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The Force Awakens: Official Review Thread - ** SPOILERS ** — Page 77

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lpd said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

And people wouldn’t listen to me when I said the humans of the SW Galaxy were the descendants of Earthlings.

No. We are the descendants. This was a long time ago.

Pfft. The human fossil record begs to differ.

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darklordoftech said:

I definitely understand what you’re trying to say. In particular, I felt like the planets weren’t shown in a way that suspends your disbelief and makes you care about them.

You forgot to use the #sarcasm hashtag.

John Doom said:

I just noticed something: in TFA C3PO’s left arm is red, while the same one is rusty in AOTC. Was it a PT reference for the fans?

Bingowings said:

Maybe Rylo Ken stole Threepio’s old arm for his Vader shrine and was caught red handed.

In a “material not included in the film” YouTube video, I saw a panel from a TFA comic book that had Chewbacca tearing off 3P0’s arm, reason unspecified. Could be unrelated, but I find it likely that it is related to some deleted scene or unfilmed part of the script or something.

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cyclista said:

-the editing was wrong all over. I don’t mean the fades and transitions, as in they were awkward or jumpy, but the assembly of all the scenes as a whole. It felt like the team had created a whole lot of great individual components/parts, but then put them together in a way wherein the whole wasn’t balanced right. I can’t break it down scene by scene and say where each should rightly have gone to balance out better, I just have a really strong impression of this. The film felt kind of lumpy. Like, almost right, but then you look closer and the building has a door on the 5th floor exiting into open air with no balcony. Or you realize that person you’ve been talking to for ten minutes has no left ear.

Dialogue, costumes, characters, scenery, architecture, everything was accurate and great - in both form and spirit - just put together without a sense of cohesion. An alternative (and more generous) criticism might be to say that it was edited with a sense of composition that was abstract and unconventional, but even that wouldn’t serve, the scene ordering/structure just deviates from the wavelength of the OT. I think this is the real and only significant flaw in this entry in the series.

Does this assessment make sense for anyone else out there? I’m really struggling to articulate something that is elusive and subtle to me.

I believe that this is pertinent to the discussion: http://birthmoviesdeath.com/2015/12/28/star-wars-storytelling-and-fixing-it-in-post

You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite THE SHATTERED SWORD (Complete!)
The Force Awakens Restructured (V3 Released!) and The Starlight Project (WORKPRINT RELEASED!)

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cyclista said:

John Doom said:

I just noticed something: in TFA C3PO’s left arm is red, while the same one is rusty in AOTC. Was it a PT reference for the fans?

In a “material not included in the film” YouTube video, I saw a panel from a TFA comic book that had Chewbacca tearing off 3P0’s arm, reason unspecified. Could be unrelated, but I find it likely that it is related to some deleted scene or unfilmed part of the script or something.

This I know and it’s probably true from a story standpoint, but it could still be a PT reference behind-the-scenes.

The Original Trilogy’s Timeline Reconstruction: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Implied-starting-date-of-the-Empire-from-OT-dialogue/post/786201/#TopicPost786201

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cyclista said:

In a “material not included in the film” YouTube video, I saw a panel from a TFA comic book that had Chewbacca tearing off 3P0’s arm, reason unspecified. Could be unrelated, but I find it likely that it is related to some deleted scene or unfilmed part of the script or something.

I don’t know what the actual deal with this was in the script and with the deleted scenes, but I found it interesting that at the end of the film you can see C-3P0 waving with his newly restored golden left arm, and just a few feet away from him is another protocol droid who’s whole body is the same shade of red as 3P0’s arm in this film.

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NeverarGreat said:

I believe that this is pertinent to the discussion: http://birthmoviesdeath.com/2015/12/28/star-wars-storytelling-and-fixing-it-in-post

That article gives about my same critique, but with more substantiation. Thanks for the link. Now if only the author would point out more than merely Maz and Rey’s scene as a concrete example—!

DominicCobb said:

If anything that article goes to show how good the editing doctoring is.

fixed

But there is a lot of interesting observation here too. That article is definitely worth a read for perspective.

You know, I also enjoy reading commentaries like that about the difficulty of fixing things post production simply because of the utter finesse so many faneditors show - it can be fixed, guys.

I think Abrams probably just ran out of time, something faneditors often have [relatively] limitless amount of. As is often the case in creating something, being able to do something is one thing, being able to do it on time is another.

Faneditors often work alone and substitute enormous amounts of time for what would otherwise require an enormous budget. But there are margins between these extremes with gradients, and even an infinite budget, as we can see, might not magically sculpt what can only be achieved through an expense of time.

Not all currencies are accepted everywhere in the universe 😉

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Anchorhead said:
I’m at a loss as to why one gets a pass and one does not.

Hello from Germany,

i understand absolutely what you mean.
But these plot holes in the OT did not bother me at all the first time i saw the OT. The films were a completely new thing back in the days and everything in the OT was so damn remarkable that these failures did not disturbed anybody.

But if you make a (reboot-)sequel with nearly the same plot, it’s stupid to copy the plot-holes too.

The SW-fans are “trained” to see this failures. You make it once and nobody cares, make it again and everybody hates it. Better is to learn from failures.

Today SW is so much more than 1977 and with the EU everybody was forced to be accurate on the SW-Universe. I think if you want to make a proper SW-Sequel you have to be more accurate than in the OT.

Phil…

(sorry for bad english)

“LUKE… I’M SEEING HIM.
HE’S COMMANDING THE IMPERIAL FORCES… LIKE OUR FATHER!
I FEAR WE LOST HIM, HAN… I FEAR WE LOST EVERYTHING.”

