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Why was the '04 DVD set such a botched release?

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 (Edited)

The color changes were odd, most of the scenes seem to have a slight turquoise/teal tone added to them. The Hoth scenes have a heavy blue tone added to them. Now, I wouldn't mind the blue tone if it was subtle, but they added too heavy of a blue tone to it. Lucasfilm doesn't seem to be capable of subtlety anymore.

Almost all of the continuity errors were left in the movie, only a few were addressed. Like Han's shirt in ESB, english text translated to their sci-fi text, and that's about it. 

The censoring of blaster shots was a stupid, pointless change aimed at the kiddies to make the movie more "child friendly." A lot of shots of characters being shot by blasters was shortened to make the shot hitting them less visible and we all know about the infamous Greedo shooting first scene.

A lot of the special effects and continuity errors were not addressed. Like the pinkish squares surrounding the tie fighters.

Who did the restoration of the movies? Was LFL the ones who restored the movies or did they have a separate company restore them. When they did the '04 DVD restoration, did they restore the OOT film prints and then reinsert the '97 SE changes to that, or did they just work with the '97 prints and expand from them?

Why did Lucas pay so much attention to strange and unnecessary changes while continuity errors were left intact? Why didn't Lucas explain these changes in the '04 DVD commentary? How could the most popular Science Fiction films in history get such poor treatment?

Feel free to point out other poor changes and errors that weren't addressed.

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Some think it was a quality-control screwup, others think it was a deliberate attempt to 'modernize' the look of the films- to make them look more like the prequels. :-/

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If youre referring to Han's shirt in the carbon freeze, i thought it was determined that it wasnt a continuity error, but rather lighting that made the shirt appear dark.

aka nostromo777 on myspleen

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Echo3 said:

If youre referring to Han's shirt in the carbon freeze, i thought it was determined that it wasnt a continuity error, but rather lighting that made the shirt appear dark.

It was just the lighting. All the behind-the-scenes footage of that scene clearly show him in a white shirt. 

 

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 (Edited)

Because George and Lucasfilm don't care about putting out a quality product anymore, how hard is that to figure out look at the 2006 gout biggest insult and joke in cinema history.

That is how George Rewards the millions of fans who made him a very rich man.

Too bad the remaining film prints and negatives are slowly rotting and someday will be lost to time.  If a real restoration is to be done now is the time fuck waiting, George could call R. Harris to supervise the restoration.

But he simply does not care.  Therefore the fans do not care for him or anything he puts out whether it is the special editions,prequels, new indiana jones, clone wars, force unleashed etc.

The younger fans who like flashy graphics "and a special effect without a story" can have them if they want to waste their hard earned money or their parents on them, Though George deserves nothing until the 1977-1983 trilogy is restored.

I really hope the jerk loses sleap at night over it, but that would be someone owning up to the error of their ways.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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skyjedi2005 said:

Because George and Lucasfilm don't care about putting out a quality product anymore, how hard is that to figure out look at the 2006 gout biggest insult and joke in cinema history.

That is how George Rewards the millions of fans who made him a very rich man.

 

 i've just gotten a ton of versions of the PT on DVD, and they seem quality to me

(not the quality of the movies) , the actual documentaries, video quality, and

included material..

 

i think all the people that got those, would think so to...

 

the young indiana jones boxsets on DVD are amazing, and the new indiana

jones remasters are good too.. and if INDY 4 is coming out on bluray, i think

it would do really well too..

 

so what do mean that they don't care about quality anymore????

 

if you mean that there was only 1 product, the SE DVD's that weren't quality

then you might have a point, everything else they've put out has been fine..

and excellent quality..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

However, my SW prequel DVD's, Willow, and Indiana Jones trilogy all look and sound great. So yeah, I wouldn't say that they simply don't care about about quality.

However, I would like to hear any excuses that Lucasfilm has as to why the 2004 SE set isn't up to par since, after all, those DVD's are supposed to be the best representation of those films available.  I'm sure SOMEBODY at LFL had to have noticed that something wasn't quite right. I was excited when I heard that it was being restored, and that some of the SE additions (like that funky 1997 CG Jabba) were being redone or tweaked, but now I wish they would have just released the 97 SE masters as they were and just left everything alone.

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Bobocop said:

The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

while they are a disappointment to you, and the tiny majority of people on this board,

they were a huge success in sales for the fans that DID want star wars (SE) on DVD...

when they came out HDTV's weren't that big in sales, and they still aren't, although

they're slowing rising (and in 2009 when the US goes all digital, i'm sure this christmas

will have record sales)...   

