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Team Negative1 — Page 11

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Jetrell Fo said:

I apologized to you publicly. Please leave me out of your responses in regards to that matter.

True, and I apologize for bringing it up again. It’s easy to slip into old habits. 😉

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TV’s Frink said:

Jetrell Fo said:

I apologized to you publicly. Please leave me out of your responses in regards to that matter.

True, and I apologize for bringing it up again. It’s easy to slip into old habits. 😉

I understand and I thank you

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Jetrell Fo said:

Is the evidence of the accusers going to be presented openly as williarob has done or is that evidence in some off limits state at this point?

Let’s be conservative with the use of the word “evidence”.

Williarob has one perspective. Other perspectives have been presented that differ from his. Little hard “evidence” besides clips of e-mails and chat transcripts have been made available, none of which is concrete evidence of anything. Based on the sources we have at this point and the trust we place in them, we believe the ban of TN1’s team account is justified.

I’m sorry that your trust in us is shaken, but if the years we’ve spent maintaining this community haven’t been enough to shore up that trust so it can withstand times like these, I’m afraid we never really had it to begin with and I’m not going to try to sell you on our intentions now.

Stinky-Dinkins said:

I wish it wasn’t though. It seems like all this multiple account drama has eclipsed the prospect of a potentially killer Technicolor release that has now inexplicably been halted. I know this is the Team Negative 1 thread/announcement and everything, but in terms of relative importance it seems like absolutely nothing compared to the loss of what would’ve been one of the most important fan preservations of all time. I don’t know if it’s a case of tragic irony or not seeing the forest for the trees… but the fact that here we sit on a forum you created dedicated to preserving the films in the purest ways possible and on the cusp of a public release of the Tecnicolor scan everyone’s always dreamed of, suddenly everyone is distracted by inconsequential e-drama nonsense.

Let me be clear about one thing: the goal of this site has always been, and will continue to be, the availability of a legitimate, legal release of the restored original trilogy – one that compensates the artists and owners of the original work and is widely available to the public without having to dig around the dark corners of the web to find it and risk being ratted out by their ISP and sued into oblivion.

If anyone is under the impression that TN1’s efforts represent the culmination of our goals as a community, they are mistaken.

Is their work awesome? Yes.

Is it the end game? No.

I’d like to see all parties involved hash this out and come to an understanding so they can work together to get us where we need to be. That’s why we built a community around this cause…so we can work together.

Again, anyone on TN1 is welcome to participate here using their own accounts. The fact that this thread is still open and visible should lend some credibility to our position. It would be very easy to make all this go away with a few mouse clicks.

Forum Administrator

MTFBWY…A

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So their unethical status was based on a perspective Jay, and not real evidence?

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Jay said:
If anyone is under the impression that TN1’s efforts represent the culmination of our goals as a community, they are mistaken.

Is their work awesome? Yes.

Is it the end game? No.

No one think it’s the culmination of all the community’s goals (especially considering it’s the first film only), but we’re talking about a killer Technicolor scan here. It would be unprecedented among releases thus far. To suddenly call it quits on the project for no clear reason seems absolutely nuts to me. It would’ve absolutely been one of the most important and valuable preservations of all time.

Harrison Ford Has Pretty Much Given Up on His Son. Here's Why

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Stinky-Dinkins said:

To suddenly call it quits on the project for no clear reason seems absolutely nuts to me. It would’ve absolutely been one of the most important and valuable preservations of all time.

You’ll need to take that up with TN1. I only banned their account; I don’t run the team.

Jetrell Fo said:

So their unethical status was based on a perspective Jay, and not real evidence?

I’m guessing you did well in high school debate class.

Every law on the books today is based on someone’s perspective. From our perspective and the perspective of members we trust most, we believe TN1’s actions were not in the best interest of the community. They’re free to weigh in with their perspectives, as I said.

If that doesn’t meet your personal standard, you’re free to resume the forum vacation you never actually went on.

Forum Administrator

MTFBWY…A

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Jay said:

Stinky-Dinkins said:

To suddenly call it quits on the project for no clear reason seems absolutely nuts to me. It would’ve absolutely been one of the most important and valuable preservations of all time.

You’ll need to take that up with TN1. I only banned their account; I don’t run the team.

Jetrell Fo said:

So their unethical status was based on a perspective Jay, and not real evidence?

I’m guessing you did well in high school debate class.

Every law on the books today is based on someone’s perspective. From our perspective and the perspective of members we trust most, we believe TN1’s actions were not in the best interest of the community. They’re free to weigh in with their perspectives, as I said.

If that doesn’t meet your personal standard, you’re free to resume the forum vacation you never actually went on.

Not in the best interest and unethical means are two separate things. You also gave me some comment about trust but now you say trust is at stake here. More confusion. Also though I appreciate your concern over my temp forum vacation, as nicely as it was stated, I did not get the impression that you were being nice, just diplomatic.

