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When did The Empire Strikes Back become more highly regarded than Star Wars? — Page 3

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It was pretty ballsy to end on a downbeat cliffhanger note like that. And a considerably longer wait to find out what happens next compared to movie serials of old.

I hope they shoot the sequels concurrently, and get them out a year or two apart instead of three, because I'm not getting any younger. ;)

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Where were you in '77?

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Father Skywalker said:

Star Wars is not a movie. There is no Star wars, episode, star wars. Star wars is the name of all 6 movies in both trilogies, not a paticular movie in paticular..... All Star wars films are called/named star wars; not a paticular movie called "star wars"...

Strike two.

"Close the blast doors!"
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Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Father Skywalker said:

Star Wars is not a movie. There is no Star wars, episode, star wars. Star wars is the name of all 6 movies in both trilogies, not a paticular movie in paticular..... All Star wars films are called/named star wars; not a paticular movie called "star wars"...

Strike two.

lol

I wish that I could just wish my feelings away...but I can't.  Wishful wishing can only lead to wishes wished for in futile wishfulness, which is not what I wish to wish for. 

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I want to see where this goes.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

(It hasn’t happened yet)

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LexX said:

Father Skywalker said:

Markdav said:

I never saw any of the Star Wars movies as a kid, but I always do remember hearing from most fans that Star Wars was the best of the trilogy.  To be sure, I looked up IMDB's top 250 in 1996, and found that Star Wars was ranked #1, and Empire was ranked #26!  Below is the link to prove it.

 

http://web.archive.org/web/19961219233558/us.imdb.com/top_250_films

 

I looked at more lists, and found that around 2004-2005 is when ESB surpassed Star Wars on the list, and today ESB is the only Star Wars movie on the top ten.  Now I'm sure there were plenty of people in the 1980s and 1990s who considered ESB the best of the trilogy, but it seems like in the 1980s and 1990s Star Wars was considered the masterpiece of the trilogy, with Empire ranked behind it.  Now, in 2010, Empire is widely considered the crowning achievement of the saga.  Has anyone else noticed how opinions on these two films seem to have changed over the years?  I'm curious as to why they've change the way they did.

Star Wars is not a movie. There is no Star wars, episode, star wars. Star wars is the name of all 6 movies in both trilogies, not a paticular movie in paticular..... All Star wars films are called/named star wars; not a paticular movie called "star wars"...

LOL. Nice trolling.

I aint trolling.....

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Father Skywalker said:

I aint trolling.....

"Star Wars" is the name of a great movie that came out in 1977.  A series of altered versions of the same movie started appearing years later under a different name.  This is easily verified by a mountain of historic artifacts.  The primary purpose of this forum is to support efforts to preserve the original 1977 movie.  Saying that it doesn't exist is thus anathema to posting here.

"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars

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Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Father Skywalker said:

I aint trolling.....

"Star Wars" is the name of a great movie that came out in 1977.  A series of altered versions of the same movie started appearing years later under a different name.  This is easily verified by a mountain of historic artifacts.  The primary purpose of this forum is to support efforts to preserve the original 1977 movie.  Saying that it doesn't exist is thus anathema to posting here.

Ok, now I kinda understand it. ""Star Wars" is another name/word for star wars episode 4-a new hope; being that it was originally intended to be one movie, rather than an entire saga and series, the first one got the nickname "star wars", and just "star wars"......

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stretch009 said:

Tyrphanax said:

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Anchorhead said:

I never considered Empire superior to Star Wars.  I did like it when it was first released and even had a laserdisc of it a few years after that.  After a while, the things that I had never liked about it (Vader as father, Yoda, 3PO silliness) ended up becoming the things that caused me to lose interest.  To me, it felt small and stylized compared to Star Wars.  It was too slick, too formula.  I very much prefer the vast unknown, far away adventure of Star Wars.

I agree with you.  Also, the script and acting are noticeably better in SW (esp. Guinness and Cushing).  ESB has lots of cool stuff in it for saga fans, but as a movie, SW can stand up against any film ever made.

I dunno about that. There is a lot of weird delivery for me (Especially on Harrison's part) in Star Wars.

 

Any examples?

I don't know... the scene with Han and Leia in the cockpit of the MF on the way to Yavin always strikes me as oddly subpar.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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Father Skywalker said:

Ok, now I kinda understand it. ""Star Wars" is another name/word for star wars episode 4-a new hope; being that it was originally intended to be one movie, rather than an entire saga and series, the first one got the nickname "star wars", and just "star wars"......

I know, it's a neat little story, innit? I mean to nickname "Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope" just "Star Wars"... It's like they didn't know about "The Tragedy Of Darth Vader" back then. And then when "Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back"  came everyone would be like "WHAAAAAAT...?" because they thought they missed something.

But they didn't, becuz "Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back" is the direct sequel to "Episode IV: A New Hope", if you disregard the EU (Expanded Universe).

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Wexter said:

Father Skywalker said:

Ok, now I kinda understand it. ""Star Wars" is another name/word for star wars episode 4-a new hope; being that it was originally intended to be one movie, rather than an entire saga and series, the first one got the nickname "star wars", and just "star wars"......

