Sign In

The Empire Strikes Back "1980 Theatrical version" Reconstruction - Adywan (Released) — Page 10

Author
Time

I just got done burning this to dvd and watching it on my 50" plasma and it is just a stunning image. I watched the first 40 or so minutes. You have created another winner here. Lucas should be ashamed of what he put out to the public because you just hammered it home. Take that Lucas! Well done!

Author
Time

Chewtobacca said:

...it would be the first time anyone has successfully blent lower quality footage into higher quality footage ..

 

Blent?  Is that a word?

My outlook on life - we’re all on the Hindenburg anyway…no point fighting over the window seat.

Author
Time

Seconded.  Add it to the unofficial glossary.

Author
Time

Thank you, thank you Adywan.  This is just all kinds of wonderful.  I can now watch Empire without feeling 'unclean' as I do when I watch the SE.

For years now I have felt that the jammed in 'Vader goes to his ship' scenes have been overlooked as one of the most destructive of the SE changes.  What was the dramatic crux, and maybe the best paced and edited part of the entire entire trilogy, is just ruined.  The rhythm of it, the timing of the music (also maybe the best arc of music ever to grace a film), the very emotion of it is thrown out of whack.  Even a amateur film maker wouldn't make this mistake.

I'm glad to hear that you might try to do an HD upgrade of this.  Please give it a shot.  I would kill for that.

 

Author
Time

Wouldn't uprezing a standard def file have about the same effect as just upscaling from your player? Or was this downcoverted from an HD source in the first place?

The Secret History of Star Wars -- now available on Amazon.com!

"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

Author
Time

adywan said:

Created using the colour corrected ESB version used for my AVCHD '97 SE, elements of the GOUT and other higher quality elements to improve theatrical scenes eg. matte painting scans

Author
Time

Well, yes a large part of this was taken from an HD source (the master files for Adywan's AVCHD) and also a DVD player with upscaling function can hardly have the same hardware as a decent computer and the player has to upscale in miliseconds, computer will take much much longer (time depending on CPU) to do the upscaling even though it has more powerfull hardware, so using a decent software you're bound to have better results upscaling on a computer, than directly from a player.

Author
Time

A link to rapidshare would be greatly appreciated - Thanks!  I always get excited like a little kid again when there is something new to download from Adywan!!

Author
Time

zombie84 said:

Wouldn't uprezing a standard def file have about the same effect as just upscaling from your player? Or was this downcoverted from an HD source in the first place?

I used the 1080p master file that i used for the SE AVCHD and downscaled this to 480p.

Now unfortunately doing a HD version just won't work. Downscaling the 1080p colour corrected master to 720p still retains most of the detail, but upscaling the GOUT to 720p just really brings out just how bad the quality is when spliced in with 720p video. It just doesn't blend in at all. So the DVD version is all there will be, i'm afraid

ANH:REVISITED
ESB:REVISITED

DONATIONS TOWARDS MATERIALS FOR THE REVISITED SAGA

Author
Time

I just wanted to say, to Adywan:


Thank you, sir.  You've made me so happy. :)

Author
Time
 (Edited)

adywan said:

I used the 1080p master file that i used for the SE AVCHD and downscaled this to 480p.

Now unfortunately doing a HD version just won't work. Downscaling the 1080p colour corrected master to 720p still retains most of the detail, but upscaling the GOUT to 720p just really brings out just how bad the quality is when spliced in with 720p video. It just doesn't blend in at all. So the DVD version is all there will be, i'm afraid

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but IMHO as most people now have HDTVs, that means they will be watching this upscaled to HD anyway, only the quality of the upscale will be worse than if it was done in a computer. But I see your point, the LQ elements probably will stand out less, if the quality of the rest is also lower.

Well, thank you again for doing this, and thank you for trying to fulfil my request and I completely understand that you won't release something, if you're not satisfied with the results.

Oh, well, I'll have to do it myself, then :-) Especially in ESB, there are long sequences where nothing was changed exept for colour (like most of Hoth before the battle, the Yoda scenes, the carbon freezing chamber, the light sabre fight) and I'd feel kind of robbed watching them in SD knowing I could be watching the exact same sequence in higher res. I can just put the whole sequences that were changed in from the DVD and there should be a very few jumps from HD to SD.

I hope you see my point, I don't mind watching something that is better content-wise in lower quality (before the AVCHDs I mostly watched the GOUT) but I do mind watching something in LQ when I know I could be watching the exact same thing in HQ.

 

Author
Time
 (Edited)

adywan said:

Kurgan said:

Since this will apparently be the last version from Ady with blue-ties, I second the motion for "BT, MU, and RS uploads soon, pretty please." ;)

I will only be uploading it to newsgroups as i stay well clear of torrents. With it only being a DVD-5 the free giganews or other trials should be sufficient to grab this.

Well screw that (sides, how many free trials will it take to get every new fan edit/preservation that comes out?). I'll wait for the free megaupload or rapidshare uploads, much easier than giving them your cc # and having to cancel before the end of the "trial" just for one file.

 

I hope those aren't on your blacklist too... (and jdownloader makes it really easy) ;)

Author
Time
 (Edited)

only the quality of the upscale will be worse than if it was done in a computer


Not necessarily (or possibly not even most of the time) true - and even if it was, there would always be a noticeable difference in quality between the sources. ETA: which you already said.

DE

Author
Time

In my film THE FIXER, I had to upscale 4x3 letterboxed standard definition video to match the resolution of 16x9 video (long story as to why).  That alone is about 134% upscale, and it immediately begins to show softness and grain since everything's been magnified.  You can add a sharpen filter, but you're basically making a choice to either have soft image or a grainy one.  To upscale 640x480 interlaced footage to 16x9 720p, that's gonna get ugly.

