kk650's Star Wars Saga: Regraded and Semi-Specialized (Released) — Page 13

I think it looks great. I think the main flaw is the somewhat obvious sound cuts that we've discussed a bit already, so no need to dwell on that more. It would be lovely to see that fix in the 16gb version, though.

As far as other editing decisions go, as you've said, everyone would probably create a slightly different version for themselves. I personally would love a copy with *no* CGI 'dinosaurs' at all (or flying droids) in addition to the rest of your changes. But, different strokes for different folks.

And I did notice the grey line in that shot. Is it only a single frame with this?

towne32 said:

I think it looks great. I think the main flaw is the somewhat obvious sound cuts that we've discussed a bit already, so no need to dwell on that more. It would be lovely to see that fix in the 16gb version, though.

As far as other editing decisions go, as you've said, everyone would probably create a slightly different version for themselves. I personally would love a copy with *no* CGI 'dinosaurs' at all (or flying droids) in addition to the rest of your changes. But, different strokes for different folks.

And I did notice the grey line in that shot. Is it only a single frame with this?

Thanks for the feedback towne32! I'm very glad to hear that you like how it looks. That's what I want to know the most, what people feel about the new colour scheme of the latest Star Wars Semi-Specialised Edition release.

As for those audio cuts on tatooine, they are noticable if you're looking for them but they are not at all jarring for me so I don't consider them flaws that need fixing. The cut that removes the swinging jawa is also cutting a piece of music so its going to be impossible to make that totally seamless. That cut worked out a lot better than I could have hoped though, seamless enough to satisfy me. The other two are scene changes where such audio transitions are common in films, even in Belbucus's Star Wars PCM audio. Both seamless enough for me. I will look into whether I can improve on what i've already done with crossfades though for the 16gb release, if crossfades make them even more satisfactory then of course that is exactly what i'll do.

If I had access to blu-ray level HD footage of the shots you're talking about without the 'dinosaurs', I'd certainly consider removing the one that walks across Luke and Ben when they're in the speeder about to talk to the storm troopers. Honestly the droids flying around don't really bother me. Hopefully Disney will release the original unaltered trilogy on blu-ray sooner rather than later so I have more options. I would especially love to have the Lapti Nek, Yub Nub and Jedi Ghosts footage in blu-ray quality to be able to reinstate them into the Return of the Jedi Semi-Specialised Edition.

Thankfully that thick grey line is only in a single frame, so its an easy fix. I'm amazed that I didn't notice it a year ago when I first released the Star Wars Semi-Specialised Edition.

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

I think it looks great. I think the main flaw is the somewhat obvious sound cuts that we've discussed a bit already, so no need to dwell on that more. It would be lovely to see that fix in the 16gb version, though.

As far as other editing decisions go, as you've said, everyone would probably create a slightly different version for themselves. I personally would love a copy with *no* CGI 'dinosaurs' at all (or flying droids) in addition to the rest of your changes. But, different strokes for different folks.

And I did notice the grey line in that shot. Is it only a single frame with this?

If I had access to blu-ray level HD footage of the shots you're talking about without the 'dinosaurs', I'd certainly consider removing the one that walks accross Luke and Ben when they're in the speeder about to talk to the storm troopers. 

 I agree that the flying droids aren't the end of the world.

Would you consider asking Harmy/team negative1 to use their 35mm scan to get rid of the giant dino blocking the camera? It would probably need a lot of color alteration. Given that a lot of that has probably already been done on the shot, I'm not sure how much a clip can be changed back and forth before it starts getting... odd.

I don't necessarily like the 'dino' that they pass *after* the stormtroopers. But, the landspeeder was a mess in that shot as it was originally done. (I recall reading that it was processed and blurred repeatedly, and it shows). So, short of some rotoscoping to keep the speeder and lose the creature, it's probably fine for semi-specialized as is.

There is the shot when they're first pulling into the city, specific to the SE, where there are exact duplicate stormtroopers on both sides, making the exact same motions. I like the shot (for SE purposes), but the identically moving stormtroopers make it look like a 90's video game. Again, probably not an easy fix by any means.

towne32 said:

There is the shot when they're first pulling into the city, specific to the SE, where there are exact duplicate stormtroopers on both sides, making the exact same motions. I like the shot (for SE purposes), but the identically moving stormtroopers make it look like a 90's video game. Again, probably not an easy fix by any means.

