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your thoughts: Did Disney kill star wars because it sounds like they did with the last jedi solo and resistance. — Page 4

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Hey, he gave Jabba a non-violent way out of the situation. Not Luke’s fault that drug addled slug didn’t take it. 😉

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Not to mention Luke sure didn’t care about the innocent workers who died on the Death Star.

I can answer almost all questions anyone might have about the Sith from Star Wars Legends, and please do PM me for the bd25 DEED(Despecalised Editions), as I have this version, though I can’t answer technical questions about them. Auntie Derry/Rumpelstiltskin.
Do not go gentle into that good night, Though wise men at their end know dark is right, They
Do not go gentle into that good night. “Stay Phrosty” - Lemar Kentell, my other half. Feel the love.

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Seriously? The thing is called the Death Star. Good luck for any of those Imperials who escaped trying that tactic in court.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

Seriously? The thing is called the Death Star. Good luck for any of those Imperials who escaped trying that tactic in court.

Well they could say they were forced into it. I mean Vader was threatening them constantly.

I can answer almost all questions anyone might have about the Sith from Star Wars Legends, and please do PM me for the bd25 DEED(Despecalised Editions), as I have this version, though I can’t answer technical questions about them. Auntie Derry/Rumpelstiltskin.
Do not go gentle into that good night, Though wise men at their end know dark is right, They
Do not go gentle into that good night. “Stay Phrosty” - Lemar Kentell, my other half. Feel the love.

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Voss Caltrez said:

Shopping Maul said:

Voss Caltrez said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Voss Caltrez said:

Luke using the dark side to choke out the guards at Jabba’s palace.

Actually, this is one of the tidbits of ROTJ I do still like. It’s morally gray stuff like that the film needed much more of.

But who is Darth Henrietta? The Emperor?

Yeah. With the makeup, cackling, and aerodynamics, ROTS Palpatine brings to mind Henrietta from Evil Dead II.

Supposedly, it was done to make audiences unsure of whether or not Luke would become like his father, or stay on the good side. If that’s the reason, that’s cool.
But still, I thought that once you start down the path of the dark side, forever it will consumes you.
If he’s using the dark side of the Force, he must have been practicing it to some degree. And it’s like, why would he do that? How can you pick and choose when you’re going to use the dark side, and still not become evil?
And I thought the Force was only for knowledge and defense, never for attack.

I never saw Evil Dead II. I wonder if The Emperor would have been better if the actor had gone with the initial advice of doing the same type of voice from ESB?

Here’s what I don’t get - killing Palpatine because he is in the throes of annihilating entire shipfuls of sentient beings with a super-laser is ‘the Dark Side’. Killing Palpatine because he’s zapping your son with Force-lightning is ‘the Good Side’.

Sounds like BS to me…

It’s been awhile since I’ve watched ROTJ, but yeah, even then I remember Luke’s decision real questionable.
He won’t fight his father, okay.
The Emperor?
He won’t fight him either. He even throws his ligth saber to the ground, to show he’s about non-violence.
So…what was his plan? Convince Vader to be good again. Maybe that might work since he’s is father.
But what about the Emperor? How was he going to defeat him? With a well-reasoned argument?
If Luke was all Ghandi-like, where was that vow of non-violence on Jabba’s barge?

Funnily enough, when there was prior talk of TLJ having a controversial angle, I thought this was going to be it. I thought Luke was going to come clean about the supposed legend surrounding the Emperor’s defeat, and basically admit that Palpatine’s death had been a fortunate by-product of Luke’s more selfish/insular pursuits regarding Vader. An extension of this would be Luke admitting that Jedi ethics may not be entirely useful or appropriate in a war situation. TLJ did touch upon notions of Jedi hubris but still ignored the blue elephant in the room - namely that after all that ‘only hope’ build-up of the previous two films, Luke was busy redeeming his mass-murdering war-criminal father while everyone else was saving the galaxy.

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On ROTJ the childish stuff hides Luke’s darker motives and tactics.

If you really look closely, from an adult POV, you notice that he uses the force to manipulate the Ewoks.
When 3CPO is telling the story, that’s Luke mind controlling, both 3CPO and the Ewoks.
Immediately after, they are accepted into the tribe, with the Ewoks sacrificing themselves in the battle.
So yes, Luke is not a nice guy in Jedi 😉

On TLJ the dumb childish stuff highlights Luke’s darker side.
So it’s in your face, but it was there before.

