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The Mandalorian - a general discussion thread - * SPOILERS * — Page 58

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BREAKING: Gina Carano no longer employed by Lucasfilm after latest array of controversial social media posts

Deadline

Source: https://io9.gizmodo.com/gina-carano-is-no-longer-a-part-of-star-wars-1846244896

No more Cara Dune in The Mandalorian? Gina Carano wasn’t exactly popular because of her political statements, but it seems that a recent TikTok alluding to antisemitism is the stroke that broke the camel’s back. Apparently this and other posts quickly got Gina canceled in social media and a Lucasfilm spokesperson stated they don’t have any further ties to the actress and condemned her comments.

What do you guys think?

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She most recently made a tweet comparing being a Republican in Biden’s America to being a Jew during the Holocaust. She’s apparently also tweeted transphobic statements, and made tweets mocking COVID vaccines and mail-in voting, and liked tweets that were supportive of the Capitol riot. I think some things are certainly more egregious than others, but I think the Nazi tweet definitely crossed the line for her employers.

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Gina went far too far yesterday. What she shared was a post trivialising the Holocaust to make a political point. That is not acceptable - neither is mocking trans people (as vague as that joke might have been), denying racism, or sharing harmful conspiracy theories about the pandemic or the US election. It’s about time Lucasfilm stopped catering to bigots.

Gina was already in deep waters, with the #FireGinaCarano hashtag having trended a couple times before. I have NO idea why she decided it was appropriate - or wise, for her own sake - to share a post like that. She brought this on herself.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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Thing is, she had SO many opportunities to not be terrible. Seriously. Staff members on shows get SO MUCH leeway from fans, because they’re fans! They don’t want to say anything, even if it’s true, because they don’t want to harm the series they like. If you get to a point where fans are outright pushing for your removal, you probably went “too far” a long time ago. This evokes a lot of 2019’s Vic Mignogna shenanigans, where internally the issues with the actor had been known for YEARS, but because they were someone people liked and made the company money, they didn’t get removed until WAY too late, leading to backlash from that sect of online people that just don’t care who gets hurt* as long as they get their TV. If either the company had dealt with the bad behavior early, or the person involved had simply stopped, there almost never would have been a problem (I say almost because in the case of Mignogna you don’t just take back years of sexual harassment).

The simple fact is, companies will only deal with bad behavior once they fear NOT doing so will be a financial threat. The fact that this went down the way it did shows both that Carano did NOT feel threatened by Lucasfilm’s actions AND that Lucasfilm themselves waited the absolute longest they could to take her off the project, which basically ensures the crazy backlash from entitled internet weirdos.

* (I should mention that in both cases, this is a charitable assumption. I actually think defenders of both Carano and Vic are angry because they agree with the actions of the actors who got removed, but I guess there could be some who don’t, and just didn’t want things to change)

TL;DR: Carano dug her own grave, but also Disney should have acted earlier if they didn’t want backlash from the angry online brigade.

Watch Adventure Time

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Wexter said:

Thank you for a thorough answer, however, I respectfully disagree on several accounts.

You’re very welcome. Like you, I doubt that Gina meant the image as openly anti-semitic, but it was foolish to slap such a graphic image on her twitter without looking into it. Same goes to BLM Oxford - it must be the extreme analogy that attracts people who are looking to make a point about extreme wealth inequality, which I suspect was the motive for both Gina and the BLM group.

As for this whole topic in general, I love the character of Cara Dune - a refuge from Alderaan having to find purpose again in the aftermath of the war - and I think a recast is best. I wondered if it’s possible for Lucasfilm to have fired Gina and told her, ‘If you stop sharing offensive stuff for good we’ll consider re-employing you’, but honestly I don’t think the relationship between her and the cast and crew (particularly Pedro, who is staunchly anti-Trump) would ever be the same again. There are plenty of other actors who would love to take on the role.

Speaking of Pedro Pascal… he recently did a couple of posts to support his sister Lux, who has just come out as a trans woman, and in an interview Lux said that throughout her whole journey to this point he was concerned for her wellbeing and always very encouraging. The difference between supporting trans people and mocking them is simply one of kindness. We’re lucky to have him.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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Freedom of speech protects against prosecution. Disney and Lucasfilm are in business to sell a product. If someone’s actions put that product in a negative light and potentially impact sales, of course they will fire that person. it’s just business. I’m sure they would rather have not fired her. It probably wasn’t just one thing she said, but the cumulative effect and not showing any sign of stopping.

