Wars movie)? :

Hasn't he got one already?

That's why I suggested R2 using his jets (the only time in the OT it makes sense for him to use them therefore validating him having them in the PT)  to push himself and Threepio to a soft landing.

I hate that shot, it's just another bit of forced humor and as you say makes no sense at all.

Vaderisnothayden said:

C3PX said:

miker71 said:

having found a bunch of the Marvel comics, I see what you mean about Marvel having disregard for clone status. I guess the clone army is augmented by regular guys, but is that canon?

 

There wouldn't be much point in augmenting a clone army with regular guys, might as well just make a few more batches. I think the real issue here is that vast numbers of us, myself included, never got the memo on the whole silly clone thing, and for years have been thrown by things like Luke's conversation with Biggs stating that he wasn't going to wait around to be drafted into the Imperial Navy.

No where in the films or any the absolute mass quantity of EU I consumed while growing up did I ever come across anything that suggested to me that Stormtroopers were all clones. On the contrary, things like Luke talking about not wanting to be drafted and comics featuring Stormtroopers without their helmets and in other ways expressing individual personalities have always lead me far far away from ever even considering these guys could merely be clones. I also think it adds more of a hard edge to the Empire if they were all conscripts.

Is the idea of all Stormtoopers being clones actually true 1977 canon? I guess there were things to suggest it in early drafts, but there was a whole freakin' deleted scene from the actual movie to suggest they were conscripts.

The imperial navy being conscripts doesn't necessarily mean the stormtroopers were. Remember, in the OT we saw all these guys on the ships without stormtrooper gear and with revealed faces and they weren't clones. Stormtroopers would be more equivalent to marines or army than actual navy. Stormtroopers being clones appears at least as early as the 4th issue of Star Wars Poster Monthly in 1978.

As for the clone armies being expanded with non-clones, that's what the EU goes by these days.

I had that poster monthly and a couple of others post ROTJ which also refered to the stormies as clones.

Leia's a man!

That's a twist, that puts you removing his underpants in a whole new light.

I can swear that I can hear one of the Ewoks saying of Threepio "He's a woman" too.

"No it's not like that at all, I'm his brother and Threepio is his sister."

Only pulling your leg.

Going back to the grrrrrrreat cowl makeover, I really wish Mark got to wear that thing (or at least a spare) from Endor onwards instead of that pointless tatty camo poncho and helmet.

It gave him gravitas while the Rebel helmet thing made Luke and Leia look like bottles of shampoo (Han doesn't wear one but then he doesn't go speeder biking, those Jedi kids obviously knew they were going to steal bikes before they got there through the Force).

Imagine how he would have looked showing up before the Emperor in pretty much the same outfit.

Luke the Jedi at last.

Trooperman said:

Regarding the stereotype issue, one of my favorite parts of the original trilogy and other great movies is they're not overly concerned with being politically correct.  I think the voice is great.

Leia is hardly the usual damsel in distress (even in her metal bra) and the aliens in the OT aren't ethnic stereotypes of Earthly humans (with the possible exeption of Yoda who is basically every elderly martial arts master in character even if his voice is more Grover than Master Po).

The PT didn't just ignore PC it practically waved two CGI fingers up at it.

The female characters are there to either get captured or killed, aliens are either childish cartoons or something out of the a Bernard Manning routine and Threepio isn't just questionably fussy but as camp as Christmas.

Just because it's a vent in the original footage doesn't mean it can't be a light source now (I think it improves things greatly) as does adding weight to Luke's cowl.

Nice to see Threepio with his full headlamps on too (were they trying to save on electricity with him or something in Jedi his eyes are either really dim or orange).

I wish something could be done to make Vader less glossy when he arrives at the Death Star at the beginning (it doesn't match the rest of the footage in this film or the general look in the others).

Does anyone have any large images of the Ewok village? I can't seem to find any.

If anyone wants to play with the silhouette here, have a go for yourself :

Quick sketch of the larger totem version :

Great stuff SSWR (nice to see my wee Ewok god turn up) I shall have a look at making a larger scale variation for the way you have used it (the one I designed was meant to be like an indoor shrine version rather than an outdoor totem). I will try and scale the idea up (more Wickerman than Greenman).

The dialogue from the radio version works very well indeed, it would be nice if we could remove the comical lilt in the incidental music, what comedy there is doesn't need to be enhanced with music and it removes any feeling of threat (the scene should be both worrying in a general view but amusing in relation to their reaction to Threepio). The Wizard Of Oz inspired chanting could be tinkered with to make it sound a little bit more sophisticated (distorted Tibetan chanting springs to mind).

I don't mind them disobeying Threepio, it would make sense that they should test him.

I would like to see some attempt to get Artoo to project frightening images over Threepio, it still seems odd that they are scared of him floating when they have seen things like Speeder Bikes and Metal moons.

Luke could just call out to Artoo and he improvises.

The Ewoks really need work done on their eyes too but it really is amazing work.

Pity we can't fix Harrison's gurning (can we?).

Darth Lars, I agree, if it is possible to unify the look of all the saber props it should be done.