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The Pope — Page 2

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I don't agree with the idea of having a "Pope". It was founded on the idea of Peter as the "rock" of the church. But I think Catholics have taken it way too far.

But John Paul II was a good man indeed, God rest his soul.

I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently.

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Hal hit it on the head.

In the simplest form, I don't agree with one man having so much supposed spiritual autority. What if we get an evil Pope in the future who subtley corrupts Catholic teachings into something far more insidious.

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see i personally dont hate the popacy, but i am not a big fan of it, for numerous reasons mostly for the way they react against sciences and research, historically.
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Well the popacy is supposed to be kinda simbolic, a man that represents the legacy of Christ. He has no real powers over our lifes, he dictates no law that results in punishment if you don't obey. Of course you can be excomungated from the church, but you gotta do something really nasty, like being an anti-pope (anti-pope is a sort of a false pope, it's NOT being against the pope) or burning bibles and churches... The pope has no real power over our lifes like a president or a first minister has, so if you don't like the papacy, who has no real effect over anyone, including catholics, perhaps you shouldn't like any executive power job, such as presidency...
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Originally posted by: Darth Chaltab
What if we get an evil Pope in the future who subtley corrupts Catholic teachings into something far more insidious.


Corrupting Catholic teachings?!?!? The hell you say!

"Something far more insidious" than what? More insidious than the Catholic church already is?

The Catholicchurch needs a lot of help to really regain a lot of the respect it has lost in recent years. Pope John Paul II was one of the only good things going for Catholicism. It will take one heckuva great man to fill his shoes.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Originally posted by: Bossk
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Originally posted by: Darth Chaltab
What if we get an evil Pope in the future who subtley corrupts Catholic teachings into something far more insidious.


Corrupting Catholic teachings?!?!? The hell you say!

"Something far more insidious" than what? More insidious than the Catholic church already is?

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Originally posted by: Bossk
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Originally posted by: Darth Chaltab
What if we get an evil Pope in the future who subtley corrupts Catholic teachings into something far more insidious.


Corrupting Catholic teachings?!?!? The hell you say!

"Something far more insidious" than what? More insidious than the Catholic church already is?


You'r right. I should just be glad they no longer sell indulgences.

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The Catholicchurch needs a lot of help to really regain a lot of the respect it has lost in recent years. Pope John Paul II was one of the only good things going for Catholicism. It will take one heckuva great man to fill his shoes.


You guys are completely missing the point. Catholicism and Christianity are actually affected very little by the Pope. If you think that the religion depends on who the Pope happens to be, you don't know what you're talking about. It's not about filling the last Pope's shoes; it's about leading the Church and providing an example for others to follow.

Trust me! I'm actually a Catholic myself and I know about this.

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Hey, I said I didn't want to discuss it, they're the ones asking me.

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Originally posted by: Trooperman
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The Catholicchurch needs a lot of help to really regain a lot of the respect it has lost in recent years. Pope John Paul II was one of the only good things going for Catholicism. It will take one heckuva great man to fill his shoes.


You guys are completely missing the point. Catholicism and Christianity are actually affected very little by the Pope. If you think that the religion depends on who the Pope happens to be, you don't know what you're talking about. It's not about filling the last Pope's shoes; it's about leading the Church and providing an example for others to follow.

Trust me! I'm actually a Catholic myself and I know about this.


I'm not saying he affects it much. But what he represents is the bigger picture here. He represents the faith of millions of people, regardless of denomination. He is the physical embodiment of Catholicism regardless of his actual "effect" upon the religion and its tenets. I could care less if he does a single friggin' thing, he is still what people recognize. And, whether he did something or not for the actual religion, all he did for the world as a whole is far greater.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Originally posted by: ricarleite
Well the popacy is supposed to be kinda simbolic, a man that represents the legacy of Christ. He has no real powers over our lifes, he dictates no law that results in punishment if you don't obey. Of course you can be excomungated from the church, but you gotta do something really nasty, like being an anti-pope (anti-pope is a sort of a false pope, it's NOT being against the pope) or burning bibles and churches... The pope has no real power over our lifes like a president or a first minister has, so if you don't like the papacy, who has no real effect over anyone, including catholics, perhaps you shouldn't like any executive power job, such as presidency...


that is not true. the pope has the same type of power as say the queen of england does now. they have the power change ppls veiws because so many ppl look to them. they have the power to inspire people to support ideals, thats why pope john paul is credited with being 50% responsible for toppling communism in eastern europe. he inspired the people of poland to and other places to topple the USSR.
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I think what Ric meant was legal power.. True, popes have symbolic power, but they don't have legal power, atleast outside of Vatican City.

btw. for a great movie on the Papacy, I recomend "The Shoes Of The Fishermam", and just so you know I am not Catholic.
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Well one thing is sure, it'll be kinda weird having a different pope now. At least in the first year.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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It's official, Joseph Ratzinger is the new Pope, with the name "Benedict XVI".

