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Stardust1138

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18-Mar-2018
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18-Apr-2022
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Post
#1475947
Topic
What do you think of The Prequel Trilogy? A general discussion.
Time

BedeHistory731 said:

There really isn’t anything that separates this franchise from things like Star Trek or Harry Potter beyond window dressing. If anything, this franchise made the franchise model a more commonplace thing to the detriment of cinema.

As Patrick H. Willems said, these are just family movies about space wizards. It’s not that deep.

It’s all in how you look at it or want to see Star Wars I find in the case of George’s films. It can work as he describes but it can equally work as so much more than that but not everyone wants to go in that deep as the Disney era films gleefully demonstrate. They want to enjoy it for the surface level thrills. There’s nothing inherently bad about that but George himself has spoken about all of these things I talk about. It’s just it goes right pass the majority of the audience. There’s nothing inherently bad about that either but there’s a lot there if you know where to look. This is why I’m a strong firm believer in artistic expression and visual literacy. There’s examples of things Patrick misses in Star Wars like the way shots are constructed and are actually in fact within George’s six films because of where his focus is with watching them. There’s nothing wrong with that per say but I think with any great work of art you should be able to broaden the way you see it and understand the author’s intentions. It may not be to your personal tastes but that doesn’t mean there can’t be more going on.

Post
#1475933
Topic
What do you think of The Prequel Trilogy? A general discussion.
Time

BedeHistory731 said:

The ROTJ parallel is definitely noticable in the finale, but with the ground combat split in two (human action scenes and the Gungan battle). That’s enough of a difference for me to write off an entirely intentional mirroring of the third acts.

That’s the whole point of what ring composition is. The mirroring and parallels must be different to work as visual poetry just like written prose or musical prose as Richard Wagner developed using the same techniques.

The Gungans and Ewoks are meant to parallel each other but be different.

Padme, Panaka, and the Naboo soliders taking back Theed Palace is meant to parallel Han, Leia, and the Rebel soldiers entering the shield generator bunker but be different.

The space battles and lightsaber fights are meant to echo Return of the Jedi but also A New Hope and Revenge of the Sith. This is “rings within rings”.

It’s about playing with different techniques and refreshing the idea to create something new to juxtaposition off of one another. Repeating isn’t poetry and tends to be what you find in the Sequel Trilogy.

Post
#1475884
Topic
The Kenobi <s>Movie</s> Show (Spoilers)
Time

Emre1601 said:

I would say Rogue One is an exception to this, maybe Solo too in the characterisation of Han.

I completely agree. Rogue One is definitely the exception. I remember reading one of the writers of Rogue One said when they presented the story to Alan Horn and told him all the characters died he only agreed because he saw they weren’t in A New Hope. They’re not smart enough to realise that if they work together like they did on Rogue One that we could get some very good Star Wars stories as they’re able to present things to Disney as a collective group instead of chaos of so many voices wanting a different say of what things should be. They may never capture exactly George’s spirit but they’d continue his legacy in a meaningful way that respects it instead of shying away from it. There’s a reason Rogue One, the first season of Mandalorian, and Rebels tend to be the best received Disney era content. I suppose you could add Solo. I don’t personally like it that much but many seem to find it to be an underrated gem but it’s inevitable with someone other than George making the stories I may feel disconnected from some of it as others would with Rogue One. You can’t argue though it isn’t the most consistent in tone and what its aiming to be. It wouldn’t be from a lack of trying. I’ve not watched Visions yet or Mandalorian for that matter but from what I’ve glimpsed I can see they try what you say. Star Wars is at its best received when it understands context but is different from anything it has been before.

Post
#1475876
Topic
The Kenobi <s>Movie</s> Show (Spoilers)
Time

These stories have always been for kids but their beliefs they have continues to baffle me. They don’t understand context but only understand Star Wars on a very superficial level. There’s dark aspects to George’s stories but they’re told in a way that is more often than not light and hopeful. They however don’t shy away from addressing darker and more mature issues where needed. They’re ulimately told in a tone that is accessible to children but they don’t dumb themselves down for them. Disney Star Wars and a lot of storytellers have forgotten this. You don’t need your characters to be perfect to teach kids. It’s okay for them to know you’ll fail sometimes. Teaching them characters are perfect creates unnecessary expectations like that of rom-coms when it comes to love.

