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The Final Order - A no Leia/Rey Nobody TROS edit by Spence (Completed) — Page 3

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omg that clip got me too

I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently.

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SpenceEdit said:

I’ve had a major breakthrough with the force bond duel. I can’t believe I didn’t think of it sooner.

This took hours, and is probably some of the best faneditor work I’ve ever done. Please take a look at the below clip and let me know what you think!

https://vimeo.com/694564040

🤣🤣🤦

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SpenceEdit said:

So, a serious update.

(by the way, the clip a few posts above this one was a fun April Fool’s joke, if you missed it.)

At this point I consider the edit “picture locked”, which in my head means I’ve got it where I want it and will not be making any further major changes. Everything from here on out is just tweaking things and fixing technical problems. I’ve got it in a good place, but some of the audio changes are challenging and require some more attention.

I’ve got some trusted eyes watching it this weekend that will likely find more problems I haven’t noticed, but I watched it from beginning to end yesterday on a big TV with very loud surround sound (my wife was out of the house so I could really crank it) and I’m very happy with how it has turned out.

So TL:DR, this should be released very soon, within the next two weeks or so. I’m very proud of it. I’m grateful for all the assistance and shared ideas that I was able to use. Big shoutout to all the amazing work on Ascendent that HAL9000 and all his contributors put into that edit, as it formed the basis of mine and brought in some incredible moments nobody would’ve thought could even exist.

There will be a big long list of thank you’s at the end of the credits for this one!

That’s some amazing news Spence, looking forward to seeing this edit😁👍

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Thanks Spence. I’m very much looking forward to this.

heil palpatine!

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So my understanding is that this edit removes all connection/backstory between Rey/Ochi/Palpatine? What does your version of the hangar scene looks like?

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Octorox said:

So my understanding is that this edit removes all connection/backstory between Rey/Ochi/Palpatine? What does your version of the hangar scene looks like?

I’m using RogueLeader’s version he created. The reveal is now that Palpatine saw a vision of Rey taking the Sith throne. The focus is now on her struggling with the dark side and Kylo struggling with the light.

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So there’s two things I’ve been wrestling with this whole time, and I’ve decided to put them back in.

  • C-3PO will exclaim “Oh, they fly now!” without Finn and Poe mimicking it. I think the initial line from 3PO is funny, but the other two don’t need to parrot it.

  • I’m gonna have Babu Frik pop up in the big battle. Honestly, it made me and everyone I was with laugh at the theater, and I still enjoy it.

A little humor never hurt anyone, right?

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SpenceEdit said:

So there’s two things I’ve been wrestling with this whole time, and I’ve decided to put them back in.

  • C-3PO will exclaim “Oh, they fly now!” without Finn and Poe mimicking it. I think the initial line from 3PO is funny, but the other two don’t need to parrot it.

  • I’m gonna have Babu Frik pop up in the big battle. Honestly, it made me and everyone I was with laugh at the theater, and I still enjoy it.

A little humor never hurt anyone, right?

Oh dude, with each of your posts here I get closer to the point where I just let my personal edit rest 😄
90 percent of your ideas correspond to my imagination (and the other 10 are better than mine)

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fidodido said:

Oh dude, with each of your posts here I get closer to the point where I just let my personal edit rest 😄
90 percent of your ideas correspond to my imagination (and the other 10 are better than mine)

Next time I render I’ll send it to you, we can compare and contrast!

Don’t let your edit rest, we need as many different, interesting versions of this movie as possible.

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This sounds like an awesome idea. Ascendant brought things much closer to what I’d consider to be the ideal version of this movie but some of the stuff that you’re talking about such as stripping out Leia and reining things in to be a little more intimate and a more thematically appropriate send-off to the Skywalker saga sounds really cool. What crippled Episode IX to me very much was how it was clear this was supposed to be Leia’s movie and how unfortunately Carrie Fisher’s passing not only I’d say messed up Trevorrow’s vision for the film but couple that with the rushed production with Abrams and the stubborn refusal to accept that this story just can’t be as much about Leia as it was supposed to be and it hampered this movie big time so this one I will definitely be keeping a close eye on.

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SpenceEdit said:

Next time I render I’ll send it to you, we can compare and contrast!

Don’t let your edit rest, we need as many different, interesting versions of this movie as possible.

That’s bloody generous of you! I would love to compare some of my takes on similar (or resembling) ideas like yours.