I love the character of Cara Dune. Despite not having the most acting talent, I also was a fan of Gina Carano’s work in the movie Haywire and her appearance in the Almost Human series. The whole thing is very unfortunate.

I wonder what the plans for Cara Dune were in the third season of The Mandalorian and upcoming series like Rangers of the New Republic. Don’t think I’d be a fan of recasting. Probably best to replace with a new character.

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jedi_bendu said:

Wexter said:

Thank you for a thorough answer, however, I respectfully disagree on several accounts.

You’re very welcome. Like you, I doubt that Gina meant the image as openly anti-semitic, but it was foolish to slap such a graphic image on her twitter without looking into it. Same goes to BLM Oxford - it must be the extreme analogy that attracts people who are looking to make a point about extreme wealth inequality, which I suspect was the motive for both Gina and the BLM group.

As for this whole topic in general, I love the character of Cara Dune - a refuge from Alderaan having to find purpose again in the aftermath of the war - and I think a recast is best. I wondered if it’s possible for Lucasfilm to have fired Gina and told her, ‘If you stop sharing offensive stuff for good we’ll consider re-employing you’, but honestly I don’t think the relationship between her and the cast and crew (particularly Pedro, who is staunchly anti-Trump) would ever be the same again. There are plenty of other actors who would love to take on the role.

Should Pascal’s feelings towards a co-star’s political views, or just personality in general, be all that important to a production though? Many actors have in the past and present thoroughly disliked each other yet still managed to act professionally on set.

And I would hope film/TV sets are largely politics-free zones.


I personally take somewhat of a middle-ground viewpoint when it comes to stuff like this. Carano’s tweets (the one’s I’ve seen anyhow) were hyperbolic and some were outright thoughtless, but I still can’t help but feel that her views, provocative or not, isn’t any of her employers business at all. That is provided she behaves professionally and politely on set, which as far as I know she always has.

Of course if someone can point to direct harassment or incitements to harassment, violence, etc. then this discussion is obviously irrelevant and they made a good decisions. But, actors do have opinions, both liberal and conservative and there’s always bound to be things that will upset other people, both inside and outside the film industry. And the internet does unfortunately tend to bring out the worst in people and twitter especially makes it easy for people to quickly blurt out things without much thought regarding the larger context (and this goes double for retweets).

But as Rodney pointed out, companies do of course wish to avoid bad press so they are of course in their right overall.

Either way, as for how this will impact the series going forward, I’d assume it would be fairly easy to write her out of the The Mandalorian. Though we don’t know if they had big plans for her in the Rangers of the New Republic spin-off series as some speculated. It’s not that big of a plot thread to leave hanging, but it did seem like they were planning on doing something with the character.

Original Trilogy Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Beyond the OT Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Star Wars is Surrealism, not Science Fiction (essay)
Amazon link to my first novel; Dawn of the Karabu.

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jedi_bendu said:

As for this whole topic in general, I love the character of Cara Dune - a refuge from Alderaan having to find purpose again in the aftermath of the war - and I think a recast is best. I wondered if it’s possible for Lucasfilm to have fired Gina and told her, ‘If you stop sharing offensive stuff for good we’ll consider re-employing you’, but honestly I don’t think the relationship between her and the cast and crew (particularly Pedro, who is staunchly anti-Trump) would ever be the same again. There are plenty of other actors who would love to take on the role.

I think its a stretch to say that Pedro Pascal would have had problems with Gina. People with different political views work together all the time. Just look at Richard Donner and Mel Gibson. Their worldviews are like, diametrically opposed and they still managed to make six films together and seem to be on good terms to this day.

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theprequelsrule said:

The bigger question is should you lose your job for being “provocative”.

If you’re a celebrity with a massive following and employed by a giant corporation with a reputation to uphold, then probably, yes


Also I’ve noticed myself that Pedro and Gina always seemed to publicly get on well, behaving friendly in interviews, liking and commenting on each other’s social media posts. I meant her relationship with cast and crew in general might be more tense after being fired from the show, but perhaps that’s not the case. Anyway, including Pedro was a bad example.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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Quattro Bajeena said:

It really makes you think, huh? I guess some holocaust stupid analogies are worse than others.

