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The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy — Page 3

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So is this for an outline? How far do you plan to form these ideas?

“The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force.” - DV

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yotsuya said:

For instance, you cannot have a good force user who solely uses the dark side. They are not balanced and are going to succumb to the temptations. But you can have a good force user who can tap into the dark side as needed to make use of that power in the service of good.

I disagree. You can’t tap into it at all. Because you’ll realize how powerful the Dark Side is. It’s seductive in it’s ways. George says it leads to greater pleasure than joy. The difference between the two being that pleasure is more short termed. If you tap into it, you will eventually fall under it’s spell.

Remember that what Luke did in Episode VI was by accident. He didn’t mean to use his rage to overpower Vader, but once he realized he had, he stopped fighting. But we will bring this up in the Sequel Trilogy. Luke will probably contemplate why he didn’t use rage to protect his students against the Jedi Killer. He will war with himself. Because you are right, you can get things done through the Dark Side, but you shouldn’t. Luke had a taste of it before, so he’ll want it again.

yotsuya said:

So I don’t see the Jedi we have seen as balanced. We may see something different a few hundred years earlier, but I think the problems with the Jedi go back to the split with the Sith (provided that piece of the EU stays accurate). It would be a natural turn of events for the Jedi to start teaching complete avoidance of anything pertaining to the dark side.

I agree, and I see where you’re coming from. I wish we could find a way to work this into the trilogy, but I don’t see how we could. It goes too far back, far beyond what the audience has seen.

yotsuya said:

So I think the pure force is far more neutral and balanced that what we see in the Jedi. The Bendu is the best example of a being that is balanced in the force. I see the father/daughter/son trio as representing the force, the Jedi, and the Sith with the father again being a being balanced in the force. I see those three as part of Lucas’s Whills concept. The balanced, the light, and the dark. I personally would watch those episodes and use them as inspiration. Lucas had many ideas that never saw the screen and they might be Filoni’s interpretation of something Lucas shared with him. I don’t think he would have gone there without consulting George about it. So I think George’s ideas are in those characters. I wouldn’t say they are Whills, but they are related to them in some way. The Bendu might be as well. The whills should be something higher like those beings. They should be less affected by human sensibilities. They should reflect balance and nature rather than human passions.

I looove that you mention Bendu. You know your lore well. I have toyed with the idea that Luke will renounce Jedi Knighthood to create a new order; Jedi-Bendu.

Thank you for the ideas for the Whills. Very constructive, and I’ve definitely watched the Mortis episodes for inspiration!

“Who are you?”, asked Kira.

“I am the balance”, replied the ghost.

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RogueLeader said:

I think calling it fully developed is a bit of an overstatement.

I just disagree. If you have a script, you have a finished story.

RogueLeader said:
George definitely had an outline, but Michael Arndt left the project because he needed more time to finish the actual script, which Iger wouldn’t give him.

I had heard that he was fired.

RogueLeader said:
From what I understand, it was during this process that Arndt was trying to figure out how to fit Luke into the story without overshadowing the new characters, which was when they came up with the idea of making him the thing the heroes are actually searching for.

Well, they got rid of him, then JJ and Kasdan came up with the idea not to include him in the movie basically.

RogueLeader said:

The development process was exactly that, a development. If you’re trying to go off of what we know about George’s original treatments (and treatment are basically just summaries of a story that can fit onto a few pages, if not a single page), that’s one thing. But ideas clearly changed as development continued, and I doubt anything was really fully developed for George’s original ideas.

A story treatment is still a story treatment. That’s fleshed out. And there was a script by Arndt. Big enough to inspire JJ and Kasdan and receive a writing credit. They even had story art commissioned from it, illustrating scenes we never saw. I find that to be fleshed out enough. And we should stand up for George, so let’s tell the real truth: Ideas didn’t just change in that story development, ideas were thrown out. Big difference.

RogueLeader said:

I really think we need to map out what exactly we know from the development process. I might do that and post it later.

Looking forward to it!

“Who are you?”, asked Kira.

“I am the balance”, replied the ghost.

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act on instinct said:

So is this for an outline? How far do you plan to form these ideas?

I’d like to make an outline.

“Who are you?”, asked Kira.

