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team negative1 - star wars 1977 - 35mm theatrical version (Released) — Page 120

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Molly said:

I’m actually not sure all this publicity around the Team Negative1 and Harmy releases is a good thing.

Harmy’s stuff is already fairly publicly known, I’ve seen it mentioned a few times “out in the wild”.

SpenceEdit said:

Watched this on my projector the other day and it was Star Wars bliss.

I would love to try that out, but it seems like a bit of a waste, since my projector only does 480p =)

Wazzles said:

The official Team Negative 1 release will use 35mm stereo, which should sound much better. Anything aside from mono English/Spanish tracks are left up to everyone else on OT that wants to do it themselves.

Hopefully they’ll get the GOUT syncing figured out, so nobody will have to convert any audio themselves =)

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 (Edited)

Interesting stuff I discovered synching the Team Negative1 Silver Screen Edition (SSE) to Harmy’s Despecialized Edition version 2.5. The goal of this was to teach myself video editing, and to have a 1920x1080 SSE that matches Harmy’s English DTS 5.1 audio, which I hear matches GOUT. I don’t have a copy of GOUT to use.

All frame numbers refer to Harmy’s version.

  1. Harmy’s has 105 more frames by the final shot transition before the end credits swipe (f:168,675). By the time I synch the final shot, I will have had to add 105 blank frames to the SSE.
  2. Harmy’s “Look, sir. Droids.” shot (f:21,789) is ahead one frame. Swipes don’t match. (Maybe Harmy’s doing in removing SE crap. Maybe difference between Harmy’s source and SSE.)
  3. Harmy’s following sandcrawler shot (f:22,121) is behind a frame or few. The following shot is back to perfect synch (f:22,290).
  4. Interestingly, the change to reel 2 just before “thank the maker” syncs perfectly (~f:27,826).
  5. Harmy’s has 12 extra frames at the end of the shot in which Ben kneels to touch Luke’s wrist as Luke lies unconscious (f:42,504). Funny thing is that in those frames, Luke’s fingers move slightly even though he seems to be out cold. Ben’s hand remains a bit longer on Luke’s wrist and starts to lift off which is about 2 frames inconsistent with the start of the next shot (f:42,605).
  6. Harmy’s has 4 extra frames at the end of the “the droid does belong to you” shot (f:45,050).
  7. Harmy’s has 3 extra frames at the end of the “one swift stroke” shot and 1 at the beginning of the next (f:55,749). This is the transition from reel 2 to reel 3.
  8. Harmy’s has 1 extra frame at end of first shot of reel 3 (f:55,749).
  9. Harmy’s has 1 extra frame as Ben says “it’s too dangerous” (f:56,927).
  10. Harmy’s shot of Luke racing home in his landspeeder (f:57,164) is 5 frames ahead of the SSE, which means that the final frames are not in the SSE. Interestingly, the coloring of these final frames suddenly becomes sharper.
  11. Harmy’s has 4 extra frames in the shot of the 3 tie fighters flying toward the death star after Luke sees his dead relatives (f:58,362). This footage is 5 frames ahead of the SSE and the death star definitely seems to be further away from the camera ending up being much smaller and higher in the frame. The result is that the ties don’t seem to get as close to it has they do in the SSE. Perhaps this is a special edition recomposite.
  12. Harmy’s has 1 extra frame at the end of the shot of the group on the cliff overlooking Mos Eisley (f:60,650).
  13. Harmy’s has 1 extra frame at the beginning of the shot in which Luke walks up to the cantina bar (f:64,771).
  14. Harmy’s has 2 extra frames at the end of the shot in which Han and Chewie get up from the table to leave the cantina (f:70,505).
  15. Harmy’s has 1 extra frame at the end of the shot in which Tarkin looks at Alderaan with his back to the camera and waves off another officer (f:78,664).
  16. Harmy’s has 4 extra frames at the end of the shot in which Chewie smoothes his hair back at the chess table (f:83,448).
  17. Reel 3 was by far the most screwy reel. I had to make 8 splits in this section.
  18. Change to reel 4 (f:86,677). Harmy’s has 39 extra frames at the beginning of the first shot of reel 4 when the officer enters Tarkin’s chamber and 19 extra frames at the end of the previous shot in which Luke enters a “larger world”.
  19. Change to reel 5 (f:113,652). Harmy’s has 2 extra frames at the end of the shot in which a soaked Luke says the monster just “disappeared” and 4 extra frames at the beginning of the following shot of Leia.
  20. Change to the final reel – reel 6 (f:144,054). Harmy’s has 3 extra frames at the end of the shot in which the green R2 unit is lowered into the x-wing and 3 extra frames at the beginning of the following shot of the “all pilots to your stations” x-wing.
  21. Reels 1, 4, 5 and 6 needed no edits other than the beginnings and endings of the reels. I removed the Team Negative1 opening simply to sync the beginning. All due respect and love to them and Harmy, of course!
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Some guys already made available on the Spleen both synchronized Hairy_Hen’s 5.1 in FLAC and 35 mm stereo also in FLAC.