 
Yeah. I love the shot and have never noticed the flipped Stormtrooper footage for the better part of a decade, yet once I read that online I could no longer unsee it. Same for Luke's "ghostly image" standing in an archway of the Lars Homestead, which I read about on here. That was *really* shoddy quality control.

Also, kk650, could you please elaborate on the error in this shot. I fail to spot it (maybe that's a blessing). ;)

kk650 said:

For those interested, here's one of the more obvious examples of the type of error i'm talking about on the Star wars blu-ray that i've been removing. I'm amazed this one made it onto the blu-ray:

Looks like it could be a messed up clone brush or something like that when they were cleaning up the print that they left in by mistake.

I think it's the big grey line to the left of his cheek. It would probably be easier to see compared to a frame before or after. It looks like a color from the background xwing. So presumably they were using a color extracted with an eye-dropper type tool and left a paint stroke.

Ah, right. I thought it was part of the seat illuminated by lighting.

towne32 said:

I think it's the big grey line to the left of his cheek. It would probably be easier to see compared to a frame before or after. It looks like a color from the background xwing. So presumably they were using a color extracted with an eye-dropper type tool and left a paint stroke.

Yes, that's it exactly. In hindsight I should have also posted the frame before as you say so it was more obvious what I was talking about.

towne32 said:

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

I think it looks great. I think the main flaw is the somewhat obvious sound cuts that we've discussed a bit already, so no need to dwell on that more. It would be lovely to see that fix in the 16gb version, though.

As far as other editing decisions go, as you've said, everyone would probably create a slightly different version for themselves. I personally would love a copy with *no* CGI 'dinosaurs' at all (or flying droids) in addition to the rest of your changes. But, different strokes for different folks.

And I did notice the grey line in that shot. Is it only a single frame with this?

If I had access to blu-ray level HD footage of the shots you're talking about without the 'dinosaurs', I'd certainly consider removing the one that walks accross Luke and Ben when they're in the speeder about to talk to the storm troopers. 

 I agree that the flying droids aren't the end of the world.

Would you consider asking Harmy/team negative1 to use their 35mm scan to get rid of the giant dino blocking the camera? It would probably need a lot of color alteration. Given that a lot of that has probably already been done on the shot, I'm not sure how much a clip can be changed back and forth before it starts getting... odd.

I don't necessarily like the 'dino' that they pass *after* the stormtroopers. But, the landspeeder was a mess in that shot as it was originally done. (I recall reading that it was processed and blurred repeatedly, and it shows). So, short of some rotoscoping to keep the speeder and lose the creature, it's probably fine for semi-specialized as is.

There is the shot when they're first pulling into the city, specific to the SE, where there are exact duplicate stormtroopers on both sides, making the exact same motions. I like the shot (for SE purposes), but the identically moving stormtroopers make it look like a 90's video game. Again, probably not an easy fix by any means.

Hmm, it's fascinating because i'm looking at althor1138's incredibly useful Star Wars COLD release to quickly compare the SE to the GOUT and it seems like that dino walking across was put there on purpose to hide the cheap looking half painted white and green R2D2 unit that passes by. Which is the lesser of two evils is the question, GL thinks the dino it seems. I'm 50/50 to be honest.

The shot when they pass the dino after the stormtroopers, I have no preference whether the dino is there or not, both are fine to me, though the GOUT and Japanese laserdisc release have a lot more deadspace below the R2D2 droid with the red top than the SE releases, making the GOUT/laserdisc shot look more like a set and a bit fake compared to the SE releases IMHO. In this case I would definately choose the SE shot because of the reduced amount of deadspace, making for better frame composition and making the set look more real, a definate improvement in my book.

The third thing you mentioned is something i've never noticed (nice spot, though you probably wish you hadn't noticed it now haha) so its not really an issue for me. As you say though, even if it was, I don't think there's that much I could do about it.

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

I think it looks great. I think the main flaw is the somewhat obvious sound cuts that we've discussed a bit already, so no need to dwell on that more. It would be lovely to see that fix in the 16gb version, though.

As far as other editing decisions go, as you've said, everyone would probably create a slightly different version for themselves. I personally would love a copy with *no* CGI 'dinosaurs' at all (or flying droids) in addition to the rest of your changes. But, different strokes for different folks.

And I did notice the grey line in that shot. Is it only a single frame with this?