“I am the balance”, replied the ghost.

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ShamanWhill said:

DominicCobb said:

There is no “proper canon.” That’s bullshit. George was constantly changing his mind. He had approximately 500 different ideas for the sequel trilogy over the years that were probably incredibly contradictory (as the PT often was to the OT).

Please refrain from becoming so meta that you end up saying things that make no sense. There is a proper canon. We have an artist and his creation. Anything he wants to do or approves of is canon. Let’s not confuse ourselves.

Yes, there is a “proper canon.” It includes the films made by Disney. Lucas sold the rights to the series to them, and artists continued the story, whether you personally like it or not.

I also prefer to see it as George coming up with ideas constantly instead of constantly changing his mind. When I think of the way the Star Wars story came about, I can admit that it did happen, but I don’t think it happened in the way you’re trying to prove.

He was changing his mind constantly. You can choose to see it a different way if you please, but the simple fact of the matter is things changed over time. It didn’t come fully formed from go. It took time and changes - that’s the actual creative process.

DominicCobb said:
This thread is just speculative fan fiction. Don’t pretend it’s anything else.

Of course. I never said it wasn’t. I’m sorry you came into here thinking it was otherwise. I should’ve been more clearer. I would like to justify our “fan fiction” though: at least it’s more rooted in the creator’s ideas than Disney’s trilogy was. So which one is the real fan fiction?

Yours is the fan fiction. That’s just a fact. George had a treatment, sure. But have you seen it? No. Ardnt starting working off the treatment, and thus TFA (and TLJ) feature elements of it. So the sequel trilogy as is is more imbued with George’s actual ideas than yours ever could be, just as a point of fact (not to mention JJ and Rian meeting with Lucas).

This should be in the “Screenwriting and Rewritting” forum, not this one.

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Can you guys please tone it down? I’m smelling a flame war brewing.

Although I do agree that this should be moved to the “Script Writing and Rewriting” subforum. There are many threads there that aren’t for fully fleshed out scripts.

My preferred saga experience:
TPM/AOTC/ROTS (Hal 9000), ANH/ESB/ROTJ (Despecialized), The Mandalorian,
TFA (Starlight), TLJ (Fallen Knight), TROS (Resurgence).
May the midichlorians be with you.

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Putting aside the “Only Holy Lucas knows the True Canon” silliness, the idea that some rando fan has a better idea of Lucas’s true wishes is ridiculous. That’s all I’m saying.

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DominicCobb said:

Putting aside the “Only Holy Lucas knows the True Canon” silliness, the idea that some rando fan has a better idea of Lucas’s true wishes is ridiculous. That’s all I’m saying.

I said, tone it down. We’re all fellow fans here, and I don’t want the conversation to escalate into an argument.

My preferred saga experience:
TPM/AOTC/ROTS (Hal 9000), ANH/ESB/ROTJ (Despecialized), The Mandalorian,
TFA (Starlight), TLJ (Fallen Knight), TROS (Resurgence).
May the midichlorians be with you.

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Obligatory self advert for Death of the Author, where Sparky, myself, and a few others are brainstorming our own “canon”

https://discord.gg/Y7zAhj

I don’t think there’s anything wrong in wondering what Lucas would have done. He is the creator of SW so he holds a bit of sway. And we can invent our own canon, even if it doesn’t hold any credibility. And likewise, Disney has every right to do as they please now that they own the franchise. Overall, canon is a stupid idea and anyone can do as they please.

Maul- A Star Wars Story

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StarkillerAG said:

DominicCobb said:

Putting aside the “Only Holy Lucas knows the True Canon” silliness, the idea that some rando fan has a better idea of Lucas’s true wishes is ridiculous. That’s all I’m saying.

I said, tone it down. We’re all fellow fans here, and I don’t want the conversation to escalate into an argument.

Must have missed when you got promoted to moderator. My post was just to clarify that I find it silly is all. Nothing heated on my end, no argument necessary.

OutboundFlight said:

Overall, canon is a stupid idea and anyone can do as they please.

Exactly.

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DominicCobb said:

StarkillerAG said:

DominicCobb said:

Putting aside the “Only Holy Lucas knows the True Canon” silliness, the idea that some rando fan has a better idea of Lucas’s true wishes is ridiculous. That’s all I’m saying.

