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The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS ** — Page 54

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pittrek said:

To be honest, I can’t. I had to google it.

Listen to the soundtrack, you’ll know her name ! (and her lovely theme)

(but I think the character sucks… too bad since the death of her sister is a truly powerful moment and I like the necklace thing - which is very Lucas as a matter of fact)

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MalàStrana said:

pittrek said:

To be honest, I can’t. I had to google it.

Listen to the soundtrack, you’ll know her name ! (and her lovely theme)

(but I think he character sucks… too bad since the death of her sister is a truly powerful moment and I like the necklace thing - which is very Lucas as a matter of fact)

Oh yes, her sister was actually interesting, and had a really well written death scene.

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How I think Episode IX will go down.

How do you break away from copying the Original Trilogy? When it comes to Kylo Ren, where does JJ go from here? He can’t be turned, that’s too predictable. Will he be killed? That’s too easy and predictable, so what do you think will happen with him?

I see it going down like this in Episode IX, he will seek out knowledge and lore, possibly using Snoke’s ring, which will give him unlimited Darkside power, much like the Emperor. Kylo will be almost as powerful as the Emperor in ROTJ. He will have darkside lightning that he can shoot out of his hands. Snoke’s ring is the key.

He will have what’s left of the Knights of Ren, because those guards in Snoke’s throne room were actually some of the Knights of Ren, the others Kylo Ren will call upon once he discovers his new power.

I also see Kylo Ren hiring bounty hunters to search for Rey, Finn, Poe and the rest of them. I think he’ll capture someone or a few of them, and Rey will confront Kylo for the ultimate battle.

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Oh yeah I just want to mention how much I adore the over the top acting by Mark Hamill from Kylo’s point of view of his attempted murder.

Also, I hope that Kylo redeems himself but Rey taps into her anger and still murders him in cold blood, like in the last novel of the Legacy of the Force series with Jaina and Darth Caedus. I’m not banking on that, and I won’t be disappointed if it doesn’t happen, but still, it’d be cool.

Not enough people read the EU.

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My review of TLJ: great RiffTrax material.

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I want to see either Rey or Kylo get injured badly and need something to live, much like Vader, but not exactly like Vader. Would be weird to see Rey wearing something similar to Vader, but being the hero instead of the villain.

Perhaps on a planet where they both have to use masks to live like the Ralph McQuarrie art of Vader and Luke.

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DrDre said:

I’m out of here.

Using the r-word to describe a fictional character is apparently bad enough for a moderator to weigh in, but directly calling a user an asshole and telling them to fuck off is not?!!! If mr. Frink objected to the use of the word, he could have just said so in a civilized manner. I would have apologized, and that would have been the end of it.

I’ve outstayed my welcome on these boards. Hasta la vista baby.

Wish some people would stick to their promises…

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adywan said:

MalàStrana said:

KILLOFFPOE said:
Watching TFA again, some lines about Snoke sound ridiculous. Especially Leia talking about Snoke turning Ben.

We can still presume that Luke lied to Leia about that when he left everything behind ?

But Snoke did turn Ben. He had already seduced Ben before Luke’s moment of weakness.

I’ve only seen TLJ once so far, so is it established ? (I really don’t remember when Snoke got into the Luke/Ben equation)

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Matt.F said:

DrDre said:

I’m out of here.

Using the r-word to describe a fictional character is apparently bad enough for a moderator to weigh in, but directly calling a user an asshole and telling them to fuck off is not?!!! If mr. Frink objected to the use of the word, he could have just said so in a civilized manner. I would have apologized, and that would have been the end of it.

I’ve outstayed my welcome on these boards. Hasta la vista baby.

Wish some people would stick to their promises…

Yeah, and I wish some users would grow up, and stop attacking other users, but guess what? That’s never going to happen.

Perhaps you should stay on topic.

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MalàStrana said:

adywan said:

MalàStrana said:

KILLOFFPOE said:
Watching TFA again, some lines about Snoke sound ridiculous. Especially Leia talking about Snoke turning Ben.

We can still presume that Luke lied to Leia about that when he left everything behind ?

But Snoke did turn Ben. He had already seduced Ben before Luke’s moment of weakness.

I’ve only seen TLJ once so far, so is it established ? (I really don’t remember when Snoke got into the Luke/Ben equation)

I think Luke says something like “but Snoke had already won his heart”, when he’s relating the moment he lost Kylo for good.

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Quick question which has been on my mind lately. I have been thinking about the film’s overall symbolism and several times Kylo said that the true path forward was to burn the past and at the end of the film, Luke dies. Is this Lucas Film telling us, the OT fanbase that they have once and for all put the OT out to pasture? We all know that a lot of fans have waited for a very long time for the unmolested OT on Blu ray or 4K and now the latest word is ‘burn the past’ and to kill off the OT’s hero. Am I crazy (don’t answer that) or is there something to this theory? If this topic has been discussed already, forgive me, but trying to wade back through the past several pages was difficult.

