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http://orangecow.org/thief/thiefpologame.mp3
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(Hey, at least I'm not asking for an mp3 of the Brigand song)
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"
- from The Bank Dick
The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Director's Cut (Released) — Page 15
(Hey, at least I'm not asking for an mp3 of the Brigand song)
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"
- from The Bank Dick
http://orangecow.org/thief/thiefpologame.mp3
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http://www.ersoz.com/Flash/DancerBW_JPG.swf
This is glimpsed during the pull-out from Zigzag's eye to One Eye's, but you can see much more full animation in here. I definitely recognize the motion seen at the very end.
A layout drawing for the same scene, also by Sahin Ersoz.
http://www.ersoz.com/layout/images/Thief_Layout.jpg
Probably the best shot in the film, this.
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We've hit Youtube ... I've spotted a bootleg version of my trailer, and clips from my old cut of the movie - and a large part of the workprint! - there .... Well, bootlegging is the sincerest form of flattery ...
Incidentally the version of the workprint at Youtube is unusually good quality. Looks as good as my best copy ... at least. I wonder who posted it. I'll contact them ...
EDIT:
Oh! It was posted by Erik Northfell who's been doing some cover art for this project recently. He got it off emule. The colors are good, so I'd like to compare it ...
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I've clearly been spoiled by The Thief, because as good as Disney-quality animation was at this point (and it is quite good) you can see where corners were cut, or where they couldn't quite get the figures to move through 3D space the same way the flying carpet did. Still, a nice study in human anatomy courtesy of Glen Keane on Aladdin and whoever did Jasmine.
At the time, I recall Disney promoting the film by quoting a critic who said "There ain't never been a film like this."
Major irony.
CURRENT STATUS OF THIS CUT - I'm expecting the Boniface (Faceman) restorations of the Miramax cut and other material to come in in the next couple days, hopefully he sent them already yesterday.
When those come in I'll replace all the Miramax material with this restored version.
If Erik's emule version of the workprint turns out to be the best one, I'll go ahead with that and not wait for Stanch's copy.
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Just like the look of it.
Compare this to the workprint from Stanch. (At bottom.)
I give Erik's (at top) the edge. Some detail in the whites seems lost in the Stanch copy, and although Erik's copy is soft it really looks like the Miramax version ...
Note also the crud around the edges in the Stanch version (at top), the sign of a multi generation dub. None of that is present in the Northfell copy.
I think we have a winner!
The edit will be completed with the Erik Northfell workprint - it looks gorgeous.
I'll send it to Chris Boniface for restoration.
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I used to be very active on this forum. I’m not really anymore. Sometimes, people still want to get in touch with me about something, and that is great! If that describes you, please email me at [my username]ATgmailDOTcom.
Hi everybody. You’re all awesome. Keep up the good work.
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More comparisons. As you can see, Stanch's version is sharper, so you see more detail on, say, the witch's knees, but Erik's version has much better color density and shows much more detail in the whites and darks which is lost in Stanch's version - which looks hideous by comparison! I'm hoping that Erik's version can be sharpened by Chris' restoration, but Erik's will mix in better with the Miramax cut, obviously. On most of these shots, there's no comparison.
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Just a thought. I know you're a Mac person so I don't know if you've got the ability.
Dr. M
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There was an article posted a while back in the King Kong thread (I think), about merging soft colored images with sharp desaturated images. To be more specific, it was about the restoration of an old Doctor Who episode. BBC only had an original copy in black and white of what was originally a color episode. They found somebody that had made a color tape recording of the show, but was obviously much softer than the source B&W copy. So they layered the color image over the black and white, and came up with an image that was better than the two images going into it. Obviously, this would be a major pain in the ass in this case, as there's probably incocnsistencies in frame counts for various scenes, plus the videos would have to be re-encoded to have identical aspect ratios (and resolutions?). Also, there's the trick of actually merging the two. But I think this would be something worth looking into, because while the color is better on the new workprint.
Also, the less saturated (older) workprint you're showing--this isn't the one you just got in the mail, is it?
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And yes, I'm comparing it to my best copy, which is the one Stanch recently sent.
If I was to compare it to the old copies, you'd puke.
I've gotten in touch with Jerry Verschoor, who worked on the film. He has a lot of love for it - he saved a lot of material from it, and it's been a dream of his to see the true version of this film restored. He says hi to anyone who worked on the film who might secretly be reading.
More news soon. =)
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And it looks like the folks are finally starting to come out of the woodwork. BTW, how did this person hear of the project?
