I make predictions, because I’m a scientist, and this sort of stuff interests me. I hope TROS will get the reception it deserves. If it’s great and widely accepted by the fandom, and the public in general, I hope it succeeds. If it’s bad or another extremy divisive film, which further deepens the rift in the fandom, I hope it sinks faster than Titanic.
Personally I don’t think we should be cheering for the failures of things that refuse to play it safe or don’t fear what will happen if they don’t satiate the desires of some fans. I couldn’t care less what the fandom at large (or at small) thinks. I just care if it’s good or not.
The divide between fans goes well beyond the merits of a single movie. A climate has been created by the creators, media, and fandom, that has led to some very ugly situations, and people being demonized for having an opinion on a movie, whether positive or negative. If that climate is perpetuated, I won’t care about the future of the franchise one way or the other. Star Wars to me is more than a bunch of films, it is a relationship, and the fandom is an integral part of that relationship. If the fandom is broken, all that will be left is a bunch of blockbusters with the Star Wars brand slapped on it. So, I believe the creators should think out of the box AND do their part to make that relationship work.
That ‘climate,’ hate to break it to you, is largely imaginary.
Personally I find it easy to separate the work from the fandom. Most fandoms are obnoxious, SW perhaps moreso than many. Personally, I’m not going to let that affect my enjoy of the films any time soon.
There’s nothing imaginary about being called an SJW for liking Holdo, and Rose Tico, or a misogynist or man baby for disliking those same characters.
The imaginary claim is in regards to the creators. Yeah, the fandom says stupid shit. That’s why I said fandom is obnoxious and best ignored.
The fandom, the media, and Lucasfilm employees have directly or indirectly kept adding fuel to the fire. From the very beginning critics were branded as haters, misogynists, manbabies, and what not, and not just by obnoxious fans. In the mean time Lucasfilm, and Disney did very little to set the record straight, that most critical fans had no association with toxic elements in the fandom. So, yes the creators didn’t directly attack fans for the most part. They had the media do the dirty work for them. All they had to do is stay silent, while the critics were all painted with the same toxic brush. I guess, it was in their interest to perpetuate the myth, that criticism against their products was mostly limited to toxic fans, driven by sinister motives, and Russian bots. Let’s get real here, even on this forum the motives of critics are continually questioned. We’re annoying, unreasonable people, that didn’t get what we want, and therefore hate Disney Star Wars, and desperately want it to fail…
The fact of the matter is, the complaining from TLJ-haters about being painted with a broad brush as something they’re not mostly comes across as silly and whiny. Most of complaints in regards to people calling everyone who criticized the movie “man baby” or “misogynist” are grossly overstated, considering there’s practically no one actually doing that, and these people are just latching on to legitimate critiques of people who actually are being man babies and misogynist, and falsely claiming they’re being lumped in with them (for reasons beyond me, maybe persecution complex or they don’t want to engage with the fact that there are people who are actually like that out there, who might share some opinions on a movie with them). Ultimately, posts like this^ just come across a little tinfoil hat-y. ‘The whole fandom is divided and out to get me, and Lucasfilm is complicit.’ It’s just silly man, I don’t know how else to describe it.
That’s why I call it imaginary. That’s what it feels like, a made up controversy. Obviously there are people out there being annoying on either side. But to the extent that it’s this extensive, disastrous, oppressive ‘climate’… not feeling it personally.
Sorry, but it’s easy for you to claim it’s overstated and imaginary being on the other side. You don’t have to endure all the name calling, and have your motives continually questioned. You yourself accused me of hating the ST two days ago, only to backtrack once I confronted you with it, and yesterday again questioned my motives for doing a little research, implying I must want TROS to fail. Earlier in the week another user here stated, since he or she feels Rey is a perfectly good character, the motives of those criticizing Rey’s character are suspect by default. Even if we’re not open misogynists, and racists, we’re likely closet misogynists, and racists. It’s this sort of atmosphere that contributes to the climate I’m talking about. It’s not just obnoxious fans doing it, it’s regular reasonable people that help sustain it, looking to validate their opinions. Then there’s the media. There have literally been dozens of articles, which boil down to “I’m sure there are some fans with legitimate complaints about the movie, but most of them are toxic”, or the articles that try to do amateur psychology, and explain why some fans dislike the movie, which in the best case scenario can be summarized, that we didn’t get what we want, and want things to stay the same, and in the worst case scenario accuse us of misogyny, racism, and trolling. Then there’s the so called research allegedly showing fans mostly criticized TLJ out of political motives, or show we largely consist of Russian bots, research that was either biased, or taken out of context by the media to produce another clickbait article, and spin the narrative (and retweeted by RJ by the way, who somewhat understandably wants to believe the vast majority of fans like his movie). This has been the climate since TLJ’s release, sparked by a small group of toxic fans, that started harrassing people, and sustained by fans and the media holding on to the belief that the division amounts to little more than a vocal minority.
To recapitulate according to many fans, and the media, I’m a hater bent on the destruction of Disney Star Wars, whereas in reality I still like most Disney Star Wars. I liked TFA upon release, and still do mostly, even if I feel it’s too derivative, and that it’s a missed opportunity to just hit the reset button. I like RO, which I feel is the best Disney movie to date, even if it’s too heavy on the fan service, and the characters could use more development. I dislike TLJ overall for reasons, which have been discussed ad nauseum, but still feel there are good and even great elements to it, like the Rey/Luke/Kylo dynamic, which is up there with the best the franchise has to offer. I thought Solo was an oke movie, but largely forgettable. Finally, I’m cautiously optimistic about TROS, and hope it will be a good movie, that will satisfy most fans. That is my reality, and the reality of the vast majority of critical fans I engage with. We are critical of some of the choices made, and question some of the motives behind it, but are generally still hopeful that the franchise has a bright future ahead.
In any case, we are probably not going to agree on this, so let’s get back on topic.