 

so why is it insult? people DID get STAR WARS on DVD, that was the point, to replace

their VHS tapes...

 

 

However, my SW prequel DVD's, Willow, and Indiana Jones trilogy all look and sound great. So yeah, I wouldn't say that they simply don't care about about quality.

 

agreed.

 

However, I would like to hear any excuses that Lucasfilm has as to why the 2004 SE set isn't up to par since, after all, those DVD's are supposed to be the best representation of those films available.  I'm sure SOMEBODY at LFL had to have noticed that something wasn't quite right. I was excited when I heard that it was being restored, and that some of the SE additions (like that funky 1997 CG Jabba) were being redone or tweaked, but now I wish they would have just released the 97 SE masters as they were and just left everything alone.

 

but why should they give out any excuses.... what would be the point?

 

i had them all on laserdisc, and since those were the best quality at the time, i didn't notice

any difference on the dvds, which were the same quality, so what was there to complain about?

 

the definite boxset laserdisc, the japanese pressings were all excellent quality..

 

and if you were on this board, and had been keeping up with all the excellent laserdisc

transfers (and some are still going on)... you would have already had the OT on DVD

several times over... for free.... way before the official dvd's came out..

 

i'm sure a lot of people are watching their own custom LD transfers compared to the DVD's ,

so why keep arguing about something you already (should) have?

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Because we shouldn't have to bootleg?

"Right now the coffees are doing their final work." (Airi, Masked Rider Den-o episode 1)

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Yeah, most of us don't have laserdisks and LFL shouldn't exxpect us to get our OOT from that format only and not DVD. Lucas even said he was looking forward to the time when all the OOT VHS tapes have deteriorated, I think he forgot about laserdisks. Idiot.

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Janskeet said:

Yeah, most of us don't have laserdisks and LFL shouldn't exxpect us to get our OOT from that format only and not DVD. Lucas even said he was looking forward to the time when all the OOT VHS tapes have deteriorated, I think he forgot about laserdisks. Idiot.

 

 i'm not blaming you, if you weren't interested in getting a laserdisc player,

maybe you weren't interested in getting high quality video either?

 

anyways, a decent laserdisc player now, is about as cheap as a cheap dvd player (>$50),

and finding the definitive boxset on laserdisc costs anywhere from $20-$50 depending

on the condition..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Molly said:

Because we shouldn't have to bootleg?

 

 boy does this seem like the worst board to be on if you don't bootleg..

did you expect something different when you came here?

 

i've gotten tons of 'fanedit's  from here, and those are legal if you own the original,

and all those LD remasters are just continuations of the fanedits..... to me..

 

so i see no problem in getting them for free, along with all the high definition

versions, which no one seems to care about either, and all the other documentaries,

spoofs, and everything else...

 

i've paid for star wars on about 25 different versions by now, so why can't

i get free versions in HD, or whatever else is out there? since there is no

official HD version, it's not like they're losing any money..

 

don't you think you've paid for several versions before, and deserve more?

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Did Adywan post his HD versions yet? I didn't see them at fanedit.org.

 

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Negative1 - sorry to post this but I have to say I find your attitude to those that feel we deserve a high quality release of the original trilogy a tad perplexing!

YOU may be perfectly happy with the SE DVDs or the GOUT releases, but I am not, nor are those that care about quality resentations of a rather significant slice of film history!

 

I don't understand why you make these comments on ORIGINALtrilogy.com, AND are currently in the process of trying to transfer the actual ESB film... and yet you appear to NOT care about those that DO want a decent transfer of the originals - don't get where you are coming from mate in other words Lol! If you're perfectly happy with the GOUT then why are you bothering looking into ways of transferring an ORIGINAL print of ESB? I certainly hope - by the way - it's successful and applaud your efforts into looking into this.

It's just some of your comments directed at those who are not happy with the 2004/2006 release I find... odd.

The GOUT was NOT a high quality release, and did NOT give us what we wanted - hence this website and others similar to it. I agree it is probabky the best transfer of the original ld masters, but NOT of the 3 original films which is the whole point.

 

Cheers,

 

- 7FN

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Nobody answered my question about -Who did the restoration of the movies? Was LFL the ones who restored the movies or did they have a separate company restore them. When they did the '04 DVD restoration, did they restore the OOT film prints and then reinsert the '97 SE changes to that, or did they just work with the '97 prints and expand from them?

