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28-Sep-2006
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24-Dec-2013
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Post
#261471
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/261471/action/topic#261471
Time
I didn't know would follow my composite III/IV idea at all. Anywho, if it could happen, then how about this:

Have the amnesia kiss out of II, but use it in the end of III. That way it could tie in into SR.

Of course there's the Fortress thing in IV. I suggest its cut completely. That, and the Smallville scenes (these because of SR).

What do you say? Won't that allow II to happen less controversialy?

Its an idea, anyway...
Post
#261249
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/261249/action/topic#261249
Time
Actually, it wouldn't be such a bad idea. The nuclear dissarmament plot could be fused with Superman vs. Superman and other details could fall into place. It just needs a little open mind, thats all.

Originally posted by: booah
Originally posted by: The Bizzle
Again, if you think that, then why are you inserting yourself into a discussion where people are trying to figure out how to tie them together even CLOSER? . . . "It's done. It's on DVD. Good night."
It's not that hard, man.


"Inserting myself"? I started this thread, in case you hadn't noticed. The discussion of SR is a separate discussion from the original topic, which is about a Superman II edit combining Lester and Donner. Nothing to do with Returns or tying it in. Working with III and IV also, yes, but not Returns. So who's the one wasting "thousands of words"? It went from a suggestion to something of the utmost importance. For the purposes of making the best Superman II edit, Returns is an afterthought.

"It's done" refers to the fact that Returns is done. This isn't about making a Returns edit (although there should be more discussion about improving that flawed sum'bitch... Superman ReReturns?). Returns *already* ties into the previous movies, so again-- why is its tying in to an unrelated fan edit so important, when it's not the point? Don't get pissed at me because of a tangent, man.

It's not that hard, man.

I guess I should've specified this as a "CHRISTOPHER REEVE SUPERMAN EDIT" thread.

I don't get you. One scene thats actually well played, to be left in to allow another sequel to follow afterwards, constitutes for SINGER/.SR RE-EDIT? Come on. Its one lousy scene that enables the proposed definitive ending for Superman II to sit well with STM, while also allowing us, viewers, believe that theit story continues on... And it does, with SR. So the necessity of it isn't in question. Its about its compability with what exists out there. Frankly, you're annihilating fans this way.

Anyway, to each their own... BTW, I'm in favor of Courage's idea. Perhaps branching is the best thing. Next to that is three re-edits, that the same definitive cut with three different ending. A three disk set, ideally. What do you think of that?
Post
#261138
Topic
Ideas: James Bond re-edit suggestions...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/261138/action/topic#261138
Time
Thing is, ADM, I live in Region 2. That automatically prevents me from having CR tape, since its Region 1 and NTSC. I have PAL and VHS in my region.

Thats why I persistently ask about it. Anywho, I would still like an opinion on how that entry could be re-edited. Meaning, the opinion of somehow who actually saw it. I can only speculate.

And coconuts..... Thats a really interesting take. I never thought of it that way. You gave OHMSS a whole new spin. The suggestions you made could very well do the trick for the film to be re-edited as a prequel to Dalton/Brosnan... Problem is, as you said, it might evoke too much of a 60's feel, but that can be solved, I believe.

I guess we could think of that... But what do the others say about it?

Well?
Post
#260912
Topic
Ideas: James Bond re-edit suggestions...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260912/action/topic#260912
Time
Originally posted by: FanFiltration
Cut "California Girls" out of "A View to a Kill" or replace it with Barry score with some new gun shots...
In fact, just let's forget this film... ;}

I see... That bad?

But still, there must be SOME way of rectifying it... I'm positive of that.

Anyone else who has seen the film that can tell?

And coconuts.... I don't know. Tinkering with a classic? How do you suppose it is re-edited into a Dalton-Brosnan prequel? I mean, isn't it too old, so to speak?

I don't say I'm not open to the idea. Although I would still have prefered a Dalton-Brosnan film re-modfied.

Well?
Post
#260773
Topic
Ideas: James Bond re-edit suggestions...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260773/action/topic#260773
Time
I bump this up to ask about CR. Anyone know how can I find the FULL version of CR 54?

