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The Rise Of Skywalker - Abrams' Vision or Executive Meddling? — Page 4

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adywan said:

Hadrian sunrider said:

adywan said:

Hadrian sunrider said:

StarkillerAG said:

Dude, stop trying to blame everything on TLJ. That movie wasn’t universally hated like you think, most people actually liked it. The reason Solo bombed was because of Disney’s terrible marketing decisions, and TROS’s performance is actually pretty good for the third installment of a series. The anger of a few hardcore fans had nothing to do with it.

Revenge of the sith made more than AOTC

Return of the Jedi was dead even with empire strikes back

The sequel trilogy just went downhill with every installment with its latter two installments having the worst legs in December box office history

Do you really want to argue with math?

Well, lets talk the maths…

Stats or original release for the OT:

ANH - $503,015,849
ESB - $400,083,259
ROTJ - $374,593,074

And those were different times than now. Before the internet and before the rise of the internet trolls and “youtubers” shitting all over everything. ROTJ broke weekend box office records, but the numbers dropped pretty fast after the first week.

Sith made more than AOTC because of the hype surrounding Vader appearing in it and people hoping it would feel more like the OT. They wanted to see the Vader hunting down the jedi, they wanted to see the duel over lava and anakin become vader. It is something fans had wanted to see for decades. You can’t beat that type of hype.

So lets use other stats. Ticket sales. Est # ticket sales for each film (domestic) in ascending order:

ANH 178,119,500
TFA 108,115,100
ESB 98,213,400
ROTJ 94,059,400
TPM 90,312,100
TLJ 67,594,500
ROTS 59,324,600
ROS 54,984,300
AOTC 53,468,500

Jesus, fans must have hated ESB. Just look at how many less tickets were sold for that films compared to its predecessor.

The sequel trilogy performed perfectly well. You have to remember that China is a HUGE market for the film industry and its only in recent years that China has even shown any of the Star Wars films. So they haven’t grown up with the films and have an attachment to them as we all do. So a big chunk of the box office market is gone right there. Yet all three earned over $1 billion.

Solo under-performing had nothing to do with TLJ either. Right from the films announcement a lot of the fanbase just wasn’t that interested in the idea of it. Having someone playing Han Solo who wasn’t Harrison Ford turned them off the film right away. That was back in 2015, when Star Wars fever was at a high, 6 months prior to TFA being released. And then followed all the reports of the troubles during the making of it etc. That really didn’t help.

Then you had George jumping in and throwing his dummy out the pram after TFA because they didn’t use his story treatments> calling Disney the “white slavers” etc. You have that section of the fanbase that were loyal to george that decided they were going to boycott the Disney Star Wars out of loyalty to George.

On top of that you had the “Legends” crown that were boycotting everything because “Disney destroyed our Star Wars”

But what is really turning fans off Star Wars, isn’t the movies or TV series, but a certain section of the fanbase. Sucking the fun out of any online discussion about the franchise. You can’t even discuss the Disney films without a bunch of assholes jumping in, telling them that they are an idiot/ moron who must have low IQ if they liked the ST.

Wow…a 4 million ticket decline

Such a disaster

TLJ and TROS still dropped worse than any of the Star Wars sequels

And it’s not the fans that are killing the hype for Star Wars…it is the lack of interesting characters with long term value.

I have yet to see someone who wants to see Rey ever again

I could find a million fans who want Vader to be given a tv series or a movie

I can find no one who wants to see Rey even mentioned in future films

That is what is killing Star Wars.

Maybe get out of your little closed " the sequels are shit" circle and you’ll find there are plenty of people that would like to see Rey back at some point, along with Finn, BB-8 and other sequel characters. And of course you’ll see more people wanting a vader spin off. Vader is embedded in pop culture and has been around for 43 years.

