Sign In

What can Disney do to improve the nuEU?

Author
Time

I quite liked Dark Disciple, Lords of The Sith, Tarkin and Weapon of A Jedi but a lot of people are still displeased with the new canon. So what specifically can Disney do to improve the image it has with people who loved the EU? 

For starters I think they should canonize Kotor I & II, canonize the Darth Bane we know (not that fucking abomination in TCW) and make the Plagueis novel canon as well. 

All one would have to do to make the Darth Bane Trilogy canon is to remove the Vaapad reference and have Zannah kill him on Moraband

Author
Time

I think the only thing to do is give it time. Yes, nothing that's out so far is as good as the best of the old stuff, but the new EU has only been going for a year, and the quality of the now-Legends stuff had been declining for a while anyway. I think it would be a good idea to be less shy about explicitly re-canonizing things from Legends, and if the implication at the end of Aftermath does in fact pan out, I think that'll be a step in the right direction. But really, I think the biggest thing is that we don't have a large enough sample size yet to really know what we're dealing with.

Don't know much about Darth Bane because I never found the Sith to be terribly interesting, but that and KOTOR are so far removed from the films in the timeline that I'd imagine they're not that tied into classic-era continuity anyway. I've always figured the Old Republic stuff probably functions in-universe as "legend", in that it's so distant that its historicity is ambiguous. I always thought that line they had when they rolled out the Legends label about how these are stories that may or may not be true made the most sense when thinking about that distant past stuff. As for Plagueis, I didn't read that one either, but I think a case could be made for re-canonizing it. I seem to remember Lucas somehow granting it higher status than the other books when it came out, and Luceno makes frequent reference to it in Tarkin. I'm not sure if they'd just take the Legends label off the existing book as-is, but it wouldn't surprise me if they brought a lot of that stuff back in.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

- not canonize Sith tattoos

- not canonize the thought bomb

- not canonize the SWTOR Sith Empire's symbol, titles, and ships

- not canonize the Rakata

- establish Plagueis's death as occuring before TPM

- more adaptations of unproduced TCW episodes

If Plagueis shows up in the ST, not only will I refuse to watch the movies, but I won't so much as watch the trailers, either. - DuracellEnergizer

Author
Time

darklordoftech said:

- establish Plagueis's death as occuring before TPM

 why?

the way Luceno had it unfold was great.

Author
Time

swagmasta69 said:

darklordoftech said:

- establish Plagueis's death as occuring before TPM

 why?

because Plagueis is nowhere to be seen in TPM

If Plagueis shows up in the ST, not only will I refuse to watch the movies, but I won't so much as watch the trailers, either. - DuracellEnergizer

Author
Time

They could make it not suck.  That would be a general direction to aspire towards.

Except wait, no, they can't do that.  Never mind.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Fire whoever's been giving the shitty new comics and novels the stamp of approval and replace them with someone who'll actually say a great big "NO!" to schlock stories.

Abandon the stupid concept of "canon" once and for all and let the writers write whatever stories they may in whatever continuity they wish (be it a previously established continuity or their own personal continuity).

Cancel all the ongoing Star Wars comic series and replace them with a single SW series -- an anthology series containing multiple stories per issue focused on a wide variety of characters from various timeframes. 

Publish fewer novels.

That's it -- that's all it would take to improve the nuEU for me.

“Okay, I’m goin’, takin’ off. See ya… bye….” — Chip Douglas

“This concludes our broadcast day. Click.” — Chip Douglas

Author
Time

DuracellEnergizer said:

Fire whoever's been giving the shitty new comics and novels the stamp of approval and replace them with someone who'll actually say a great big "NO!" to schlock stories.

Abandon the stupid concept of "canon" once and for all and let the writers write whatever stories they may in whatever continuity they wish (be it a previously established continuity or their own personal continuity).

Cancel all the ongoing Star Wars comic series and replace them with a single SW series -- an anthology series containing multiple stories per issue focused on a wide variety of characters from various timeframes. 

Publish fewer novels.

That's it -- that's all it would take to improve the nuEU for me.

 I'd have to agree with you there. Forcing every story to fit into a single continuity was a large part of what made things so hard for me to follow. Give fans a choice of whatever writer's continuity they like more. Star Wars is big enough for this to work.

Also I'd like to see less retcons. Hundreds of those spilling into each other didn't help with my confusion.