Yes, you’re absolutely right! The comparison of concentration camps to concentration camps, a juxtaposition made to remind people that we must never repeat the mistakes of the past, is completely fair, while comparing conservatives to people who were attacked and persecuted because of their religion is not. Bang on.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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Like I said in my previous post; political views can and will provoke people, and Pascal has every right to do so just like anyone else should. Of course you could make the argument that detention camps, internment camps, and obviously extermination camps, are all very different things, but I do get this particular comparisons and what he was trying to say with it. The point I’m making is that Pascal, like many celebrities (and regular people) on social media, are not immune to provocative comparisons.

The eternal issue with these things is where do you draw the line? And when does someone’s definition of when the line is crossed simply boil down to their own personal political beliefs? And can you even make objective distinctions when no written law or rule is being clearly contradicted?

Original Trilogy Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Beyond the OT Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Star Wars is Surrealism, not Science Fiction (essay)
Amazon link to my first novel; Dawn of the Karabu.

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I’m currently rewatching The Mandalorian. It’s simply the best thing I’ve ever seen on any screen, big or small.

I’m a Disney+ subscriber for life, but I’d pay a hefty amount for The Mandalorian on 4K UHD disc.

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If there is a good reason to be pissed off at Disney this week, it’s that they have shuttered Blue Sky studios forever, (which they got in the Fox deal) putting hundreds out of work and scuttling their latest animated film Nimona, when it was less than a year from completion!

Disney will make money off of the corpse, as the Ice Age characters are worth more to them than the studio that actually created them. Sadly, only animation fans will notice or care about such things.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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I’m really looking forward to Mando on Mandalore doing Mandalorian things.

desperately trying to get forum back on topic

The Skywalker Saga:
I / II / III / IV / V / VI / VII / VIII / IX
This is the way.

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DZ-330 said:

I’m really looking forward to Mando on Mandalore doing Mandalorian things.

desperately trying to get forum back on topic

looks around sheepishly

I am too. It’ll be interesting to see what it will be like without Grogu being a focal point. I am looking forward to the resolution of the darksaber subplot, and seeing Mandalore in live action (outside of brief flashbacks).

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DZ-330 said:

I’m really looking forward to Mando on Mandalore doing Mandalorian things.

desperately trying to get forum back on topic

I wonder what’s gonna happen to Moff Gideon in captivity. It seems like part of his “master plan” was for one of the heroes to kill him, and we wasn’t prepared to get captured. I assume a Disney show wouldn’t feature a character repeatedly attempting to commit suicide in prison, but I can’t really imagine him doing anything else now that he’s played his part in the Empire’s plan, so to speak.

You’ve got to ask yourself one question: “Am I making Carrie Fisher’s ghost proud?”
Well, are ya, punk?

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RicOlie_2 said:

I am too. It’ll be interesting to see what it will be like without Grogu being a focal point. I am looking forward to the resolution of the darksaber subplot, and seeing Mandalore in live action (outside of brief flashbacks).

I will admit to being a bit concerned with him not being on the show. I prefer the more solitary episodes early on when it was primarily about the Mando and Grogu. It seemed more remote in location, as well as removed from the known franchise. Something I’ve always wanted.

I like the second season a lot and particularly enjoyed Fett, someone to me who was well over-backstoried in the prequels. For that, I’m incredibly thankful to The Mandalorian for putting right again.

That said, it looks like Grogu and Fett are taking a a backseat for a while. I have all the faith in the world in Favreau & Co to make an awesome show, so I’m looking forward to where they take the story. They had some outstanding episodes this second season. No reason they can’t keep up the great work.

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Listen, it don’t really matter to me, baby.
You believe what you want to believe.

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Quattro Bajeena said:

Shaddy Zaphon said:
This is gonna offend a lot of the bootyblasted reactionary demographic, but it’s actually really easy to not be called bigoted by progressives. If you think it’s difficult at all, it is a personal failure on your part and nobody is required to cater to and make exceptions for your bad behavior.

Oh yes, everyone who doesn’t bow to the left indoctrination has failed, failed in being a complete retard. LOL
Congratulations to Gina Carano, for not being a complete retard.