I said, tone it down. We’re all fellow fans here, and I don’t want the conversation to escalate into an argument.

Must have missed when you got promoted to moderator. My post was just to clarify that I find it silly is all. Nothing heated on my end, no argument necessary.

This is exactly what I’m talking about, your constant passive-aggressive and condescending tone to anyone who disagrees with you. You may not be intending to cause an argument, but people can be easily pissed off by such abrasive language. I’m not trying to be a moderator, I’ve just seen stuff like this happen before.

My preferred saga experience:
TPM/AOTC/ROTS (Hal 9000), ANH/ESB/ROTJ (Despecialized), The Mandalorian,
TFA (Starlight), TLJ (Fallen Knight), TROS (Resurgence).
May the midichlorians be with you.

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StarkillerAG said:

DominicCobb said:

StarkillerAG said:

DominicCobb said:

Putting aside the “Only Holy Lucas knows the True Canon” silliness, the idea that some rando fan has a better idea of Lucas’s true wishes is ridiculous. That’s all I’m saying.

I said, tone it down. We’re all fellow fans here, and I don’t want the conversation to escalate into an argument.

Must have missed when you got promoted to moderator. My post was just to clarify that I find it silly is all. Nothing heated on my end, no argument necessary.

This is exactly what I’m talking about, your constant passive-aggressive and condescending tone to anyone who disagrees with you. You may not be intending to cause an argument, but people can be easily pissed off by such abrasive language. I’m not trying to be a moderator, I’ve just seen stuff like this happen before.

Uh… okay? I think you’re taking this too seriously. We’re just posting shit on a forum.

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DominicCobb said:

Yes, there is a “proper canon.” It includes the films made by Disney. Lucas sold the rights to the series to them, and artists continued the story, whether you personally like it or not.

Never really stated I did or didn’t.

DominicCobb said:

Yours is the fan fiction. That’s just a fact. George had a treatment, sure. But have you seen it? No. Ardnt starting working off the treatment, and thus TFA (and TLJ) feature elements of it. So the sequel trilogy as is is more imbued with George’s actual ideas than yours ever could be, just as a point of fact (not to mention JJ and Rian meeting with Lucas).

I don’t think TLJ does feature elements from George’s stories. I had always heard that Rian had made that stuff from scratch. But I’m afraid I have to disagree with you: our Sequel Trilogy will have numerous things the Disney Trilogy did not include. For starters, our main character is the Granddaughter of Darth Vader, not Palpatine. Pretty big difference.

I have to agree with StarkillerAG; you’re coming off a little aggressive. I certainly don’t mean to start an argument, so I hope our disagreement ends here.

DominicCobb said:

Putting aside the “Only Holy Lucas knows the True Canon” silliness, the idea that some rando fan has a better idea of Lucas’s true wishes is ridiculous. That’s all I’m saying.

Dude… you’re kinda being a bully right now. That’s my view on the matter. I think absolute authority belongs to the artist.

“Who are you?”, asked Kira.

“I am the balance”, replied the ghost.

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ShamanWhill said:

DominicCobb said:

Yours is the fan fiction. That’s just a fact. George had a treatment, sure. But have you seen it? No. Ardnt starting working off the treatment, and thus TFA (and TLJ) feature elements of it. So the sequel trilogy as is is more imbued with George’s actual ideas than yours ever could be, just as a point of fact (not to mention JJ and Rian meeting with Lucas).

I don’t think TLJ does feature elements from George’s stories. I had always heard that Rian had made that stuff from scratch. But I’m afraid I have to disagree with you: our Sequel Trilogy will have numerous things the Disney Trilogy did not include. For starters, our main character is the Granddaughter of Darth Vader, not Palpatine. Pretty big difference.

When was it ever confirmed that Lucas’s treatment had Kira/Rey as a Skywalker? I don’t think I’ve seen that.

I have to agree with StarkillerAG; you’re coming off a little aggressive. I certainly don’t mean to start an argument, so I hope our disagreement ends here.