If I had access to blu-ray level HD footage of the shots you're talking about without the 'dinosaurs', I'd certainly consider removing the one that walks accross Luke and Ben when they're in the speeder about to talk to the storm troopers. 

 I agree that the flying droids aren't the end of the world.

Would you consider asking Harmy/team negative1 to use their 35mm scan to get rid of the giant dino blocking the camera? It would probably need a lot of color alteration. Given that a lot of that has probably already been done on the shot, I'm not sure how much a clip can be changed back and forth before it starts getting... odd.

I don't necessarily like the 'dino' that they pass *after* the stormtroopers. But, the landspeeder was a mess in that shot as it was originally done. (I recall reading that it was processed and blurred repeatedly, and it shows). So, short of some rotoscoping to keep the speeder and lose the creature, it's probably fine for semi-specialized as is.

There is the shot when they're first pulling into the city, specific to the SE, where there are exact duplicate stormtroopers on both sides, making the exact same motions. I like the shot (for SE purposes), but the identically moving stormtroopers make it look like a 90's video game. Again, probably not an easy fix by any means.

Hmm, it's fascinating because i'm looking at althor1138's incredibly useful Star Wars COLD release to quickly compare the SE to the GOUT and it seems like that dino walking across was put there on purpose to hide the cheap looking half painted white and green R2D2 unit that passes by. Which is the lesser of two evils is the question, GL thinks the dino it seems. I'm 50/50 to be honest.

The shot when they pass the dino after the stormtroopers, I have no preference whether the dino is there or not, both are fine to me, though the GOUT and Japanese laserdisc release have a lot more deadspace below the R2D2 droid with the red top than the SE releases, making the GOUT/laserdisc shot look more like a set and a bit fake compared to the SE releases IMHO. In this case I would definately choose the SE shot because of the reduced amount of deadspace, making for better frame composition and making the set look more real, a definate improvement in my book.

The third thing you mentioned is something i've never noticed (nice spot, though you probably wish you hadn't noticed it now haha) so its not really an issue for me. As you say though, even if it was, I don't think there's that much I could do about it.

 I never really thought of the up close dino-skin as an attempt to block the green droid. Just had another look, and I don't think the droid looks too bad (surely he would have blocked the ugly yellow one instead?).

You're right about the other points.

I also compared the sound changes (as the shot switches) in your version, the SE, and the original. I think you're mostly right, that you found pretty good spots to cut. 

I think what's problematic for you is the very brief look at the first dino, after the dupli-troopers shot. I see why you have it there. Before the shenanigans, it's a prototypical example of what the SE is trying to do in expanding mos eisley, and you're *not* making a despecialized. But more importantly, the up-close dino skin in the next shot would be so much worse without the viewer having been exposed to what that creature *even is*. But the shot is so quick the way you've got it. It's a bit awkward in both the video and your sound cut. Have you considered cutting when the dino's feet hit the ground? The ridiculous part, honestly, is the swinging jawa.

In conclusion: Mos Eisley is a mess and it's difficult to strike a good balance.

Hey there,

I don't know how active The Aluminum Falcon is.

I've recently gave the semi-specialized V2 a view and it rather impressive then I gave Empire Strikes Back semi-specialized a go and I was very disappointed. Clearly stated in descriptions "to remove the blue tint that was introduced in the DVD versions".

What I see is a clear, thick blue tint all over Hoth, just as blue as any dvd ever was!:

Shouldn't it be ...less blue ...more white?

Actually here's a comparison picture from the recently uploaded Japanese Collector's edition. They go way back to 1993 when color's where still unaltered. That' some of the nicest white I've ever seen on Hoth:

So what happened?

I'm trying again the 16GB version. Maybe I'm just really scared of the blue tint?

BuddhaMaster said:

Hey there,

I don't know how active The Aluminum Falcon is.

I've recently gave the semi-specialized V2 a view and it rather impressive then I gave Empire Strikes Back semi-specialized a go and I was very disappointed. Clearly stated in descriptions "to remove the blue tint that was introduced in the DVD versions".

What I see is a clear, thick blue tint all over Hoth, just as blue as any dvd ever was!:

Shouldn't it be ...less blue ...more white?

Actually here's a comparison picture from the recently uploaded Japanese Collector's edition. They go way back to 1993 when color's where still unaltered. That' some of the nicest white I've ever seen on Hoth:

So what happened?