TLJ’s problem is not Luke, is the poor B story that makes little sense and is not integrated with the main one.
If you remove the silly stuff from both movies, Luke is consistent.

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4throck said:

On ROTJ the childish stuff hides Luke’s darker motives and tactics.

If you really look closely, from an adult POV, you notice that he uses the force to manipulate the Ewoks.
When 3CPO is telling the story, that’s Luke mind controlling, both 3CPO and the Ewoks.
Immediately after, they are accepted into the tribe, with the Ewoks sacrificing themselves in the battle.
So yes, Luke is not a nice guy in Jedi 😉

On TLJ the dumb childish stuff highlights Luke’s darker side.
So it’s in your face, but it was there before.

TLJ’s problem is not Luke, is the poor B story that makes little sense and is not integrated with the main one.
If you remove the silly stuff from both movies, Luke is consistent.

When has anyone been able to use mind control on a droid?

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

4throck said:

On ROTJ the childish stuff hides Luke’s darker motives and tactics.

If you really look closely, from an adult POV, you notice that he uses the force to manipulate the Ewoks.
When 3CPO is telling the story, that’s Luke mind controlling, both 3CPO and the Ewoks.
Immediately after, they are accepted into the tribe, with the Ewoks sacrificing themselves in the battle.
So yes, Luke is not a nice guy in Jedi 😉

On TLJ the dumb childish stuff highlights Luke’s darker side.
So it’s in your face, but it was there before.

TLJ’s problem is not Luke, is the poor B story that makes little sense and is not integrated with the main one.
If you remove the silly stuff from both movies, Luke is consistent.

When has anyone been able to use mind control on a droid?

Maybe it’s just everyday manipulation. Which is kind of worse.

Yub Nub for life

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DuracellEnergizer said:

DrDre said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Voss Caltrez said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Voss Caltrez said:

Luke using the dark side to choke out the guards at Jabba’s palace.

Actually, this is one of the tidbits of ROTJ I do still like. It’s morally gray stuff like that the film needed much more of.

But who is Darth Henrietta? The Emperor?

Yeah. With the makeup, cackling, and aerodynamics, ROTS Palpatine brings to mind Henrietta from Evil Dead II.

Supposedly, it was done to make audiences unsure of whether or not Luke would become like his father, or stay on the good side. If that’s the reason, that’s cool.
But still, I thought that once you start down the path of the dark side, forever it will consumes you.
If he’s using the dark side of the Force, he must have been practicing it to some degree. And it’s like, why would he do that? How can you pick and choose when you’re going to use the dark side, and still not become evil?
And I thought the Force was only for knowledge and defense, never for attack.

The Jedi interpretation of the Force is just that — an interpretation. Just because they view the Force through some quasi-Objectivist framework which recognizes no shades of gray doesn’t mean the Force is truly like that.

The greatest failure of the SW films — and the franchise as a whole, really — is this idea that the Jedi have the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth on the Force and that any path differing from theirs is deficient.

I disagree. It is Lucas who invented this universe and its rules. He deliberately opted to introduce the concept of the Force and a dark side, a universe without many shades of grey. It is not a fault, it is part of its identity. I don’t see why the Star Wars universe should be made to conform to our own real world sense of morality. In my view this weakens the mythology.

I guess you could say this is among the top 3 reasons why I’m a lapsed Star Wars fan. Not only do I no longer believe in its fundamental worldview, I find that worldview utterly repugnant.

You’re a Kreia fan for sure.

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fmalover said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

DrDre said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Voss Caltrez said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Voss Caltrez said:

Luke using the dark side to choke out the guards at Jabba’s palace.

Actually, this is one of the tidbits of ROTJ I do still like. It’s morally gray stuff like that the film needed much more of.

But who is Darth Henrietta? The Emperor?

Yeah. With the makeup, cackling, and aerodynamics, ROTS Palpatine brings to mind Henrietta from Evil Dead II.

