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The new Clone Wars movie — Page 12

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skyjedi2005 said:

She even makes the characters appear to be human beings and not video game characters from Lucasarts. 

 

I don't know if that's entirely fair.

Back in the day, LucasArts actually managed to come up with some pretty convincing and fleshed-out characters... ;-)

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skyjedi2005 said:

She even makes the characters appear to be human beings and not video game characters from Lucasarts. 

Before you guys get mad at me over that, yeah i know Lucasarts Had Kyle Katarn and Revan but those are not Lucasian pieces of shit and were written by Someone else who loved the old movies.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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I don't know why every one hates the prequel trilogy i mean the story is amazing behind it and we got to see the rise of Darth Vader. Yes the originals are classics but people should appreciate the prequel trilogy more. 

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While many would argue that that amazing story isn't told too well, I think the main reason people dislike the prequel trilogy is because of the many ways it forces bad retcons on the original trilogy.  Granted, the original trilogy had many retcons, but most (not all) worked very well for the story.  The fact that Lucas felt compelled to return to the original films again and alter things just to tie it in better with the prequel trilogy speaks volumes about how poorly it was planned.

However, I don't strongly dislike the prequels.  I enjoy watching them.  I don't think they're up to the caliber of the originals at all, and trying to tie it together with the original leaves a bad taste in my mouth (which is why I rarely ever think of the prequels when I'm watching the originals), but I do enjoy seeing them from time to time.  They have some pretty good moments in them.  You just have to wait a bit for them.  ^_~

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I don't think people should appreciate the prequels more, as it is I think they get way more credit than they deserve. Anyone who is honest with themselves will realize that the prequel trilogy consists of three awful films riding on the name Star Wars. Without that SW attached to the titles, The Phantom Menace wouldn't have gotten any sequels...

Not everyone hates the prequels, a lot of people like them, and that is fine by me. I didn't feel the story was amazing, I thought the story sucked through and through. I simply don't enjoy them at all, I get about as much enjoyment out of them as I get from watching day time TV (and I absolutely f ing hate day time TV...) I don't feel like I should appreciate them more, and I never will appreciate them, I dislike them, plain and simple. There are others like me that feel the same way. They really are not good films, but it is just dandy that some people really like them.

You also have to keep in mind that some of us waited for these for close to 20 years, even though most fans didn't expect them to be as good as the OT, they were expecting something slightly not as bad as what we got. This is a factor that adds to some of our dislikes of the film, also as Gaffer pointed out, not only did these films fall about a billion miles short of expectation, but since they somehow managed not to fit with the OT very well, we end up getting revised version of the OT that have been molded to fit the akward hole the PT left for them. Not only where the films changed, which is something I am prefectly fine with, doesn't bother me a bit, but then the originals are not availble and we are told to get the VHS tapes if we really want them so badly, but they will never be on DVD. Then we finally we do get them on DVD, they are nearly on watchable on many modern TVs. Just to let you know where some people are coming from, and why the quality of the PT is such an insult to them.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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TheDoctor1987 said:

I don't know why every one hates the prequel trilogy i mean the story is amazing behind it and we got to see the rise of Darth Vader. Yes the originals are classics but people should appreciate the prequel trilogy more. 

Admittedly, the core stories behind the prequels are pretty good, but remember that a good story by itself does not a good movie make. While the concept for the PT was decent enough, the execution was terrible. Most of the main characters were obnoxious or unlikeable, the dialogue was atrocious, what "humor" there was just came across as juvenile and dorky, most of the acting was incredibly wooden, many visual effects (particularly CG characters) were so over-the-top that they destroyed suspension of disbelief, and the editing left much to be desired. Take all of those factors together, and you've got yourself a pretty good recipe to utterly destroy an otherwise potential-filled film project.