And a question to those who have seen it: I want to re-edit this as a prequel (still in B&W, to evoke the sense of an old tale) to DR. NO. Am I foolish to think of that? I mean, can it be done or not? Aside from add-liping the "Card-Sense Jimmy Bond" and any CIA references and all.

Well?

Also, what do you all think of the idea of taking an irrelevant Brosnan or Dalton, spy-related, movie, and turn it into a prequel to TLD, LTK, GE, TND, TWINE and DAD? I only want to seperate the film from the Connery-Moore entries, since with the new CR and all, I like to believe that the Daltona and Brosnan entries are a seperate universe to the Connery/Moore (Moore can still, somewhat, convince me he's the same Bond with Connery), with OHMSS a common link to both - it happened in both universes, that is.

Well, what do you think?
Post
#260740
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260740/action/topic#260740
Time
Originally posted by: Jobel
I've actually just spent the last two nights creating my own cut of II. Which is now completed and authored. I did it purely for my own pleasure to create a cut that I could consider to be canonical. Which means the Paris scene back in, and the magic kiss at the end. Most of the middle of the film is the Donner cut, Brando back in and York out. all the extra Luthor stuff included. But with the addition of extra Niagra scenes, including the original clark to superman reveal. All the action sequences are Donner cut, which means stupid lester humour is gone. So what I have now is a more serious, but hopefully more complete viewing experience of the film. It's got the Donner opening titles and the Lester End titles, just to balnce it out. PAL running time is 2 hours and 6 minutes.

NONE has commented on this!

Great job, Jobel. Say, what do you think of that film now? Do you feel its better in some way? Will you make it available?
Post
#260739
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260739/action/topic#260739
Time
Again and again, I think the amnesia kiss should stay. And the Diner.

And as for a trilogy, I suggested on taking the bests parts of SUPERMAN III, and insert it into SUPERMAN IV -which would have scenes cut out, obviously- and create a new SUPERMAN III, that is actually continuing SUPERMAN II's story instead of sequeling it.

Maybe if a fan cut of SUPERMAN II ended like you said, with Lois knowing, and then the SUPERMAN III I mentioned ended with the amnesia kiss, and the whole film somehow worked around the plot so that Lois and Clark know each, then I'm in!
Post
#260594
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260594/action/topic#260594
Time
The spinning around the world in SII WON'T tie it with SR. No sir, no.

Not in any stretch of the imagination. Its also far too complicated a concept. So please, keep the kiss scene. May be insipid, but makes more "sense" when considering tieing to SR.

Booah, the kiss is just ONE scene, THE one scene that would allow SII to tie with SR well. I am not asking the film to be modified to SR, no sir no. But the inclusion of that scene would allow SR to happen, seamlessly.
Post
#260420
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260420/action/topic#260420
Time
And one other thing.

Originally posted by: booah

The kiss has been there for YEARS now, one fourth of a century

That is the lamest argument I've ever heard.


Thank you for that. Now, let me explain very simply: The amnesia kiss scene has been SII's ending for 25 years, and Singer admitedly and figuretively followed from there. The spinning-the-world-around, time travel ending, has been STM's ending for more than that. I guess what I'm trying to say is that, while not that great a resolution (satisfying to a certain degree, but not too much), is far more validated than using the same ending from STM all over again. I mean, I understand the decision behind the choice - Donner didn't even get for the re-edit, why should he consider a new ending for the film. That decision might've led him to other decisions, which as he admited, could've resulted to an entirely differently edited SII. Thats why Michael Thau was most of the time in charge and Donner was the YES or OK man. I understand that if Donner had some sort of chance to really create a better ending for his SII, he'd had done it. But he didn't, and the reasons we know led him to do the time-reversal thing. Which absolutely restricts it from being SR's prequel.

OK?
Post
#260419
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260419/action/topic#260419
Time
I just don't think it'd be too bad to leave it in. Besides, I think we're talking about a definitive Superman II, are we not?