I'm not sure about this... I had a bad feeling when I saw this guy on TV... and Benedict? C'mon...
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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The first Benedict tried to unite the people and heal divisions in the Church, if you want the symbolism behind it.

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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I'm waiting for some art-rock indie band to adopt the name "Benedict XVI." You can see it, right?

Princess Leia: I happen to like nice men.
Han Solo: I'm a nice man.

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It would be a great way for Falco to make a comeback. Alas...
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Originally posted by: GundarkHunter
I'm waiting for some art-rock indie band to adopt the name "Benedict XVI." You can see it, right?


LOL ... yes, I can. Very interesting perspective, GH.
I am fluent in over six million forms of procrastination.
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I've read that Ratzinger was once part of the "Hitler Youth"... I don't know, I'm not trying to be disrespectful here, but he seems kinda evil to me... Some sort of a "Palpatinesque" way about him, like he pressured the cardinals to vote for him or something...
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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As far as the Nazi Youth thing, he may have been forced to join. But even so I can't say I'm crazy about their choice for Pope. I was hoping they would choose an African or Latin American.
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Originally posted by: Warbler
As far as the Nazi Youth thing, he may have been forced to join. But even so I can't say I'm crazy about their choice for Pope. I was hoping they would choose an African or Latin American.

In agreement on both counts. Having a non-white Pope would have been a nice change of pace, and Benedict XVI is 78 years old! Not to be morbid but that doesn't leave very long for him to make much of an impact, especially after the decades long term of John Paul II.
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Originally posted by: ricarleite
I've read that Ratzinger was once part of the "Hitler Youth"... I don't know, I'm not trying to be disrespectful here, but he seems kinda evil to me... Some sort of a "Palpatinesque" way about him, like he pressured the cardinals to vote for him or something...
I have the same bad feeling. I don't know why. I don't really watch TV so I've only seen a picture of the new Pope on the cover of somebody else's newspaper on my way to work this morning...but I just get a bad feeling.

War does not make one great.

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Originally posted by: Warbler
As far as the Nazi Youth thing, he may have been forced to join. But even so I can't say I'm crazy about their choice for Pope. I was hoping they would choose an African or Latin American.


This is a good point. As an ex-Catholic, IMO: He should have been African or Middle/East Asian. The church is making great strides in Africa and the Eastern world, and they are doctrinally more conservative than most.

Nemo me impune lacessit

http://ttrim.blogspot.com
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I wanted the nigerian one to win, if not him then Claudio Hummes... But no, the church chose to stick to its white european creepy looking Pope...

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Originally posted by: Yoda Is Your Father
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Originally posted by: ricarleite
I've read that Ratzinger was once part of the "Hitler Youth"... I don't know, I'm not trying to be disrespectful here, but he seems kinda evil to me... Some sort of a "Palpatinesque" way about him, like he pressured the cardinals to vote for him or something...
I have the same bad feeling. I don't know why. I don't really watch TV so I've only seen a picture of the new Pope on the cover of somebody else's newspaper on my way to work this morning...but I just get a bad feeling.


I'm not kidding, this Ratzinger guy has some evil aurea over him... It's kinda suspicious him winning this conclave... Feels like he threatned the cardinals to vote for him...
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Originally posted by: ricarleite
I wanted the nigerian one to win, if not him then Claudio Hummes... But no, the church chose to stick to its white european creepy looking Pope...

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Originally posted by: Yoda Is Your Father
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Originally posted by: ricarleite
I've read that Ratzinger was once part of the "Hitler Youth"... I don't know, I'm not trying to be disrespectful here, but he seems kinda evil to me... Some sort of a "Palpatinesque" way about him, like he pressured the cardinals to vote for him or something...
I have the same bad feeling. I don't know why. I don't really watch TV so I've only seen a picture of the new Pope on the cover of somebody else's newspaper on my way to work this morning...but I just get a bad feeling.


I'm not kidding, this Ratzinger guy has some evil aurea over him... It's kinda suspicious him winning this conclave... Feels like he threatned the cardinals to vote for him...


I've made a conscious decision to leave the church. I now consider myself to be of the Protestant/Reformed faith (although no official affiliation yet). So, I have a problem with the entire notion of papal authority to begin with. The institution is too easily corrupted, and the position seems to have falled to an almost idolatrous one within the entire body. This guy...time will tell obviously. I can just hear him start his first encyclic: "From this time forward, every Jedi is to be considered an enem....ooops, wrong speech".
Nemo me impune lacessit

http://ttrim.blogspot.com