I want to be optimistic about the show and enjoy it for what it is but I’m very nervous it will continue the trend of what Star Wars has become.

Post
#1475855
Topic
What do you think of The Prequel Trilogy? A general discussion.
Time

thebluefrog said:

I once read a long theory that Lucas deliberately made PM mirror ROTJ; that may be giving him too much credit, but who knows?

It’s true but even deeper than that. I recommend watching Rick Worley’s videos on the Prequels and even the channel - So Uncivilized. Both cover the films in a great amount of detail. The two trilogies are meant to mirror and interrelate to one another. I think sometimes some refuse to acknowledge just how much because they don’t think George could ever think up something so profoundly deep as he made what they perceive as the the downfall in Jar Jar and had dialogue/acting that was unforgivable. Let’s not forget the Original Trilogy had goofy humour and the dialogue has always been done in the old fashion style with old style acting before method acting became the common place. It’s funny how even Harrison Ford thought the dialogue worked but his famous quote is misquoted so often. George prefers the old style of making films as he doesn’t like contemporary style films.

Sometimes I find people watch these films from the lenses of what they want them to be instead of just viewing things for what they are. I’m fortunate I think looking back to seeing The Phantom Menace first then the Original Trilogy and so forth. I didn’t have years to think up how everything must go down. I think the same can be said for fans who grew up with the Originals on a similar level. They had time to form in their head what happened and grew up in a different yet similar time. Then when it came to the Sequels we ended up with they more often work for them because expectations were super low and they’re made in a style similar to what you feel personally is Star Wars that you perceive George Lucas got away from in his Prequels. This isn’t a bad thing as it’s subjective in some ways but I’d argue George never changed as much as it’s claimed by most.

I’d also recommend this video:

https://youtu.be/gUKvHwjcfIQ

Post
#1475818
Topic
What do you think of The Prequel Trilogy? A general discussion.
Time

It’s no secret I love the Prequels and embrace George’s interpretation of the story. I know though it works differently for everyone. Especially on here. I think sometimes I find the problem some have is seeing them as the second trilogy instead of as the first trilogy as he intended. It’s not a criticism against anyone personally as I know it’s subjective but an observation I’ve noticed as there’s often a lot of disconnect I find in certain perceived plot holes that aren’t actual plot holes versus what actually is one. There are some things that I think can be considered plot holes depending on if you expect to see them like Obi-Wan serving Bail Organa in The Clone Wars but other things like why the Trade Federation is still part of the Senate after The Phantom Menace is explained by Sio Bibble in Attack of the Clones. As for seeing Obi-Wan and Bail, I don’t really expect to as I understand the story of the films shows us the beginning and ending of the war. It leaves you to your imagination or The Clone Wars series to fill in more details but for me personally it’s an added bonus of more Star Wars from an era I love. It’s not a means of fixing things. I know it’s a little thing re: plot holes and it’s understandable with how densely detailed the films are that plots could be overlooked but certain things are in the films that many complain about not being there. Not to mention there’s things that were in the Originals first but aren’t as focused on as heavily as they are in the Prequels. I think that’s one major reason I love them though. There’s so much going on underneath and above the surface. It makes rewatching the films very rewarding as you catch more and more each viewing. They’re not perfect but neither are the films in the Original Trilogy. Each of George’s six films have their share of issues but they all come directly from his creative vision and this is for better or worse depending on who you ask. For me it’s for the better as the films are highly entertaining and teaching you something bigger than yourself if you know where to look.

My problems with the Sequels stem from its inability to understand the context of the films as George sees them. This isn’t bad for those who enjoy everything regardless or who dislike the bigger picture approach of him embracing contextualising the first six films as a collective whole about the tragedy of Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader but when you’re like me it creates the feeling of they’re running away from the story being told in favour of being an “antidote” to what some people disliked about the Prequels. The other and probably bigger issue for me is they don’t understand George’s philosophy and worldview but I suppose that’s inevitable with different creatives and a corporation at work making the stories now. It’s just unfortunate the story got lost in the shuffle in trying to continue off of one trilogy instead of two trilogies.