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@DrDre
Ah Ok, thanks, I forgot that line. I’m still wondering how Ben could have lost his heart to Snoke (but I get the ST is in fact somehow a remake/retake of the PT with another way to tell the story of Anakin’s journey into the dark side).

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TK-949 said:

pleasehello said:

Because everyone on this forum loves RedLetterMedia so much:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9hwGZFPSmw

OMG! They didn’t like it. They didn’t like a movie I like! Now I don’t know, what I’m gonna do with rest of my life! I think I’m gonna hate them now.

I still haven’t watched RedLetterMedia’s review of The Force Awakens. Do they “like” that movie?

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Ryan said:

TK-949 said:

pleasehello said:

Because everyone on this forum loves RedLetterMedia so much:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9hwGZFPSmw

OMG! They didn’t like it. They didn’t like a movie I like! Now I don’t know, what I’m gonna do with rest of my life! I think I’m gonna hate them now.

I still haven’t watched RedLetterMedia’s review of The Force Awakens. Do they “like” that movie?

They thought it was an entertaining movie with some good characters, but that it was too derivative. Overall, I think they liked it mostly, but felt and still feel Star Wars is in the recycling business. TFA actually made RLM’s Mr. Plinkett praise the the prequels for trying to do something original.

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theprequelsrule said:

After seeing a bad Star wars movie this always calms me down: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBrLHMCTDAA

That’s why they shouldn’t have had a New Order and new Storm Troopers in these new movies. It really takes away from the ending in Jedi with the defeat of the Empire.

Since the 80’s, I’ve always envisioned that the Empire was defeated in ROTJ and stayed defeated. i.e. there wasn’t a New Order or any of that stuff in my mind coming after it.

Does anyone know if in Lucas’s treatment of the new trilogy if he had something like a New Order and new Storm Troopers?

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theprequelsrule said:

What if after the astral projection scene, we cut to Luke on ahchoo. He stands up with a little smile, his lightsaber flies to his hand and he puts it on his belt. He walks out and raises his X-wing from the water - time to join the fight. Would anyone have been opposed to this?

I would have done everything differently.

But I’d much rather have what you talk about than Luke disappearing.

I like the idea of Luke raising the X-wing at the end of the movie. And then in-between 8 and 9 is Luke flying to the Resistance.

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Thought you were going to say he wakes up on the island and takes out his lightsaber to commit Sudoku. (Humorous typo on purpose.)

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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yotsuya said:

DrDre said:

yotsuya said:

DrDre said:

Then there’s the fact that this entire arc aims to push Rey to the foreground as the next last Jedi, Luke 2.0, new and improved. However, does she deserve this mantle? Luke goes through hell and back before becoming a Jedi, making mistakes, suffering loss of life and limbs. Rey get’s her powers handed to her, and seemingly is never tempted. She’s almost a perfect heroine. The secret of her parents are supposed to be a representation of her personal demons, but it’s ultimately inconsequential. She cries about it, and the next scene she’s back being the hero. When Luke discovered the secret about his father, there was anguish and reflection, setting up the redemption arc of the next film.

Sorry to jump back a couple of pages, but if you remember Empire, Luke had this huge immediate reaction. The rest of his reaction had nothing to do with who his father is, but that Ben didn’t tell him. His litany is “Ben, why didn’t you tell me.” Before we ever see him really deal with it, he is back to his old self by the end of the movie and back to being a hero in the opening act of Jedi. Yes, he asks Yoda to confirm it, but Luke instantly accepted who his father was and carried on. So I’m failing to see how Rey crying about it and back to being a hero in the next scene is much different.

For one ROTJ takes place about a year after TESB, so it’s a difference between several minutes and a year. Secondly, the Luke we meet in ROTJ is not exactly the same character. He’s more mature, and serious, perhaps even a little darker (applying a Force choke early on). Either way, his discovery of his father’s identity leads directly into him questioning his masters, the shock of the confirmation, and the Vader redemption arc. Rey’s discovery as depicted really can’t go anywhere, and she’s already forgotten about it minutes later in the same film, and it is thus totally inconsequential. So, it’s definitely not the same situation.

One of the things that I didn’t point out was that it has been SW fans who have been dying to know who Rey’s parents are. Rey just wanted them to come back. Her revelation isn’t quite the same as Luke’s in TESB (and I was talking about how nomral he acted in the ending scene as he gets his new hand more than how he acted a year later in ROTJ). Rey learns her parents are nobody special (not a real surprise for her) whereas Luke learns the most evil creature in the Galaxy is his father. Quite a difference.

I think the problem, like with Rey’s parents thing. Is there was all this setup in TFA regarding her parents, then in 8 they just threw that away. i.e. all setup, and no payoff. I think this has to do with there not being a Lucas figure overseeing all these different hands in the pot. Rian came in and decided not to answer a lot of the setup questions from TFA.

