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.: The XØ Project - Laserdisc on Steroids :. (SEE FIRST POST FOR UPDATES) — Page 20

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I think those X0 caps look very promising, individual frames don't really give a good representation of the final moving video anyway.
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I wanted to try and bring things back on topic and ask something.

How do you guy handle color correction? Do you have a certain program? Do you have to do something to each individual frame or can you use an algorithm to handle color correction? I know you go frame by frame to clean up dirt, spots, and other damage, but I didn't know how you handle color.

Patrick
"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk." - Tuco from The Good, The Bad And The Ugly
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Discreet Lustre primarily. But I've also been doing some work in Adobe Premiere with Synthetic Aperature Color Finesse.

Contrary to what others might say, color correction isn't just a quick 2 minute process. When you color correct, you start off with a general correction of the whole film which includes gamma, black and white points, saturation, and color. Then you go into correcting individual shots. Then individual frames if need be.

Programs like these allow you to correct the colors of only certain parts of a shot, like the walls of the Tantive for instance. What we can do is look at our reference material and see what the color of the walls should be and correct just those, leaving everything else intact.

My Projects:
[Holiday Special Hybrid DVD v2]
[X0 Project]
[Backstroke of the West DVD]
[ROTS Theatrical DVD]

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I don't want to take this back into the territory we just left but I'm curious about color correction in general too.

Does the already color "corrected" (term used VERY loosely) 2004 DVD's provide more of a challenge to color correct-ors than the laserdiscs do (which seem to be in a more raw state)?

I ask that because when I did my set, I was working to tweak colors that someone else already tweaked and I found a distinct lack of dynamic range to work with. Is the same true for the DVDs? If so that's a real strong argument for the continuation of the X0 project right there.

Dr. M

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"Hey. I am assuming AWK was a flamer or something. I'm not AWK."

Sorry about that, Andy. I hadn't even heard of you when your username was mentioned, and I hope you don't think I was implying you were someone else. Welcome to the boards (belatedly.)

As to color-correcting the 04 DVDs, I couldn't answer that question, because I haven't even seen the '04 DVDs, and have had no opportunity to try. I've seen plenty of screenshots, and they look pretty bad. I can't stand that all the Tantive scenes have blue walls. What's up with that?

I also read somewhere (TF.n, I believe) that the reason the lightsabers appear so dull is because one of the many video processes used to clean up the video treats very bright light as video noise, and mutes it accordingly. This is why I like frame-by-frame fixes whenever possible or feasible, versus simply applying a filter. Lowry was under a tremendous time constrant, so this kind of stuff was allowed to pass through QC.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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The laserdiscs are closer to the actual film color obviously. But since you have to go through every shot anyway, I don't see the 2004 DVDs as being a whole lot more of a burden to work with. Maybe just a little.

The Star Wars films - and A New Hope in particular - have very "pastel" like colors. Nothing is really overly vibrant, save for things like laser blasts, engine flames, and a couple planets. The DVD's colors were brightened and saturated to match the prequel DVD releases, so most of your work would have to go into toning those colors down to match the OUT DVDs.

My Projects:
[Holiday Special Hybrid DVD v2]
[X0 Project]
[Backstroke of the West DVD]
[ROTS Theatrical DVD]

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Originally posted by: MeBeJedi
"Hey. I am assuming AWK was a flamer or something. I'm not AWK."

Sorry about that, Andy. I hadn't even heard of you when your username was mentioned, and I hope you don't think I was implying you were someone else. Welcome to the boards (belatedly.)


Thanks for the welcome. I didn't think you were implying I was; Darth Richard did, but that's okay. It's no big deal. I just didn't want it to turn into a rumor.

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http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/8653/userbar381853dp6.gif
Super Mario Bros. - The Wicked Star Story
"Ah, the proverbial sad sack with a wasted wish."
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Originally posted by: andy_k_250
Originally posted by: Darth Richard
Originally posted by: MeBeJedi
Poor OCB. Now I see the problem. He's desperate for attention and kudos for his release.

Sad, really. No one likes an attention whore. I was hoping the days of DanielB and AWK were over, and now one of our own has turned to the Dark Side.


I know it is a shame that we have a new troll here. But AWK is here as Andy_K_250 or something like that.
Anyways on a good note, I have so much respect for you guys and what and undertaking you are doing *tips my hat off you to guys*. And I can't wait to have the whole XO trilogy on my shelf one day .