Killing threads with Cynicism since 2003

Author
Time
 (Edited)

hairy_hen said:

They could make it not suck.  That would be a general direction to aspire towards.

Except wait, no, they can't do that.  Never mind.

Other than "cuz nostalgia" can you explain why the entirety of the nuEU sucks? What about the aforementioned Dark Disciple, Weapon of A Jedi and Lost Stars? These among a couple of other books I  listed are getting rave reviews 

Weapon of A Jedi:

Amazon- 4 &1/2 out of 5 stars based on 55 reviews 

Goodreads- 3.76 out of 5 stars based on 305 reviews

Audible- 4.50 out of 5 stars based on 136 reviews

Lost Stars: 

Amazon- 5 out of 5 stars based on 174 reviews

Goodreads 4.40 out of 5 stars based on 516 reviews.

Audible 4.70 out of 5 stars based on 456 reviews

Dark Disciple: 

Amazon- 4 and 1/2 stars baded on 218 reviews 

Goodreads- 3.99 out of 5 based on 1580 reviews  (which is pretty good considering that the highest rated book on Goodreads is a 4.22 out of 5)

Audible- 4.60 out of 5 stars based on 1163 reviews

So lets not act like the entirety of the nuEU is bad. Shit, even books like Lords of The Sith and Tarkin (while not the best books) are better than MOST of the stuff in the EU. 

Sources and shit:

Weapon of A Jedi -

Amazon:http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1484724968/ref=s9_psimh_gw_p14_d1_i2?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=desktop-1&pf_rd_r=0NGWDVVVDVHDZPF1M324&pf_rd_t=36701&pf_rd_p=2079475242&pf_rd_i=desktop

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/25067044-the-weapon-of-a-jedi

http://www.audible.com/pd/Teens/Star-Wars-The-Weapon-of-the-Jedi-Audiobook/B011PVW9PG/ref=a_hp_c3_1_1_i_pd_recs_1?ie=UTF8&pf_rd_r=1CRVMZGKJ1CEDMS8VHCC&pf_rd_m=A2ZO8JX97D5MN9&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_i=5000&pf_rd_p=2074596142&pf_rd_s=center-3

Lost Stars -

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1484724984/ref=s9_psimh_gw_p14_d1_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=desktop-1&pf_rd_r=0NGWDVVVDVHDZPF1M324&pf_rd_t=36701&pf_rd_p=2079475242&pf_rd_i=desktop

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/25067046-lost-stars

http://www.audible.com/pd/Sci-Fi-Fantasy/Star-Wars-Lost-Stars-Audiobook/B011PVVZL0/ref=a_search_c4_1_1_srTtl?qid=1444082290&sr=1-1

Dark Disciple - 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345511530/ref=s9_psimh_gw_p14_d1_i11?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=desktop-1&pf_rd_r=0NGWDVVVDVHDZPF1M324&pf_rd_t=36701&pf_rd_p=2079475242&pf_rd_i=desktop

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23277298-dark-disciple

http://www.audible.com/pd/Sci-Fi-Fantasy/Dark-Disciple-Star-Wars-Audiobook/B00ZAURNZA/ref=a_search_c4_1_1_srTtl?qid=1444082371&sr=1-1

Author
Time

DuracellEnergizer said:

Abandon the stupid concept of "canon" once and for all and let the writers write whatever stories they may in whatever continuity they wish (be it a previously established continuity or their own personal continuity).

If it's noted that these stories were to take place in an alternate universe or is a legend I could dig it. If not the shit is going to be a mess just like the EU was. I've always wanted to see an alternate universe in which Luke joins Vader at the end of ESB. 

Author
Time

Lord Haseo said:

If it's noted that these stories were to take place in an alternate universe or is a legend I could dig it. If not the shit is going to be a mess just like the EU was.

A policy of non-canon doesn't seem to have hurt Star Trek's expanded universe any. 

“Okay, I’m goin’, takin’ off. See ya… bye….” — Chip Douglas

“This concludes our broadcast day. Click.” — Chip Douglas

Author
Time

Funnily enough, it's been within the last few years that the Trek novels have started their own general canon of agreed upon events. Probably as a response to the death/abandonment of the prime timeline to JJTrek.

DuracellEnergizer said:

Cancel all the ongoing Star Wars comic series and replace them with a single SW series -- an anthology series containing multiple stories per issue focused on a wide variety of characters from various timeframes. 

 Ever read Dark Horses Star Wars Tales line? It was precisely this.