Not trying to be aggressive. Just find the scope of the thread odd and confusing. Putting blinders on about the ST as it exists is strange, I don’t get why you’re outlawing people to talk about it in here except because the mentality that ‘Lucas didn’t make it, so it’s not real Star Wars,’ which, no offense, I think is a ridiculous position to have (nothing personal, you’re far from the only person who feels this way).

DominicCobb said:

Putting aside the “Only Holy Lucas knows the True Canon” silliness, the idea that some rando fan has a better idea of Lucas’s true wishes is ridiculous. That’s all I’m saying.

Dude… you’re kinda being a bully right now. That’s my view on the matter. I think absolute authority belongs to the artist.

JJ and Rian are artists, they have authority over their stories. Your thread is about George’s “Original” ST, which is fair. But all you’re doing is fan fiction. That’s what I’m trying to say.

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Dom if you have no interest in the subject of the thread why participate? Feels like you’re just arguing to argue when you’re going against the premise of the thread. We can all have our opinions and ShamanWhill made their intentions clear from the beginning.

“The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force.” - DV

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act on instinct said:

Dom if you have no interest in the subject of the thread why participate? Feels like you’re just arguing to argue when you’re going against the premise of the thread. We can all have our opinions and ShamanWhill made their intentions clear from the beginning.

I think it’s an interesting subject. I don’t get why discussing the ST is banned, as I feel like that’s pretty germane to the subject. But I see that this thread is more about fan fiction, which is completely fair. But if so, it’s in the wrong forum.

Everything I’ve said on the topic has been in relation to these^ thoughts. Hope my position is clear and people can stop yelling at me.

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Let’s get back on track.

Having reread a few sites discussing what little we know of Lucas’s ideas, I think it’s safe to say the Whills would serve as the main protagonists and antagonists. Based off the only Lucas canon – the OT, the PT, and TCW – the force is best understood as divided into the light and dark sides. The Jedi were not perfect but there is nothing from Lucas that suggests they need widespread reform.

So I think we would learn that there is a Dark Whill somewhere that has brought evil into the galaxy, cheesy as it may be, and this being was what corrupted Sidious in the first place. Keeping in mind this would remain a Skywalker / Solo drama, I think Ben Solo may be the Dark Whill’s “next target” and start corrupting him to restart the Sith, and it will be up to Luke’s daughter to redeem her cousin and break the cycle.

I think this is a fairly basic plan that would fit well within the established lore of Lucas.

Maul- A Star Wars Story

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DominicCobb said:

When was it ever confirmed that Lucas’s treatment had Kira/Rey as a Skywalker? I don’t think I’ve seen that.

You’re right. They never truly confirmed if they were Skywalkers, but she’s the main character and George said the Sequels are about Darth Vader’s grandchildren.

DominicCobb said:

JJ and Rian are artists, they have authority over their stories. Your thread is about George’s “Original” ST, which is fair. But all you’re doing is fan fiction. That’s what I’m trying to say.

Sure, they have authority over their stories. But they had to trample the original artist’s stories to write their own, so I don’t think they deserve the same level of respect.

I know this is fan fiction, but that’s not a bad thing. You don’t need to put me in my place. I’m already aware of it.

“Who are you?”, asked Kira.

“I am the balance”, replied the ghost.

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OutboundFlight said:
Having reread a few sites discussing what little we know of Lucas’s ideas, I think it’s safe to say the Whills would serve as the main protagonists and antagonists. Based off the only Lucas canon – the OT, the PT, and TCW – the force is best understood as divided into the light and dark sides. The Jedi were not perfect but there is nothing from Lucas that suggests they need widespread reform.

I saw this concept art picture of Darth Talon, with a shadowy figure hovering behind her (https://miro.medium.com/max/2063/1*-ez8L1awc_mE6G4kac6Gwg.jpeg). The caption by the concept artist described the shadowy figure behind her as the puppeteer manipulating her. I think it would be interesting if we made this an Evil Whill. Maybe Darth Plagueis found a way to secretly preserve his own consciousness after death through the Midi-Chlorians as the Jedi had. He searched and found a Force Sensitive Twi-lek with attractive features and manipulated her to seduce the Jedi Killer and turn him against Luke.

We can drop the Plagueis idea if you’d like, but I think we’d still need to explain where this Evil Whill came from.

