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Terminator 3 T-HOPE Edition

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My first fanedit. I'm still busy with the final steps, the DVD menu, etc. But here's already a list of changes that my T3 fanedit will have.

Covers:
T3 T-HOPE Edition - Cover "limited edition" style (1,2 mb)
T3 T-HOPE Edition - Cover "endoskeleton" style (1,2 mb)


My T3 fan-edit will be a lot darker, more in T1's style. The T-X says not that much as in the official cut, and she's more like a cold blooded killer. Cheesy oneliners and other pathetic scenes (like the Elton John glasses and T-X's boobs) will be removed, making my fan-edit a lot darker and serious. The Sgt. Candy will be reinserted back into the movie, but without the Candy part (which is cheesy and I don't like the fact that CRS is already makes Endoskeletons).



Complete list:

Added footage (60,44 seconds):
- The T-850 grabbing the shotgun out of the truck at the vet.
- CRS promotional video. A nice reference to T2's Cyberdyne Systems. Sgt. Candy does not make his appearance. I didn't like the fact that they already were making the Endoskeletons in the present, this was supposed to happen in the future by SKYNET. And ofcourse the fact that Robert Brewster sees this video and does not refer to the T-850 as Sgt. Candy. Besides, thie video trims down the darker movie I wanted to edit.
- Scene of John and Kate dodging some flying piece of debris at Crystal Peak after the T-850 crashes in.
- Short clip of Kate screaming while pulling John away under the blast door while the T-X holds John's ankle.

Alternate footage (4.88 seconds):
- Some short alternate scenes of the T-850 firing his gun while holding the coffin.
- "She’ll be back” video-sequence from the first trailer, so it has more value.

Alternate audio (0,65 seconds):
- John Connor's intro narration. Instead of the line "When I was thirteen, they tried again." it's now "When I was a teen, they tried again." This is changed because John Connor was ten years old in T2, and not 13.
- Another audio change. "That was a different T-101." has now become "That was a different Terminator." Many people found the original line confusing, and looking at IMDb or any other forum, many people still have difficulties understanding it.