I would not be surprised if you see fan edits of TFA where they edit out a lot of Rey’s parent stuff. I think the Rey’s parent stuff in TFA will feel like a drag on repeated viewings. That’s assuming nothing changes on that in 9.

I didn’t like JJ was doing TFA, and was originally glad he didn’t do 8. But I don’t like not getting payoff, i.e. Rian throwing it out the window. But before I saw 8, I didn’t like JJ coming back for 9. But now I’m glad that JJ is to hopefully add some payoff to 9.

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DrDre said:

Ryan said:

TK-949 said:

pleasehello said:

Because everyone on this forum loves RedLetterMedia so much:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9hwGZFPSmw

OMG! They didn’t like it. They didn’t like a movie I like! Now I don’t know, what I’m gonna do with rest of my life! I think I’m gonna hate them now.

I still haven’t watched RedLetterMedia’s review of The Force Awakens. Do they “like” that movie?

They thought it was an entertaining movie with some good characters, but that it was too derivative. Overall, I think they liked it mostly, but felt and still feel Star Wars is in the recycling business. TFA actually made RLM’s Mr. Plinkett praise the the prequels for trying to do something original.

I do think that about the prequels. In that I never felt the prequels were a rehash of the OT like we’re getting with the ST.

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Ryan said:
I would not be surprised if you see fan edits of TFA where they edit out a lot of Rey’s parent stuff. I think the Rey’s parent stuff in TFA will feel like a drag on repeated viewings. That’s assuming nothing changes on that in 9.

But knowing she really is “no one” and not a Skywalker/whatever blood relative is one of the strongest ideas of the movie (and RJ takes his time to make that reveal, so in a way it’s quite respectful of the material). By making Rey not-Skywalker, he gives the Saga new horizons (I don’t like the Rey character but this idea is great me-think).

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MalàStrana said:

Ryan said:
I would not be surprised if you see fan edits of TFA where they edit out a lot of Rey’s parent stuff. I think the Rey’s parent stuff in TFA will feel like a drag on repeated viewings. That’s assuming nothing changes on that in 9.

But knowing she really is “no one” and not a Skywalker/whatever blood relative is one of the strongest ideas of the movie (and RJ takes his time to make that reveal, so in a way it’s quite respectful of the material). By making Rey not-Skywalker, he gives the Saga new horizons (I don’t like the Rey character but this idea is great me-think).

If they wanted Rey to be a “no one”, then they could have done that in TFA. There was no need to do a big setup, then in TLJ to throw that away of her being a “no one”.

I would have much rather we know in TFA that Rey is no one. They could have easily and quickly done that in TFA of her NOT being a Skywalker sibling, but a daughter of regular “no one” parents.

What was the point of her being “classified” in TFA?

Who knows, maybe JJ will retcon the whole thing and it will matter in Episode 9?

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Oh I agree about that, there was some over-the-top “what girl?” moments in TFA (I count 3: 2 by Ren, 1 by Maz), but I would rather removing them in a TFA-Edit than removing the anti-twist of her legacy, which, in fact, means her legacy is the Force, not the Skywalker blood line. What I mean is that in every story of fight of light v darkness (good v evil and so on) every hero needs a nemesis, which is, by definition, his “anti”. What a better way to confront a no-one to the only heir of Skywalker the (“I THOUGHT he was a”) myth guy ? (THOUGHT = I might have been wrong about that… damned…)

PT: Anakin v his own inner fears of losing control/his beloved ones
OT: Luke v his very own father
ST: Rey v her faith in a myth

I agree it might not be handled that well in the movie, but it’s like the PT for me: the result on screen is not satisfying but the intentions are higly interesting (and I’m not going to rant against 2 entries that don’t even try that 😃).

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MalàStrana said:

Ryan said:
I would not be surprised if you see fan edits of TFA where they edit out a lot of Rey’s parent stuff. I think the Rey’s parent stuff in TFA will feel like a drag on repeated viewings. That’s assuming nothing changes on that in 9.

But knowing she really is “no one” and not a Skywalker/whatever blood relative is one of the strongest ideas of the movie (and RJ takes his time to make that reveal, so in a way it’s quite respectful of the material). By making Rey not-Skywalker, he gives the Saga new horizons (I don’t like the Rey character but this idea is great me-think).

Yeah, but one of the underlying issues was, that in TFA Rey was already so proficient in using the Force, that the only way to reconcile this with the workings of the Star Wars universe was, that she had been trained at a young age, and then abandoned on Jakku to protect her from Snoke.

By making her a nobody her character simly doesn’t rhyme with the rest of the Star Wars saga, magically getting access to these amazing powers without having to put in the commitment, and also bypassing the idea, that becoming a Jedi involves some sort of test of character, like the trials mentioned in the PT, and Luke facing Vader again in the OT.

I’ve often defended Rey’s character against accusations of her being a Mary Sue on the basis that her proficiency in the Force was linked to her past, but must now conclude, that as she is depicted in TLJ, those accusations may have merit. Her powers and ability to get out of trouble stretch believability.