Compare that to the OT. Luke, Han and Leia are all very likeable, while Anakin is leery, creepy, obnoxious, arrogant, self-absorbed & whiny, Padme comes across as a shrill activist (and somehow manages to be even preachier than Jean-Luc Picard), and Jar-Jar is just plan irritating. A film is primarily character-driven, and if most of your main characters have nothing at all to recommend them...well, you get the idea. Dialogue? To be fair, the OT has never been touted as a pinnacle of rhetorical excellence, but when you compare its dialogue to that of the PT it comes off sounding like Shakespeare. The OT had plenty of humor, most of which was personality-driven and genuinely funny. The PT relied on silly saturday-morning-cartoon dialogue, terrible puns, and poop & fart jokes to carry the comedic element. Does the OT have better acting than the PT? I've never met anyone who would argue otherwise. Compare the worst acting in the OT (probably the Ewok village conversation between Luke and Leia in ROTJ) to, say, the "Are you an angel?" interaction in TPM, or the fireplace scene in AOTC. You get the idea. In the OT, the visual effects were very convincing and believable (and managed to take backseat to the story, thankfully.) On the other hand, I simply cannot imagine a willowy seven-foot-tall eighty-pound thin-as-a-toothpick creature existing on a stormy planet and not being blown away by the wind. Finally, consider the editing. The OT had very tight, fast-paced editing which flowed beautifully. The PT dwells on scenes waaay too long (which destroys pacing), and overexplains things that should be obvious to the audience almost as the rule, not the exception.

Anyway, hope that answers your question. It's not meant to be derogatory; simply to explain why I (and presumably quite a few others) find the PT to be so incredibly inferior to the OT, and therefore don't really appreciate it very much.

(By the way, as kewl as the notion of seeing the rise of Vader is, it's kinda rendered totally unkewl when he's ten times more likeable as an evil villain than he is as a "good guy.") ;-)

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TheDoctor1987 said:

I don't know why every one hates the prequel trilogy i mean the story is amazing behind it and we got to see the rise of Darth Vader. Yes the originals are classics but people should appreciate the prequel trilogy more. 

 

 Telling people what they "should" do is a bad idea.

"Fuck you. All the star wars movies were excellent. none of them sucked. Also, revenge of the sith is the best."

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Akwat Kbrana said:

or the fireplace scene in AOTC.

That was actually the first time I ever thought to myself "Yeah, that's how you turn a guy off.  You put on that dress and then you tell him you can't be together.  Whoever wrote this was absolutely retarded!"  That scene was so in your face laughable that it's amazing it ever got filmed.

 

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I originally posted this on the prequels in another thread:

The story of Luke Skywalker was rooting for the underdog and the oppressed. the Story of a traditional hero not like today where villains and anti heroes are the heroes of films. Where a creepy youngling serial killer becomes the hero of the saga and dethrones the story of Luke. Where goth crap and dark for darkness sake have taken over cinemas. Where is the hero that kids need to root for in stories, the good fairy story every child needs i think lucas once said

 

The whole problem with the prequels is you already know pretty much who lives and who dies and what is going to happen there are little room for surprises. The whole success of the venture was hinging on showing anakin's transformation into vader and showing he was a good man and beneficent before that happened.

Lucas fucked up the turn making it instantaneous instead of the slow seduction hinted at in the oot. Instead of turning from a good man to a bad man you a get a whiny teenage emo spoiled brat you want to punch in the face.

Not only does that turn the vader in the suit into a total whiny bitch, but you also feel nothing for anakin except he got what he deserved. He could have been left to burn in the lava and not a soul would care based on the botched characterization of a classic villain.

The biggest problem for me anakin before the suit and after the suit zero character development.

You never get that he cares for another person (except padme and that only as an object aka selfish). You never see him make any sacrifices for the republic or fighting side by side his fellow common man in the war.

All you get is a selfish ego driven bastard you really wish obi wan put out of his misery on Mustafar.

 

and earlier in this thread i posted this :

 

Why did the clone wars movie have to return to the hated land of the prequels when it could have been set after return of the jedi and actually have characters i would care about, or feel engaged by.

Who does not relate to Luke Skywalker the everyman,  Anakin is a selfish and whiny emo fag and an asshole.  You get the fealing he got just what he deserved in Revenge Of the Sith when he gets owned by Obi.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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skyjedi2005 said:

Why did the clone wars movie have to return to the hated land of the prequels when it could have been set after return of the jedi and actually have characters i would care about, or feel engaged by.