StarkillerAG said:

Could you stop your constant anti-sequel spamming? People here have varying opinions about those movies, but it seems like the only thing you ever post is “sequel bad, everyone hates the sequels” which is just not true if you look outside your echo chamber for more than 5 minutes.

Yeh, his constant anti-sequel spamming pretty much proved my point that its the fans destroying star wars and not the films doing this. It just seems to blow this type of fans brains that people may have a different opinion on the films and actually like them. Its as if they have to try and force their view that nobody likes them, down peoples throats until they comply. THAT’S what is putting people off Star Wars.

Well said, Ady. I am one that would like to see Rey, BB-8, Finn, Poe, Rose, Jannah, Babu Frik, etc. all comeback eventually.

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Dude, if you have to work this hard to get even one person to agree with you…

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Hadrian sunrider said:

https://www.jeditemplearchives.com/2020-04-22-diamond-select-toys-sees-little-demand-for-sequel-trilogy-merchandise/

The toys have nothing to do with any of this. ALL toys have been seeing a decline in interest recently, not just Star Wars sequel-themed toys. The sequel haters who use toy sales to say “Kathleen is ruining Star Wars, get woke go broke” are clearly just grabbing at straws, especially when the movies themselves made so much money.

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Jedi Temple Archives is… bad, right?

I thought I remembered them being bad.

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 (Edited)

Anakin Starkiller said:

Broom Kid said:

Don’t underestimate how many people loathed the direction that TLJ was going in

I’m sure it’s in the thousands, sure. Thousands can seem like a lot of people if you’re packed into a convention hall, or watching a minor league sporting event. But when you’re dealing with tens of MILLIONS of tickets sold, blu-rays bought, and streams counted, thousands aren’t a whole hell of a lot.

I have the impression the haters are something like a third of people. Just speaking anecdotally from conversations IRL, that seems about right.

I think 40% of Star Wars fans like all 9 episodes, 30% like the OT & PT (or, they may not like the prequels, but they much prefer the prequels to the sequels), and 30% like the OT and ST (or, they may not like the sequels, but they much prefer them to the prequels, although this group also tends not to like TRoS).

StarkillerAG said:

Hadrian sunrider said:

https://www.jeditemplearchives.com/2020-04-22-diamond-select-toys-sees-little-demand-for-sequel-trilogy-merchandise/

The toys have nothing to do with any of this. ALL toys have been seeing a decline in interest recently, not just Star Wars sequel-themed toys. The sequel haters who use toy sales to say “Kathleen is ruining Star Wars, get woke go broke” are clearly just grabbing at straws, especially when the movies themselves made so much money.

No you see, something something Walmart something something Legos screw you go woke go broke

There aren’t even toy sections in stores I go to anymore. Mobile gaming has totally replaced toys for kids these days, for better or for worse.

Death of the Author

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I would go to see another film with Rey becoming a Jedi Master and taking Finn as her apprentice.

We could finally see the Republic restored and the Jedi order rebuilt.

I don’t know if you could do an entire trilogy out of it but a stand alone episode 10 maybe.

I don’t see Lucasfilm doing that though.

Also conflict makes good drama, well the conflict of Star Wars is played out you can only do so much Jedi VS Sith stories, or rebels vs empire.

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What’s a “fan” anyway, just someone participating in the current Internet discourse? Does someone’s dad somewhere who doesn’t watch YouTube factor in?

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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This was a nice conversation to begin with, but +1 on the anti-sequel spam not being the most welcome, ugh.

I have mixed feelings on the sequel trilogy, but a lot of people love them unabashedly. It’s cool to hate all three, just… not everyone does. Just the truth.

And to respond to Broom Kid way back RE: the story group- I know they are just glorified canon timeline checkers, but I always WISHED they steered the creatives in any way, shape, or form. Or were even given a suggestion box? lol

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I expect the conversations between the story group and writers are very similar to a forum thread, lot’s of debate. I don’t think the story group can show up like the Department of Temporal Investigations (Star Trek) to enforce the canon.