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The thread for the serious discussion that started in the "Am I a Bully?" thread. — Page 3

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Also for the record, DrCrow, I'm sorry I used to the word excellent to you, and I'm sorry that I could not read your mind and understand the rest of the story that you didn't bother mentioning that would have influenced me to not use the word.  It's my fault really, my telepathy has gotten a bit rusty.  It's understandable to ignore somebody and say they want to destroy all christians when they use the word "excellent", especially when in context of a story they only have the least important part of.  

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Possessed said:

Also for the record, DrCrow, I'm sorry I used to the word excellent to you, and I'm sorry that I could not read your mind and understand the rest of the story that you didn't bother mentioning that would have influenced me to not use the word.  It's my fault really, my telepathy has gotten a bit rusty.  It's understandable to ignore somebody and say they want to destroy all christians when they use the word "excellent", especially when in context of a story they only have the least important part of.  

 Sorry I should have put that part in it. 

Maybe it is different in other places but here in our small towns the churches are really the center of the communities and where a lot of groups gather and they really are the public meeting places.  I know that makes it sound like the 1850s but that is what it is like in the small towns around here so even with out the deaths burning down three churches really is an attack on everyone. I should have explained that too.

Sorry I got so mad, I shouldn't have it was not the Christian thing to do.

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It doesn't make it seem like the 1850's, and I was also being sarcastic.  I should also probably change my avatar because now that I think about it it does sort of give off a "church burny" vibe.

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Yeah a a decaying corps give off a much better vibe.

Then again Peter died on an upside down cross, so how that became an anti-Christian thing I have no idea.

History and people are strange and not logical.

Also all I know is that my area reminds me of a modern day version of the towns from the book series that started with Little House in the big Woods, so I always compare it to the 1800s. At least it feels that way when the phones stops working for days at a time:)

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TV's Frink said:

And Vice Mayor?  Let's not demote him unnecessarily!

I meant me.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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Ah.  Well, sorry to break this to you,  but at best you are qualified for Assistant to the Vice Mayor of Crazytown.

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 (Edited)

DrCrowTStarwars said:

Yeah a a decaying corpsE giveS off a much better vibe.

 Actually, it's Regan from "The Exorcist" in her fully *POSSESSED* form.  See what I did there?

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TV's Frink said:

Ah.  Well, sorry to break this to you,  but at best you are qualified for Assistant to the Vice Mayor of Crazytown.

 Assistant Vice Mayor of Crazytown?  I can live with that.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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xhonzi said:

Warbler said:

xhonzi said:

Anyways, there seems to be "bullying" coming from only one participant in this thread.  If telling other people that they should make sweet love to themselves (feat. expletives) is still considered bullying.

Which seems to be a rather silly overreaction to hearing opposing views in a thread he started to discuss a topic.

*shrug*

 Sorry but you pissed me off. 

Oh dear!  By all means then, you are free to treat me however you wish without judgment.

When I get pissed, I tend to loss my temper.  

You said  I allowed the bullying to happen.  That is complete utter bs.   I didn't want to be bullied, I didn't choose to be bullied.   It just happened.  IT WASN'T MY FAULT!

I didn't say anything about you.

You said this:

xhonzi said:

you must teach the bullied not to allow it to happen. 

 about all bullied people.  Since I was bullied, it is about me.   It implies that we allowed it to happen, which is complete b.s.  

I did, however, say that the bullied were indeed faultless, and generally have the power to not care what bullies say to them

I didn't feel like I had that power and it seems like you are like everyone that tried to help me back then by treating me like it was all my fault for how I reacted instead of the bully's fault for doing it in the first place. 

p.s.  I don't think you can regard what I said as bullying.    

What is it then, exactly, when you reply to civil conversation with "f*$S you!" as often as you do?  Perhaps it's not bullying... but it's not nice.

 I don't do it often.  It must have been multiple months since the last time I did it in this thread.   I don't call it bullying.   Not sure how it could possibly be called that.  I call it someone saying something stupid that was complete b.s. that offended me and pissed me off and I lost my temper.   