Hey. I am assuming AWK was a flamer or something. I'm not AWK. I think if you search my posts, you'll see that I have never posted anything inflammatory and, aside from maybe being less schooled in a lot of the technical aspects of these projects, I've shown nothing but support for everyone here. If I did something to offend you, please let me know. If you were just grabbing a name that starts with A at random, that's cool, but please don't malign my reputation here (what little I have).


Sorry Dude it jsut that AWK made a shit load of usernames like that, and then the OOT anouncement came and your came. Sorry to jump to conclusions. Please forgive my irrational judgement.
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"The DVD's colors were brightened and saturated to match the prequel DVD releases"

Interesting. I'd not considered that, but it certainly makes sense.

Ironically, there's this quote from "The Creative Impulse", which is the large hardbound book that comes with the Definitive Collection LDs:
There was, most especially, Lucas' emphasis on the idea of a used future that was meant to be experienced as reality rather than fantasy. The Star Wars future was not showroom shiny but dented and rusty, as if it had had hard use on the back roads of innumerable galaxies. Lucas told an interviewer during production in England that the Apollo capsules may have looked brand-new when they soared away, but it was clear when they returned that the interior was littered with candy wrappers, empty Tang cans, and other trash, just like the family station wagon.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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MBJ yeah that bothered me too. I saw an interview (the '04 extra DVD?) where Lucas says he was trying for a "lived in" future, unlike previous scifi movies.

I could understand the prequels being all bright and shiny since galactic economies were thriving, but in the OT you expect to see a lot of junkers left over from the "golden age" before the empire. The color changes in the '04 DVD sort of yanked out a lot of the "lived in" dirty colors.

Dr. M

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Off the top of my head, the best person to ask would be ADigitalMan, since he did extensive work with the '04 DVDs. To my knowledge, he hasn't posted much lately.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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There was, most especially, Lucas' emphasis on the idea of a used future that was meant to be experienced as reality rather than fantasy. The Star Wars future was not showroom shiny but dented and rusty, as if it had had hard use on the back roads of innumerable galaxies. Lucas told an interviewer during production in England that the Apollo capsules may have looked brand-new when they soared away, but it was clear when they returned that the interior was littered with candy wrappers, empty Tang cans, and other trash, just like the family station wagon.


Jesus Christ I hate George Lucas. If this isn't definitive proof the prequels are the most worthless, cashwhore movies ever made, I dunno what is.

Sorry to get off topic.
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Originally posted by: Darth Richard
Originally posted by: andy_k_250
Originally posted by: Darth Richard
Originally posted by: MeBeJedi
Poor OCB. Now I see the problem. He's desperate for attention and kudos for his release.

Sad, really. No one likes an attention whore. I was hoping the days of DanielB and AWK were over, and now one of our own has turned to the Dark Side.


I know it is a shame that we have a new troll here. But AWK is here as Andy_K_250 or something like that.
Anyways on a good note, I have so much respect for you guys and what and undertaking you are doing *tips my hat off you to guys*. And I can't wait to have the whole XO trilogy on my shelf one day .


Hey. I am assuming AWK was a flamer or something. I'm not AWK. I think if you search my posts, you'll see that I have never posted anything inflammatory and, aside from maybe being less schooled in a lot of the technical aspects of these projects, I've shown nothing but support for everyone here. If I did something to offend you, please let me know. If you were just grabbing a name that starts with A at random, that's cool, but please don't malign my reputation here (what little I have).


Sorry Dude it jsut that AWK made a shit load of usernames like that, and then the OOT anouncement came and your came. Sorry to jump to conclusions. Please forgive my irrational judgement.


Hey, no big deal. Thanks for the apology, though.

For the record, though, to everyone else - I'm NOT AdamWanKenobi - I just happen to like "Old Ben," too.
http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/1113/userbar381851ln2.gif
http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/8653/userbar381853dp6.gif
Super Mario Bros. - The Wicked Star Story
"Ah, the proverbial sad sack with a wasted wish."
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"the prequels are the most worthless, cashwhore movies ever made"

ROTFLMAO! Great adjectives there.

BTW, here's a few more from Ralph McQuarrie in the Annotated Screenplays:

"I had a lot more equipment on [Luke] at first, very tailored-looking piping and little gadgets sewn into his costume. But I got the impression that George wanted all the costumes to be a lot more simple. He didn't want the costumes to be the center of attention."