Just the kiss allows for SR to happen. Just that. No other change is needed. Its not like you said with the prequel/OT trilogy analogy at all. One scene allows for SR to happen with no real probs, and the rest is the new monster, derived from Donner/Lester.

I still think that the new edit should Donner's Cut, enhanced with the better Lester scenes. I really want to hear which movie should the basis for the re-edit, Lester or Donner's?

Commander Courage's and mine are Lester. I suppose booah says so too (BTW, I kind of agree with the Lara idea of yours, but will need more convicing).

MORE importantly... IF anything is decided, do we have editors lined up for something like that? I'm curious...
Post
#260377
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260377/action/topic#260377
Time
For me, the ideal SII is the Donner cut without the time reversal and with the amnesia kiss in. That way I can enjoy it for what it is and still watch SR afterwards, knowing that it continues SII's story. Which is ideal, as it allows me to believe that these entries still count.

On the other hand, that is a good question: Should it follow Donner Cut's "previously on STM" thing, with the bad guys being released by Luthor's missile, or should the Eiffel Tower scene be restored alltogether? I'm curious...
Post
#260360
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/260360/action/topic#260360
Time
I dunno, I pretty much agree with Commander Courage. Thing is, I believe he's right about the time-reversal thing - the Lester kiss would only erase Lois' memory of her being with Superman. And who Superman is, of course.

A whole fuss is made about not making certain choices that will allow STM, SII and SR to sit better with themselves. I believe that leaving the Lester kiss scene in, no matter how corny it might be, is the only way to allow SR happen as it did. The time travel might be a good device, but its TOO DAMN CONFUSING at that. And its a repeat from I, so...
Post
#259876
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/259876/action/topic#259876
Time
Exactly!
Originally posted by: booah
Salvaging the Kent/Superman fight from Supes III is key, because that is one of the few salvagable scenes of that flick. Without having watched the deleted IV stuff, I think that's an underrated movie. Flawed (the Nuclear Man stuff is laughable), but underrated, and still possessing the spirit and heart of the Reeve films. If combined with III, it could work as part 3 of a "Reeve Trilogy."

Originally posted by: Batman Beyond
I mean, SR is clearly a sequel to those two films (any cut).

Uh, no it's not. It's far from a "sequel." It may be "inspired by", and "stolen from", but it's more of a remake/companion than anything. Aside from saying he was gone for x amount of years, it doesn't continue the stories of I and II, it just replicates elements from them and sets it in present day. It rehashes some origin story from I, and recycles the "man vs. superman" theme of II. It's all been done. It could've been more inspired by the old flicks without just redoing a lot of it.

Originally posted by: Commander Courage
You make valid arguments against Superman Returns, but at the end of the day I still think we got a quality movie. Singer being such a Donner fan is a wonderful thing, although I'll admit he takes things a bit overboard at times. When promoting the sequel as "Wrath of Khan"-esque I can only hope he doesn't plan on using Zod yet again. That definitely would be crossing the line. So yes, more orginality on Singer and his writers' parts is in order, but I think SR accomplished what it set out to do: update the Reeve Superman franchise and bring it into modern times. Now that's been done, and I don't see why SR2 can't be one of the best Superhero films of all time.


Yeah, it was decent enough overall, and not embarassing (like Batman & Robin or something). It just left a lot to be desired. I hope Singer does go more all-out with story in a follow-up. It has the potential to be great stuff.

Thanks for supporting my SUPERMAN III idea.

My main idea is, as SUPERMAN II: THE DONNER CUT follows immediately from SUPERMAN THE MOVIE, a re-edited SUPERMAN IV (because, like you said, IV had the heart of the first Supes movie, still) could follow from II almost immediately. If handled professionaly, IV could be the continuance of the story told in I and II. Not just a sequel re-modified. But a movie modified to be a continuance.

Superman's stance towards nuclear weapons and all could very well follow his need to help the people he recklessly abandoned when he was with Lois. His guilt over not protecting them could be the main motive of doing what he does in the story. That angle can play in the film.

