But at the end of TESB we are left with Han frozen and the rebellion baseless. In TLJ we are left with the characters intact but the Resistance in shambles, but with hope. But in TESB, we have a galaxy wide Empire that is strong and unwavering. In TLJ, we have a First Order just beginning its conquest, not yet cemented or truly in power yet. The crawl uses the word reigns, but I take that to mean there is no force to oppose them rather than they have actually taken over anything and the rest of the text of the crawl agrees with that as does the movie dialog. It also provides a reason why Leia’s call was not answered. But the final scene in the stable shows that Luke had again brought hope and if word has reached Canto Bight, it will spread across the galaxy and give courage to those who want to resist the First Order’s conquest.
Yes, but that’s where our interpretations differ. TLJ makes a strong case, that the FO is a pretty much unstoppable force. Apart from the crawl, there’s the statement in the film, that the FO will control all major systems in weeks. This might not be very credible, but this is the message the film tries to get across. Then there’s the fact, that the Resistance/rebellion is decimated. People might be inspired, but it is hope without substance, wishful thinking at best. It is a spark that has to evaporate an ocean of bad. It may turn into a great big fire, but it may also be extinguished. If the latter is not the case, there’s no more tension in the film, as the heroes will prevail no matter what. The situation at the end of TESB is quite different. The Rebel Alliance may be without a base, but it has a fleet and personel. It has a real hope of defeating the Empire, more than just inspiration. There are unresolved story threads, like what will become of Han Solo? Is Darth Vader really Luke’s father? Is the Emperor really so powerful, that he can boss around Darth Vader? What is left to resolve after TLJ? I would say very little, other than the rebellion has to somehow reform, and beat the FO.
I tend to agree with this. “So this is how liberty dies. With thunderous applause” we had to wait 20 years for any sort of resistance or rebellion to rise again the Empire. Rebels has established that it happened more or less at the same time, with several cells rebelling in several places. But that was 15 years after RotS. Unless we have a huge time jump now, it’s going to be hard to have a huge showdown RotJ-style in IX and make it believable. But I hope they pull it off if they decide to go for it.
I wonder if they’re going to do something different for IX that not the final Rebels vs Empire and Rey vs Kylo confrontation. I really hope so.
The big difference. At the end of ROTS, you have the long established Galactic Republic turn into the first Galactic Empire. That means all the institutions, all the structure, everything remains in place and there is just a change at the top. In the ST, we have the capitol of the new Republic destroyed along with the fleet. The First Order is moving in (present action, not yet completed) so they will have to come in and establish a new structure and build it from scratch. On some world they may just be able to step into the Republic’s shoes, other they will have to fight to gain control. They cannot just walk into the role of the Republic like the Emperor did in ROTS. So the situation is entirely different. If Leia can raise a fleet in time, they could still stop the First Order from gaining any real power in the remains of the Republic and many of the Republic world will likely form a new govenment on another world. There is no easy path here like the Emperor spent so many years arranging for himself. The First Order was always about conquest of the new Republic while the Empire was about subjugation of the extant old Republic.
It will not take 20 years to gather allies to fight back. It could happen in weeks or months and be realistic.
How? It took the Allies three years to mount an attack against the Axis powers in WWII, who like the FO conquered continental Europe in a matter of weeks. The allies were mostly sovereign nations with their military power intact. The Resistance is in ruins. Even if they still have allies, it takes years to form and build an organisation with a unified agenda. The weeks or months prognosis is completely unrealistic even in the GFFA.
Um… that is one front of one war. It took 4 months for the US to mount the Doolittle Raid on Tokyo. The battle of Midway was 7 months to the day from Pearl Harbor. By the time D-day happened half the battles in the Pacific had been fought. And you are talking about a major invasion of occupied territory. That is not the case as we leave the story in TLJ. The Republic had a fleet, but unless they were absolutely crazy, so did many of the worlds of the Republic. Where is the Mon Calamari fleet? And there are bound to be others. And if you think they aren’t out there, then why did Leia send that message? When you consider all the pieces given to us in TLJ, the First Order invasion is not going to be met without a fight. And an invasion force is only good until it is spread too thin.
Also, the other theaters of WWII were North Africa, Mediterranean, and the Eastern Front, all of which saw major activity prior to D-day. Also, the war was going for 2 years with plenty of activity on all fronts before Pearl Harbor. So your analogy is way way off.
Actually it is not, as many of the allied countries that mounted those attacks you mention were not invaded. As I stated these were sovereign nations with full military capabilities. As TLJ states, the FO will control all the major systems in weeks. You continue to ignore what is stated jn the film. This clearly implies these systems do not have the military capabilities to stop them. So, a rebellion would have to be mounted from occupied territory. As such the comparisson to the battle of Midway is way off.
Also in TLJ is the answer to your question. The arms dealers on Canto Bight will sell to anyone. That is what took 3 years to mount the invasion of Europe (that and the US was fully engaged in the pacific front). The US had to build up to a full war footing from the post WWI limits. But the US started bombing raids within months. They escalated constantly until they even dropped the camouflage paint schemes. So the implication that the First Order can fully occupy the entire galaxy is an overreach. Again, it is Rey who says weeks and she doesn’t give specifics. We don’t know what she was told or by whom. Now if Leia had said that it would be concrete, but coming from Rey, it is not a statement I take at face value. Some major systems that aren’t likely to put up a fight are the likely first targets. But as of this movie, nothing has been captured by the First Order as yet. So the First Order, in WWII terms, has taken out the Maginot Line, but hasn’t conquered France yet. It is May 10, 1940 and we have until June 4 before the cause is lost. If the Americans had joined before Pearl Harbor, maybe the invasion could have been halted. That is where TLJ leaves us if you want to put it in WWII terms. Will Luke’s stand bring the allies to stop the First Order? There is still time. Otherwise you are right, it will be 4 years later, on June 6, 1944, that the battle to retake the French Republic begins. I think there is still a chance to stop the First Order. But also to put it in WWII terms, we lost France early, but we never lost Great Britain or Russia who put up a fight the entire time. So if they parallel WWII as you suggest, then the First Order only stands to take over a relatively small section of the fallen New Republic while the rest puts up a fight. The rest being the allies that Leia was hoping to hear from. Given that RJ was watching WWII movies, I wouldn’t be surprised if IX pics up days or weeks after TLJ or skips forward a few years. Depends on the level of conflict they want to dish out to the galaxy.