Kindly do not use the R word around here again. It’s offensive.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

Quattro Bajeena said:

Shaddy Zaphon said:
This is gonna offend a lot of the bootyblasted reactionary demographic, but it’s actually really easy to not be called bigoted by progressives. If you think it’s difficult at all, it is a personal failure on your part and nobody is required to cater to and make exceptions for your bad behavior.

Oh yes, everyone who doesn’t bow to the left indoctrination has failed, failed in being a complete retard. LOL
Congratulations to Gina Carano, for not being a complete retard.

Kindly do not use the R word around here again. It’s offensive.

That’s retarded, but ok.

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While I’m not sure how much we’ll actually get to see, I’m very curious about what goes on with Luke training Grogu and where Grogu ends up.

I’m also very much looking forward to seeing how the Dark Saber “issue” plays out, as others mentioned.

On a more random thought, I would LOVE to see Hasbro bring out some Mando themed Micro Machines. I had a blast getting back into Star Wars Micro Machines when TFA came out and was very sad they canned the line after Rogue One (though I’m glad we got MMs from R1!).

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I let the political discussion continue for a bit here because it was relative to a member of the cast. I also participated. Both were a mistake. Locked until it’s subsided or we have actual news about the third season.

  • Forum Rule #4:
    No politics; only light discussion of current events is permitted, and only in the Off Topic section. Your signature, which appears beneath all your posts, may not contain political content or social commentary.*

Edit;
I’ve also cleaned out a lot of the pure political arguing. A bit heavy-handed perhaps, but I am leaving the banning post for reference. I’ll clean that out later as well.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Listen, it don’t really matter to me, baby.
You believe what you want to believe.

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My feelings on Mando season 2 have actually soured over the past few months. Part of that is maybe bitterness at how much Disney seems to be capitalising on its success, and that possibly taking away from a future for animated shows, but in general I’ve come to see the plot of season 2 as too contrived. It’s playing join the dots with its special character appearances, there are too many coincidences, the sidequest structure is a little formulaic, and when Grogu gets kidnapped it’s not actually as emotionally compelling as it should be. Season 2 has some of my favourite episodes - The Marshal, The Heiress and The Believer, and I still find those outstanding - but now I might prefer season 1.

I wonder if anyone else has had this kind of change of feelings now the hype for the new season is over. For me, it’s similar to what happened to my opinion on The Force Awakens: over time I saw many more flaws in the film, but I’m still grateful it gave me an amazing viewing experience when it came out. I still remember the weeks of waiting for new Mando episodes really fondly.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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Now that this thread is open again I can finally share some videos that previously posted in the Beyond the OT Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds) thread.


Behind the Magic: The Visual Effects of The Mandalorian Season 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fb6Aww3LIDE - from the official ILMVFX YouTube channel (3:30 mins long).

The blurb:
“Visual effects work on The Mandalorian was completed in all five of ILM’s studios (San Francisco, Singapore, Vancouver, London, and Sydney) as well as a contingent of other vendors under ILM’s supervision. The season’s 8 episodes encompassed nearly 5,000 visual effects shots in addition to all of ILM’s real-time effects work done for use during principal photography. The effects team leveraged virtually every trick in the book, from miniatures and motion control to traditional puppeteering, advanced animatronics, spectacular special effects, and photo-real CG. Here’s a sampling of ILM’s post visual effects work done for the series that garnered ILM 13 Visual Effects Society Award nominations.”

The Virtual Production of The Mandalorian, Season Two
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gX4N5rDYeQ - from the ILMVFX YouTube channel (7 mins long).

The blurb:
“For the second season of Lucasfilm’s hit Disney+ series, The Mandalorian, Industrial Light & Magic reengineered their StageCraft virtual production platform rolling out version 2.0 in which ILM introduced among other things, Helios, Industrial Light & Magic’s first cinematic render engine designed for real-time visual effects. Engineered from the ground up with film and television production in mind, Helios offers incredible performance, high fidelity real-time ray tracing, the ability to rip through scenes of unparalleled complexity, all while leveraging ILM’s unrivaled color science, and was designed from the start to work seamlessly with ILM StageCraft.
The purpose-built, production-hardened platform allows filmmakers to explore new ideas, communicate concepts, and execute shots in a collaborative and flexible production environment.”

Original Trilogy Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Beyond the OT Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Star Wars is Surrealism, not Science Fiction (essay)
Amazon link to my first novel; Dawn of the Karabu.