 

 Do you actually trust Lucas to make a movie with Han, Leia and Luke?  I think that would be the final nail in the coffin for many old school fans.

I'm happy to have Lucas only muck around with prequel characters.  He can do what ever he wants with them as far as I care.

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Sluggo said:
skyjedi2005 said:

Why did the clone wars movie have to return to the hated land of the prequels when it could have been set after return of the jedi and actually have characters i would care about, or feel engaged by.

 

 Do you actually trust Lucas to make a movie with Han, Leia and Luke?  I think that would be the final nail in the coffin for many old school fans.

I'm happy to have Lucas only muck around with prequel characters.  He can do what ever he wants with them as far as I care.

 

That is why i am kinda happy he did not do episodes 7-9.  Star Wars to me ended in 1983 at least as a film series.  I liked the EU that continued after jedi without ruining the saga, i liked the Zahn Trilogy.  Even the EU got ruined by the prequels and special editions because everything had to be retconned to fit the prequels and special editions even the marvel comics.

To me 1999 was an awful year Star Wars was ruined with Crapisode 1 That  Phantom Plot Movie, and of Course the Deluge of ruination of the EU started with Vector Prime.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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I think most people appreciate the potential of the prequels and what they project into it, rather than the actual construction of the films themselves. The story potential is incredible--the fall of a hero, the rise of Darth Vader, the downfall of the Jedi, a Republic torn asunder in civil war, a secret warrior sect striking out from the shadows to bring about an apocalypse, Anakin's forbidden love and his torn loyalty's between his mentor and Palpatine, his quest for immortality, etc. The actual storyline is fantastic, and the thematic elements are far more powerful than anything in the OT. But none of that gets translated to the screen; it's all flat and messy and without any emotional resonation. But, because the potential is so great, just having those elements in the storyline itself still sort of allows people to appreciate it, they can sort of project their own emotions into it and intellectually fill the great void that Lucas left. I think thats one of the reasons there is so many people convinced of how great the prequels are; the potential is there, but unfortunately none of it is used. It is like if a twelve year old had written the films; you are simultaneously admiring the very sophisticated storyline but disappointed that none of it gets pulled off. I'd like to see someone really do the prequels with all of the human drama present in its conception, because I truely believe the three films could make one of the greatest sagas of all time.

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As a friend of mine has said, the "Art of" books for the prequels really make you hurt from what might've been.

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Having seen what JarJar will look like in the series, I am so glad he wasn't in the movie! Since I was all alone in the theater, they probably wouldn't have found me slumped on the floor until closing time!

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zombie84 said:

I think most people appreciate the potential of the prequels and what they project into it, rather than the actual construction of the films themselves. The story potential is incredible--the fall of a hero, the rise of Darth Vader, the downfall of the Jedi, a Republic torn asunder in civil war, a secret warrior sect striking out from the shadows to bring about an apocalypse, Anakin's forbidden love and his torn loyalty's between his mentor and Palpatine, his quest for immortality, etc. The actual storyline is fantastic, and the thematic elements are far more powerful than anything in the OT. But none of that gets translated to the screen; it's all flat and messy and without any emotional resonation. But, because the potential is so great, just having those elements in the storyline itself still sort of allows people to appreciate it, they can sort of project their own emotions into it and intellectually fill the great void that Lucas left. I think thats one of the reasons there is so many people convinced of how great the prequels are; the potential is there, but unfortunately none of it is used. It is like if a twelve year old had written the films; you are simultaneously admiring the very sophisticated storyline but disappointed that none of it gets pulled off. I'd like to see someone really do the prequels with all of the human drama present in its conception, because I truely believe the three films could make one of the greatest sagas of all time.

Great way to put it. However, we should also state that the prequels were filled concepts and styles that were heavily incongruous with the OT despite the absence of any decent reasons for it.

"Now all Lucas has to do is make a cgi version of himself.  It will be better than the original and fit his original vision." - skyjedi2005

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I know this is really old, but did anyone else have a problem with Ahsoka wearing a halter top?  I know that Aayla Sexkura wore one, but she was a bit older and she started out in the EU.  I just think having a bit more clothes on would be a little more appropriate for a character her age and a Jedi in training.