Help back OMNO!

Author
Time

Yep, I read Star Wars Tales.

“Okay, I’m goin’, takin’ off. See ya… bye….” — Chip Douglas

“This concludes our broadcast day. Click.” — Chip Douglas

Author
Time

Either enforce the supposed continuity to which they are aspiring, or don't. The EU was rebooted, but is otherwise the same thing it always was. The vines are growing into the foundation faster this time.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

DuracellEnergizer said:

Fire whoever's been giving the shitty new comics and novels the stamp of approval and replace them with someone who'll actually say a great big "NO!" to schlock stories.

Abandon the stupid concept of "canon" once and for all and let the writers write whatever stories they may in whatever continuity they wish (be it a previously established continuity or their own personal continuity).

Cancel all the ongoing Star Wars comic series and replace them with a single SW series -- an anthology series containing multiple stories per issue focused on a wide variety of characters from various timeframes. 

Publish fewer novels.

That's it -- that's all it would take to improve the nuEU for me.

Here's the funny thing about the old canon: nothing was ever explicitly de-canonized. Even the Holiday Special counted, on some level.

Which brings us to the whole concept of different levels of canon.

Which is half the reason the EU was rebooted in the first place.

What did George think of the Thrawn trilogy? Obviously he gave the OK for post-Jedi stories to be told, and I remember hearing about how he liked the Dark Empire comic.*

Did the EU just get away from him later on or was it always intended as a cash grab from the very beginning?

Like, he also gave the OK to kill off Chewie in Vector Prime.

I get the impression that the EU writers were leaving a contingency plan for the eventual Episode VII but that George was leaving no such plan for the EU. It simply didn't count, in his view.

*Although, Dark Empire contains one of the three big post-Jedi EU things that George said never happened in that now infamous quote.

Author
Time

Tobar said:

Hire good writers.

If you scroll up there are notable examples that there are good writers due to certain novels getting universal praise. So the whole "make it better" response doesn't necessarily equate to the entirety of the nuEU

Author
Time

Fang Zei said:

What did George think of the Thrawn trilogy? Obviously he gave the OK for post-Jedi stories to be told, and I remember hearing about how he liked the Dark Empire comic.*

...

*Although, Dark Empire contains one of the three big post-Jedi EU things that George said never happened in that now infamous quote.

Liking a story and considering it "real" aren't necessarily synonymous.

“Okay, I’m goin’, takin’ off. See ya… bye….” — Chip Douglas

“This concludes our broadcast day. Click.” — Chip Douglas

Author
Time

Lord Haseo said:

Tobar said:

Hire good writers.

If you scroll up there are notable examples that there are good writers due to certain novels getting universal praise. So the whole "make it better" response doesn't necessarily equate to the entirety of the nuEU

 Don't hire crap writers.

Help back OMNO!

Author
Time

Specifically, don't hire Chuck Wendig (again).

“Okay, I’m goin’, takin’ off. See ya… bye….” — Chip Douglas

“This concludes our broadcast day. Click.” — Chip Douglas

Author
Time

Tobar said:

Lord Haseo said:

Tobar said:

Hire good writers.

If you scroll up there are notable examples that there are good writers due to certain novels getting universal praise. So the whole "make it better" response doesn't necessarily equate to the entirety of the nuEU

 Don't hire crap writers.

Now that I can accept because who ever wrote Heir To The Jedi and Aftermath needs to be fired immediately. They need to have James Luceno do some more novels and as someone else pointed out there needs to be less novels. 2...maybe 3 a year. 

Author
Time

Isn't "good" writing subjective? Apparently someone thought he was good. Someone with an opinion just as valid as yours even if it's opposite.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Sevb32 said:

Isn't "good" writing subjective? Apparently someone thought he was good. Someone with an opinion just as valid as yours even if it's opposite.

Universal consensus trumps the loud yelling of the few. We're living in the age of contrarian but I think unpopular opinions should have a limit. I'm not going to take someone seriously if they say that Batman and Robin is a better film than TDK. 

Author
Time

Tobar said:

Hire good writers.

 spot on!

Author
Time

I think we should get more daring and bold stories instead of the usual "Oh, no! Another Imperial commander is taking over the remnants of the Empire!". I'd love to see alternate universe storylines like "What if Luke joined Vader?". "What if Greedo shot first and KILLED Han?", or even "What if the prequels were good?". I'd pay good money to see that.