One idea for an opening is, have a recap of the previous movie -not STM, just Donner's Cut-, and have then Superman deliver the american flag to the white house and him saying "I won't let you down again" or something (its been awhile, sorry for not remembering), then the new titles. The thing is, this line could be the prelude to what Superman promises to do and what the re-edited story can hold on to. I have other ideas, too. Want to expand them? Please tell, cause if you're not interested, I won't delve into it much more.

Now, on SUPERMAN II....I'm in favor of a re-edit that follows the Donner Cut, but with Lester elements thrown here and there. Except for the Eiffer Tower sequence, which I think could work for a modified SUPERMAN IV-III, the rest of the film could use some good, mind GOOD, scenes from the Lester cut. So yeah, I'm in favor of that.

As for the ending, either the amnesia kiss re-instated -it HAS been the film's official ending for over 25 years, whatever way you look at it- or nothing at all. But definetely no spinning the world around again. That seemed just out of place in the movie. Plus, the bully scene doesn't work nearly as well with the spinning around.

However, if the amnesia kiss is left out of II, it should be re-instated in my aformentioned SUPERMAN IV-III. That way, it can always lead to SUPERMAN RETURNS, nicely.

I stand by my opinion that, if any re-edit doesn't even try to help SR be aknowledged, why bother? Singer himself was in a tight spot, because he didn't know if he was going to follow Lester's cut, or Donner's cut. He used Brando, but by the time he did, Donner's cut was already commisioned. So Singer worked the story around to be as loose as possible, to allow both II's to have happened, somehow. Really, if the Donner cut had happened before or at the early production of SR, Singer would've been more clear about how it follows the previous Reeve flicks.

And I like SR, by the way. I found it wonderful. But STM and the Donner Cut of SII are better. 'Nuff said.
Post
#259552
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/259552/action/topic#259552
Time
I think an ultimate SUPERMAN II should allow to tie itself with SUPERMAN RETURNS... Otherwise, why bother? I mean, SR is clearly a sequel to those two films (any cut). Why not enhance its viewing. And it doesn't require much, really -either just cut the spinning around and leave the rest of the story intact, or insert the amnesia kiss.

Bizarrely, I prefer it over the spinning around the world again. That doesn't say much. But its more plausible considering SR.

ADM, what do you think of my idea? Or taking taking the Eiffel Towe sequence, the Evil Supes moments/scenes from SIII and the entire SIV (WITH the deleted scenes) and recreate it as a whole new movie? My idea for it, is that it could serve as a continuance to SII itself, furthering the story of SII and STM. If re-edited smartly, we could get a trilogy out of Reeve's films, using all Superman films available. Imagine... CHRISTOPHER REEVE - THE SUPERMAN TRILOGY.

What do you think?
Post
#259396
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/259396/action/topic#259396
Time
Originally posted by: Commander Courage
What makes the time-travel bit just bearable in I is that it works emotionally, if not logically. Lois is DEAD, and an enraged, grieving Superman draws on some primal reservoir of superpower we're not sure he knew he had.

Yes. Exactly. You are so caught up in the moment and invested in Superman's emotions that the old reliable deus ex machina doesn't bother you at all. To COPY AND PASTE this into Donner's II, negating the ENTIRE FILM, is just plain silly. In I, it was a matter of minutes. In II, it's a number of days!

And even if you don't take S:TM and SR into consideration, the time reversal is a plothole because of the Diner. In Lester's II, the bully beats up Clark, who returns at the end to teach him a lesson. "Oh, I've been...working out." Great moment. But in Donner's II, no one should know who Clark is, as those events never happened.

Batman Beyond: It would be interesting to see what could be cobbled together from the remaining movies in an effort to make a totally new one. For now though I think our efforts should be focused on getting Superman II right, something the professional editors couldn't seem to do.

Thanks for your kind words. I made this suggestion again in the past, but no one commented.

I believe that, for a definitive SUPERMAN II, the Donner Cut should be the basis - the Lester cut's Eiffel tower sub-plot shouldn't be used, and for reasons that I have explained (to combine with III and IV for a new film alltogether) above. So, maybe enhance Donner's cut with Lester material - like the deleted scene where Ursa kills that little boy. And generally, elements that should have been in the final cut.