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The Dark Empire said:
But if you make a sequel with nearly the same plot, it’s stupid to copy the plot-holes too.

The number of plot holes that are brought over from ANH to TFA are minimal though. Plus the bigger fuss was made about the contrivances whether they be from ANH or not. Which is kind of inane because every Star Wars film is saturated with plot contrivances .

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The truth is (and I apologize if I’m generalizing a bit here) most of us were kids when we saw the OT, so the “plot holes” and contrivances flew over our heads.

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DominicCobb said:

The truth is (and I apologize if I’m generalizing a bit here) most of us were kids when we saw the OT, so the “plot holes” and contrivances flew over our heads.

For my SW-experience that seems to be correct.
I can not find any connection to the PT or TFA… Or everething i have seen of Rogue One so far.
Maybe it is not possible for me to feel the same for SW now than i did as a kid.
The style of filmmaking today is to far away from what i like.

At a time i was so looking forward to see what these clone wars mentioned in the OT are.
Then came the PT… doh
But anyway, with the EU i thought that it was still possible to make great SW-stories.
At a time i was so damn looking forward to see a filmed version of the things happend in the EU after ROTJ. I love the EU after ROTJ.
And now THAT… Generally i am not amused about killing the canon.

So i think for me SW on film is episode 4-6 as usual standing alone (oh wait… the Ewok-films work great for my SW-universe as well). TFA is too close and at the same time too far away from the OT.

“LUKE… I’M SEEING HIM.
HE’S COMMANDING THE IMPERIAL FORCES… LIKE OUR FATHER!
I FEAR WE LOST HIM, HAN… I FEAR WE LOST EVERYTHING.”

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The Dark Empire said:
Or everething i have seen of Rogue One so far.

Which is barely anything aside from that picture with the cast in costume and a logo.

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And the little bit of the plot. I think i do not need a film that connects the PT and the OT.
Including a new interpetation of Vader or Tarkin or what ever. PT and OT are canon and so RO has not the freedom that JJ creates for TFA.

With Disney as creator this can only be a mess.

“LUKE… I’M SEEING HIM.
HE’S COMMANDING THE IMPERIAL FORCES… LIKE OUR FATHER!
I FEAR WE LOST HIM, HAN… I FEAR WE LOST EVERYTHING.”

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The Dark Empire said:

And the little bit of the plot.

That’s still not a lot considering we don’t how much Vader will be featured in the film. As it pertains to TFA I needed to see the 1st trailer before coming to any kind of assessment.

With Disney as creator this can only be a mess.

I think for at least the next 5 years it will be fine but when they really start to milk it is when it will all turn to shit.

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Some family friends saw TFA, and liked it a lot. They have not seen any of the other movies, so make of that what you will. One of them did ask me who the old guy was at the end. 😉

Now I have to decide whether to loan them the Puggo versions to bring them up to speed.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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The Dark Empire said:
I think for at least the next 5 years it will be fine but when they really start to milk it is when it will all turn to shit.

Yeah, I have a bad feeling that once the ST concludes everything will go downhill. I liked TFA enough to be fairly confident in the rest of the ST but after that I am terrified. Especially since Iger said that the movies will continue “forever”.

.

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suspiciouscoffee said:

The Dark Empire said:
I think for at least the next 5 years it will be fine but when they really start to milk it is when it will all turn to shit.

Yeah, I have a bad feeling that once the ST concludes everything will go downhill. I liked TFA enough to be fairly confident in the rest of the ST but after that I am terrified. Especially since Iger said that the movies will continue “forever”.

I’m okay with there being another trilogy IF the Dark Side prevails this time around.

I could care less about the spin off films to be honest even though I want a Vader film more than I want to see the ST conclude.

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suspiciouscoffee said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

lpd said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

And people wouldn’t listen to me when I said the humans of the SW Galaxy were the descendants of Earthlings.

No. We are the descendants. This was a long time ago.

Pfft. The human fossil record begs to differ.

not if aliens came in and banged our ancestors

Bah! Extraterrestials being genetically compatible with terrestrial life makes even less biological sense!

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TV’s Frink said:

Lord Haseo said:

I could care less about the spin off films to be honest even though I want a Vader film more than I want to see the ST conclude.

That means you do care, at least a little.

https://youtu.be/8Gv0H-vPoDc?t=65

About Vader? Sure but it wouldn’t matter if they made it a novel I still want a Vader story where he’s purging the remnants of the Jedi Order.

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Welp. I finally saw it a second time. I liked it the first time. I really liked it the second. This time I got to see it on a full three story high IMAX screen with newly upgraded dual projectors. At that size it’s almost like you’re in the movie. I saw so many little background characters and little details that I completely missed the first time.

There were of course still aspects of it that bothered me but for the most part I was able to just let it all go and enjoy the ride. Definitely deem it a worthy addition to the saga and here’s hoping VIII fills in the gaps.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Stepping softly in a danger zone…

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DuracellEnergizer said:

suspiciouscoffee said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

lpd said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

And people wouldn’t listen to me when I said the humans of the SW Galaxy were the descendants of Earthlings.

No. We are the descendants. This was a long time ago.

Pfft. The human fossil record begs to differ.

not if aliens came in and banged our ancestors

Bah! Extraterrestials being genetically compatible with terrestrial life makes even less biological sense!

Never said it made sense, just said that it is technically possible within a fictional universe

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