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seventiesfilmnut said:

Negative1 - sorry to post this but I have to say I find your attitude to those that feel we deserve a high quality release of the original trilogy a tad perplexing!

YOU may be perfectly happy with the SE DVDs or the GOUT releases, but I am not, nor are those that care about quality resentations of a rather significant slice of film history!

 

 

alright, let's try this again, because we seem to run into this conundrum every single

time it is brought up:

--------------------------

1)  for the last time, i feel that there is no slippage in the quality of releases from Lucasfilm,

why? because i am comparing what we have now to what was released on laserdisc,

and to me there is no difference

2) in fact, with the SE versions, on laserdisc, and DVD the quality is very high already...

with the new DVD's having the highest quality..

-----------------------

i don't know why people think the quality of Lucasfilm is slipping when, they put

out amazing boxsets on laserdisc with THX, remastered, and on CAV, on an SD

tv they are excellent......................... but what do we constantly hear, about how

bad Lucasfilm is, how their products are shoddy etc..

 

when in fact there is only 1 issue, with 1 boxset, and that's about the GOUT..

ok, next..

 

I don't understand why you make these comments on ORIGINALtrilogy.com, AND are currently in the process of trying to transfer the actual ESB film... and yet you appear to NOT care about those that DO want a decent transfer of the originals - don't get where you are coming from mate in other words Lol! If you're perfectly happy with the GOUT then why are you bothering looking into ways of transferring an ORIGINAL print of ESB? I certainly hope - by the way - it's successful and applaud your efforts into looking into this.

 

 

i've been coming to this board for several years, but was never involved, are you telling me

that all those people that did transfers, had projects and edits worked in vain?

 

are you saying you're not happy with any of the transfers, that you can get for free?

 

and on top of that with the completely free HD versions of the SE that blow away anything

else, that you can't even buy , no one cares about those?

 

my intent when i came to this board, was to find out about what was going on in

this community, (i didn't really have internet access or high speed before), and when

i came here, all i heard was complaining, griping, etc (and i still see it, like this thread)..

 

yes, there are people that take action (adywan, all the faneditors, sound editors, and

moderators), but what about the rest of you? there are so many great ideas on this

board ..........   one that caught my eye was the 8mm transfers, which i ended up getting

for free..  honestly that is still the most amazing thing i have just seen here, and it completely

blew me away ... well i didn't know anything about film, but someone mentioned 16mm, and

then there was a thread about 35mm film too... around that time, someone mentioned

there were some auctions going on ebay........... well i figured someone would take action,

but i didn't hear back from anyone, so that's why i got involved... this was for star wars,

by the way, and i lost that auction by a close amount...

 

i thought it would be a great looking at everyone elses ideas about what could be

done if we got one, around this time, i got a 32  widescreen tv, and thought, well

wouldn't it be nice to watch these movies in high definition...   and then the ESB 35mm

auction came up, again, i couldn't find anybody interested ....... and i was determined

not to let it get away, and ended up winning it..

 

so for me, it was more of a technical challenge, and interest in film, etc, and having

a project to do, and that's why i got involved...

 

it has nothing to do with me being unsatisfied with previous releases, or complaints

against Lucasfilm, etc... like i said, i have about 4 different HD versions of the SE,

and with the Wookiegroomer versions, i'm incredibly happy.... well to add to that

Adywan's HD releases are only going to get better.... so why shouldn't i be happy

about it..

 

that's what puzzles me about this board, no one really seems to care too much

about the fact that these HD versions are out there....yeah, i know they're SE,

but whats more important to you? having them in HD, or having them in perfectly

acceptable SD format for the OT, with the many, many excellent transfers people

have made already?

 

 

It's just some of your comments directed at those who are not happy with the 2004/2006 release I find... odd.

 

yeah, well i find it odd, that people refuse to confirm the availability of all the hard work

of people on this board already available..

 

The GOUT was NOT a high quality release, and did NOT give us what we wanted - hence this website and others similar to it. I agree it is probabky the best transfer of the original ld masters, but NOT of the 3 original films which is the whole point.

 

Cheers,

 

- 7FN

 

 well, i think this website has done an excellent job of educating people, giving them

tons of technical resources (which i hardly see anyone else using, like the excellent

scripts, and details on how to fix the GOUT versions by yourself) .....  

 

i just don't know why people don't want to be proactive, and do things for themselves,

when it is being handed to you for free, and you're given all the information to handle

it here, especially with the technical help, and references that are available..