Supposedly, it was done to make audiences unsure of whether or not Luke would become like his father, or stay on the good side. If that’s the reason, that’s cool.
But still, I thought that once you start down the path of the dark side, forever it will consumes you.
If he’s using the dark side of the Force, he must have been practicing it to some degree. And it’s like, why would he do that? How can you pick and choose when you’re going to use the dark side, and still not become evil?
And I thought the Force was only for knowledge and defense, never for attack.

The Jedi interpretation of the Force is just that — an interpretation. Just because they view the Force through some quasi-Objectivist framework which recognizes no shades of gray doesn’t mean the Force is truly like that.

The greatest failure of the SW films — and the franchise as a whole, really — is this idea that the Jedi have the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth on the Force and that any path differing from theirs is deficient.

I disagree. It is Lucas who invented this universe and its rules. He deliberately opted to introduce the concept of the Force and a dark side, a universe without many shades of grey. It is not a fault, it is part of its identity. I don’t see why the Star Wars universe should be made to conform to our own real world sense of morality. In my view this weakens the mythology.

I guess you could say this is among the top 3 reasons why I’m a lapsed Star Wars fan. Not only do I no longer believe in its fundamental worldview, I find that worldview utterly repugnant.

You’re a Kreia fan for sure.

Better to be a Darth Revan fan

I can answer almost all questions anyone might have about the Sith from Star Wars Legends, and please do PM me for the bd25 DEED(Despecalised Editions), as I have this version, though I can’t answer technical questions about them. Auntie Derry/Rumpelstiltskin.
Do not go gentle into that good night, Though wise men at their end know dark is right, They
Do not go gentle into that good night. “Stay Phrosty” - Lemar Kentell, my other half. Feel the love.

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Hey…

For me this is the second time STAR WARS died.

When Episode 1 hit the cinemas, I could hardly be more excited. Unfortunately, I was disappointed afterwards as well. I never liked the ideas George Lucas had to tell about the prehistory. Still, it was clear in the STAR WARS universe. But my old STAR WARS FILMS died with the prequels.

As moderate as the prequels were so terrific and great was everything that came afterwards. Through the prequels, the entire universe blossomed into an Expandet Universe. And suddenly the prequels did not seem so out of place. Through the EU, STAR WARS had grown up far from the screen. When the CLONE WARS came I ignored them because I thought it was kid stuff. That was a mistake. This series was great and showed so much of the STAR WARS universe that I’ve always wanted to see.

When I heard that Disney wanted to buy STAR WARS and wanted to do sequels, I was briefly euphoric again. But then came the death blow: killing the entire EU was the wrong thing DISNEY could do. Although I have to say that EP7 subliminally brought a bit of STAR WARS feel, EP8 drove the cart to the wall. RO felt like the prequels back then. Solo is indisputably bad. That’s it … STAR WARS is like Latin. Kind of dead.

“LUKE… I’M SEEING HIM.
HE’S COMMANDING THE IMPERIAL FORCES… LIKE OUR FATHER!
I FEAR WE LOST HIM, HAN… I FEAR WE LOST EVERYTHING.”

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You can never kill Star Wars.

The Holiday Special, The 16 year gap between Jedi and Phantom Menace, the prequels and the hiatus between Sith and Force Awakens didn’t kill Star Wars. It’s here as long as the cultural zeitgeist exists as it does. No one or two movies will ever kill it. Some suck, we shrug, we move on. Attack of the Clones is in my opinion the absolute worst Star Wars movie, but it didn’t kill the whole thing for (almost) anyone. Better films and shows followed to cover it.

That said, I’m not at all liking Disney’s current decision making. Doesn’t mean they won’t change.

For my ally is the Force and a powerful ally, it is.

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OutboundFlight said:

Did Disney really have a choice when to came to the EU though? Prefer they make a movie with drama then “well Han couldn’t die here because he’s gotta be around for the Vong war”!

I prefer the EU where Han doesn’t get treated like less than just so a new actor can get a role.

I can answer almost all questions anyone might have about the Sith from Star Wars Legends, and please do PM me for the bd25 DEED(Despecalised Editions), as I have this version, though I can’t answer technical questions about them. Auntie Derry/Rumpelstiltskin.
Do not go gentle into that good night, Though wise men at their end know dark is right, They
Do not go gentle into that good night. “Stay Phrosty” - Lemar Kentell, my other half. Feel the love.