But don’t stress yourself too much, I’m a patient person and can wait for the final product 😉

Do you already have a complete cut list of all changes made/intended?

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 (Edited)

Sounds great! You definitely go further than I would in places, but anything that strengthens the focus on Rey and Kylo is doing the movie a favour IMO. I’d love to see your workprint when it’s done so I can continue to poach everyone else’s changes.

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You know I had the thought to do that way back, wasn’t sure if it’d work. Not bad!

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DominicCobb said:

You know I had the thought to do that way back, wasn’t sure if it’d work. Not bad!

I actually flipped the two shots after the 3PO shot since I rendered and it works better. Stating with that skiff and cutting to Poe makes the cut feel less sudden. Thanks!

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I’ve decided to add the 20th Century Fox logo and fanfare at the beginning of the movie. It just doesn’t feel Star Wars without it. I guess Disney owns Fox now so it’s not technically wrong!

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I love the idea of having the 20th Century Fox fanfare not just as a cute fanservice thing but also it kind of helps with this feeling like the end of this nine-part epic in a way by getting a reminder of where Star Wars came from. Question is though if you’re including the fanfare? Are you including the logo and if so? Will it be the 20th Century Fox or 20th Century Studios variant? Minor detail I know but it has sparked my curiosity.

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AspiringCreator said:

I love the idea of having the 20th Century Fox fanfare not just as a cute fanservice thing but also it kind of helps with this feeling like the end of this nine-part epic in a way by getting a reminder of where Star Wars came from. Question is though if you’re including the fanfare? Are you including the logo and if so? Will it be the 20th Century Fox or 20th Century Studios variant? Minor detail I know but it has sparked my curiosity.

It is the fanfare and logo from 4K83, no changes. I too like the idea of it being a throwback to the originals.

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SpenceEdit said:

AspiringCreator said:

I love the idea of having the 20th Century Fox fanfare not just as a cute fanservice thing but also it kind of helps with this feeling like the end of this nine-part epic in a way by getting a reminder of where Star Wars came from. Question is though if you’re including the fanfare? Are you including the logo and if so? Will it be the 20th Century Fox or 20th Century Studios variant? Minor detail I know but it has sparked my curiosity.

It is the fanfare and logo from 4K83, no changes. I too like the idea of it being a throwback to the originals.

Ahh… I see, kind of gives me vibes of when TCW’s four-part finale began with the old 70s Lucasfilm logo for both nostalgia and to really emphasize that it was an event. I dig it.

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 (Edited)

SpenceEdit said:

Time for some clips!

The Force Bond Duel
https://vimeo.com/696759375

The Death Star Fight
https://vimeo.com/696759509

Rey V Palpatine (lots of credit to bbghost on this one)
https://vimeo.com/696759576

The End
https://vimeo.com/696759536

This is some cool stuff! I’m surprised how convincingly this version of the Force Bond Duel sells, purely on Rey’s inner anger.

And making Kylo’s hesitance on the Death Star based on his connection with Rey, rather than Leia’s interference, makes the scene so much more personal. There’s a great sense of continuity there with the previous movie, and Rey being scared by her own actions is more believable without the distraction of Leia; Rey is confronted with the terrible realization that, in that moment at least, she has less self-control and more hatred than Kylo himself, and there’s no excuse for it.

As for Rey vs Palpatine, I find it interesting in how the theatrical version’s weakness has only become more pronounced after these fan edits. Jonh/HAL 9000’s of course was immediately well-received for being more fan-servicing, loosely addressing the unspoken issue of Palpatine’s immortality, and aiming to better satisfy as the ending of a 9-movie saga. But even going in the complete opposite direction, yours ends up more character-driven, personal, and in continuity with the trilogy’s greater arc of Rey’s self-validation (and reminds me just a bit of Duel of the Fates’s equivalent scene). With both extremes proving more effective, the original theatrical’s middle-ground option of “voices but not ghosts” just looks… weak, even though I didn’t dislike it on my initial viewing.

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 (Edited)

Neerb said:

SpenceEdit said:

Time for some clips!

The Force Bond Duel
https://vimeo.com/696759375

The Death Star Fight
https://vimeo.com/696759509

Rey V Palpatine (lots of credit to bbghost on this one)
https://vimeo.com/696759576

The End
https://vimeo.com/696759536

This is some cool stuff! I’m surprised how convincingly this version of the Force Bond Duel sells, purely on Rey’s inner anger.