I'm trying again the 16GB version. Maybe I'm just really scared of the blue tint?

Thanks! I'm very glad that you enjoyed my latest Star Wars release.

I actually haven't released the Empire Strikes Back Semi-Specialised Edition V2 yet though, I am currently on finalising the colour grading for that and Return of the Jedi. The version you downloaded there is from a year ago when I first released these three Semi-Specialised editions for the first time, so its colour grading doesn't fit with my latest Star Wars release. I've learnt a few tricks since then so the colour grading for this V2 of Empire Strikes Back that i'm about to release should be consistant with my latest Star Wars release and look much better overall than my release from a year ago, I expect Hoth will also look much better and more natural than my previous release.

Hoth during that scene definately won't look like that screencap you posted from the Japanese Collector's laserdisc though, the snow looks too yellow on my monitor, especially considering that its meant to be an evening/night shot. It isn't surprising because all three Star Wars OT films from the Japanese laserdiscs seem to have a strong blanket yellowish orange tint over the majority of the scenes of the three films for some reason. Those Japanese Collector's laserdiscs weren't a useful guide for colour grading these films for the V2 releases at all to be honest.

towne32 said:

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

I think it looks great. I think the main flaw is the somewhat obvious sound cuts that we've discussed a bit already, so no need to dwell on that more. It would be lovely to see that fix in the 16gb version, though.

As far as other editing decisions go, as you've said, everyone would probably create a slightly different version for themselves. I personally would love a copy with *no* CGI 'dinosaurs' at all (or flying droids) in addition to the rest of your changes. But, different strokes for different folks.

And I did notice the grey line in that shot. Is it only a single frame with this?

If I had access to blu-ray level HD footage of the shots you're talking about without the 'dinosaurs', I'd certainly consider removing the one that walks accross Luke and Ben when they're in the speeder about to talk to the storm troopers. 

 I agree that the flying droids aren't the end of the world.

Would you consider asking Harmy/team negative1 to use their 35mm scan to get rid of the giant dino blocking the camera? It would probably need a lot of color alteration. Given that a lot of that has probably already been done on the shot, I'm not sure how much a clip can be changed back and forth before it starts getting... odd.

I don't necessarily like the 'dino' that they pass *after* the stormtroopers. But, the landspeeder was a mess in that shot as it was originally done. (I recall reading that it was processed and blurred repeatedly, and it shows). So, short of some rotoscoping to keep the speeder and lose the creature, it's probably fine for semi-specialized as is.

There is the shot when they're first pulling into the city, specific to the SE, where there are exact duplicate stormtroopers on both sides, making the exact same motions. I like the shot (for SE purposes), but the identically moving stormtroopers make it look like a 90's video game. Again, probably not an easy fix by any means.

Hmm, it's fascinating because i'm looking at althor1138's incredibly useful Star Wars COLD release to quickly compare the SE to the GOUT and it seems like that dino walking across was put there on purpose to hide the cheap looking half painted white and green R2D2 unit that passes by. Which is the lesser of two evils is the question, GL thinks the dino it seems. I'm 50/50 to be honest.

The shot when they pass the dino after the stormtroopers, I have no preference whether the dino is there or not, both are fine to me, though the GOUT and Japanese laserdisc release have a lot more deadspace below the R2D2 droid with the red top than the SE releases, making the GOUT/laserdisc shot look more like a set and a bit fake compared to the SE releases IMHO. In this case I would definately choose the SE shot because of the reduced amount of deadspace, making for better frame composition and making the set look more real, a definate improvement in my book.

The third thing you mentioned is something i've never noticed (nice spot, though you probably wish you hadn't noticed it now haha) so its not really an issue for me. As you say though, even if it was, I don't think there's that much I could do about it.

 I never really thought of the up close dino-skin as an attempt to block the green droid. Just had another look, and I don't think the droid looks too bad (surely he would have blocked the ugly yellow one instead?).

You're right about the other points.

I also compared the sound changes (as the shot switches) in your version, the SE, and the original. I think you're mostly right, that you found pretty good spots to cut. 

I think what's problematic for you is the very brief look at the first dino, after the dupli-troopers shot. I see why you have it there. Before the shenanigans, it's a prototypical example of what the SE is trying to do in expanding mos eisley, and you're *not* making a despecialized. But more importantly, the up-close dino skin in the next shot would be so much worse without the viewer having been exposed to what that creature *even is*. But the shot is so quick the way you've got it. It's a bit awkward in both the video and your sound cut. Have you considered cutting when the dino's feet hit the ground? The ridiculous part, honestly, is the swinging jawa.