I know, it's a neat little story, innit? I mean to nickname "Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope" just "Star Wars"... It's like they didn't know about "The Tragedy Of Darth Vader" back then. And then when "Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back"  came everyone would be like "WHAAAAAAT...?" because they thought they missed something.

But they didn't, becuz "Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back" is the direct sequel to "Episode IV: A New Hope", if you disregard the EU (Expanded Universe).

Why is Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker's story called a "tragedy"???

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Lucas has been calling it that for many years now.

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Where were you in '77?

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I think it is because the first three films ("Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace", "Star Wars Episode II: Attack of The Clones" and "Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith"), are kinda tragic.

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Wexter said:

I think it is because the first three films ("Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace", "Star Wars Episode II: Attack of The Clones" and "Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith"), are kinda tragic.

Why??

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Father Skywalker said:

Ok, now I kinda understand it. ""Star Wars" is another name/word for star wars episode 4-a new hope; being that it was originally intended to be one movie, rather than an entire saga and series, the first one got the nickname "star wars", and just "star wars"......

When "Star Wars" came out in 1977, there were no episodes.  The name of the movie was simply "Star Wars".  That was the title of the movie in the print, on the credits, in the opening crawl, all promotional material, all trailers, placards, reviews, toys, ... everything.  There was never an "Episode 4 A New Hope" until after ESB came out, several years later.  "Star Wars" is not a nickname, it was the name of the movie when it was released, and was that way for several years thereafter.  There do not exist prints prior to ESB that say anything but "Star Wars".

Whether George intended in 1977 for it to be part of a saga is another discussion.

The movie today is sometimes abbreviated SW, sometimes ANH.  But to say that there isn't (or wasn't) a movie called Star Wars is simply not true.

"Close the blast doors!"
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Father Skywalker said:

Wexter said:

I think it is because the first three films ("Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace", "Star Wars Episode II: Attack of The Clones" and "Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith"), are kinda tragic.

Why??

 

Because he (Anakin Skywalker, Jedi Knight) is like this super smart child who destroys the droid control ship and then he falls in love and goes evil and kills children and makes the love of his life lose the will to live and then he is in this armor and can hardly breath and he doesn't even know he has two children (he will find out about this in Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back).

Sorry for the spoilers, all.

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I almost had an aneurysm catching up on this topic, but I'm just going to operate under the pretext that we are teaching someone with absolutely no information outside of the very, very mainstream canon (including the EU).

This is our chance to shine. But I need to lie down first so this headache will go away.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

(It hasn’t happened yet)

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Wexter said:

I think it is because the first three films ("Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace", "Star Wars Episode II: Attack of The Clones" and "Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith"), are kinda tragic.

I think they're very tragic!

"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars

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Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Wexter said:

I think it is because the first three films ("Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace", "Star Wars Episode II: Attack of The Clones" and "Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith"), are kinda tragic.

I think they're very tragic!

 +1!

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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^^Tragic for different reasons altogether...haha

I wish that I could just wish my feelings away...but I can't.  Wishful wishing can only lead to wishes wished for in futile wishfulness, which is not what I wish to wish for. 

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The story itself is a tragedy.

Too bad it doesn't show all that well through the cheesy oneliners, bad acting and poor writing.

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Father Skywalker said:


the first one got the nickname "star wars", and just "star wars"......

Nickname, you say?

Posted Image

 

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BmB said:

The story itself is a tragedy.

Too bad it doesn't show all that well through the cheesy oneliners, bad acting and poor writing.

You can say that again!!!!!

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Mainly because it wasn't more of the same. I think it continued the story in a logical way. If you blow up the Death Star, you do not win for good, The Empire will come after you. It tells you what happens afterwards it isn't just Episode 4 with same characters, different villain. It is a logical continuation and I think it is the one of the greatest movies ever made. Granted, I like the first one a lot but I think this one is definitely my favorite but I guess that is just my preference.

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OneCentSky said:

Mainly because it wasn't more of the same. I think it continued the story in a logical way. If you blow up the Death Star, you do not win for good, The Empire will come after you. It tells you what happens afterwards it isn't just Episode 4 with same characters, different villain. It is a logical continuation and I think it is the one of the greatest movies ever made. Granted, I like the first one a lot but I think this one is definitely my favorite but I guess that is just my preference.

What the hell was the point of blowing up the first death star anyways??? Why did the rebels steal the plans for it??

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Father Skywalker said:

OneCentSky said:

Mainly because it wasn't more of the same. I think it continued the story in a logical way. If you blow up the Death Star, you do not win for good, The Empire will come after you. It tells you what happens afterwards it isn't just Episode 4 with same characters, different villain. It is a logical continuation and I think it is the one of the greatest movies ever made. Granted, I like the first one a lot but I think this one is definitely my favorite but I guess that is just my preference.

What the hell was the point of blowing up the first death star anyways??? Why did the rebels steal the plans for it??

To make a good ending to a movie

J