I do appreciate The Last Jedi on its own merits most of the time. It’s one of those films that I don’t think I’ll ever have a firm and definitive opinion on but maybe that’s not a bad thing. Sometimes films can be messy and unpredictable but so is life. It’s not my Star Wars. I can’t say much for the other two films in the trilogy except they feel like what happens when Hollywood makes Star Wars. They’re nostalgia pandering in the case of one and mindless fun with nostalgia in the other.

However like the majority of the Disney era content out there they’re ultimately somebody’s Star Wars just not mine.

Post
#1475741
Topic
What do you think of the <strong>Sequel Trilogy</strong>? - a general discussion thread
Time

theprequelsrule said:

I have a theory (just a theory), that is probably going to generate some controversy…Star Wars is a conservative film. It is very much a modern Western. George Lucas was not some pot smoking hippie. Coming at the source material from a liberal progressive angle has created the bizarre content we see under Disney. Even when it is made well…it just seems off.

RogueLeader said:

George has been described as a more “conservative” guy, but not in the political or ideological sense. The Rebels in Star Wars were the Viet Cong, and the Empire and the Emperor were the United States and Nixon. George has said this.

For the prequels, there is literally a quote out there where he says Bush is Vader and Cheney is the Emperor. Even Anakin’s line, “If you’re not with me, then you’re my enemy” is a paraphrase of Bush’s, “If you’re not with us, you’re with the terrorists”.

I do think that the original Star Wars film was vague enough for the message to feel like it could apply to anyone. A liberal or conservative could watch Star Wars and see themselves as the Rebel underdogs. Although I’m not really sure what could be seen as explicitly “liberal progressive” that the internet or media hasn’t primed people to identify as such.

George is “conservative” in the sense he values tradition and the romanticism of civility. He has said he finds contemporary storytelling boring. He prefers to teach through action of characters and visual literacy versus more of a narrative literacy preacher as you see more often these days. He also values doing things as cost effective as possible. He learned this skill from his father who was very conservative but fair. George is more “liberal” in terms of his political views and wanting a fair and equal society. He values the underdog. He’s a complex individual as all the really great creatives are.

The key difference between George’s films and Disney’s films when it comes to ideology is the people and what they do with their power. With the Disney era it’s mostly portrayed with the exception of Rogue One that good guys are good and bad guys are bad. It’s used more in a symbolism type of way like DJ. He’s a symbol. This compared to George who let the viewer draw their own conclusions with subtly. You see it with say Dooku who is a living and breathing character with ideologies and views but has a history with Qui-Gon and Jedi to go along with leading the Separatist Movement. He also has a place within the story as a foil to Anakin and to foreshadow what he will become. With DJ he’s just there to tell us the Resistance and First Order are good and bad. We don’t actually see or understand the conflict they’re going through except on superficial levels. We hear about how the Republic needs to be restored but we have no reason to understand why it’s needed. We merely understand it on some level in The Force Awakens due to its over familiarity with A New Hope. It’s all about context that is lost and how ideology is portrayed as good and bad in the Disney films with no middle ground.

The best example of this within George’s story is comparing the Rebel Alliance on Hoth and Geonosisians on Geonosis. Both are rebels but with different intentions and beliefs. One is separating from the Republic, the other is trying to bring it back. Both are trying to escape the capture of the Republic and Empire but the implications of what will happen to both if caught is completely different. They’re similar from each other but different.

The Prequels and Originals are meant to mirror and juxtaposition one another. You don’t get this with the Sequels as it’s trying to be familiar to the Originals without understanding context. The next logical move is exactly what George planned with a power vacuum created by the end of the Empire and Hutts. Space pirates and others would try to exploit the Republic from securing itself again. There’s no logic or reason within universe to understand how the First Order secured funds and amassed a massive fleet without massive exposition. They avoided it anyways and went for what was easy.

RogueLeader said:

I definitely agree with you though, prequelsrule, about how it would’ve been nice to have seen Luke with a thriving (or at least some students) Jedi order.

I also agree, that if they jump ahead beyond the sequel trilogy, there will just be a Jedi order and it won’t matter who started it per se. I feel Luke will be seen as the founder of the New Jedi Order, and Rey will be seen as his successor who continued it after him.