Deleted footage (197,40 seconds) :
- Removal of T-X’s line “I like this car.” A reference to T2's "Say, that's a nice bike," but it gets annoying because she says it again with police officer a scene later. Also T-X just kills, and doesn’t say unnecessary lines to insignificant persons. She’s a cold blooded killer now.
- Removal of the growing T-X’s breasts. In the T3 novelization it makes a bit sense, since she lures the cop with her breasts into an alley to kill him out of sight. However, since such a thing does not happen in the movie, this is just a very lame example of T-X morphing-abilities. She’s a cold blooded killer, not some cute sexrobot.
- Removal of T-X’s line “I like your gun.” As explained above. Now it is only hinted that the T-X will take the gun one way or another.
- Removal of T-850’s line “Now” when he moves forward to speak against the stripper’s hand. Pathetic scene in which is shown that the Terminator does not know human gestures. It’s an infiltration unit, so it should not bow over to literally talk to the hand.
- Removal of the pathetic Elton John sunglasses scene. Terminator just walks out of the bar, stands still a second (to take a look at the offscreen parked cards) and then we cut to Terminator slamming the window.
- Removal of T-850 synchrozing his internal clock with the watch. Although it's an awesome scene and idea, this sequence causes more confusion than it clears things up. The order of dates that appear is not chronological, so we are still left to guess which date is really is.
- T-X just goes into the driveby and shoots Jose without even asking his name or checking him via her TermoVision. She just brutally shoots without a known reason for the audience yet, just like in the first Terminator movie.
- Same goes for Bill Anderson. T-X arrives at his house and just slams him to the ground and shoots him. This is also more like the style of the first Terminator movie. Although we have seen the T-X connecting to some database, she is just killing unknown persons while we are left to guess why at the moment.
- Removal of T-X's sampling the cat lady's blood and her reaction "No." First of all, if it's the target the T-X is looking for, she wouldn't say "no" to herself but just continue looking for her target. Second, the T-X sampling someone's blood is shown in a scene later in which she samples John Connor's blood. Redunancy thus...
- Removal of T-X’s orgasmic reaction after sampling John’s blood. Wasn’t my comment about the T-X being some kind of cold blooded killing machine instead of robotic sextoy not enough?
- Kate doesn’t drop the keys, the T-X is right at her when she jumps in the Tundra. This makes the T-X a more dangerous Terminator than she was portrayed in the movie. Like one of the T3 tv spots says: "More intelligent, more powerful, more dangerous."
- Removal of the line “I lied.” T-850 needs the time to save John, so why bother having a conversation with Kate when you know that you will need all the time in the world to save the person you are programmed to protect.
- Removal of T-X double checking when she notices the T-850 is driving his firetruck next to her crane. She only looks one time at him, and makes her more menacing.
- Removal of T-850’s line “Excuse me” to the T-X, before striking his axe into her neck during the crane chase. Silly line, a Terminator would never say something like this in the heat of a battle. T-X just notices the Terminator now.
- Removed the pathetic lines:
John Connor: “So, she’s an anti-Terminator Terminator? You’ve got to be shitting me.”
T-850: “No, I am not shitting you.”
And you wonder why Terminator wasn't taken seriously...?
- Remove T-850’s second “Relax”. The T-850 looks so out of place with that movement. Kate’s screaming can be heard when the Tundra drives away from the explosion.
- Removal of "Talk to the hand." The Terminator just stares blankly at the guy.
- Removal of the T-850’s line “Don’t do that” after being shot in the mouth by Kate. It hints that the T-850 has a real personality (which also appears later in the movie, when he corrects John who calls him a robot instead of a cybernetic organism). And would a Terminator tell the one he should obey not to do something?
- Removed storyline of John and Kate’s children, or that Kate will even turn out to be John’s spouse. This romantic stuff has been trimmed down heavily. The only hints for a possible future relationship are the Mike Kripke's conversations and the couple hloding hands at the end of the movie.
- Removed Kate’s line “Do something” while the T-X attacks the hearse. Like if the Terminator doesn’t understand that his mission objectives are in danger and that he needs to act.
- Removed human pair bounding scene.
- Removed the T-850 correcting John after being called a robot instead of a cybernetic organism. Again, it looked like the Terminator had a personality and needed to stand up for his ego.
- Removal of short conversation about Kate's role in the future (being second-in-command and being John's spouse).
- Removal of Kate’s pathetic line “Just die you bitch,” during the particle accelerator escape. That line came suddenly out of nowhere, like Kate needed her own one-liner.
- In the CRS fight, the T-850 slams the T-X with some kind of gas canister, and she spins her head. I have removed that bit. It focusses a bit more on the action and not the T-X's "I'm far more superior than you"-look.
- Removal of John’s line “You can’t kill a human being, you said so yourself” during the desire scene. In the novelization, at the cemetery the T-850 tells John he can't kill humans. However, this is unknown to the movie watching audience, and removing this line makes the desire scene have more impact. The T-850 is more dangerous when it is unknown whether he can kill a human (John) or not, and this questions if John will survive the T-850 during the desire scene.



I'm busy with the DVD menu at the moment. I'm planning to have the next stuff on the DVD

DVD
1. teasing introduction clip that will play before the main menu will appear.
2. main menu:
- Play movie:
* With/Without marker (optional): marker will point out what was changed.
- Scene selection
- Alternate Scenes:
* "The New Stripper"
* "Cemetery Shootout"
- Info (info about fancut + thanks)


When I have more news, or when the DVD is finished, I will let you know.

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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Hot damn that sounds awesome. I'll definitely check it out when it's released.
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Nice.

I'm looking forward to checking this out. This is the kind of editing that T3 can benefit from and I've yet to watch any T3 fan-edits.

By the way, how do you create the awesome 3D metal effect for the text/logo on your custom covers? I have a personal project that could benefit from this type of effect on some things.

To contact me outside the forum, for trades and such my email address is my OT.com username @gmail.com

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This is the kind of T3 I'd love to see. I hated what they did with Terminator during T3.
F Scale score - 3.3333333333333335

You are disciplined but tolerant; a true American.

Pissing off Rob since August 2007.
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Originally posted by: klokwerk
Nice.

I'm looking forward to checking this out. This is the kind of editing that T3 can benefit from and I've yet to watch any T3 fan-edits.

By the way, how do you create the awesome 3D metal effect for the text/logo on your custom covers? I have a personal project that could benefit from this type of effect on some things.

The T3 logo is the official logo, I didn't do anything with it.
I made the "T-HOPE Edition" logo in Adobe Photoshop, with a chrome plug-in. I thought the plug-in set was called "eye candy". With this plug-in, you can add some various chrome looks to a layer (or font in this case).


Thanks guys for the nice words!!