And making Kylo’s hesitance on the Death Star based on his connection with Rey, rather than Leia’s interference, makes the scene so much more personal. There’s a great sense of continuity there with the previous movie, and Rey being scared by her own actions is more believable without the distraction of Leia; Rey is confronted with the terrible realization that, in that moment at least, she has less self-control and more hatred than Kylo himself, and there’s no excuse for it.

As for Rey vs Palpatine, I find it interesting in how the theatrical version’s weakness has only become more pronounced after these fan edits. Jonh/HAL 9000’s of course was immediately well-received for being more fan-servicing, loosely addressing the unspoken issue of Palpatine’s immortality, and aiming to better satisfy as the ending of a 9-movie saga. But even going in the complete opposite direction, yours ends up more character-driven, personal, and in continuity with the trilogy’s greater arc of Rey’s self-validation (and reminds me just a bit of Duel of the Fates’s equivalent scene). With both extremes proving more effective, the original theatrical’s middle-ground option of “voices but not ghosts” just looks… weak, even though I didn’t dislike it on my initial viewing.

Thank you for the feedback!

I truly believe this movie was maybe 2 more drafts away from being very good. The worst thing that happened to it was trying to hit the December release date. If they had given them 6 months longer to get it right, we’d be having very different conversations about it. There’s a ton of good ideas in it, but none of them really quite land.

I think that’s why the fanedits are so interesting. We are doing all of that noodling around that the creative team didn’t have time to do.

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 (Edited)

I truly believe this movie was maybe 2 more drafts away from being very good. The worst thing that happened to it was trying to hit the December release date. If they had given them 6 months longer to get it right, we’d be having very different conversations about it. There’s a ton of good ideas in it, but none of them really quite land.

Frankly I’m not sure why they didn’t borrow more from the Duel of the Fates script they already had (more than they already borrowed from it, that is). There were some elements in there that didn’t jive well, like the embracing-darkness “grey jedi” stuff, and of course Leia’s material would need to be minimized, but overall it did a much better job paying off character arcs and plot threads. And not just the threads of previous movies, but its own too; for example, TROS borrowed Lando’s thousand-ship-fleet and the life-essence-transfer stuff from DotF, but didn’t even try to set them up in a natural way (which DotF did). It’s all very baffling.

Anyways, for a final cut, I wonder if there’s a more subtle audio track you could use for Kylo’s moment on the Death Star. The Force Theme in your clip feels a bit… whimsical? Something a little more thematically specific to the scene might be ideal; maybe there’s something quieter from Rey & Kylo’s scenes together in TLJ, or an appropriate moment from “Ben’s theme” (the different-key Kylo’s Theme) if one exists. The little bit that plays during his death (around one minute into the track “Farewell”) comes to mind, especially since an angrier version of Kylo’s theme plays earlier in the Death Star scene. It’d be reusing music from the same movie, but it could be acceptable since the Death Star scene is, in a way, “Kylo Ren’s death scene.”

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Neerb said:
Anyways, for a final cut, I wonder if there’s a more subtle audio track you could use for Kylo’s moment on the Death Star. The Force Theme in your clip feels a bit… whimsical? Something a little more thematically specific to the scene might be ideal; maybe there’s something quieter from Rey & Kylo’s scenes together in TLJ, or an appropriate moment from “Ben’s theme” (the different-key Kylo’s Theme) if one exists. The little bit that plays during his death (around one minute into the track “Farewell”) comes to mind, especially since an angrier version of Kylo’s theme plays earlier in the Death Star scene. It’d be reusing music from the same movie, but it could be acceptable since the Death Star scene is, in a way, “Kylo Ren’s death scene.”

I did try a few options and I couldn’t get anything else to work quite right. If I could find a less triumphant version of the Ben Solo theme I might give it ago. I think I tried Farewell, but maybe I’ll have another look at it.

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Here’s a cool example of a small change making a big impact. Out of curiosity, I reversed the shot of R2 standing over Leia during her death scene, which makes the end of the shot the reveal of her limp hand. Small change, huge difference, and something I only thought of after staring at it for a month wondering why it wasn’t quite working.

https://vimeo.com/700838434

I’m hoping the fact that it’s raining upwards in the background isn’t too noticeable, because I absolutely love this change.