In conclusion: Mos Eisley is a mess and it's difficult to strike a good balance.

How bad the droid is is definately something everybody will have a different opinion on. That droid does look pretty cheap to me and it looks cheaper and cheaper each time I look at him to be honest, I can understand why GL would want to get rid of him so bad, it looks like the sort of cheap prop that would have expected to see in a low budget 70's sci-fi TV series or something like that. You don't expect to see something of such lazy workmanship in a film classic like Star Wars.

Is he cheap enough to break the fourth wall for me now that i've noticed him and take me out of the film each time I watch that scene? Probably. Has the CG dino crossing ever taken me out of the film? Honestly, no, never. That's the only thing that's important to me so I prefer the dino, even if I had the UOT footage in blu-ray quality I'd choose the dino over the cheap looking R2D2 unit I think. I just wish that GL had come up with a more subtle way to hide that drioid.

I see what you've saying about cutting when the dino puts his foot down but there was a very good reason why I cut where I did. There is another speeder coming in from the bottom of the frame. I tried cutting when the speeder luke and ben fully cross the frame but then the other speeder coming from the bottom is fully in the frame and I found it very jarring to cut there because the shot suggests that your eyes should follow the second speeder, which is of course is what you're meant to do when watching the SE because it causes the Jawas to fall off and swing from side to side. Ones eyes not being able to follow the second speeder and see what happens due to the cut was very jarring for me, taking me out of the film.

I tried many cut points and settled on this one because I felt it struck a good compromise between letting the speeder ben and luke are on get most of the way across the frame so you know where they're going while not allowing that speeder coming in from the bottom to come into the frame enough to catch the viewers eye and thereby jarr the viewer out the film when you cut away from the second speeder. I tried all the different cut points I could and felt that this one was the one that jarred me the least, so that's the one I went for. That that cut point happened to work really nicely as an audio cut point as well IHMO was just serendipity.

Thanks for all the detailed explanations! 

It's easy enough for me to glance at these things and think of alternatives, but it's quite another to try them out and see how they work. I do feel the opposite way about the dino vs. droid, but to each their own. The dino makes me feel like I'm back in 1997 and CGI cut scenes in video games are just starting to become a thing, but are not very good yet.

But it's just a personal preference. Obviously, as someone posting in this thread, I am not 100% anti-SE. I think there's nothing wrong with getting a bit crazy with a 20th anniversary theater re-release! So long as you don't try to wish away history after that. For just about anything *living* that has been done with CGI (Dinos, Jedi Rocks sequence, Sarlac*, Jar Jar ;) ) itjust misses the mark on a technical level. There are other flaws on top of those, in many cases. But if they spliced a Jabba prop into ANH well instead of a terribly anachronistic model, I wouldn't mind it sticking around despite the other faults with it (re-used dialog, breaking the Jabba reveal).

*on that note, I'm crossing my fingers that you can make this particular edit work. :)

Thanks for the words. Still I'm under the impression that you can really simply reduce the blue's by some 10-15% for the special editions to get rid of the tint. It really is THAT severe

You can simply remove as much blue's as until Hoth becomes basically white. It will look instantly gratified. At least for me it looks right.

If you set Blue to 89% and Green to 93% the snow parts look about right

Thats what I usually do in my media player, because I can't stop playing with the controls. And I really can't stand the BLUE ;)

towne32 said:

Thanks for all the detailed explanations! 

It's easy enough for me to glance at these things and think of alternatives, but it's quite another to try them out and see how they work. I do feel the opposite way about the dino vs. droid, but to each their own. The dino makes me feel like I'm back in 1997 and CGI cut scenes in video games are just starting to become a thing, but are not very good yet.

But it's just a personal preference. Obviously, as someone posting in this thread, I am not 100% anti-SE. I think there's nothing wrong with getting a bit crazy with a 20th anniversary theater re-release! So long as you don't try to wish away history after that. For just about anything *living* that has been done with CGI (Dinos, Jedi Rocks sequence, Sarlac*, Jar Jar ;) ) itjust misses the mark on a technical level. There are other flaws on top of those, in many cases. But if they spliced a Jabba prop into ANH well instead of a terribly anachronistic model, I wouldn't mind it sticking around despite the other faults with it (re-used dialog, breaking the Jabba reveal).

