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The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released) — Page 381

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Oh yeah on a second listening I can kinda hear what you’re talking about on sherlock’s clip. It’s a very subtle difference yet again, but honestly I don’t think I’d notice it if it was my first viewing.

Are you sure there isn’t any way to spruce up what he provided?

Exsqueeze me.

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No, I’m not sure of that.

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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I’ll work on it more tonight. No guarantees, of course; but you never know. I’m determined, darn it! lol

Also, I think you said there were two instances of Kylo saying “become”? I was working with the one to Max von Sydow at the beginning of TFA. What’s the second?

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The puppet shot looks great! Can’t believe what you guys are able to accomplish

And just my take but the “become a dyad” line from sherlock sounds seamless to me

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“She’s just beginning to test her powers. The longer she [I forgot] the more dangerous she becomes.”

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Your changes suggest he is aware they are a dyad… only to discover they are a SUPER dyad. Not sure I like that tbh.

Still stand by this ^

Also RogueLeader, I think I’d probably just shut off the movie if I found out that the mind link (emphasis on mind) created by Snoke survived his death and literally allowed them to transfer a freaking lightsaber across that distance. Imo the dyad, even if it isn’t explained properly, is absolutely necessary.

Water literally gets onto Kylo Ren’s hand and Rey experiences visions of his future upon touching his hand.

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TestingOutTheTest said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Your changes suggest he is aware they are a dyad… only to discover they are a SUPER dyad. Not sure I like that tbh.

Still stand by this ^

Also RogueLeader, I think I’d probably just shut off the movie if I found out that the mind link (emphasis on mind) created by Snoke survived his death and literally allowed them to transfer a freaking lightsaber across that distance. Imo the dyad, even if it isn’t explained properly, is absolutely necessary.

Water literally gets onto Kylo Ren’s hand and Rey experiences visions of his future upon touching his hand.

IMO that is actually a hint towards there being something more going on than a mind link (the dyad). Sure, it probably wasn’t originally written with that intention, but that was one of the things I disliked about TLJ until TROS. You’re telling me that Luke projecting himself killed him, but then Snoke is so powerful that he can allow two people to see/touch each other from across the galaxy AND transport physical matter all without dying? And when he does die, “his” connection persists? Give me a break. When Luke dies the dice he transported fade away, the same should happen to their connection if Snoke solely created it.

Exsqueeze me.

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

TestingOutTheTest said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Your changes suggest he is aware they are a dyad… only to discover they are a SUPER dyad. Not sure I like that tbh.

Still stand by this ^

Also RogueLeader, I think I’d probably just shut off the movie if I found out that the mind link (emphasis on mind) created by Snoke survived his death and literally allowed them to transfer a freaking lightsaber across that distance. Imo the dyad, even if it isn’t explained properly, is absolutely necessary.

Water literally gets onto Kylo Ren’s hand and Rey experiences visions of his future upon touching his hand.

IMO that is actually a hint towards there being something more going on than a mind link (the dyad). Sure, it probably wasn’t originally written with that intention, but that was one of the things I disliked about TLJ until TROS. You’re telling me that Luke projecting himself killed him, but then Snoke is so powerful that he can allow two people to see/touch each other from across the galaxy AND transport physical matter all without dying? And when he does die, “his” connection persists? Give me a break. When Luke dies the dice he transported fade away, the same should happen to their connection if Snoke solely created it.

We don’t know how this power works, all we know is that Snoke connected them, so we can INFER that it works that way.

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TestingOutTheTest said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

TestingOutTheTest said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Your changes suggest he is aware they are a dyad… only to discover they are a SUPER dyad. Not sure I like that tbh.

Still stand by this ^

Also RogueLeader, I think I’d probably just shut off the movie if I found out that the mind link (emphasis on mind) created by Snoke survived his death and literally allowed them to transfer a freaking lightsaber across that distance. Imo the dyad, even if it isn’t explained properly, is absolutely necessary.

Water literally gets onto Kylo Ren’s hand and Rey experiences visions of his future upon touching his hand.