This is exactly what George planned to do. There would be 50 to 100 survivors of Order 66 and over the course of the trilogy he would rebuild the Jedi Order then pass on in Episode IX. I assume in this scenario the Solowalker granddaughter would become the Grand Jedi Master bestowed onto her by Luke after defeating Darth Maul and Darth Talon. Luke would have his material victory and Leia would too for that matter as she’s elected Supreme Chancellor to echo Padme giving away democracy in The Phantom Menace.

Everything came full circle within George’s story instead of ending with putting us in the same story position in a matter of speaking as Return of the Jedi.

Post
#1475705
Topic
Last movie seen
Time

Almost Famous by Cameron Crowe.

My friend recommended it to me while she watched Star Wars for the first time! It’s hard to fully gadge how I feel about it on first impressions but overall I think I really liked it. There’s a lot of subtle nuances and character development. I could only find the director’s cut to watch and I think that let some aspects drag on a little too long for a first viewing. I would’ve appreciated the extended length more I think seeing it for the second time. However saying that I think I love how each character was portrayed as neither good or bad. It showed how we all have flaws and make mistakes along the way. It really is a love letter to the early 70’s and rock and roll. All and all it’s pretty fun and layered. It feels in a way like my initial thoughts with The Last Jedi. It’s perplexing to know entirely what to think and feel but it’s not bad by any stretch. There’s a lot to appreciate and admire but it will take rewatches to contextualise thoughts.

Hal 9000 said:

The Seventh Seal is one of the most moving cinematic experiences of my life.

Mine too. Ingmar Bergman is one of my favourite filmmakers. What are your favourite films by him?

Post
#1475616
Topic
Screening of Original 70mm Print of STAR WARS at The Academy Museum of Motion Pictures
Time

Tobar said:

Just caught wind of this screening to be held on May 31st. Here are the details:

George Lucas’s homage to the pulpy tradition of Buck Rogers and Flash Gordon changed the face of cinema and revolutionized visual effects. Combining classic techniques such as matte paintings and miniatures with the then-new technology of motion control photography, Star Wars imagined worlds, machines, and creatures that remain cinematic touchstones. A Best Picture nominee, the record-breaking hit won six Oscars including Visual Effects, as well as received a Special Achievement Award for Ben Burtt’s imaginative sound creations.

DIRECTOR: George Lucas. WRITTEN BY: George Lucas. CAST: Mark Hamill, Harrison Ford, Carrie Fisher, Alec Guinness. 1977. 119 min. USA. Color. Scope. English. 70mm. Print courtesy of Academy Film Archive. Special thanks to Disney Media and Entertainment Distribution and Lucasfilm.

Very surprising to see LFL allow a print screening. Is there anyone in the area that will try to attend?

This also happened a couple of years ago alongside a showing of Rogue One. They were given permission directly from George that time. I wouldn’t be surprised if they got his blessing to show it in limited releases. It seems to be the same print.

https://comicbook.com/starwars/news/star-wars-special-edition-original-screening-70mm-rare-lucasfilm/

Post
#1475526
Topic
Should Palpatine have been the one to say “To be angry is to be human”?
Time

StarkillerAG said:

I guess the line about anger does have some value, but I still think it’s weird that Padme is so understanding after Anakin just went on a borderline psychopathic rant about slaughtering an entire village. It feels really out-of-character, especially given how shocked Padme is that Anakin did the exact same thing to the Jedi temple in ROTS.

Keep in mind Padme also only knows the Tusken Raiders as “walk like men, but they’re vicious, mindless monsters” according to Cliegg Lars. She has no reason to doubt him and that the Lars aren’t good people. Anakin himself tells her that before he sets off if it wasn’t enough to be shown. She also knew Shmi personally and was just as shocked later that he fell to the Dark Side as she was about the younglings. She knows for a fact the younglings are innocents. The context around both circumstances is different enough to blur the lines. It doesn’t justify her excusing Anakin for what he did to the Tuskens but it does paint a picture as to how she could make the leap with the greater thematic issue throughout the film and what’s happening within that part of galactic history.

It also in a way carries over to the next film as Anakin promises both Padme and Shmi at her gravestone that he won’t fail again at saving those he loves. This is his entire downfall in Revenge of the Sith. I truly don’t think issues and actions are as rushed as some believe them to be with his fall. It’s been happening from the very beginning in The Phantom Menace. It’s just very subtly done and not rushing to get there as there’s no story to Anakin being in the suit except to create a mindless monster. He’s not one. He might be created as a Frankenstein monster when he became Darth Vader in the suit but Anakin himself isn’t one. Anakin was a good person that fell to temptation through a pact with the devil and his inability to let go.