*on that note, I'm crossing my fingers that you can make this particular edit work. :)

It seems that we all have different tolerances for different changes in the SE, which is why its pretty much impossible for anybody to make a version that combines the two which will make everybody happy. You clearly really dislike the dinos but the dinos have never been an issue for me. That bit with the stormtroopers riding on those CG animals looking for the droids in the desert has never been an issue with me for the same reason.

By contrast though, you wouldn't be too bothered by keeping that Jabba scene in Star Wars so long as they used a decent prop while I absolutely HATE that scene and it has little to do with the CG Jabba. It's probably the change I hate the most out of all the SE changes throughout the OT, closely followed by Greedo shooting first and Hayden Christenson replacing Sebastian Shaw in the Jedi Ghosts scene in Return of the Jedi. I hate the Jabba scene in Star Wars for three main reasons:

1) Its simply repeating all the information we were already told during the Han Solo/Greedo scene

2) It makes Jabba look like a clown, a buffoon that nobody in their right mind would be afraid of, certainly not like Han is in Empire Strikes Back

3) It ruins the surprise and final brilliant reveal in Return of the Jedi of this villain that has been a menace hanging over Han and the others, a dark shadow looming over them throughout the entire trilogy, with people thinking 'Oh, its that clown from Star Wars again'.

Everybody has a different opinion on what should be kept/what should stay. The only sane thing for me to do is go with what works for me. Hopefully others will agree with a lot of my choices and be able to enjoy these Semi-Specialised Editions as well.

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

Thanks for all the detailed explanations! 

It's easy enough for me to glance at these things and think of alternatives, but it's quite another to try them out and see how they work. I do feel the opposite way about the dino vs. droid, but to each their own. The dino makes me feel like I'm back in 1997 and CGI cut scenes in video games are just starting to become a thing, but are not very good yet.

But it's just a personal preference. Obviously, as someone posting in this thread, I am not 100% anti-SE. I think there's nothing wrong with getting a bit crazy with a 20th anniversary theater re-release! So long as you don't try to wish away history after that. For just about anything *living* that has been done with CGI (Dinos, Jedi Rocks sequence, Sarlac*, Jar Jar ;) ) itjust misses the mark on a technical level. There are other flaws on top of those, in many cases. But if they spliced a Jabba prop into ANH well instead of a terribly anachronistic model, I wouldn't mind it sticking around despite the other faults with it (re-used dialog, breaking the Jabba reveal).

*on that note, I'm crossing my fingers that you can make this particular edit work. :)

It seems that we all have different tolerances for different changes in the SE, which is why its pretty much impossible for anybody to make a version that combines the two which will make everybody happy. You clearly really dislike the dinos but the dinos have never been an issue for me. That bit with the stormtroopers riding on those CG animals looking for the droids in the desert has never been an issue with me for the same reason.

By contrast though, you wouldn't be too bothered by keeping that Jabba scene in Star Wars so long as they used a decent prop while I absolutely HATE that scene and it has little to do with the CG Jabba. It's probably the change I hate the most out of all the SE changes throughout the OT, closely followed by Greedo shooting first and Hayden Christenson replacing Sebastian Shaw in the Jedi Ghosts scene in Return of the Jedi. I hate the Jabba scene in Star Wars for three main reasons:

1) Its simply repeating all the information we were already told during the Han Solo/Greedo scene

2) It makes Jabba look like a clown, a buffoon that nobody in their right mind would be afraid of, certainly not like Han is in Empire Strikes Back

3) It ruins the surprise and final brilliant reveal in Return of the Jedi of this villain that has been a menace hanging over Han and the others, a dark shadow looming over them throughout the entire trilogy, with people thinking 'Oh, its that clown from Star Wars again'.

Everybody has a different opinion on what should be kept/what should stay. The only sane thing for me to do is go with what works for me. Hopefully others will agree with a lot of my choices and be able to enjoy these Semi-Specialised Editions as well.

 Oh, I fully agree with all of those reasons, and I think it has no place in an *ideal* version of the movie. I simply mean that, while watching it, the thing that takes me out of the movie the most is that it feels like I'm watching a youtube video on "how to do CGI in maya" or something. It was a neat little bonus to show off unused footage in the '97 release, but I think it honestly should never be shown aside from a DVD/bluray easter egg section.