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xhonzi said:

TV's Frink said:

Ah.  Well, sorry to break this to you,  but at best you are qualified for Assistant to the Vice Mayor of Crazytown.

 Assistant Vice Mayor of Crazytown?  I can live with that.

 No, Assistant TO the Vice Mayor.

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 (Edited)

xhonzi said:

DrCrowTStarwars said:

Hey I am just spitballing ideas here.

Er... maybe I'm campaigning for Vice Mayor of Crazy Town here, but I believe DrCrow is using a little thing called "hyperbole" to illustrate his point. 

given his mental problems and his history of extreme and illogical irrational posts, I am not so sure you can conclude this.

I could be wrong, but I think he is saying "here are the alternatives in stamping out bullying- either you completely infringe on all human rights, or you teach people to stop empowering bullies by caring what they have to say".

Or you could take more reasonable steps againts bullies that don't infringe on all human rights.   Do more to teach that it is wrong to bully.   Do more to encourage kids to report bullying to teachers or other appropiate adults at school when they see it.   Keep a better eye on the bullied and the bully.   Do whatever you can reasonably do to keep bullies and the bullied separate from one another at school.  Make sure that people that are supposed to watch kids at recess and or on the playground, do just that instead of just gossip with each other(which happened at my school a lot).   When a kid a reports being bullied, take it seriously, more seriously than it used to be taken.   Sure, teach the bullied to try to not to react to bullied and care what he says,  but make sure you don't at like he is blame for how he reacted when the bully is to blame for bullying in the first place.   Also punish to bully appropiately(and no, I don't me that bullys should be executed).    I can't describe how much it upset me that I was treated that I did something wrong for how I reacted, and the bully seemed to be able to get away with murder.

Perhaps this comparison is apt: You will never solve "the drug problem" by going after the dealers. 

the difference is, those that buy and take drugs, choose to do so,  the bullied do not choose to be bulled.

Unless we move to a complete police state where every action is monitored and enforced.  But NO ONE is suggesting we do that.  Probably.

 no I am not suggesting a police state.  Never did suggest it nor come anywhere near close to suggesting it.   A police state is not what I want. 

Now, I think I am done with this.   Perhaps creating this thread was a bad idea.  This subject is a very sensitive issue for me, perhaps too sensitive for a discussion like this.   Sorry.   

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Warbler said:

xhonzi said:

Warbler said:

xhonzi said:

Anyways, there seems to be "bullying" coming from only one participant in this thread.  If telling other people that they should make sweet love to themselves (feat. expletives) is still considered bullying.

Which seems to be a rather silly overreaction to hearing opposing views in a thread he started to discuss a topic.

*shrug*

 Sorry but you pissed me off. 

Oh dear!  By all means then, you are free to treat me however you wish without judgment.

When I get pissed, I tend to loss my temper.  

 Okay see I think here is the problem. That is all every bully I have ever dealt with in my life is guilty of, they are upset about something so they take it out on those around them.

I think the real divide here is in how bullies are viewed. Some of us view them as troubled and not doing anything that any kid could end up doing. Others seem to view them as just monsters who need to be locked up and shouldn't be treated as members of the human race.

Also I don't think education will work since I am pretty sure every bully knows they are doing the wrong thing already.  I don't see how that will stop them.

Now requiring parents to stay home with their kids or have them watched by another adult and sending both the kid and the adult who was supposed to be watching them to prison if the kid acts out, that would work. Do you really think parents would let their kids bully other kids if they could be sent to prison for five years if their kid did it?  I don't.

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Possessed said:

DrCrowTStarwars said:

Yeah a a decaying corpsE giveS off a much better vibe.

 Actually, it's Regan from "The Exorcist" in her fully *POSSESSED* form.  See what I did there?

 D'oh!

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DrCrowTStarwars said:

Now requiring parents to stay home with their kids or have them watched by another adult and sending both the kid and the adult who was supposed to be watching them to prison if the kid acts out, that would work. Do you really think parents would let their kids bully other kids if they could be sent to prison for five years if their kid did it?  I don't.