Post
#1475460
Topic
Should Palpatine have been the one to say “To be angry is to be human”?
Time

Another reason to appreciate the line is seeing it for the way it fits a motif of the stories.

Take these scenes between Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon and later another with Obi-Wan and Anakin.

https://youtu.be/t7yek8bWTkE

There’s a great deal of subtle implication and foreshadowing with each along with the poetic links between them. There’s even visual poetry as Anakin’s background is washed out and darker to signify further final steps to bring about the Empire while Obi-Wan’s is still colourful indicating his alliance with the Republic and democracy.

Anakin also often has the same ambitions as Dooku throughout Attack of the Clones. He promises he will become more powerful than any Jedi. Dooku claims he is.

Another thing to note about the Anakin and Padme exchange is exactly what jedi_bendu mentioned. It’s a different character later with Palpatine relying to Anakin a different motivation and way of seeing things to exploit him. Like when Obi-Wan tells him he’s wise and proud of him. Palpatine tells him he’s wise and strokes his ego with how he knows he’s always wanted a life of significance.

It’s a musical idea in a way. It’s a reoccurring motif within Star Wars that doesn’t get referenced nearly enough.

Personally my favourite is when Anakin tells Palpatine that Obi-Wan’s fate will be the same as ours. It has double meaning as they escape the Invisible Hand and all three end up dying on a Death Star.

Post
#1475386
Topic
Should Palpatine have been the one to say “To be angry is to be human”?
Time

BedeHistory731 said:

Stardust1138 said:

I don’t think so. Attack of the Clones really illustrates how different characters are unable to live up to their own standards and often compromise themselves and their principles.

Examples:

Obi-Wan scolds Anakin for losing his lightsaber during the air speeder chase. He loses his lightsaber during his fight with Jango on Kamino.

Mace tells Palpatine they’re the keepers of the peace and not soliders. He cuts Jango’s head off.

Padme doing the same illustrates further how she fell in love with the wrong person but she doesn’t know it until later. However she still holds onto the belief there’s good in him when he completely succumbs and this trait carries over to Luke.

I do like that idea, especially since it implies Padme unknowingly was an enabler for Anakin’s lesser traits.

Exactly this. Nobody knows what to do with Anakin except for Shmi and Qui-Gon. They’re the only ones that understood him for who he is and what he was capable of being. Padme in a way comes closest to everyone else within their circle as they both allow each other to be themselves instead of strictly being defined by their professions of Jedi and Senator as the others see them as. It’s only natural they’d fall in love.

Post
#1475382
Topic
Should Palpatine have been the one to say “To be angry is to be human”?
Time

I don’t think so. Attack of the Clones really illustrates how different characters are unable to live up to their own standards and often compromise themselves and their principles.

Examples:

Obi-Wan scolds Anakin for losing his lightsaber during the air speeder chase. He loses his lightsaber during his fight with Jango on Kamino.

Mace tells Palpatine they’re the keepers of the peace and not soliders. He cuts Jango’s head off.

Padme doing the same illustrates further how she fell in love with the wrong person but she doesn’t know it until later. However she still holds onto the belief there’s good in him when he completely succumbs and this trait carries over to Luke.

Post
#1475231
Topic
What do you think of the <strong>Sequel Trilogy</strong>? - a general discussion thread
Time

yotsuya said:

Those who don’t like these films find ways to explain why they don’t like them. That some don’t like them because they are too different and others don’t like them because they are too similar shows that both views are in they eye of the viewer. Apply the same critiques to the PT and you will get the same result. They are either too similar or too different. TPM, ANH, and TFA all have similar beats and echo each other. In each one a young person with no direction finds a mentor and before the mentor can impart very much, they die. In each one there is a space battle where the hero plays a decisive part (in TFA Rey helps plant the explosives that opens the whole for the destruciton of Starkiller base where in the other two Anakin and Luke are the fighter pilot who fires the shot that destroys the base). The hero meets the other two in the trio that carries through the trilogy. TPM doesn’t have any plans or map as a McGiffin. And I could go on, but why? I think I made my point.

