The Prequel Radical Redux Ideas Thread — Page 57

there is an 'uncamp' filter on after effects i heard....;)

Don't try using it on Anthony Daniels though as it will drain all the energy out of the universe attempting the impossible.

Ripplin said:

Oh come now, no facepalms were necessary with those comments. ;) Just don't show Bingo's comment to Anthony Daniels.

Seriously, about Anthony Daniels, in the "Bring Back...Star Wars" special, he really seems to come off as a guy who thinks he's a great actor. (and bigger than those old Star Wars films) I cannot say if he is or not, not having seen him in anything else. Has anyone here seen him in other things? Is he any good with drama and such? Can he play a bad guy convincingly?

I just saw that he played the voice of Legolas in the 78's animated LOTR, funny. (I only listen to the french version, so I don't know about his acting in it)

He did not play much things out of SW (wikipedia source). He had a role in a Young Indy episode.

Other than that it's mostly few TV series/movies appearances.

EDIT: Imdb has a more precise list of his movies, but nothing very impressive.

Ripplin said:

Oh come now, no facepalms were necessary with those comments. ;) Just don't show Bingo's comment to Anthony Daniels.

Seriously, about Anthony Daniels, in the "Bring Back...Star Wars" special, he really seems to come off as a guy who thinks he's a great actor. (and bigger than those old Star Wars films) I cannot say if he is or not, not having seen him in anything else. Has anyone here seen him in other things? Is he any good with drama and such? Can he play a bad guy convincingly?

He has played a variety of roles on British television rather well but he is always undeniably Anthony Daniels.

He plays prequel 3PO almost as a caricature of himself, so to me, his arrogance is utterly undeserved.

brash_stryker said:

I think saving Padme's life being Anakin's rationale for turning to the dark side needs to be cut completely.

Either cut the dream, or replace it with a more symbolic dream sequence, and don't have Anakin mention the dream to her or promise that he can save her (Luke never talked about his vision in the cave; we just saw it, and that worked just fine)

Also get rid of all Palpatine's promises about saving her. Just keep the parts of him seducing Anakin with promises of power.

After Anakin tells Windu about palpatine being a sith, and he's in the Jedi council chamber, and you hear the echoing voice of palpatine saying "any chance of saving her will be lost" etc. Replace that with sound bytes of his senior jedi masters being critical/holding him back/saying things that hint at dishonesty, interspersed with palpatine's promises of power.

When he then rushes to stop Windu, it is clear then that it is his distrust of the Jedi, along with the promise of power that's seducing him. It's not perfect, but it's better than "I'm making a conscious decision to turn to the dark side to save my girlfriend"

I'm sorry, but I disagree with that, brash_stryker. I actually think Anakin's issues with attachment is one of the few things that works very well in the PT. It's a thread that runs through all the three movies: he leaves his mother in TPM, is too late to save her in AOTC, and in ROTS, his one attachment has become such an obsession he turns to the Dark Side over it. It's actually pretty character defining.

Anakin's whole turn in ROTS hinges on him wanting to save Padme. If we cut out all of the references to saving Padme, pretty much nothing of the turn remains. The scene in the opera house would be gone, we'd have to cut pretty much half of the scene where Palpatine reveals himself to be Sidious and the "ruminations" scene, and cut Palpatine's plea to Anakin "I have the power to save the one you love, you must choose". Also, the very moment Anakin actually decides to turn still hinges on Padme: "I will do whatever you ask, just help me save Padme's life". I think removing the "saving Padme" aspect from the turn, there would leave nothing left of the turn.

Also, where is Palpatine promising Anakin power? It's only in one scene, and that's the scene where he reveals himself to be Sidious, that's hardly a seduction.

When Anakin turns, cut Palpatine telling Anakin that he doesn't have the power to stop death. It makes no sense for Anakin to turn of Palpatine can't actually help him. Later, when Anakin has become Darth Vader, and asks about Padme, we could dub in a line of Sidious saying something like "It is too late..." followed by the original dialogue of "in your anger, you killed her". Again, Anakin realises he was too late to stop (and even had a hand in) a loved one's death, hence the agonized scream (the NoooOOOooooOO must go though). This would also keep vague whether or not Palpatine actually did have the power to stop death, which adds to his character of being a manipulator.

After Anakin has turned though, he should be evil. Cut him crying on Mustafar, make it more of a brooding scene, as if he is already plotting to overthrow Palpatine, as he later says to Padme. I don't think Anakin needs to be killing kids though, that's taking it too far, and makes him irredeemable. My suggestion is: have Mace Windu face Sidious alone. We can make that logical by adding some empty chairs in the council chamber. The Jedi are spread across the Galaxy, and there is no backup. The deaths of the other three Jedi could be reworked with footage from the Separatist slaughter, with a blue lightsaber rotoscoped in, making it look like Anakin is killing some Jedi during the raid on the temple.