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How do extra frames happen? Why would there be that disparity if they come from the same source originally?

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Lust-In-Phaze said:

How do extra frames happen? Why would there be that disparity if they come from the same source originally?

Well, I really don’t know, so I am sure other people know better than I, but I had a couple ideas. The frames missing from the 35mm at the reel changes could be a result of the ends of the reel breaking from lots of handling. The other missing frames could be from times when the film broke during playing, ruining a frame or three, and then being spliced back together. Why reel 3 had so many more missing frames compared to the others could be because it was a more used reel from a different set, I suppose. Another idea I had was that there was more than one original source. Just as the audio master kept changing, so did the film edit master. That’s all I could come up with with my NO knowledge of such things. 😃

As for the footage differences with Harmy’s, I guess that’s from Harmy doing his best, brilliant trickery to recreate the original from remastered sources that used slightly different footage. Again, I can only guess.

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Yarko said:

As for the footage differences with Harmy’s, I guess that’s from Harmy doing his best, brilliant trickery to recreate the original from remastered sources that used slightly different footage. Again, I can only guess.

Nope. Harmy doesn’t sacrifice the original sync to make things work, as tempting as that could be for recreating wipes and such. The soundtracks are set in stone, synced to a GOUT standard. Harmy’s are at times imperfect by a frame or so, but not intentionally.

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Been scouring the internet for where to find the Star Wars fanedits for a long time. From what I’m reading here it’s Myspleen. If anyone has extra invites that would be great(btw I can trade invites to Torrentleech, great place for new movies)!

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Ooo. I have a question for the video codec experts. When I use FFMPEG to examine Harmy’s Despec Star Wars v2.5, it tells me that his video stream is at 23.98 fps which makes sense to me. When I use it to examine the Silver Screen Edition, it tells me that it is at 23.81 fps which surprised me. Why the discrepancy?

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Yarko said:

Ooo. I have a question for the video codec experts. When I use FFMPEG to examine Harmy’s Despec Star Wars v2.5, it tells me that his video stream is at 23.98 fps which makes sense to me. When I use it to examine the Silver Screen Edition, it tells me that it is at 23.81 fps which surprised me. Why the discrepancy?

The SSE container has an error. But the video stream is fine and plays correctly.

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towne32 said:

The SSE container has an error. But the video stream is fine and plays correctly.

I wonder how that happens.

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So what exactly has been released? From what I gather a version of this is out there already, but it’s not the finalized release tn1 is planning?

My apologies for having to ask. I’ve tried to skim as much as I can of this thread but I have a toddler and a newborn and reading all 120 pages will take me months… I barely had time to make this post!

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canofhumdingers said:

So what exactly has been released? From what I gather a version of this is out there already, but it’s not the finalized release tn1 is planning?

My apologies for having to ask. I’ve tried to skim as much as I can of this thread but I have a toddler and a newborn and reading all 120 pages will take me months… I barely had time to make this post!

I jumped in before realizing what had been done, like the Grindhouse ESB earlier on.

This is a test issue basically that is the 35 Eastman/LPP mix of prints. v2.0. A later v2.5 will be finalized and include stereo and mono. Also, TN1 have a preview of the IB R5.
I didn’t realize until now, but this preliminary copy only has the GOUT DVD 2.0 ac3 synced to it.

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captainsolo said:

canofhumdingers said:

So what exactly has been released? From what I gather a version of this is out there already, but it’s not the finalized release tn1 is planning?

My apologies for having to ask. I’ve tried to skim as much as I can of this thread but I have a toddler and a newborn and reading all 120 pages will take me months… I barely had time to make this post!

I jumped in before realizing what had been done, like the Grindhouse ESB earlier on.

This is a test issue basically that is the 35 Eastman/LPP mix of prints. v2.0. A later v2.5 will be finalized and include stereo and mono. Also, TN1 have a preview of the IB R5.
I didn’t realize until now, but this preliminary copy only has the GOUT DVD 2.0 ac3 synced to it.

Thank you! So it sounds like I’d be safe waiting for the next (soon to come?) version that is more finalized if I’m not in a hurry anyway.