Technically The Phantom Menace and A New Hope do share many similar story beats but equally The Phantom Menace shares many story beats with Return of the Jedi too. The difference between them and The Force Awakens is one isn’t going out of its way to copy and paste the same story we’ve seen before to the minutest detail. The story surrounding a young Force sensitive who gets off planet to begin their journey as a Jedi is vastly different in both of George’s two films. It has the same basic framework of the story being told through two characters Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan and R2-D2/C-3PO as is the personal story of Padme and Leia of trying to help their people while being juxtaposed alongside the fractional stories of Anakin and Luke. The intentions are all different to create symmetry and poetry within the narratives. It’s all meant to echo but not copy and paste. Poetry has to be different to work but with The Force Awakens it’s lifting the complete story from A New Hope beat for beat. There’s nothing new or anything that isn’t meant to draw lines between it and the Original Trilogy. You don’t have that with The Phantom Menace per say as it’s new and original but at the same time familiar with the shift towards the Empire gradually being painted subtly. It’s a difficult tightrope to execute as there’s so much nuance to making a Star Wars film.

Rey may have planted explosives but it’s meant to be just like Han in Return of the Jedi. She also has parallels with Anakin, Luke, and Obi-Wan. That’s a real problem as it’s lifting parallels without understanding context as to why they’re there in the first place. The why is mostly to echo and illustrate the sins of the father and son and their shared journey to finally fully intertwine on Death Star II. It could be extended further with the next generation of the Skywalker family through the “Skywalker Parallels” but the intention of the first six films is to create symmetry between Anakin and Luke. It’s not to create a mismatch of parallels like they give Rey and ulimately through giving her everything as the plot says she must have them as she’s the protagonist. There’s always an exception to every rule within reason through George’s six films but not without thought put behind its purpose within the narrative. His films were an ecological value system and about the collective whole as much as they were about poetry.

The Phantom Menace also does have one through a map. The map R2-D2 shows Padme, Boss Nass, Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, and indirectly young Anakin of Theed to illustrate the plan to capture Nute Gunray. However it’s not blatantly drawing lines. It’s much more subtle and letting the viewer find the connection instead of telling you as the pointer scene in The Force Awakens does.

These two videos explain what I’m saying:

https://youtu.be/Btp1BoGbuiM

https://youtu.be/XtArKawnWNI

Post
#1474649
Topic
[fill in the blank] Just Died!
Time

Sad to report that Alan Ladd Jr. has passed away.

Thank you, Laddie! Without you there’s no Star Wars or countless other films such as Alien, Blade Runner, Chariots of Fire, and Police Academy.

“Laddie loved film and believed in filmmakers. He was one of the few executives who bet on the person rather than the project,” said Lucas. “Without Laddie there would be no Star Wars. He didn’t understand what Star Wars was about, but he believed in me and supported my vision. Quiet and thoughtful, he had an independent spirit that gave so many storytellers a chance. He stood up to the studios and went with his gut instinct. Laddie took a great personal and professional risk on Star Wars, and on me, and for that I will be forever grateful.”

Post
#1474625
Topic
Did Lucas forget that Obi Wan served Bail Organa in the Clone Wars ?
Time

SparkySywer said:

Stardust1138 said:

SparkySywer said:

Stardust1138 said:

StarkillerAG said:

  • Obi-Wan doesn’t remember owning a droid, despite having owned a droid for at least 3 years
  1. During the Clone Wars he has a very low opinion of droids and thinks they can be easily replaced.

Considering a droid replaceable and never owning a droid are different things

Not necessarily. He could have such a low opinion that he couldn’t care less for remembering their names or having one.

That’s a really insane stretch man

Not really. It could be any number of things including PTSD or being of two mindsets. Like me with the Sequels. I don’t like them necessarily as continuations and as a conclusion to the first six films but I can still enjoy them to a degree as mindless escapism. You can hold two opinions at the same time. Just as Obi-Wan couldn’t care less for remembering ever owning a droid or their names. Life can be a contradiction and not always fully set in stone. The more we know, the less we know. I know less as I get older.