OutboundFlight said:
So I think we would learn that there is a Dark Whill somewhere that has brought evil into the galaxy, cheesy as it may be, and this being was what corrupted Sidious in the first place. Keeping in mind this would remain a Skywalker / Solo drama, I think Ben Solo may be the Dark Whill’s “next target” and start corrupting him to restart the Sith, and it will be up to Luke’s daughter to redeem her cousin and break the cycle.

Ben Solo would be Sam Solo. In George’s trilogy, he wasn’t Force sensitive. However, the Jedi Killer left a real impact on Luke, so I’m toying with the idea of him being Luke’s son.

I don’t know if Luke should have an heir though. You’d need to explain where his wife is, and if he changed that rule in the Jedi Order, and as you said there’s no evidence that George wanted the Jedi way to be changed. If Kira was Luke’s daughter, than we would have to go down the route that Luke doesn’t know and she was hidden as a child by her Mother who was in trouble and is now deceased.

“Who are you?”, asked Kira.

“I am the balance”, replied the ghost.

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ShamanWhill said:

OutboundFlight said:
Having reread a few sites discussing what little we know of Lucas’s ideas, I think it’s safe to say the Whills would serve as the main protagonists and antagonists. Based off the only Lucas canon – the OT, the PT, and TCW – the force is best understood as divided into the light and dark sides. The Jedi were not perfect but there is nothing from Lucas that suggests they need widespread reform.

I saw this concept art picture of Darth Talon, with a shadowy figure hovering behind her (https://miro.medium.com/max/2063/1*-ez8L1awc_mE6G4kac6Gwg.jpeg). The caption by the concept artist described the shadowy figure behind her as the puppeteer manipulating her. I think it would be interesting if we made this an Evil Whill. Maybe Darth Plagueis found a way to secretly preserve his own consciousness after death through the Midi-Chlorians as the Jedi had. He searched and found a Force Sensitive Twi-lek with attractive features and manipulated her to seduce the Jedi Killer and turn him against Luke.

We can drop the Plagueis idea if you’d like, but I think we’d still need to explain where this Evil Whill came from.

OutboundFlight said:
So I think we would learn that there is a Dark Whill somewhere that has brought evil into the galaxy, cheesy as it may be, and this being was what corrupted Sidious in the first place. Keeping in mind this would remain a Skywalker / Solo drama, I think Ben Solo may be the Dark Whill’s “next target” and start corrupting him to restart the Sith, and it will be up to Luke’s daughter to redeem her cousin and break the cycle.

Ben Solo would be Sam Solo. In George’s trilogy, he wasn’t Force sensitive. However, the Jedi Killer left a real impact on Luke, so I’m toying with the idea of him being Luke’s son.

I don’t know if Luke should have an heir though. You’d need to explain where his wife is, and if he changed that rule in the Jedi Order, and as you said there’s no evidence that George wanted the Jedi way to be changed. If Kira was Luke’s daughter, than we would have to go down the route that Luke doesn’t know and she was hidden as a child by her Mother who was in trouble and is now deceased.

This is a very good base plan. At this point, I don’t think there is much more we can do without creating our own story out of things we would like to see.

In that vein, I will make a few suggestions. Trying to keep in the Lucas Lore but all my ideas are really fanfiction at this point.

– Darth Talon would make for an interesting antagonist, but I don’t think she should live past Episode 8. Perhaps Jedi Killer kills her in an act similar to Snoke’s death in TLJ. If the Dark Whill / Plaguies remains the big bad it won’t be as crazy as the DT… it would be more Jedi Killer promoting himself to directly serving the Dark Whill.

– If we go the Sam Solo route, I’d prefer to make it so that Sam thinks he doesn’t have the force because he doesn’t have a natural affinity to it like Kira. But perhaps in the 9th episode, he realizes he had it all along, he just needed to believe he had it in the first place.

– Jedi Killer could work as Luke’s very first apprentice, sorta like Kyp Durron in the EU. Luke sees on him as living proof of his early failures, from before his academy was properly established.

– Why not make Kira’s mother a mystery? Luke never tells her who her mother is, and she spends a while wondering who it might be. It could another Jedi (inspired by Mara Jade) in hiding that returns by Episode 9.