 

i barely knew anything about avisynth before i came here, and now i'm modifying

the GOUT stabilisation script ....  i haven't done much video editing or conversion,

but working with Adywans HD files, i know how to convert multiple HD sources

back and forth from MKV, to .EDO for -> HD DVD formats...... i didn't know anything

about film scanning, but know i know how to make 2k previews, and learn the

basics of color correction ...... i've learned about sound sources, from goodmusician...

i've learned about dead formats like the CED versions, and now i have a player,

and the movies in that format ... i didn't know much about video capture, but

people are there to help me learn the ins and outs of analog and digital capture...

 

this board has been the greatest audio/video resource i have ever seen,

there is not one question (ok maybe one about VC1 codecs, help me!) that

hasn't been answered, or that someone hasn't figured out how to do, or

made a suggestion..... i could never have dreamt that i could contribute or

do anything useful like this before  .... it was only after watching adywan's

ANH:R edit that my eyes were opened to the technical capabilities that are

available now, and to the people on this board with all the other projects

going on...

 

i'll say it again, and i'll keep saying it everytime someone complains..

 

STOP being so sedate, TAKE matters into your own hands, BE PROACTIVE

 

everyone here is willing to help you with whatever your questions/problems

are, why is it so hard to actually take the step, and do something about your

issues by yourself?  

 

i took that step, and now look where we might be heading...

 

i can only imagine what someone on this board that comes after me that is more skilled, has more

money, more time, and more dedication than i will ever have, will do for the star wars community,

because it will blow you away.....

 

i'm just one casual fan, that decided to take a step into an interesting technical project,

and wanted to see where it went...

 

by the way, i can't even begin to explain how meaningful it was to me, to get the

Star Wars reel 6, and examine the frames for the preview scans.... it really was

an amazing step back into time..

 

i hope some of you will feel that  way someday, instead of constantly complaining

about the present, and ignoring what the future could be like..if you would just take that first step...

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Bobocop said:

The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

You know the worst part of it? I have my DVD player connected via HDMI to my HDTV and guess what, the damn DRM crap prohibits me to zoom. I need to use a second YUV connection for all letterboxed DVDs to zoom them to their full supposed glory.

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iRantanplan said:
Bobocop said:

The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

You know the worst part of it? I have my DVD player connected via HDMI to my HDTV and guess what, the damn DRM crap prohibits me to zoom. I need to use a second YUV connection for all letterboxed DVDs to zoom them to their full supposed glory.

 

that has nothing to do with the DVD's, so don't try to blame Lucasfilm for that,

thats a hardware limitation that affects all films..  it has NOTHING TO DO WITH DRM..

later

-1

 

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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negative1 said:
iRantanplan said:
Bobocop said:

The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

You know the worst part of it? I have my DVD player connected via HDMI to my HDTV and guess what, the damn DRM crap prohibits me to zoom. I need to use a second YUV connection for all letterboxed DVDs to zoom them to their full supposed glory.

 

that has nothing to do with the DVD's, so don't try to blame Lucasfilm for that,

thats a hardware limitation that affects all films..  it has NOTHING TO DO WITH DRM..

later

-1

 

Actually it has something to do with Lucasarts, they could have released the DVD anamorphic. Doesn't matter if it's only an upscale. And it's DRM indeed which prohibits the zoom as this is the fault of HDCP copy protection which is part of HDMI (and optional on DVI).

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iRantanplan said:
negative1 said:
iRantanplan said:
Bobocop said:

The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

You know the worst part of it? I have my DVD player connected via HDMI to my HDTV and guess what, the damn DRM crap prohibits me to zoom. I need to use a second YUV connection for all letterboxed DVDs to zoom them to their full supposed glory.

 

that has nothing to do with the DVD's, so don't try to blame Lucasfilm for that,

thats a hardware limitation that affects all films..  it has NOTHING TO DO WITH DRM..

later

-1

 

Actually it has something to do with Lucasarts, they could have released the DVD anamorphic. Doesn't matter if it's only an upscale. And it's DRM indeed which prohibits the zoom as this is the fault of HDCP copy protection which is part of HDMI (and optional on DVI).

i think you missed my point,

the DRM is on your hardware, its not on the DVD,

so it would affect ANY DVD you played, anamorphic or not....

later

-1

 

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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You are fudging the issues here mate - this has NOTHING to do with not being grateful for the many releases here. I don't think anyone on this board has been ungrateful for any release.