IMO that is actually a hint towards there being something more going on than a mind link (the dyad). Sure, it probably wasn’t originally written with that intention, but that was one of the things I disliked about TLJ until TROS. You’re telling me that Luke projecting himself killed him, but then Snoke is so powerful that he can allow two people to see/touch each other from across the galaxy AND transport physical matter all without dying? And when he does die, “his” connection persists? Give me a break. When Luke dies the dice he transported fade away, the same should happen to their connection if Snoke solely created it.

We don’t know how this power works, all we know is that Snoke connected them, so we can INFER that it works that way.

Well then, I would say that it is a pretty darn easy inference to make then. Or maybe it’s just me?

I honestly simply hate the idea that Snoke had anything to do with establishing their connection. I’m okay with him knowing about it and using it to his advantage to lure Rey in, but nothing beyond that. But I’ve said that so many times at this point that I’m starting to sound like a broken record.

Plus, I’ve already got an edit which does that for me. If other people don’t agree, then I won’t force them to make that change as well.

Exsqueeze me.

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Here is one take on the whole thing. They’ve been a Dyad since the beginning (TFA) and Snoke’s Mind Meldtm “jumpstarted” their Dyadness. I mean, those two would have no idea about it or understanding of their “special bond.” So having Snoke do something with the unintended result of the whole “transfer of physical things/touching/etc.”

I would almost think Snoke’s plan was to have them connected like how Luke and Vader were able to connect, or Leia and Luke were able to connect from a distance, but a more “clear” connection. The the unintended results is it jump started their Dyad ability instead of it naturally growing if they were together and on the same “side” of things, if that makes sense.

TL:DR version: Snoke’s mind bridge was intended for them to communicate, not the whole physical stuff which is contributed to the Dyad stuff. He didn’t know that, just wanted them to chat.

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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jarbear said:

TL:DR version: Snoke’s mind bridge was intended for them to communicate, not the whole physical stuff which is contributed to the Dyad stuff. He didn’t know that, just wanted them to chat.

Fair enough. The problem I have with that is it isn’t made clear enough in the film that this is the case. I actually would blame TFA in this case. If TFA overtly set up that they had some mystical connection, it would be more believable that Snoke’s mind bridge would accelerate it. The problem, at least in my case, is that when Snoke says that line it appears that he is taking credit for everything, not just the chatting.

Exsqueeze me.

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

jarbear said:

TL:DR version: Snoke’s mind bridge was intended for them to communicate, not the whole physical stuff which is contributed to the Dyad stuff. He didn’t know that, just wanted them to chat.

Fair enough. The problem I have with that is it isn’t made clear enough in the film that this is the case. I actually would blame TFA in this case. If TFA overtly set up that they had some mystical connection, it would be more believable that Snoke’s mind bridge would accelerate it. The problem, at least in my case, is that when Snoke says that line it appears that he is taking credit for everything, not just the chatting.

Oh, I don’t disagree it’s all a mess. Lol. If possible, I’d remove him taking credit and instead focuses more on him knowing that Rey would come back from Kylo after learning his origin … thinking she could “save him” or whatever … kinda like Luke with Vader, when Emperor told Vader that Luke would come to them. (which he did, sorta.)

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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“It was I who bridged your minds” is the only problematic line imo. But people here prefer the twist that he orchestrated literally everything, which I can sort of understand.

I’m content enough with him scolding Kylo intentionally, knowing that it would “stoke Ren’s conflicted soul”, and as a result Rey would be more likely to see a chance of redemption in him. So in a way, he still orchestrates Rey coming to him, although he uses a tool which isn’t his own in order to do it.

Exsqueeze me.

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The twist would have been fine … if it all makes sense and is connected. Lol.

I’d probably now am motivated to remove the “bridge mind” aspect just to help clear out the mess with Bridge Minds … Dyad … etc. etc. with iMovie on the TLJ edit just to remove some weird plot holes/messiness.

That, for me, also clears up Snoke’s "how he done in and was fine AND how he … kinda understood their connection and Palpy didn’t. People can argue all the details, but it is still a mess imo.

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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I’ve already done it (although I’m sure you could do it even better)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikD6D9-OU1g

While I agree it’s still somewhat messy, to me at least it is the most sound answer. Sure, you can punch a hole in it by saying that since Snoke still is aware of their connection, why is Palpatine surprised by it. But ultimately, the way Snoke speaks without that one line could suggest that he either assumed they would somehow get in contact, or he did know about their connection. Either way is good enough for me.