Maul- A Star Wars Story

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OutboundFlight said:

This is a very good base plan. At this point, I don’t think there is much more we can do without creating our own story out of things we would like to see.

Right. Episode VII is pretty mapped out. Most quotes about the Sequel Trilogy are about Episode VII. We know how we meet Han, we know how we find Luke. Leia is a Senator and a member of a political party known as the Populists. Han and Leia are separate, but they come back together over the course of the film. Han does NOT die, at least not in Episode VII. Never a mention of Lando.

OutboundFlight said:

In that vein, I will make a few suggestions. Trying to keep in the Lucas Lore but all my ideas are really fanfiction at this point.

– Darth Talon would make for an interesting antagonist, but I don’t think she should live past Episode 8. Perhaps Jedi Killer kills her in an act similar to Snoke’s death in TLJ. If the Dark Whill / Plaguies remains the big bad it won’t be as crazy as the DT… it would be more Jedi Killer promoting himself to directly serving the Dark Whill.

There’s actually concept art of her seducing the Jedi Killer and then leaving him murdered. I think it would make for a interesting twist in Episode IX. My idea is this: in order to destroy the Evil Whill, Luke must become one with the Force and confront him, but of course Luke must die in order to do this. So he surrenders to the Jedi Killer, leading to his death. Once Luke is dead, Talon then murders the Jedi Killer, revealing that she was using him the entire time. Then Anakin and Luke face off against Plagueis, while Leia and Kira fight Talon; both a Physical Battle and a Meta-Physical battle.

OutboundFlight said:

– If we go the Sam Solo route, I’d prefer to make it so that Sam thinks he doesn’t have the force because he doesn’t have a natural affinity to it like Kira. But perhaps in the 9th episode, he realizes he had it all along, he just needed to believe he had it in the first place.

You’re right. Based on Midi-Chlorian biology, it wouldn’t make sense for Sam to have 0 Force powers. We can make it so either he’s not interested in the Force, of that by the time he was ready to learn, Luke had already been betrayed by the Jedi Killer.

OutboundFlight said:

– Jedi Killer could work as Luke’s very first apprentice, sorta like Kyp Durron in the EU. Luke sees on him as living proof of his early failures, from before his academy was properly established.

I don’t think it would really matter. I imagine Episode VII opens up with the attack on Luke’s temple. I think we could throw in a line like “he was Luke’s brightest student”, but that would be all. Luke was naïve and didn’t believe he would turn to the Dark Side because of the prophecy Anakin fulfilled; he lowered his guard.

OutboundFlight said:

– Why not make Kira’s mother a mystery? Luke never tells her who her mother is, and she spends a while wondering who it might be. It could another Jedi (inspired by Mara Jade) in hiding that returns by Episode 9.

I agree it would make the story much more interesting. She’s described as a loner, so maybe that was the case. I don’t know if making her the daughter of another Jedi would work. Luke was supposed to be the last, and he was described as the last in George’s outlines. If she is a loner/orphan, then she would have to be Luke’s child. But that raises many questions; Why was she hidden? How come Luke doesn’t know? I can understand if she was hidden because of Luke’s betrayal, then that would mean she was a baby, so almost 2 decades have gone by of Luke in hiding? I don’t know if that’s a right move to make.

“Who are you?”, asked Kira.

“I am the balance”, replied the ghost.

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yotsuya said:

I like what Rian did with TLJ that anyone can be a Jedi, but that it can run in families.

That is 100% certifiable utter bullshit. That idea was introduced with the very introduction and description of the Force in A New Hope, the expanded definition of the Force in The Empire Strikes Back, and basically the entire context of the series. Characters like Obi-Wan, Yoda, Ahsoka, and so many others already existed as special people or heroes without an important family connection. Luke’s actualization as a character and as a Jedi isn’t in the power of his bloodline, but the strength of his character to go against what others expected of him because of his family.

Anyone who parrots this pretentious nonsense should probably rewatch the other films and try paying attention.

The unfortunate reality of the Star Wars prequel and Disney trilogies is that they will always be around. Forever. They will never go away. It can never be undone.

I also prefer to be referred to as “TNT”, not “Freezing”.

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FreezingTNT2 said:

yotsuya said:

I like what Rian did with TLJ that anyone can be a Jedi, but that it can run in families.