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LordZerome1080 said:

OutboundFlight said:

Did Disney really have a choice when to came to the EU though? Prefer they make a movie with drama then “well Han couldn’t die here because he’s gotta be around for the Vong war”!

I prefer the EU where Han doesn’t get treated like less than just so a new actor can get a role.

Opinion: Han Solo getting murdered was the best part of Star Wars VII

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pleasehello said:

LordZerome1080 said:

OutboundFlight said:

Did Disney really have a choice when to came to the EU though? Prefer they make a movie with drama then “well Han couldn’t die here because he’s gotta be around for the Vong war”!

I prefer the EU where Han doesn’t get treated like less than just so a new actor can get a role.

Opinion: Han Solo getting murdered was the best part of Star Wars VII

Just fucking nope!!

I can answer almost all questions anyone might have about the Sith from Star Wars Legends, and please do PM me for the bd25 DEED(Despecalised Editions), as I have this version, though I can’t answer technical questions about them. Auntie Derry/Rumpelstiltskin.
Do not go gentle into that good night, Though wise men at their end know dark is right, They
Do not go gentle into that good night. “Stay Phrosty” - Lemar Kentell, my other half. Feel the love.

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LordZerome1080 said:

pleasehello said:

LordZerome1080 said:

OutboundFlight said:

Did Disney really have a choice when to came to the EU though? Prefer they make a movie with drama then “well Han couldn’t die here because he’s gotta be around for the Vong war”!

I prefer the EU where Han doesn’t get treated like less than just so a new actor can get a role.

Opinion: Han Solo getting murdered was the best part of Star Wars VII

Just fucking nope!!

Are you trying to tell me (in the least eloquent way possible, mind) that is not my opinion? Because I’m pretty sure it is.

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pleasehello said:

LordZerome1080 said:

pleasehello said:

LordZerome1080 said:

OutboundFlight said:

Did Disney really have a choice when to came to the EU though? Prefer they make a movie with drama then “well Han couldn’t die here because he’s gotta be around for the Vong war”!

I prefer the EU where Han doesn’t get treated like less than just so a new actor can get a role.

Opinion: Han Solo getting murdered was the best part of Star Wars VII

Just fucking nope!!

Are you trying to tell me (in the least eloquent way possible, mind) that is not my opinion? Because I’m pretty sure it is.

Opinion you should not want Han dead.

I can answer almost all questions anyone might have about the Sith from Star Wars Legends, and please do PM me for the bd25 DEED(Despecalised Editions), as I have this version, though I can’t answer technical questions about them. Auntie Derry/Rumpelstiltskin.
Do not go gentle into that good night, Though wise men at their end know dark is right, They
Do not go gentle into that good night. “Stay Phrosty” - Lemar Kentell, my other half. Feel the love.

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OutboundFlight said:

Did Disney really have a choice when to came to the EU though? Prefer they make a movie with drama then “well Han couldn’t die here because he’s gotta be around for the Vong war”!

Conversely, if they’d set the ST after whenever they were up to in the EU at that point in 2013, they would’ve had to explain - or find a way to avoid explaining - Chewie’s absence.

It’s also unclear whether it was really Disney’s call to jettison the EU, or George’s. In an interview with Total Film just over a decade ago, George said the story told in the EU post-RotJ wasn’t at all what he would’ve done with it.

But I honestly wonder if there still couldn’t have been a way to tell a story set 41 years after Endor and within the same continuity as the EU that didn’t require audiences to know what had transpired in that time. I guess we’ll never know until someone gets more info from GL and Michael Arndt about the original plans for the ST as of 2012.

Until then, all we have to go on is the knowledge that JJ rewrote the script for VII to give the returning characters a bigger role and this recent interview with George about Microbiotic World.

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Fang Zei said:

But I honestly wonder if there still couldn’t have been a way to tell a story set 41 years after Endor and within the same continuity as the EU that didn’t require audiences to know what had transpired in that time.

Sure. Just set your story 200-1000 years into the future, don’t use any OT characters, and don’t reference any events from the post-ROTJ SW Universe. Which is as it should’ve been, since the window of opportunity for a proper ST starring Luke, Leia, et al. closed after the early '00s.

Arrivederci.