Post
#1474549
Topic
George Lucas: Star Wars Creator, Unreliable Narrator &amp; Time Travelling Revisionist...
Time

The following from George explains everything:

"Everybody said, “Oh, well, there was a war between the Jedi and the Sith.” Well, that never happened. That’s just made up by fans or somebody. What really happened is, the Sith ruled the universe for a while, 2,000 years ago. Each Sith has an apprentice, but the problem was, each Sith Lord got to be powerful. And the Sith Lords would try to kill each other because they all wanted to be the most powerful. So in the end they killed each other off, and there wasn’t anything left. So the idea is that when you have a Sith Lord, and he has an apprentice, the apprentice is always trying to recruit somebody to join him — because he’s not strong enough, usually — so that he can kill his master.

That’s why I call it a Rule of Two — there’s only two Sith Lords. There can’t be any more because they kill each other. They’re not smart enough to realize that if they do that, they’re going to wipe themselves out. Which is exactly what they did."

The Phantom Menace novelisation includes the essential history of the Sith directly from George too. There was never a war between the Jedi or Sith but a skirmish of sorts. More so it was their own hubris that doomed them. There’s also no contradiction to the formation of the Republic which was 1,000 years ago. The Sith could’ve been involved in the full scale war that brought about the Republic but it doesn’t necessarily mean it was a full scale conflict between Jedi and Sith armies as per George.

Full Excerpt:

Night blanketed the vast cityscape of Coruscant, cloaking the endless horizon of gleaming spires in deep velvet layers. Lights blazed from windows, bright pinpricks against the black. As far as the eye could see, as far as a being could
travel, the city’s buildings jutted from the planet’s surface in needles of steel alloy and reflective glass. Long ago, the city had consumed the planet with its bulk, and now there was only the city, the center of the galaxy, the heartbeat of the Republic’s rule. A rule that some were intending to end once and for all. A rule that some despised. Darth Sidious stood high on a balcony overlooking Coruscant, his concealing black robes making him appear as if he were a creature produced by the night. He stood facing the city, his eyes directed at its lights, at the faint movement of its air traffic, disinterested in his apprentice, Darth Maul, who waited to one side.

His thoughts were of the Sith and of the history of their order. The Sith had come into being almost two thousand years ago. They were a
cult given over to the dark side of the Force, embracing fully the concept that power denied was power wasted. A rogue Jedi Knight had founded the Sith, a singular dissident in an order of harmonious followers, a rebel who understood
from the beginning that the real power of the Force lay not in the light, but in the dark. Failing to gain approval for his beliefs from the Council, he had broken with the order, departing with his knowledge and his skills, swearing in secret that he could bring down those who had dismissed him. He was alone at first, but others from the Jedi order who believed as he did and who had followed him in his study of the dark side soon came over. Others were recruited, and soon the ranks of the Sith swelled to more than fifty in number. Disdaining the concepts of cooperation and consensus, relying on the belief that acquisition of power in any form lends strength and yields control, the Sith began to build their cult in opposition to the Jedi. Theirs was not an order created to serve; theirs was an order created to dominate. Their war with the Jedi was vengeful and furious and ultimately doomed. The rogue Jedi who had founded the Sith order was its nominal leader, but his ambition excluded any sharing of power. His disciples began to conspire against him and each other almost from the beginning, so that the war they instigated was as much with each other as with the Jedi. In the end, the Sith destroyed themselves. They destroyed their leader first, then each other. What few survived the initial bloodbath were quickly dispatched by watchful Jedi. In a matter of only weeks, all of them died. All but one. Darth Maul shifted impatiently. The younger Sith had not yet learned his Master’s patience; that would come with time and training. It was patience that had saved the Sith order in the end. It was patience that would give them their victory now over the Jedi. The Sith who had survived when all of his fellows had died had understood that. He had adopted patience as a virtue when the others had forsaken it. He had adopted cunning, stealth, and subterfuge as the foundation of his way—old Jedi virtues the others had disdained. He stood aside while the Sith tore at each other like kriks and were destroyed. When the carnage was complete, he went into hiding, biding his time, waiting for his chance. When it was believed all of the Sith were destroyed, he emerged from his concealment. At first he worked alone, but he was growing old and he was the last of his kind. Eventually, he went out in search of an apprentice. Finding one, he trained him to be a Master in his turn, then to find his own apprentice, and so to carry on their work. But there would only be two at any one time. There would be no repetition of the mistakes of the old order, no struggle between Siths warring for power within the cult. Their common enemy was the Jedi, not each other. It was for their war with the Jedi they must save themselves. The Sith who reinvented the order called himself Darth Bane. A thousand years had passed since the Sith were believed destroyed, and the time they had waited for had come at last.