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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Originally posted by: lordjedi
This is the kind of T3 I'd love to see. I hated what they did with Terminator during T3.

I feel the same way.
I can't wait to check this fan edit out.

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Thanks for the heads-up on eyecandy, maurice. I've got version 5 around here somewhere and I can install it with photoshop CS and fiddle around with the settings. I can't believe I haven't used photoshop plugins for that long.

To contact me outside the forum, for trades and such my email address is my OT.com username @gmail.com

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Wow, you removed about 3 minutes, and added about one, but the edit still sounds worth it lol!
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Originally posted by: DarthBalls1138
Wow, you removed about 3 minutes, and added about one, but the edit still sounds worth it lol!

lol, I know. I actually removed 3 minutes and added 1 minute. After editing the movie, I felt like I removed about 10 minutes or so. And then I discovered it were just 3 minutes. What are 3 minutes? Well, 3 minutes is the sum of all scenes that I didn't like to see and which I felt that should be removed to make the movie better


And klokwerk, good luck with the plugin!!

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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Well I had to sign up when I saw this coz I just did a T3 edit 1 week ago. Mine just removed about 4 minutes.

I removed any mention of being 13 years old, also removed the "sparkle glasses" in the same way mentioned above. I actually removed any reference to Mike Krypke's basement as i felt that 10 years old was a little young for this. It is still eluded to that they knew each other as kids but not elaborated on. It actually works quite well as it holds the tension between them for longer.
I removed the talk to the hand sequence with the stripper. It cuts straight from "Take off your clothes" to him walking outside dressed. It was also removed later at the garage (again in the same way previously posted).
When T101 is synchronising the time i cut it so we do not see it go past 2006 as it was supposed to have taken place 10 years after T2.
The cemetery scene was also edited so that Sarah's grave didn't have 1959-1997 as this is just not possible when she is 29 in 1995.

Its funny seeing some of the editing decisions that have been made by others here as I was toying with the same sort of further edits. But my approach was to simply enable the movie to fit with the other 2 films in the series (removing the ridiculous sunglasses scene was a must though!)

I still cannot understand why the continuity was stuffed up so badly in the first place!
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Okay, another update:

-- FanCut marker is added (subtitles), but the position in which the text is displayed does not please me, so I will have to adjust that.
-- Scene Selection is finished!!!
-- I want to change the DVD Menu layout, since I'm not happy with it.

So the major things are done, now it's only fine tuning.

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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looking forward to this. always thought this was a great movie, with a few groaners in it.

FE<3OT

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Thank you for doing this. I'm one of those people who will really enjoy this because I was for whatever reason satisfied with and dissapointed by the latest terminator movie. I guess I was satisfied that it wasn't all bad and had some sort of meaning, mostly at the end, but very dissapointed by some of the nonsense they did in the movie.

I guess I could be really hard on the movie because it proposes judgment day is inevitable completely undermining Cameron's story with its "no fate but we make for ourselves" theme. However some argue that that line can still be applied here in this film as we see john's resolve to "keep fighting" be realized and he doesn't know if there is a fate or not but I suppose he'll be fighting to make one. So in a way it still makes sense.

Anyway, thanks again for this. I'm sure I'll love this.
He big in nothing important in good elephant.

"Miss you, I will, Original Trilogy..."

"Your midichlorians are weak, Old man." -Darth Vader 2007 super deluxe extra special dipped in chocolate sauce edition.

http://prequelsstink.ytmnd.com/
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Okay, update:

I finished the complete DVD Sunday. But Monday I got 'an inspiration from heaven'. 3 more changes/cuts will be applied to my fanedit before it will be released public:
1. alternate intro; future war scenes are removed, instead there's another surprise while listening to John's intro narration. I'm not gonna spoil which surprise, but it will be awesome.

2. the conversation between John and Kate in the back of the van has been altered. Remarks like "jerky" or "what are you? som kind of gangmember" are completely removed, and have been replaced by a future war vision (future war footage from the original intro, that's why the intro has been changed).

3. conversation about Kate's first kiss has been removed. I missed this part while doing the first version of the cut.

So what's left to?
1. right now I'm editing the scenes, which is not the hardest work.
2. mixing new surround sound from scratch for 2 scenes, this will be a pain in the ass.
3. mix in the 2 new scenes in the final fanedit.

Sorry for the delay, but trust me, it will be worth it!!!!

