Info: The Matrix - with original theatrical color timing? — Page 3

Howso?

drngr said:

Howso?

The HD-DVD set seems to get fairly high marks for audio and video quality while some are obviously unhappy with the color timing treatment of the Bluray.  Maybe the HD-DVD set would be a better starting point at least picture wise?

It would be great to have something good to put the DTS theatrical audio to ya know, kick it up a notch.

:)

I think the HDVD has the exact same video encode as the bluray. I have the HDVD and it definitely has the altered color timing.

Yeah i'm pretty darn sure the hddvd and blu-ray are the exact same.

I'm dying  to hear the DTS theatrical audio for the Matrix though.

Are the files put together for the dts cinema?

DoomBot said:

Yeah i'm pretty darn sure the hddvd and blu-ray are the exact same.

I'm dying  to hear the DTS theatrical audio for the Matrix though.

Are the files put together for the dts cinema?

The theatrical audio is not yet decoded or put together for sync.  I was hoping to see where this was going with the final choice for video to be used.  What I might do is ask someone here to work with the audio and then maybe use the HD-DVD video along with it's DD+ and add the DTS to it.  Whether it's worth it or not I don't know but being able to switch between soundtracks may be a cool thing and distract from the color timing enough for people to enjoy more .... unless someone wants to take adjusting the color timing to match it's theatrical look.

Recolortiming the HDDVD/Bluray would be a huge undertaking as there are a lot of color differences from shot to shot. I would just recommend syncing the DTS to an unchanged source, probably the first DVD or the HDTV (you would need to crop the HDTV to get it back to its original aspect ratio). You could also sync it to the BD/HDVD if you really wanted.

I would rather it be synced to the BD/HDDVD even if a recoloring is not done to it.

I agree with those encouraging a sync to the HDTV. The detail is decent, and the new color timing on bth the releases is atrocious.

Are both the Ultimate Matrix Collection (5 disc) and the Complete Matrix Trilogy (3 disc) on HD-DVD tweaked?

Update:  Got my answer already ... both are tint shifted.

penguinofgreatness said:

you would need to crop the HDTV to get it back to its original aspect ratio

See my screenshots on the previous page; the open matte is a little cropped on the sides throughout. The amount it's opened up on the top vs the bottom probably varies a bit as well.

borisanddoris said:

Despite color changes, it might be best to sync to the Blu-ray since it is the most readily available for those wanting the theatrical DTS audio.

 

I picked up 3 HD-DVD downloads, of course they are H264 IceBane releases and would easily fit on a DVD5 but they look nice.  I am already looking at a few different internal drives as I have some HD-DVD's I'd like to watch without having to purchase a stand alone player for on eBay.

Apparently some HD-DVD presentations are better than their Bluray counterparts when it comes to DVNR .... the Mummy movies come to mind.

I have the Matrix Bluray box but I may get the HD-DVD set if I can find it cheap enough just to compare with. 

I could rent The Matrix Blu-ray and rip the main video file and then re-time it. It still has the re-timing to match Reloaded and Revolutions, correct?

No, it won't be for DVD, unless if I make a BD9. Yes for BD25 since it's cheapest. Still VC-1, no MPEG2 shit downconversion. Yes for the lossless audio and subtitles.

If you don't have a Blu-ray disc player, PS3, or even a BD-ROM or burner drive, then tough shit.

Nothing will be changed to the video concerning film grain, just retiming the color. Should be easy.

FremenDar007 said:

I could rent The Matrix Blu-ray and rip the main video file and then re-time it. It still has the re-timing to match Reloaded and Revolutions, correct?

No, it won't be for DVD, unless if I make a BD9. Yes for BD25 since it's cheapest. Still VC-1, no MPEG2 shit downconversion. Yes for the lossless audio and subtitles.

If you don't have a Blu-ray disc player, PS3, or even a BD-ROM or burner drive, then tough shit.

 

Nothing will be changed to the video concerning film grain, just retiming the color. Should be easy.

Well, if this could be done fairly simply all that would need to be done is have the DTS audio properly put back together and have it synch with the video.  Do we have anyone here that is so good at audio editing and synch that they don't need to timeshift to synch? 

I sure hope there's someone that can do this, i have sound forge but i only know somethings. I take it the DTS is for 24.000fps and would have to be adjusted to 23.976fps? As well as other changes to it i'm sure.

DoomBot said:

I sure hope there's someone that can do this, i have sound forge but i only know somethings. I take it the DTS is for 24.000fps and would have to be adjusted to 23.976fps? As well as other changes to it i'm sure.

 

 

This is what I know .....

Each reel is encoded with a specific reel number.  Each includes all of the leader and tail out stuff.  If you actually look at a piece of film and decode the DTS timecode, the first frame count is something like 300- which is 10 seconds (DTS uses 30 fps).  The player actually syncs to the frame number printed on the film in the timecode.  The timecode includes reel number, frame number (for that reel) and the feature serial number.

Also, the audio is separated in to reels so each (6 or 7 depending) have to get edited back together properly. 

Jetrell Fo said:

FremenDar007 said:

I could rent The Matrix Blu-ray and rip the main video file and then re-time it. It still has the re-timing to match Reloaded and Revolutions, correct?

No, it won't be for DVD, unless if I make a BD9. Yes for BD25 since it's cheapest. Still VC-1, no MPEG2 shit downconversion. Yes for the lossless audio and subtitles.