"The sandcrawler waj just said to be an enourmous iron-tracked vehicle, and I put a big trapdoor on the front because it's collecting junk, and I made it huge and put a little driver's compartment at the top and designed this peak that comes off the front. I added engines, exhaust pipes, and plenty of tracks. In fact, there are four different tanklike tracks on the crawler. I wanted it to look like an old warehouse on tracks."
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Honestly, I often wonder what happened to ol' George. When I was a kid I used to think he was one of the greatest men that ever lived. Now I have very little respect for him. Now he seems like such a gimboit. With every interview he seems to contradict things he has said in the past. Makes me wonder if he hit his head sometime an lost his creativity along with all he used to stand for. His ideas used to be so fantastic, a used, worn out galaxy. It gave the movies such a feel, now it has all been blasted to hell. Now all I can think of are stupid incidents like them having to go back and re-film the scene where Obi-Wan picks up Anakin's sabre, because they "kinda forgot he gives it to Luke in the next movie." Another annoying thing is how many people will now say that the star wars movies were always crap but people always loved them anyway. Maybe my view is tainted by growing up with them, after all I didn't even realize how lame Ewoks were until I was 14, but it seems to me that before 1999 (or perhaps 1997) I had never heard too many people who had actually sat down and watched the things consider them to be crap. Even Ewan McGreger said that a star wars movie wouldn't be a star wars movie if it had good dialogue. In that case I don't think we should consider Star Wars or The Empire Strikes Back star wars movies because they have some awesome dialogue at parts.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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Just copying and pasting...

ONLY if it's a DVD-9 and 16:9 though! Only for comaprison reasons for the 2006 Official O-OT DVD release of which I'm assuming will look better than ANYONE'S laserdisc transfers including the XØ Project since LucasFilm has direct access to the actual film elements and believe me I believe wholeheartedly that's what their using.
From my understanding, laserdisc has a different black level compared to DVD. So, from what I can tell, what we've been seeing from the laserdisc preservations is that the contrast has been boosted due to the black levels. Sure, calibration would work perfectly but I'm having more time believing the new 2006 set will be far better than what we've seen since as stated before, they'll be derived from actual film elements instead of an inferior format.
Neil S. Bulk is just spouting b.s. that they're using straight off laserdisc transfers. No, they've been quietly working on the film transfers since they have more time since a film isn't coming out and it won't be as rushed.
I'm going to flat out purchase the 2006 release and I'm cautiously optimistic that it's going to blow all the other laserdisc derived projects out of the water in terms of clarity and opacity. Figure that alot of people could rework their various fan-edits into using the 2006 O-OT DVD's and have seperate "mastered from laserdisc" and a "mastered from DVD" releases...
I can't wait to buy the DVD's come September!

And by the way, Han doesn't shoot first anymore. He's the only one shooting.

end of copying and pasting...

I truly think the XØ Project has been quite well going so far but nothing truly beats a master from actual film archival stuff being remastered as stated above (merely speculation) than doing a laserdisc to DVD transfer no matter the equipment. I bet they've been working on this for quite some time and aren't as rushed as they were on the 2004 DVD's. I'm also figuring the 2004 DVD's in this dual release set for the Trilogy will get a silent clean up and fixing with. Like I already stated above, we'll have the 2006 O-OT DVD's to work with in the future rather than the laserdiscs.

There could be many other XØ Projects which deals with laserdisc and not particularly with Star Wars. I'll get into more detail in forum #11.
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Originally posted by: DarkGryphon2048
There could be many other XØ Projects which deals with laserdisc and not particularly with Star Wars. I'll get into more detail in forum #11.


Sounds intriguing... what/where is "forum #11"?

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Originally posted by: Karyudo
Originally posted by: DarkGryphon2048
There could be many other XØ Projects which deals with laserdisc and not particularly with Star Wars. I'll get into more detail in forum #11.


Sounds intriguing... what/where is "forum #11"?


This site but the other projects sub-forum for fan edits.
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Maybe someone could look into a restoration of the original cut of THX-1138...

Because that's not even worth starting a petition for. George Lucas will never do it, and the majority of people don't like the film anyway. But I do
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there are a few thx-1138 preservations that have been released. just do a search.

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I know about those- I was thinking about a real X0 type of preservation, though. I've only seen one widescreen boot, but the quality is pretty awful on a monitor, especially compared to the 2004 DVD. I'd love to see it in better quality.
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I like THX-1138 as well.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.