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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Sounds awesome! I cant wait!
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About ±50% of the future war scenes re-appear somewhere else, it's not that they are completely gone, but now they have a purpose and they are not just some random future war scenes like they were in the official release.

And there's another future scene as opening. I didn't want to use footage from the other 2 movies, so I took this as opener. I won't say much about it right now, I just finished editing the intro. The sound editing is not perfect, but I am happy with it. There's a small error in the opening, but I just couldn't remove or replace it, so much I love that video.

One more last note about this opening, I used the song " JC Theme" from the official soundtrack. It's a song that I really love, and too bad it was not used in the official movie. Perhaps it doesn't do well as opening song, but I just love that song!

With this new intro, the alternate line "When I was a teen" has been removed, and most likely, the other alternate line "That was a different Terminator" will be switched back to "That was a different T-101," to fit the intro.

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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Originally posted by: maurice2029

And there's another future scene as opening. I didn't want to use footage from the other 2 movies, so I took this as opener. I won't say much about it right now, I just finished editing the intro. The sound editing is not perfect, but I am happy with it. There's a small error in the opening, but I just couldn't remove or replace it, so much I love that video.

One more last note about this opening, I used the song " JC Theme" from the official soundtrack. It's a song that I really love, and too bad it was not used in the official movie. Perhaps it doesn't do well as opening song, but I just love that song!

With this new intro, the alternate line "When I was a teen" has been removed, and most likely, the other alternate line "That was a different Terminator" will be switched back to "That was a different T-101," to fit the intro.


I will comment on my previous post about the opening:
- Error has been removed by editing the video.
- "JC Theme" has been replaced by "T3" (another song on the soundtrack that did not appear in the official movie). JC Theme is an emotional song, which just does not fit as opening song. T3 has more power and sounds more menacing, exactly what the new opening needs.
- "That was a different Terminator" will remain in the fanedit.

I'm working on the last scene now. 2 of 3 cuts are finished (opening and first kiss conversation). The video of the 3rd cut has been finished, I only have to complete the audio of that scene (a lot of work and time consuming). Then my fanedit will finally be ready!!

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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Hopefully my last post on this subject, and this baby should be finished.

Running time of official movie (PAL format): 01:44:40
Running time of my fanedit (PAL format): 01:40:18

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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It's ready. I'm finishing the cover today or tomorrow, and I'm gonna put it in a torrent.

Extra's:
- FANCUT MARKER
- 4 ALTERNATE SCENES
- INFO

More info asap.

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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I might have missed it, but will there me any ntsc conversion of this? Just picked up T3 today so I could pick up some fan edits and yours sounds really interesting.
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Well, I was so stubborn to create this release in PAL (hey, it's my first fanedit and I didn't know NTSC DVd players cannot play PAL video, here our PAL DVD players can play NTSC video).. However, when the PAL version is online, I will try to convert it to NTSC. Someone told me about a program which could convert from PAL to NTSC by adding invisible frames (PAL has 25 frames, NTSC 29,97). I still have to check it out, but I hope it won't be a lot of work. I hope that I can convert the original PAL MPEG2 files into NTSC MPEG2 files. If that's not the case, then I fear for the NTSC version, since I'm not planning to completely re-edit the whole movie again. I also hope with the encoding from PAL to NTSC, the audio won't jump out of synch with the video.

These are my biggest 2 fears for the NTSC project at the moment.

If the NTSC version will turn out to be impossible (or due bad encoding and other videoproblems), then my only relief is that people with NTSC can still view it on their computer. Yeah I know, watching movies on a computer sucks, but if it's the only option.....

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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Some NTSC players can play PAL content (mine can). I'm sure someone around here can give you help with an NTSC conversion if you need it.
F Scale score - 3.3333333333333335

You are disciplined but tolerant; a true American.

Pissing off Rob since August 2007.
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TYPICALLY the best way to convert PAL to NTSC is slowing the video down to 23.976 and using pulldown flags to 29.97. (The audio must be slowed down as well).

The problem is NTSC DVDs take up more space on a DVD (4% more). If you are near the limit of the DVD's capacity it may not fit.
Also, there is currently no automated software to do a complete DVD for you, only the movie (and quality will be questionable).

An important question is, is there speed up in the audio or did they pitch shift it?
If they pitch shifted it, when you slow the audio to match the video you will butch everyone up.

If you want to build the full DVD using your raw menus and converting to NTSC, doing it all manually is still your best way to go for the movie as well.