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TheDoctor1987 said:

I don't know why every one hates the prequel trilogy i mean the story is amazing behind it and we got to see the rise of Darth Vader. Yes the originals are classics but people should appreciate the prequel trilogy more. 

 

Likewise on what zombie84 stated and I made a thread back in July stating how I hope the prequels get remade by competent writers and directors.

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lordjedi said:

I know this is really old, but did anyone else have a problem with Ahsoka wearing a halter top?  I know that Aayla Sexkura wore one, but she was a bit older and she started out in the EU.  I just think having a bit more clothes on would be a little more appropriate for a character her age and a Jedi in training.

I agree totally. She dresses far too provocatively. I mean it IS [intended to be] eye candy but why on a character so young?  

And while on that point, what is the deal with Rex? - He's meant to hold the rank of captain so why does he wear blue armour markings, Captains should be wearing RED, At least when that style of armour was still in use.

It's my understanding that even specialist troops like ARC troopes still adhere to normal colour ranking so why whould Rex be exempt? Why set up a whole Military heirarchy if you are not going to adhere to it?

 

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You people really do need to get out more.

It was a pretty good film. End of story.

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eros said:

You people really do need to get out more.

It was a pretty good film. End of story.

Why?  Am I suppose to accept 14 year old girls walking around looking like ho's just because their parents let them dress that way?  Dude, I live right down the street from a high school.  I see this type of thing every day.  That doesn't mean I have to like it.

Second, it was not a pretty good film at all.  I found myself wincing everytime Ahsoka said "Skyguy".  What the hell kind of way is that to respect the Jedi that's been charged with teaching you?  At least Anakin always referred to Obi-Wan as "Master".  And I find it hilarious that Jabba simply takes Dooku at his word that it's the Jedi that have kidnapped his son, rather than send his own cronies out to find out for sure.

This movie was laughable.

 

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I read one review where the reviewer thought Ahsoka was flirting with Anakin.  I don't think she was ever considered as a love interest.  I mean Anakin's Already Illicitly married to Senator Padme of Naboo, why would he go out with a 13 year old.  Geez unless George Lucas wanted Anakin as a pedophile which i seriously doubt despite his Stalker stare in the scene at the end  of return of the jedi,lol.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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skyjedi2005 said:

I mean Anakin's Already Illicitly married to Senator Padme of Naboo, why would he go out with a 13 year old.

Because he's a psychopath that does whatever his selfish feelings lead him to care about and desire at any given moment. Hell, this is the guy that heartlessly slaughtered countless little children over a little dream that might have implied that his wife's life might be in some danger and then was somehow able to turn right around and subsequently kill her as an additional result. He doesn't think like us ordinary people who regularly push past our selfishness enough to actually care about other people.

"Now all Lucas has to do is make a cgi version of himself.  It will be better than the original and fit his original vision." - skyjedi2005

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For me the biggest problem with the prequels is that Anakin is never built up enough as a "true hero" for his fall from grace to mean anything.  I must agree with most people here. Anakin is a whiny selfish prick who got what he deserved! We needed to see the good of Anakin and unfortunately the prequels fail to show Anakin as even being capable of putting others first

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lordjedi said:

Second, it was not a pretty good film at all. I found myself wincing everytime Ahsoka said "Skyguy". What the hell kind of way is that to respect the Jedi that's been charged with teaching you? At least Anakin always referred to Obi-Wan as "Master". And I find it hilarious that Jabba simply takes Dooku at his word that it's the Jedi that have kidnapped his son, rather than send his own cronies out to find out for sure.

This movie was laughable.

As you guys have noticed, I've not been around much lately at all. I came here to get reaction to the new movie that came out this summer. I had been thinking "Maybe this time things won't be so bad. Maybe this time a new SW movie will be okay."

This post made me realize that I never want to see The Clone Wars animated movie.

"Skyguy?" Seriously. That makes me puke.

A plot involving Jabba's son? What? WHAT?!?

This whole thing sounds like a bottom-of-the-barrel fan-fic written by a 13-year-old girl with a crush on Hayden Christensen.

At least I didn't miss anything.

I hope all is well with all of my old friends here. Talk to you again soon!

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