-NJM

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Lord__Vader said:

adywan said:

I used the 1080p master file that i used for the SE AVCHD and downscaled this to 480p.

Now unfortunately doing a HD version just won't work. Downscaling the 1080p colour corrected master to 720p still retains most of the detail, but upscaling the GOUT to 720p just really brings out just how bad the quality is when spliced in with 720p video. It just doesn't blend in at all. So the DVD version is all there will be, i'm afraid

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but IMHO as most people now have HDTVs, that means they will be watching this upscaled to HD anyway, only the quality of the upscale will be worse than if it was done in a computer. But I see your point, the LQ elements probably will stand out less, if the quality of the rest is also lower.

 The problem is that his source is native HD for most the film, except for the OOT elements, which are SD Laserdisc, so its not the same as uprezing them both from the same standard, the way it would be if you took the 480 final DVD and uprezed it to 720, the film isn't on equal ground all the way through. Someone could take the DVD that currently exists and make an HD uprez, yes, but what was being discussed was using his actual source material, which is natively HD, and uprezing the GOUT patches so that the whole thing could be natively HD, if I understand it correctly. Instead, Adywan has done the opposite--the main source (an HD SE capture) has been downrezed to match the standard-def GOUT, because it is the only way to blur the inconsistencies between the two sources used. Shame, though. I think if he--or someone else--was really ambitious it could be done though. You would need to plug in some grain reduction and play around with the detail level, and treat more shots as VFX comps, but ESB was among the more subtle SE editions and I think it could be done, it would just require a lot more work.

The Secret History of Star Wars -- now available on Amazon.com!

"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Getting a theatrical version of ESB in HD would be a monumental effort I reckon.  Some of the shots are digitally altered e.g. Lando and Leia running through Cloud City.  These could be retouched to remove the SE effects.  Some shots don't exist in HD at all, e.g. parts of the Wampa's cave scene and when Lando announces the Imperial takeover of Cloud City.  These shots would be incredibly difficult to reconstruct in HD.  Moreover if you listen to Adywan's youtube interview he says that removing one of the rontos in Mos Eisley in ANH:R was one of the most painstaking changes he had to make.  So even any digital retouching would be hard work.

All things considered unless Mr Lucas releases the theatrical versions in Blu-Ray format I don't think we'll be seeing them in HD ever.  At least we have probably the best theatrical version of ESB on DVD right now.

Lord__Vader said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but IMHO as most people now have HDTVs, that means they will be watching this upscaled to HD anyway, only the quality of the upscale will be worse than if it was done in a computer. But I see your point, the LQ elements probably will stand out less, if the quality of the rest is also lower.

That's not a safe assumption, not everyone is loaded enough to be able to afford an HDTV.

Author
Time

Michalak, love that cover!  Especially the back.

A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em

Author
Time

Updated version #1:

And now, version #2:

BTW, you can just call me Nick.  I just use my full name for professional purposes.  Don't know why I chose to use it as my username here.

-NJM

Author
Time

Nick it is!  I don't think I've ever seen a cover that uses the McQuarrie art on the back like that, it's a nice yet simple design.

A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em

Author
Time

damn, now i have to choose between 2 awesome covers :)

Author
Time

I think McQuarrie's art is the unsung gem of Star Wars.  Without his brilliant imagination, who knows how different the look of the saga would've been.  I only wish I could track down the rest of the books these days.  I cherish my "Art of The Empire Strikes Back" book.  Brought with me to jury duty once.  I remember the day very vividly since a friend of mine dropped a bomb on me that day telling me he got his girlfriend pregnant.  Made me totally forget that I was intent on watching ESB that night.

-NJM

Author
Time
 (Edited)

I was watching this last night and Lando had just rescued Leia and company. They start heading after Boba Fett and, I kid you not, they were on the East Platform firing at Slave I when I realized I hadn't noticed the restoration of the Bespin hallways from a few shots before!  I immediately stopped and went back to the shots and I ran them, and ran them, and ran them! I was watching on a 47-inch widescreen 1080 display and I couldn't see ANY quality loss! I realized then that's why I didn't notice! And what's funnier, because those SE-hallways and vistas weren't there, I wasn't pulled out of the movie to notice anything!

I was watching MY Empire again! Without any grainy artifacting or soupy smearing colors. Nor the "TECHNICOLOR musical" color timing of the 2004 DVD!

This is absolutely BEAUTIFUL work my friend!  I've NEVER seen Empire look this good - EVER!!!! And I've watched it easily 200 or more times in my life! As I watched the Reconstruction, I was looking back at my history of watching Empire (as a few involuntary tears streamed down my face) I realized the last time I had seen Empire at a current home video standard was with the 1993 Definitive Laserdiscs I bought back in 1994. Even with that quality then, which was considered very good, the film had five sides on three discs so it was constantly being interrupted!  Before that, the only uninterrupted version I had was the CBS FOX VHS pan & scan video tape!

You really brought this film back to life!!!

I was watching the GOUT and Laserdiscs until this gem came my way. I just cannot stand the Lucas SE - I cannot wait to see your Empire Revisited man! You have the sensibilities in line with mine for Special Edition edits. I'm excited to soon see the Empire Revisted with the redone lightsabers!

I cannot thank you enough - there aren't words to describe what this means to me.

Oh, and Nick - seriously let me know when you're ready to post those covers - That second one is KILLER and exactly what I wanted for this disc.

Thanks!

"I turned it off! I don't wanna talk to her!"