Don't be fooled by the few saying "I have a PAL player", PAL DVD players are damn hard to lay your hands on in the U.S.
Short of playing on a PC those of us over here will have difficulty watching your edit.

The steps:
Encode video with frame rate of 23.976 at 720x480.
Apply 23.976 -> 29.97 pulldown using DGPulldown.
Re-encode audio in BeSweet using the 25 -> 23,976 conversion option. (Assuming the audio was sped up and not shifted, this will bring the pitch back to it's original)
Rebuild the DVD.

You will need to do this for all video and audio content and re-author the DVD. You will not have sync problems doing this, I guarantee.



On another note, I'm curious if you've seen ADM's T3 edit and if that will influence any of your work.

Dr. M

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Originally posted by: Doctor M
TYPICALLY the best way to convert PAL to NTSC is slowing the video down to 23.976 and using pulldown flags to 29.97. (The audio must be slowed down as well).

The problem is NTSC DVDs take up more space on a DVD (4% more). If you are near the limit of the DVD's capacity it may not fit.
Also, there is currently no automated software to do a complete DVD for you, only the movie (and quality will be questionable).

An important question is, is there speed up in the audio or did they pitch shift it?
If they pitch shifted it, when you slow the audio to match the video you will butch everyone up.

If you want to build the full DVD using your raw menus and converting to NTSC, doing it all manually is still your best way to go for the movie as well.

Don't be fooled by the few saying "I have a PAL player", PAL DVD players are damn hard to lay your hands on in the U.S.
Short of playing on a PC those of us over here will have difficulty watching your edit.

The steps:
Encode video with frame rate of 23.976 at 720x480.
Apply 23.976 -> 29.97 pulldown using DGPulldown.
Re-encode audio in BeSweet using the 25 -> 23,976 conversion option. (Assuming the audio was sped up and not shifted, this will bring the pitch back to it's original)
Rebuild the DVD.

You will need to do this for all video and audio content and re-author the DVD. You will not have sync problems doing this, I guarantee.



On another note, I'm curious if you've seen ADM's T3 edit and if that will influence any of your work.

Boon23 once adviced me to use DGpulldown and change the framerate from 25 to 29.97 by implanting invisible half frames. But I'm not sure if he meant that I should use before creating the movie or afterwards. Anyway, I will try it out for the NTSC conversation. First I have to publish the PAL release.

About ADM's T3 edit, yes I have seen it. It was once of the first fanedits that I saw after the Phantom Edit (since I'm a big Terminator fan, I collect every Terminator fanedit that I can find). Actually, it was ADM's fanedit that inspired me to do my own edit. I give him proprs for editing some scenes, but somehow I felt I could better... meaning, removing things that he surprisingly didn't remove, like the Elton John glasses and Talk To The Hand. So I wrote down my list of changes (about 2 pages), and this is the result. Also, I thought the story of the lieutenants should be in it, since otherwise it would have the feeling "send back ANOTHER Terminator in ANOTHER attempt to kill John Connor." With the lieutenants plot intact, it's not this feeling. More like "since they couldn't find John Connor, they try to take out his army." At least not ANOTHER attempt to strike at John. So that's why my fanedit is still a lot different than ADM's.


About:
"Re-encode audio in BeSweet using the 25 -> 23,976 conversion option. (Assuming the audio was sped up and not shifted, this will bring the pitch back to it's original)"
I have AC3 (5.1 surround) sound for my movie. Can I re-encode this at once with BeSweet?

Same Make. Same Model. New Mission.

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The 25 to 29.97 trick is really pretty sweet, but I only use it on video that is natively 25 frames/sec.
If they pitchshifted the audio, it's really your only way to go (since correcting that rarely sounds good).

If they didn't pitchshift, that method will preserve the 4% speed up, which I consider the biggest flaw in most PAL conversions.
Which since you have to re-encode the video to 480 lines anyway, re-encoding the audio as well doesn't seem a huge effort.


To sum up:
If the audio is pitchshifted (that is the tonal quality lowered so people don't sound like they're sucking helium)
-Resize/reencode to 720x480 @ 25fps
-DGPulldown 25 to 29.97

If the whole thing was just sped up:
-Resize/reencode to 720x480 @ 23.976
-DGPulldown 23.976 to 29.97
-Re-encode audio 25 to 23.976

And yes, BeSweet can convert DD5.1. If you use the command line it's "-ac3enc( -b 448 -6ch ) -ota( -r 25000 23976 )".
You can find the option on most BeSweet GUIs too.

Dr. M