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 (Edited)

Never mind, sorry, can’t delete this post.

“I want to watch Empire on my refrigerator’s LCD screen but listen to the Austrailan audio thru my USB phonograph setup and it worked on the other two movies” -yoda-sama

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team_negative1 said:

Aquabat said:

This is awesome. Any chance of a version above 25 GB? 25 GB is a little small for a 1080p movie; especially one with grain. Criterion releases of grainy movies are regularly 40+ GB.
There are no plans to release any versions bigger than 25 G, due to negligible differences in quality.

Also,most people don’t have double layer bluray burners or media.

Team Negative1

And you have to now consider Ultra HD Blu Ray Discs that are hitting the market (a dual-layer disc can hold up to 66GBs). It’s only a matter of time that recordable UHD Blu Ray Disc will be available. So, presenting your next project in GBs above 25 should be considered.

In the meantime, anyone that downloads a video that has this said amount of data, or more, can just store it on a portable hard drive or even on a flash drive. Those said storage devices can be plugged, via USB port, to a Blu Ray player and it will play the videos. That is how I have done it for the past year and it has worked out well for me.

During this time the person can still enjoy the HD content from the storage device until UHD Blu Ray blank discs become available and he can then burn the content to that disc.

So, we encourage you, team negative1, to present your next project in the best quality possible without compromise. If it is 80GB, so be it. We can handle it.

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alexp120 said:

team_negative1 said:

Aquabat said:

This is awesome. Any chance of a version above 25 GB? 25 GB is a little small for a 1080p movie; especially one with grain. Criterion releases of grainy movies are regularly 40+ GB.
There are no plans to release any versions bigger than 25 G, due to negligible differences in quality.

Also,most people don’t have double layer bluray burners or media.

Team Negative1

And you have to now consider Ultra HD Blu Ray Discs that are hitting the market (a dual-layer disc can hold up to 66GBs). It’s only a matter of time that recordable UHD Blu Ray Disc will be available. So, presenting your next project in GBs above 25 should be considered.

In the meantime, anyone that downloads a video that has this said amount of data, or more, can just store it on a portable hard drive or even on a flash drive. Those said storage devices can be plugged, via USB port, to a Blu Ray player and it will play the videos. That is how I have done it for the past year and it has worked out well for me.

During this time the person can still enjoy the HD content from the storage device until UHD Blu Ray blank discs become available and he can then burn the content to that disc.

So, we encourage you, team negative1, to present your next project in the best quality possible without compromise. If it is 80GB, so be it. We can handle it.

Most people will not be able to tell the difference, especially not when properly encoded. At a certain point you reach transparency and everything after that is overkill. Increased file size for no increase in quality.

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They’ve posted some samples in the ‘how to’ section. Encoding for dual layer discs (normal BD-DL) did indeed show some tangible improvements.

You’re right that there normally is a point at which increased bitrate isn’t worth the trouble. But this is a film with tons of grain, and the extra space does it some good.

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It’s a little absurd to spend such incredible amounts of time and effort in a preservation and not attempt to release it in the absolute best quality available. Not only will it then look phenomenal long into the future but people without the ability to use 80GB files can seek out a smaller file version. It’s easy to slightly decrease quality to achieve a smaller file size, to do the opposite is not so easy…

Complete Star Wars Poster Collection

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What’s the easiest way to remove the intro? As much as I appreciate the work done, and thank you very much for that work, I don’t need or want to see a pre-movie ego boost every single time this is viewed. Also makes it harder to mux in a different audio stream when you need to figure out how to get rid of that intro.

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The GOUT Synced 720P one on the Spleen doesn’t have the intro, I’m assuming someone else has already done the work for you.

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A little tweaking of my googling terms found me AVI Trimmer+, which worked like a charm on the MKV file. Thanks. 😃

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Hey guys I realise I’m a little late to the party and first off I’d like to give a huge thank you to Team Negative and a big congratulations, it’s simply amazing and gorgeous and is a better version of the film than I ever thought I’d see in these troubled times.
However, I would like to ask how I can burn the film onto a disk. I was able to burn Harmy’s Despecialized Edition onto verbatim DVD+R DL disks but they’re max size is 8.5GB and this is 21GB.
1: Is it possible to put this onto a disk?
2: What disks do I need to buy?
3: If my computer can burn the Despecialized Edition will it be able to burn this (do I need to download any more software or by a different disk drive or something?)
Sorry if my questions have already been asked, I looked through the thread but I’ll admit that it’s late and I may have skim read some pages near the end.
Thanks in advance