“Tatooine is sparsely populated.” His student’s rough voice broke into his thoughts, and Darth Sidious lifted his eyes to the hologram. “The Hutts rule. The Republic has no presence. If the trace was correct, Master, I will find them quickly and without hindrance.” The yellow eyes glimmered with excitement and anticipation in the strange mosaic of Darth Maul’s face as he waited impatiently for a response. Darth Sidious was pleased. “Move against the Jedi first,” he advised softly. “You will then have no difficulty taking the Queen back to Naboo, where she will sign the treaty.” Darth Maul exhaled sharply. Satisfaction permeated his voice. “At last we will reveal ourselves to the Jedi. At last we will have our revenge.” “You have been well trained, my young apprentice,” Darth Sidious soothed. “The Jedi will be no match for you. It is too late for them to stop us now. Everything is going as planned. The Republic will soon be in my control.”

In the silence that followed, the Sith Lord could feel a dark heat rise inside his chest and consume him with a furious pleasure.

Post
#1474529
Topic
I wish someone would ask Kathleen Kennedy about the original versions of the movies
Time

ken-obi said:

Interviewer: “Sorry, I mean like the… the vision of George’s final cut of the film that he left us with? Like whether that might be altered over time?”

Kathleen Kennedy: “You mean the themes and ideas in the six movies he has made?”

Interviewer: “Just the Edits… he has changed over time… like the Special Editions and that sort of thing…”

Kathleen Kennedy: “Oh! I haven’t touched those. (laughs) You kidding? Those will always remain his.”

It’s good to see full context after like you said a clickbait website misrepresented what was said to an extent but this part of the exchange I quoted I find is key to the whole discussion as the interviewer asked about the edits and clarified for her to give an answer. Like she said she hasn’t touched them as they remain George’s and they’ll always remain his. This I think alludes to changing them back to the unaltered state. I wouldn’t put it pass them after the whole Sequel Trilogy fiasco and adding part of the Holiday Special to Disney+ but I don’t think it will happen either. If anything not mentioning Jason Wingreen in their Boba Fett special proves they have no intentions to release them.

Post
#1474471
Topic
Last movie seen
Time

The Seventh Seal by Ingmar Bergman.

It took a second time to understand it as I didn’t quite understand allegory my first attempt watching it but now that I do I found the film to be an incredibly profound experience and while I understand it more now there’s also just as much of a mystery behind it. It’s going to have a lot of rewatch value I think. It’s about a knight who returns home from the Cruscades and is wrestling mostly with his innermost conflict of his own morality. I don’t know how to explain it and don’t neccessary want to as it’s good sometimes not to be swayed too much with certain films before seeing them but I loved it. I highly recommend it as it’s an amazing film. I can certainly see why it’s considered one of the best films of all time.

Post
#1474437
Topic
Ranking the Star Wars films
Time

My current rankings.

Skywalker Saga:

The Phantom Menace
Return of the Jedi
Revenge of the Sith
A New Hope
Attack of the Clones
The Empire Strikes Back
The Last Jedi
The Rise of Skywalker
The Force Awakens

Spinoffs:

Rogue One
Solo

TV Series:

The Clone Wars
Rebels

It’s always difficult to rank George’s six films as I feel they form a collective whole and knowing where to place The Empire Strikes Back is very difficult. It may have one of my favourite sequences in all of the series with Yoda training Luke but I am finding I connect more overall to the full story told in Attack of the Clones at the moment. My rankings are subject to change again in the future but right now that’s what I’m thinking.

The Disney era and TV series have stayed consistently the same in terms of rankings. Rogue One is growing into my favourite film of the Disney era while The Clone Wars is such a treasure trove of new spins on Star Wars. It’s exciting and engaging to watch. I especially loved the arc with Aayla Secura and the pacifists that I saw awhile back. The series makes me miss George even more though. So it’s truly a double bladed lightsaber. I do enjoy The Rise of Skywalker slightly more than I did before but it’s still behind The Last Jedi as the best film in its trilogy.