 Do you really think parents have that much control over their kids, especially into high school? Some kids are bullies despite being brought up by good parents, who drilled into them that they should show kindness to other people and shouldn't harm anyone for any reason. And if you mean by the first part of that paragraph that bullies should be under supervision 24/7, then that's just insane.

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You have to be assertive in order to fend off a bully. As someone who was bullied a lot when in school, I really think I'd have been respected more if I'd have just looked him in the eye and said, "Suck my fat one you cheap dime-store hood." 

I would never recommend physical violence against a bully (self defense is of course acceptable) even if they're asking for it. As for how they're viewed, however, I think it tends to be a little of both. There are some bullies who are the most obnoxious and mean-spirited people in the world, and it turns out that they actually have the most traumatic background you can imagine (even someone as evil as the killer from Scream had a fucked up family life).

Some are also just truly sick minded people though. There was one kid in my high-school way back in the day who was horrifically mean to everyone and even said he got a "high" off of making people angry. In the early days of the internet he'd even go on suicide help forums and tell people to kill themselves and insult them (btw, he wasn't the victim of anything that would cause this twisted of behavior). So in his case I'd say it's definitely a situation where the bully deserves to be bullied. He was the closest thing to evil I've ever personally met in my life. 

The cause and solution vary from situation to situation though.

The Person in Question

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RicOlie_2 said:

DrCrowTStarwars said:

Now requiring parents to stay home with their kids or have them watched by another adult and sending both the kid and the adult who was supposed to be watching them to prison if the kid acts out, that would work. Do you really think parents would let their kids bully other kids if they could be sent to prison for five years if their kid did it?  I don't.

 Do you really think parents have that much control over their kids, especially into high school? Some kids are bullies despite being brought up by good parents, who drilled into them that they should show kindness to other people and shouldn't harm anyone for any reason. And if you mean by the first part of that paragraph that bullies should be under supervision 24/7, then that's just insane.

 Well if they were not doing something wrong then they wouldn't need to be watched.  Kids can't be trusted, they need to be watched or they will bully other kids.

Another option is to send any kid who bullies to prison for life. After all they have proven they are a danger to other children so I say lock them up to protect all the other kids. It's a simple solution and it would stamp out the problem completely.

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I hope you don't take too much offense at me saying that those ideas are retarded. They just aren't practicable options. Any solution to bullying must be one that doesn't leave a multitude of other problems in its stead, or it isn't much of a solution.

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I might regret saying this, but I just don't think this is one of those problems we can solve. As far as I'm aware, it's human nature to do this sort of thing, and the only "solution" is to teach everyone the effects of it, tell them it's not that nice to do, and offer some methods to cope with it.

To quote Lucas:

" It's stylistically designed to be that way and you can't undo that. But we can diminish the effects of it."

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I wouldn't regret saying it because it's true. The only way to eliminate the problem might be through some of DrCrow's extreme methods, but they obviously aren't desirable means of achieving that end.

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Handman said:

I might regret saying this, but I just don't think this is one of those problems we can solve. As far as I'm aware, it's human nature to do this sort of thing, and the only "solution" is to teach everyone the effects of it, tell them it's not that nice to do, and offer some methods to cope with it.

To quote Lucas:

" It's stylistically designed to be that way and you can't undo that. But we can diminish the effects of it."

 It is taught though. Most bullies don't know or think that they're bullying. 

The Person in Question

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moviefreakedmind said:

Handman said:

I might regret saying this, but I just don't think this is one of those problems we can solve. As far as I'm aware, it's human nature to do this sort of thing, and the only "solution" is to teach everyone the effects of it, tell them it's not that nice to do, and offer some methods to cope with it.

To quote Lucas:

" It's stylistically designed to be that way and you can't undo that. But we can diminish the effects of it."

 It is taught though. Most bullies don't know or think that they're bullying. 

 Yeah, I know. I'm not saying it's perfect, we could definitely improve the way we teach it, but someone much smarter than I am would have the answer as to how.

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No I think he's on to something, we should imprison all children who bully for life.  It makes sense.  If they go to prison, they should learn not to bully really fast.  Then they can use what they've learned in their next life.  They might be reincarnated as a frog, but you win some you lose some.  At least they'll be one of those peaceful frogs.