The quality of the HD SE are indeed incredible, BUT I want to see the films I grew up with WITHOUT any digital tinkering, bad musical edits, and incredibly bad re-colour timings... I have some decent play back equipment, but even with upsampling the GOUT looks pretty bad on my projector on a 100" screen. I paid the same price for the DVD I would for any other modern release, and yet get sub-modern playback quality, labelled as THX. It's a joke!

I paid MONEY to purchase the SE DVDs, and had done the same (frather alot of money) when the original SE laserdusc first came out... in fact I got it the day it came out - what a saddo haha!

Not sure I like your rather snide comments about moaning and yet not contributing. I've contributed my fair share of (hopefully) helpful comments on this board over the years, plus my RIPs of the 1989 LD soundtrack to Star Wars and Empire are out there, in addition to some other LP rips. So you're saying nobody can complain about the CONTENT of the Lucasfilm releases UNLESS they produce what they're moaning they don't have on this board?!?

You also seem to have a bit of a 'laying down the law' attitude in your posts: As a consumer, I have every right to complain about a release if it is sub-standard, and the GOUT is most definately that. That's partly the reason this website exists no? Until Lucasarse releases a decent version of the original trilogy I think every film fan has EVERY right to complain about it.

Also remember not every fan has your money to purchase original film reels, let alone the cash to get it all transferred. This is not something WE should have to do - that should have been done by Lucasfilm.

We'll just have to agree to disagree I think - life's too short etc etc.

Out of here.

- 7FN

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negative1, I agree that it's best to focus on the positive and what the future will bring us. But there's one thing you said that I have to disagree with:

negative1 said:

i had them all on laserdisc, and since those were the best quality at the time, i didn't notice any difference on the dvds, which were the same quality, so what was there to complain about?

By this logic, if the GOUT masters were released as-is onto Blu Ray, there would be no room to complain, since they're the same quality as the GOUT DVDs.

The GOUT is a drop in quality for a DVD release. Not a drop in quality of the actual image itself, but a drop in the quality of effort that LFL put into the release. LFL has long had a reputation (up to the late 90s, at least) for releases that pushed the technological edge. The GOUT definitely did NOT push the edge. It was a stale, 13-year-old crumb.

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

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negative1 said:
iRantanplan said:
negative1 said:
iRantanplan said:
Bobocop said:

The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

You know the worst part of it? I have my DVD player connected via HDMI to my HDTV and guess what, the damn DRM crap prohibits me to zoom. I need to use a second YUV connection for all letterboxed DVDs to zoom them to their full supposed glory.

 

that has nothing to do with the DVD's, so don't try to blame Lucasfilm for that,

thats a hardware limitation that affects all films..  it has NOTHING TO DO WITH DRM..

later

-1

 

Actually it has something to do with Lucasarts, they could have released the DVD anamorphic. Doesn't matter if it's only an upscale. And it's DRM indeed which prohibits the zoom as this is the fault of HDCP copy protection which is part of HDMI (and optional on DVI).

i think you missed my point,

the DRM is on your hardware, its not on the DVD,

so it would affect ANY DVD you played, anamorphic or not....

later

-1

 

 

Lucasarts is one of the (many many many many many) labels that insisted on HDCP in HDMI connections so of course it's their fault.

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iRantanplan said:
negative1 said:
iRantanplan said:
negative1 said:
iRantanplan said:
Bobocop said:

The 2004 DVD's are a disappointment to say the least, and the 2006 GOUT discs, while they look 'alright' on a standard 4:3 TV, are an insult not only to the fans but also to the achievements of Lucas himself and ILM.

You know the worst part of it? I have my DVD player connected via HDMI to my HDTV and guess what, the damn DRM crap prohibits me to zoom. I need to use a second YUV connection for all letterboxed DVDs to zoom them to their full supposed glory.

 

that has nothing to do with the DVD's, so don't try to blame Lucasfilm for that,

thats a hardware limitation that affects all films..  it has NOTHING TO DO WITH DRM..

later

-1

 

Actually it has something to do with Lucasarts, they could have released the DVD anamorphic. Doesn't matter if it's only an upscale. And it's DRM indeed which prohibits the zoom as this is the fault of HDCP copy protection which is part of HDMI (and optional on DVI).

i think you missed my point,

the DRM is on your hardware, its not on the DVD,

so it would affect ANY DVD you played, anamorphic or not....

later

-1

 

 

Lucasarts is one of the (many many many many many) labels that insisted on HDCP in HDMI connections so of course it's their fault.

 

 so why blame one company and not all of them?

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]