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Williams probably didn't destroy anything, but the people in Korea did ... sadly. He says in his book that Roy Naisbitt (his longtime assistant) encouraged him to keep a lot of stuff he would otherwise have destroyed.
Here is Erik Northfell's cover for The Thief .... we figured it would make a good cover for the workprint ... which will shortly be available in Erik's version anyway ...
http://orangecow.org/thief/ThiefWorkprintCover-ErikNorthfell.png
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I've even used them with different aspect ratio sources before, you just tag on a resize to each clip to match them (with a bit of cropping as needed). It takes a bit of jiggery pokery to get them right, but it does work.
Like I said I don't know if you have anything like that for the mac.
Dr. M
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"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"
- from The Bank Dick
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Also, the new workprint source has better detail. The 2nd gen one has noise that "fakes" it to look more detailed. Notice that lines are much more visible... that's a better indicator of sharpness. I did a small test in VirtualDub... there's hardly any indicator of quality lost between the Miramax footage and the workprint. Low-res, yes, but I'd imagine the processing will make it look better.
Edit:
Never mind... I realized how much essential footage was finished post-Williams. Perhaps there's a way you can fix the eyes, though? At least for close-ups of Zig-Zag, it would be nice to not have those crappy solid iris eyes. It looks like the Tack/Zig-Zag fight doesn't belong after all... this version has him falling into the pit without anything tied up. Oh, and maybe totally cut out the sound at the very end... I just noticed the sound totally dies once the thief pulls it away. Sorry if I'm being a pest... although, to be honest, I'm surprised by how exact Calvert followed some storyboard-only shots.
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"
- from The Bank Dick
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Dr. M
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After checking even Calvert's own workprint, a quick scan of Arabian Knight shows several shots that are clearly Williams work that don't appear there.
> It looks like the Tack/Zig-Zag fight doesn't belong after all
Yeah, I covered that earlier. But because it breaks up the Thief's adventures, it's hard to bring myself to cut it.
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We're on at 10:30 PM eastern, 7:30 PM pacific!
BE THERE!
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When Zig-Zag swats him with the flyswatter, you can make out "ow, my ass!" as if it was being squawked.
Also, in the bath scene, the shots from behind are clearly "mirrored" while frontal shots have "Mee-Mee"
There's a continuity problem, too... when the Thief takes the slipper from Tack, you can see the broken pipe in the window. Calvert forgot to add that!
When Zig-Zag is going through his "milk and honeyed land" speech, there's some music underneath it... which actually fades into the orchestral work during the flyover.
You can hear the eunuchs calling him through the whole "Oh ffff-Phido/you'll just have to wait" bit... it's very soft.
Throughout the whole scene with Zig-Zag in Mighty One-Eye's tent, you can hear drums beating.
You can hear all the fine echo within palace scenes... the reverb lasts about a second after speaking.
When King Nod is under the canopy with the maiden... it sounds like his mouth is full.
And I just noticed the fake soda ads behind the multi-lingual Buddha signs.... "Drink Karma-Kola" and "7thHeaven"
If you can get the actual tape, I'd imagine it would look almost seamless now. The video file is a little too compressed in spots, not to mention it's PAL. Combined with the special processing, it should look close to the Miramax DVD.
Oh, one comment from tonight's impromptu screening:
"I have never been so captivated by a movie. It was like being raped by a beautiful woman: bizarre but wonderful."
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"
- from The Bank Dick
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>>When Zig-Zag swats him with the flyswatter, you can make out "ow, my ass!" as if it was being squawked.
My my ... never noticed that.
>>Also, in the bath scene, the shots from behind are clearly "mirrored" while frontal shots have "Mee-Mee"
Or "Jasmine" as Disney calls her. =)
>>There's a continuity problem, too... when the Thief takes the slipper from Tack, you can see the broken pipe in the window. Calvert forgot to add that!
I think my edit rather fixes that continuity problem. =)
>>When Zig-Zag is going through his "milk and honeyed land" speech, there's some music underneath it... which actually fades into the orchestral work during the flyover.
Won't be in my edit though.
>>Throughout the whole scene with Zig-Zag in Mighty One-Eye's tent, you can hear drums beating.
Noticed that.
>>You can hear all the fine echo within palace scenes... the reverb lasts about a second after speaking.
Had to be careful with the audio editing here.
>And I just noticed the fake soda ads behind the multi-lingual Buddha signs.... "Drink Karma-Kola" and "7thHeaven"
Ha!