In the end, I'd prefer to watch the Donner cut, with Lester elements here and there, and Lester's ending (amnesia kiss), so that it can at least sit well with SR itself.

What do you say?
Post
#259294
Topic
Ideas: James Bond re-edit suggestions...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/259294/action/topic#259294
Time
Yeah, that'd be great... But it'd take a hell amount of time, and I know I couldn't do that.

How can anyone do a movie out of a video game? I know a recent video-game-re-edited-into-movie happened recently, but that was a painful procedure, wasn't it?

Also, about TAILOR... I believe TAILOR could be turned into a prequel... Don't know how, but I think its possible. I think if re-worked properly, it could re-present a ruthless Bond the way CR did, but in a different way... A Bond that uses other people's imagination to do his job.

Anyone who has seen the film that can actually contribute any ideas as to how this (the prequeling of the Dalton-Brosnan entries via TAILOR OF PANAMA) can be done?
Post
#259256
Topic
Info: Superman II Donner, and III & IV extended edits
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/259256/action/topic#259256
Time
I think that Jor El has surivived in some crystlas, as seen in SUPERMAN RETURNS, but not in an interactive way. Not the kind that saved him in the Donner Cut, at least. Anyway, apart from not wanting to see the Fortress destroyed in ANY fan-edit, I would be in favor of a fan edit that combined the two. Provided of course, the main movie remains the Donner Cut.

Because I think there is material in Lester Cut and Superman III and IV, to make one wholly different picture. What if we somehow used the Eiffel tower scenes of SUPERMAN II, and the Evil Superman scenes form SUPERMAN III, along with the rescue of that power plant in SUPERMAN III (you know, where Jimmy Olsen gets hurt - I haven't seen the movie for quite a while, sorry), and integrated them into a new SUPERMAN IV, on which we would also use the film's deleted scenes. My intent here, is to create the ultimate SUPERMAN III, which could partially, in SR retrospect, explain his leaving. Wouldn't it be great to use the above elements and create one better film? I mean, SUPERMAN IV would need work on its own - CGI to improved some of the film's devastating SFX, and some clever storyline to combine them all.

Anyway, what do you think of this admitedly crazy idea?

Well?
Post
#258108
Topic
Ideas: James Bond re-edit suggestions...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/258108/action/topic#258108
Time
Thanks. Thing is, with CR being a clear restart, I thought we (I mean as a community of Bond fans associated with the re-editing process) could deviate the Connery-Moore Bonds from the Dalton-Brosnan Bonds by adding films that bookend either.

In the Connery-Moore Bond, I thought we could use the black and white CR, re-edit it so that Bond is more Bond (apparently he's american and all), and sort of have as a prequel to DR. NO, like a large pre-title sequence to DR. NO in essence - an introduction to Bond before Bond. And NSNA, which as a re-edit already exists - I could always put a link to the site from where I got it.

And for Dalton-Brosnan... I had this crazy idea that TAILOR OF PANAMA could've been done as a prequel, using the pre-title sequence of CR and mixing it with DAD's scene where Bond is seated with a gun to Colonel Moon. That could be a sort of introduction to his gunbarel, too, and an essential way to re-introduce Bond for a new continuity as he's to become 00. And Panama could be his first assignment, from which he obtains, by the end of the film, his 007 code. Some scenes would surely have to be trimmed like some rather explicit examples of Brosnan's sexual tastes in the film. I have to rewatch it to determine how we can work something out.

I am actually, rather surprised that not anyone, so far, has come to say "Look, we have what we have, we don't want these re-edits, we don't need them, Brosnan sucks" and so on and so on. I was afraid I'd be gunned down by the minute.

Then again, I still might...
Post
#257960
Topic
Ideas: James Bond re-edit suggestions...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/257960/action/topic#257960
Time
No, in 1954, I think, there was a black and white version of CR where Barry Nelson played James Bond for the first time... Except, it was Jimmy Bond and it was, I think, not sure, the CIA he worked for. Here's more information http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0310853/

Does anyone know where can I obtain this film? I understand it may not be that good, but it'd still be nice to have, you know...