That is 100% certifiable utter bullshit. That idea was introduced with the very introduction and description of the Force in A New Hope, the expanded definition of the Force in The Empire Strikes Back, and basically the entire context of the series. Characters like Obi-Wan, Yoda, Ahsoka, and so many others already existed as special people or heroes without an important family connection. Luke’s actualization as a character and as a Jedi isn’t in the power of his bloodline, but the strength of his character to go against what others expected of him because of his family.

Anyone who parrots this pretentious nonsense should probably rewatch the other films and try paying attention.

Knock it off. You have a PM.

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ShamanWhill said:

– Darth Talon would make for an interesting antagonist, but I don’t think she should live past Episode 8. Perhaps Jedi Killer kills her in an act similar to Snoke’s death in TLJ. If the Dark Whill / Plaguies remains the big bad it won’t be as crazy as the DT… it would be more Jedi Killer promoting himself to directly serving the Dark Whill.

There’s actually concept art of her seducing the Jedi Killer and then leaving him murdered. I think it would make for a interesting twist in Episode IX. My idea is this: in order to destroy the Evil Whill, Luke must become one with the Force and confront him, but of course Luke must die in order to do this. So he surrenders to the Jedi Killer, leading to his death. Once Luke is dead, Talon then murders the Jedi Killer, revealing that she was using him the entire time. Then Anakin and Luke face off against Plagueis, while Leia and Kira fight Talon; both a Physical Battle and a Meta-Physical battle.

I think the Jedi ultimately killing the Jedi Killer in an act of passionate betrayal (been thinking about contradictory premonitions lately) and thus becomes the Jedi Killer is the way to go, it’s the right double bluff, the motivations are strong, the relationships are deeper. This is where I get a little wary, that momentum should carry over into pushing those protagonists forward, they should have some relation to Luke and maybe Anakin and possibly Plagueis but the ultimate battle should only be enhanced by them, not the main focus. The new characters should not by the finale be watching in awe of ancient Gods they have no direct association with, in a way that destroys the stakes; the grandchildren, the new characters, have to be the active component. And that’s appropriate, the baton pass isn’t the wrong idea fundamentally it’s how we get there.

OutboundFlight said:

– If we go the Sam Solo route, I’d prefer to make it so that Sam thinks he doesn’t have the force because he doesn’t have a natural affinity to it like Kira. But perhaps in the 9th episode, he realizes he had it all along, he just needed to believe he had it in the first place.

You’re right. Based on Midi-Chlorian biology, it wouldn’t make sense for Sam to have 0 Force powers. We can make it so either he’s not interested in the Force, of that by the time he was ready to learn, Luke had already been betrayed by the Jedi Killer.

OutboundFlight said:

Sam Solo is an intriguing opportunity because he’s not like Kylo Ren at all, and being the son of ‘rebels’ we could really have a fun chance to play up the ultimate cocky rebel, especially in the first episode when it’s lighter and establishing the new generation. Think about a teen Han Solo, reckless son of a famous politician, imagine him trying and failing to pick up girls by claiming to technically be the prince of a planet that doesn’t exist anymore. Plus that need for speed and everything that’s been said already about latent ability buried under attitude, like Anakin with the pods but with a charming heartthrob instead of a 9 year old boy. And it nails in on the family situation and gives an easy arc for the character to show contempt and even jealousy toward his family on a bratty kid level only to take responsibility and show his love when the stakes get serious and his family is threatened.

– Why not make Kira’s mother a mystery? Luke never tells her who her mother is, and she spends a while wondering who it might be. It could another Jedi (inspired by Mara Jade) in hiding that returns by Episode 9.

I agree it would make the story much more interesting. She’s described as a loner, so maybe that was the case. I don’t know if making her the daughter of another Jedi would work. Luke was supposed to be the last, and he was described as the last in George’s outlines. If she is a loner/orphan, then she would have to be Luke’s child. But that raises many questions; Why was she hidden? How come Luke doesn’t know? I can understand if she was hidden because of Luke’s betrayal, then that would mean she was a baby, so almost 2 decades have gone by of Luke in hiding? I don’t know if that’s a right move to make.

Twins separated at birth, just sayin’.

“The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force.” - DV