BuddhaMaster said:

Thanks for the words. Still I'm under the impression that you can really simply reduce the blue's by some 10-15% for the special editions to get rid of the tint. It really is THAT severe

You can simply remove as much blue's as until Hoth becomes basically white. It will look instantly gratified. At least for me it looks right.

If you set Blue to 89% and Green to 93% the snow parts look about right

Thats what I usually do in my media player, because I can't stop playing with the controls. And I really can't stand the BLUE ;)

I'm already removing the blanket blue tint with these Semi-Specialised Editions. Looking at that nighttime scene with my latest regraded settings though, it looks like that scene is meant to be bluish, which would make sense because its in the evening/at night so the sun isn't out. Also that scene is meant to feel very cold I think so we are more worried that Luke is going to freeze to death. During the daytime the snow should certainly look more white though, which is what my regraded settings achieve I believe. Here's a comparison between the blu-ray and my regraded version removing the blanket blue tint:

http://www.screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/78520

towne32 said:

kk650 said:

towne32 said:

Thanks for all the detailed explanations! 

It's easy enough for me to glance at these things and think of alternatives, but it's quite another to try them out and see how they work. I do feel the opposite way about the dino vs. droid, but to each their own. The dino makes me feel like I'm back in 1997 and CGI cut scenes in video games are just starting to become a thing, but are not very good yet.

But it's just a personal preference. Obviously, as someone posting in this thread, I am not 100% anti-SE. I think there's nothing wrong with getting a bit crazy with a 20th anniversary theater re-release! So long as you don't try to wish away history after that. For just about anything *living* that has been done with CGI (Dinos, Jedi Rocks sequence, Sarlac*, Jar Jar ;) ) itjust misses the mark on a technical level. There are other flaws on top of those, in many cases. But if they spliced a Jabba prop into ANH well instead of a terribly anachronistic model, I wouldn't mind it sticking around despite the other faults with it (re-used dialog, breaking the Jabba reveal).

*on that note, I'm crossing my fingers that you can make this particular edit work. :)

It seems that we all have different tolerances for different changes in the SE, which is why its pretty much impossible for anybody to make a version that combines the two which will make everybody happy. You clearly really dislike the dinos but the dinos have never been an issue for me. That bit with the stormtroopers riding on those CG animals looking for the droids in the desert has never been an issue with me for the same reason.

By contrast though, you wouldn't be too bothered by keeping that Jabba scene in Star Wars so long as they used a decent prop while I absolutely HATE that scene and it has little to do with the CG Jabba. It's probably the change I hate the most out of all the SE changes throughout the OT, closely followed by Greedo shooting first and Hayden Christenson replacing Sebastian Shaw in the Jedi Ghosts scene in Return of the Jedi. I hate the Jabba scene in Star Wars for three main reasons:

1) Its simply repeating all the information we were already told during the Han Solo/Greedo scene

2) It makes Jabba look like a clown, a buffoon that nobody in their right mind would be afraid of, certainly not like Han is in Empire Strikes Back

3) It ruins the surprise and final brilliant reveal in Return of the Jedi of this villain that has been a menace hanging over Han and the others, a dark shadow looming over them throughout the entire trilogy, with people thinking 'Oh, its that clown from Star Wars again'.

Everybody has a different opinion on what should be kept/what should stay. The only sane thing for me to do is go with what works for me. Hopefully others will agree with a lot of my choices and be able to enjoy these Semi-Specialised Editions as well.

 Oh, I fully agree with all of those reasons, and I think it has no place in an *ideal* version of the movie. I simply mean that, while watching it, the thing that takes me out of the movie the most is that it feels like I'm watching a youtube video on "how to do CGI in maya" or something. It was a neat little bonus to show off unused footage in the '97 release, but I think it honestly should never be shown aside from a DVD/bluray easter egg section.

Yes I agree, it looks like GL was experimenting with CG at the time and CG Jabba was nowhere near the level that it should have been to actually be included in the film, irrespective of all the narrative problems it creates.

On the other hand I felt all the CG additions in Mos Eisley were of a much better visual quality overall. Excluding the droid slamming the other one and the swinging jawas, I really like the additions that were made to Mos Eisley, making it feel more like a lived in city rather than a set, I felt it was one of the things where GL really improved on the UOT and one of the reasons why I made these Semi-Specialised Editions.

kk650 said:

 

Yes I agree, it looks like GL was experimenting with CG at the time and CG Jabba was nowhere near the level that it should have been to actually be included in the film, irrespective of all the narrative problems it creates.