SilverKey said:

The deaths of the other three Jedi could be reworked with footage from the Separatist slaughter, with a blue lightsaber rotoscoped in, making it look like Anakin is killing some Jedi during the raid on the temple.

this could work with the montage well, perhaps the windu-sidious scene could work like this...

1. a build up of scenes focuses on windus suspicions of palpatine to being the sith lord, possibly ending with the suggestion that 'he should be removed from office'
2. at another point, the war is believed to be over, people celebrate. perhaps the film reorder would be good at this, as the 'invisible hand' could crashland in the morning, with the celebrations during the day, and the turmoil in the nightime.
3. palpatine
4. anakin is summoned by palpatine, who reveals himself as sidious to anakin just before he is to leave his office.
5. windu leaves the jedi temple, [something, maybe a holographic communication from anakin] pushes him to act against the code of the jedi and take matters into his own hands
6. windu arrives alone - possibly a few hours after recieving the transmission. MACE: "I will not allow the Jedi Order to be destroyed", PALPATINE *laughing* "You're too late"
7. They battle as we view a montage of the storming of the Jedi Temple, lead by a mysterious hooded Jedi. Perhaps Ki-Ad-Mundi is shot in a place similar to where Bail Organa Parks up. Yoda and Obi Wan battle outside (same footage as them infiltrating)
8. The battle climaxes and Windu seems to have defeated Sidious. "I am going to end this", About to take the swing, Windu suddenly realises that there is stood right next to him, it is the mysterious hooded figure from before. "No." Windu utters in shock, moments before he is killed.
9. The hooded figure kneels before Palpatine. "You have done well my young apprentice" Palpatine complements. "The Jedi have been crushed as you ordered my Lord" the mysterios figure responds (maybe the voice cold be cold like darth maul?)
10. Obi Wan and Yoda walk through the halls of the moonlit Jedi Temple, noone survived. Studying the security hologram, Obi Wan is unaware of the Jedi's Identity, Yoda speaks "Revealed the Identity is of the Sithlord, a new apprentice he has!"
    

following these scenes, perhaps Yoda resolves not to confront the emperor, and turns to exile. Obi Wan, concerned for Anakin's safety, follows Padme (or travels with her openly? Maybe they decide to go to Mustafar together where he was sent on a final mission? On Mustafar, Anakin reveals his identity as the new apprentice (but not darth vader).

"around the survivors a perimeter create"

its sad that i left AOTC saying that over and over again. i totally agree on toning down the yoda sterotype alot, and possibly removing it all together. it would be cool if he seems to be going senile in ESB.

SilverKey said:

I'm sorry, but I disagree with that, brash_stryker. I actually think Anakin's issues with attachment is one of the few things that works very well in the PT. It's a thread that runs through all the three movies: he leaves his mother in TPM, is too late to save her in AOTC, and in ROTS, his one attachment has become such an obsession he turns to the Dark Side over it. It's actually pretty character defining.

It's not the reasoning that bothers me, so much as the way it's portrayed. You never actually get a sense that he's been turned. More like made a calculated decision, which to me, was not at all what I imagined turning to the dark side to be about. To me, it's a slow and gradual process of seduction, which yes, can include empty promises of saving the ones you love, but as it is now, it is the ONLY reason he turns, and it just isn't convincing.

This is why I think emphasising his distrust of the jedi/lust for power throughout the film, and de-emphasising the need to save padme needs to be done. Maybe not completely, as that was perhaps a little extreme of me, but definitely not as EXPLAIN TO THE AUDIENCE as it is now. For example, we could just have padme's death dream, but he doesn't mention it, and then palpatine's mention at the opera of a sith who could stop people from dying. That's all the audience needs to make the connection. Having Anakin explain his reasons for turning is stupid, and is just another example of Lucas' contempt for an audience he thinks are too stupid to connect dots themselves.

In the scene with anakin alone in the jedi council chamber, I really think there needs to be some fast paced sound editing, of the echoing voices of his peers criticising him/being dishonest, as well as palpatine's promises etc, which could gradually get faster and faster, culminating in a crescendo of noise, conveying his torment. Perhaps with Anakin screaming. This is when Ben Danger's idea of an anonymous Vader from then on in the film could come into play.

i heard that he had a sore throat that morning, and they just filtered his voice. lucas liked the effect it gave so decided not to re-record the lines.:P

ahh ok. weird because he sound alright in that scene.:) its weird how the pantomime villain in ROTJ becomes one of the better roles of the PT.

BarBar Jinkx said:

I still say an uncampifying filter needs to be used on his over the top lines in RotS

 

Certainly getting rid of the "No, no, no" and the "Gooooood" bits would save some of this scene I would prefer a sudden morph suggesting that he has had to call on the full strength of his powers to defeat Windu which screws him up instead of the lightning.