If you don't have a Blu-ray disc player, PS3, or even a BD-ROM or burner drive, then tough shit.

 

Nothing will be changed to the video concerning film grain, just retiming the color. Should be easy.

Well, if this could be done fairly simply all that would need to be done is have the DTS audio properly put back together and have it synch with the video.  Do we have anyone here that is so good at audio editing and synch that they don't need to timeshift to synch? 

What about the Dolby TrueHD track from the Blu-ray disc or is that not up to par? I bet it's another one of those -4db tracks too...

Might as well use my Blu-ray disc burner for a worthwhile project. All I'd need to do is have the same color timimg throughout the entire film to match the original DVD/cinematic release? Could compress it to fit on a BD25 with room to spare for a high bitrate DTS track.

Especially because Blu-ray has far better color timing and detail compared to even LD, DVD and HD DVD. If the bitrate is better and film grain kept it compared to HD DVD.

As I've mentioned, I'd never make any DVD versions of anything. AVCHD/BD9 or BD25 for this.

Jetrell Fo said:

DoomBot said:

I sure hope there's someone that can do this, i have sound forge but i only know somethings. I take it the DTS is for 24.000fps and would have to be adjusted to 23.976fps? As well as other changes to it i'm sure.

 

 

This is what I know .....

Each reel is encoded with a specific reel number.  Each includes all of the leader and tail out stuff.  If you actually look at a piece of film and decode the DTS timecode, the first frame count is something like 300- which is 10 seconds (DTS uses 30 fps).  The player actually syncs to the frame number printed on the film in the timecode.  The timecode includes reel number, frame number (for that reel) and the feature serial number.

Also, the audio is separated in to reels so each (6 or 7 depending) have to get edited back together properly. 

It would be interesting to have one of these audio files to mess around with just to see whats it's all about. How big is 1 reel after you decode it?

DoomBot said:

Jetrell Fo said:

DoomBot said:

I sure hope there's someone that can do this, i have sound forge but i only know somethings. I take it the DTS is for 24.000fps and would have to be adjusted to 23.976fps? As well as other changes to it i'm sure.

 

 

This is what I know .....

Each reel is encoded with a specific reel number.  Each includes all of the leader and tail out stuff.  If you actually look at a piece of film and decode the DTS timecode, the first frame count is something like 300- which is 10 seconds (DTS uses 30 fps).  The player actually syncs to the frame number printed on the film in the timecode.  The timecode includes reel number, frame number (for that reel) and the feature serial number.

Also, the audio is separated in to reels so each (6 or 7 depending) have to get edited back together properly. 

It would be interesting to have one of these audio files to mess around with just to see whats it's all about. How big is 1 reel after you decode it?

Reel 1 of The Matrix decoded, 16m 52s long, 6 channel 5.1 Stereo WAV, 510.61MB ....

FremenDar007 said:

Jetrell Fo said:

FremenDar007 said:

I could rent The Matrix Blu-ray and rip the main video file and then re-time it. It still has the re-timing to match Reloaded and Revolutions, correct?

No, it won't be for DVD, unless if I make a BD9. Yes for BD25 since it's cheapest. Still VC-1, no MPEG2 shit downconversion. Yes for the lossless audio and subtitles.

If you don't have a Blu-ray disc player, PS3, or even a BD-ROM or burner drive, then tough shit.

 

Nothing will be changed to the video concerning film grain, just retiming the color. Should be easy.

Well, if this could be done fairly simply all that would need to be done is have the DTS audio properly put back together and have it synch with the video.  Do we have anyone here that is so good at audio editing and synch that they don't need to timeshift to synch? 

What about the Dolby TrueHD track from the Blu-ray disc or is that not up to par? I bet it's another one of those -4db tracks too...

Might as well use my Blu-ray disc burner for a worthwhile project. All I'd need to do is have the same color timimg throughout the entire film to match the original DVD/cinematic release? Could compress it to fit on a BD25 with room to spare for a high bitrate DTS track.

Especially because Blu-ray has far better color timing and detail compared to even LD, DVD and HD DVD. If the bitrate is better and film grain kept it compared to HD DVD.

As I've mentioned, I'd never make any DVD versions of anything. AVCHD/BD9 or BD25 for this.

Would it have to be compressed or is the Bluray a BD50?

Ok so not to bad maybe 3gbs or alittle over total for all 6 or 7 reels.

Total file size for the Matrix with the TrueHD is 19.5GB

So even if we add the DTS Cinema and TrueHD it will still fit on a bd25.

DoomBot said:

Ok so not to bad maybe 3gbs or alittle over total for all 6 or 7 reels.

The editing is an undertaking for sure and I know I am still an amature at it.  Trimming the files to bring the reels together at the correct spot for synching is really where I fall short as I just don't have the experience.  Hell, if I could synch 1 reel at a time to video it would probably make it a bit easier but I don't believe it can be done that way.    

As for video size, if the HD-DVD is a 30GB disc, the Bluray is a 25GB disc, and the transfers are the same it wouldn't matter which you use as long as you had hardware support for both when ripping the video, right?

No it wouldn't matter once you extract from either source it will end up the same size.

Frankly i don't care if it fits on a bd25 since i don't watch movies from dics.

I extract them all to hard drives and watch through a media player.

FremenDar007 said:

Nothing will be changed to the video concerning film grain, just retiming the color. Should be easy.

What makes you say that? In addition to the literal hue change, there are huge changes in contrast to the point of clipping, as well as edge enhancement to give a "bolder" look.