On the other hand I felt all the CG additions in Mos Eisley were of a much better visual quality overall. Excluding the droid slamming the other one and the swinging jawas, I really like the additions that were made to Mos Eisley, making it feel more like a lived in city rather than a set, I felt it was one of the things where GL really improved on the UOT and one of the reasons why I made these Semi-Specialised Editions.

What are your thoughts on the Sarlacc CGI? I think it looks terribly dated, especially the "beak" part. Again, it reminds me of 1990's video games and ruins the mystery and absurdity of the monster. Since you say your V2 of RoTJ is in final colorizing stages, you have probably already decided whether or not to deal with the Sarlacc?

towne32 said:

kk650 said:

 

Yes I agree, it looks like GL was experimenting with CG at the time and CG Jabba was nowhere near the level that it should have been to actually be included in the film, irrespective of all the narrative problems it creates.

On the other hand I felt all the CG additions in Mos Eisley were of a much better visual quality overall. Excluding the droid slamming the other one and the swinging jawas, I really like the additions that were made to Mos Eisley, making it feel more like a lived in city rather than a set, I felt it was one of the things where GL really improved on the UOT and one of the reasons why I made these Semi-Specialised Editions.

What are your thoughts on the Sarlacc CGI? I think it looks terribly dated, especially the "beak" part. Again, it reminds me of 1990's video games and ruins the mystery and absurdity of the monster. Since you say your V2 of RoTJ is in final colorizing stages, you have probably already decided whether or not to deal with the Sarlacc?

I've never had any problem with the CG of the Sarlacc pit, I thought it was fairly well done. That said though, I've always been one to believe that when it comes to making something frightening on screen, less is more, so in that sense I prefer the original sarlacc that had a lot more mystery to it and was scarier without all the beak IMHO.

The problem is that there isn't blu-ray level quality footage of the original sarlacc pit, so if I wanted to include the original sarlacc I would have to be constantly cutting between SD footage and HD footage. I tried it in the past when I was first creating these Semi-Specialised releases and the results were not satisfactory, the difference in image quality between the two sources kept jarring me out of the film. For the time being i'm going to go with the SE sarlacc until a high enough quality source with the original sarlacc pit appears so the changes between the SE blu-ray footage and the original theatrical footage are not jarring, then i'll most likely switch back to the original beakless sarlacc.

Turisu said:

Isn't that white/green R2 unit seen later being lowered into one of the X-wings before the assault on the Death Star?

I feel that removing him from Tattooine undermines his personal journey somewhat. The least George could have done is replace him with a dinosaur in that scene as well. In fact, replacing all the X-wing droids with dinosaurs would add so much more awesome to the Battle of Yavin!

Dinos during the Battle of Yavin, scary thought haha

Don't be surprised if you see some of those dinos on tattoine in episode VII though, if only to keep the fans of the prequels happy, I don't think we've seen the last of them.

_,,,^..^,,,_ said:

kk650 said:

Here's a comparison between the blu-ray and my regraded version removing the blanket blue tint:

http://www.screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/78520

Good job! And don't forget we have blue snow also on Earth - take a look at The Thing Blu(e)-ray... (^^,)

Cheers Andrea! :)

A quick little update on how these Semi-Specialised Editions are progressing:

The Retro, Classic and Technicolour settings have now been finalised on Star Wars, Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi, each film is colour consistant with the others of the same setting, ie. the three Retro releases are consistant with each other, the Classic releases are consistant with each other, the Technicolor releases are consistant with each other. I'm very satisfied with how they look now. I hope you also like what i've done with these. These releases should start coming out very soon.

One last thing, the Retro release currently available on myspleen looks exactly the same as the new Retro release coming out soon, apart from one or two colour inconsistencies in a shot or two I missed the first time which i've now corrected and many distracting coloured dots and one big error I posted a screencap of above that appear throughout the film that have been removed. So if you liked what I did with the Retro release, you should like this new Retro release even more.

edit: went back and figured it out.

So, retro is similar to the V1 releases.

Technicolor is the more saturated version.

Classic is... somewhere in between?

It's nice to have options. Hopefully you're not having to do 12 releases of RoTJ (yubnub/new endings, 9gb and 16gb, 3 color gradings).