Exsqueeze me.

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In this moment I can’t remember exactly what was said that made me feel like it was good to leave Snoke’s TLJ line alone about bridging their minds.
Man, I am starting to feel like a demented figurehead or maybe a poisoned Theoden figure, lol. I just don’t have the headspace these days to track these things, then get to place where it’s “resolved” and then promptly forget about it.

To me, though, having Kylo tell Rey they have become a dyad makes the most intuitive sense, elegantly solving the problem. However, the TLJ Snoke scene is totally coherent without that one line. He just played on their personal weaknesses and sort of used their Force connection without causing it. I guess you could wonder how he knew to count on it or whatever, but man… idk

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

I’ve already done it (although I’m sure you could do it even better)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikD6D9-OU1g

I wonder if it might be good to swap the shots of Kylo and Rey. Let Kylo react to “a weakness in my apprentice.”

But yeah remind me… why was I talked about of this? Because it seems to solve a problem here. lol omg man these days

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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Hal, to be honest, I’ve completely forgotten how we landed on this topic again LMAO. Once I remember, I’ll edit this post or create a new one.

EDIT: Ok, so originally it was brought up because I was trying to convince everyone not to remove references to the dyad in TROS because it would create some issues, especially with Snoke’s mind bridging still in place. Then I brought up how removing it would help clear a lot of questions, such as how is Snoke powerful enough to create such a connection without dying, and to a lesser degree explain why Palpatine isn’t aware of something his pawn supposedly created. If Snoke didn’t create it, but was relying on it, it’s at least a little more understandable. It would also open the door for their connection to have started in TFA in the interrogation scene, where Rey essentially learns all of Kylo’s training in an instant.

Exsqueeze me.

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Yeah… and even then, it would still seem dumb for Palpatine to just be like, “Oh, a dyad, eh? Didn’t realize that until now but it turns out that’s the most insanely useful thing I could possible have happen here.”

I guess leaving Snoke’s line but implying they’ve become a dyad since then would make it the least amount of dumb possible, but we’ll see what happens! Thanks for recapping that for me.

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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Hal 9000 said:

I guess leaving Snoke’s line but implying they’ve become a dyad since then would make it the least amount of dumb possible, but we’ll see what happens! Thanks for recapping that for me.

I agree, mostly because changing it to “become” still works in the context of removing Snoke’s line. Kylo says, “We’ve become a dyad in the force” but never specifies when. If you want it to be when Snoke bridges their minds, go for it. If you want it to be in the interrogation scene if that Snoke line is removed, go for it.

I think it’s a win-win for everyone.

Exsqueeze me.

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I definitely want to remove the Snoke line for sure now. Lol.

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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jarbear said:

I definitely want to remove the Snoke line for sure now. Lol.

You and me both, partner. I would appreciate a link to whatever you come up with if you think it’s better than what I currently have.

The only thing I want to make sure we are NOT doing is chopping off Kylo’s “What Palpatine doesn’t know…” and Palpatine’s “a dyad in the force”. That could cause some issues between Hal’s idea and our idea.

EDIT: On second thought, it might not. If Snoke knew about their connection and was using it to his advantage, I suppose removing Kylo’s line makes sense. And Palpatine would just be surprised by how powerful their dyad is, not the fact that there is a dyad, if you remove the other line.

Exsqueeze me.

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I’ll have to think about that some more. In the before times I could go for a walk and let that and other things stew. I feel like a Turing machine all pent up and ready to do but the electricity is intermittent.

In other words, I wish I had more time to think about this project, let alone actually work on it.

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

EDIT: On second thought, it might not. If Snoke knew about their connection and was using it to his advantage, I suppose removing Kylo’s line makes sense. And Palpatine would just be surprised by how powerful their dyad is, not the fact that there is a dyad, if you remove the other line.

Just wanna make sure you see this edit, Hal. I might be brain fried as well and am not considering an important detail so lmk.

Exsqueeze me.

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Oh, I remember now. If Palpatine knows they have a dyad, it shouldn’t matter how powerful it is, he should realize that he could potentially drain it and would want Rey brought to him alive by Kylo. So yeah, maybe not a good idea to remove those lines.

God, what a mess. I need a break lmfao.

Exsqueeze me.