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Jay said:

Jetrell Fo said:

So their unethical status was based on a perspective Jay, and not real evidence?

I’m guessing you did well in high school debate class.

No fair, I used that line on him first. I want a mention in the thread credits.

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Ah, lots to think about. It is really hard to judge in these matters. It is my experience that you have to trust the site moderators to make wise decisions. I’d had to be privy to a great deal of information on both sides of this to have any idea if justice has been served, but I put my trust in Jay to make the right decisions and to weight the facts as he sees them.

A couple of side points to some comments in the preceding 11 pages:

The holy grail for A New Hope is not the original negative, but the 3 color separation master. I understand it had aged badly in that it had suffered some warping. In this day and age that is nothing significant, but back in 1997, that was a serious issue. These days they can do a digital restoration of a even warped 3 color separation and produce a flawless digital copy. It has been done so many times that I won’t bore you with examples you can pickup on blu-ray.

Who owns a film print? Well, legally the studio probably does. However, in the practical world of collecting, a studio’s right don’t even enter the picture. Possession dictates ownership and nothing else. Who owns a scan of such a print can be dicey. Is it the owner of the print, the owner of the print at the time of the scan, or the person who paid for the scan and is in possession of the scan? Opinions will differ and if someone feels ownership of all scans of a print they own it is really hard to argue with that. I agree that the best course is for a new scan to be made where the owner of the print knows who has the scan and what the intended use is.

What saddens me is that this has happened before the TESB scan was released. But as of right now, a scan of the full Original Trilogy is in the wild, so I am partially satisfied.

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TV’s Frink said:

Jay said:

Jetrell Fo said:

So their unethical status was based on a perspective Jay, and not real evidence?

I’m guessing you did well in high school debate class.

No fair, I used that line on him first. I want a mention in the thread credits.

Lol @ Frink. Now. not that it matters. but I did fairly well in math and ethics too. I know two wrongs don’t make a right.

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Jetrell Fo said:

Not in the best interest and unethical means are two separate things.

I stand by the language in my original post.

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MTFBWY…A

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For all interested (especially Stinky) I will say this: scans of other 35mm IB Technicolor prints exist and at least one non-TN1 team is in the process of booting up to start restoration work. It will likely be worked on last (since it’s the least endangered of the three from a preservation POV), but it will get worked on.

No names; no threads; no team accounts; no updates; no credits; no interviews; no deadlines; no guarantees except that the scans will get passed on if the team falls apart or loses interest or spontaneously combusts.

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3

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Jay said:

Jetrell Fo said:

Not in the best interest and unethical means are two separate things.

I stand by the language in my original post.

Well then, the future of things lay in your hands and it’s a big gamble to take… for the sake of the community, I, for one, hope your right.

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Hello, everyone -

I have made a video for you, so that you may have all the facts and straight from the horse’s mouth. That goes for you, too, Rob, because you keep geting stuck in the middle and it’s painful to watch. Go and view the video, and let us talk about this no more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkiqQq6KfDY

Additionally, I will be on my usual Ustream live-stream channel for a couple hours or so if you’d like to ask any questions or whatever, at ustream.tv/channel/mike-verta

Thanks everyone!

_Mike

View the Restoration and join the discussion at StarWarsLegacy.com!

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Thanks Mike. Looking forward to listening to that in a few hours when I have a chance.

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Edit: it isn’t worth it

And in the time of greatest despair, there shall come a savior, and he shall be known as the Son of the Suns.

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mverta said:

Hello, everyone -

I have made a video for you, so that you may have all the facts and straight from the horse’s mouth. That goes for you, too, Rob, because you keep geting stuck in the middle and it’s painful to watch. Go and view the video, and let us talk about this no more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkiqQq6KfDY

Additionally, I will be on my usual Ustream live-stream channel for a couple hours or so if you’d like to ask any questions or whatever, at ustream.tv/channel/mike-verta

Thanks everyone!

_Mike

Nutshell: “Joe” funded the scanning of his own print, in contribution to the Legacy project, and received a copy. No agreement was reached as to what he could do or not do with this copy. Later, “Joe” also funded the scanning of “Pete’s” print and was sent a copy of that as well, under the agreement that he not distribute that particular copy under any circumstance. At this point Joe has contributed several tens of thousands of dollars to the project. He then sent -1 a copy of the scans of Pete’s prints, despite agreeing not to do so. These particular scans [and not the scans of Joe’s print] were then used by -1 once work began on their Technicolor project.

So, was -1 aware that Joe had previously agreed not to disseminate Pete’s print under any circumstance? Do you have any problem with -1 using a copy of Joe’s print?

Harrison Ford Has Pretty Much Given Up on His Son. Here's Why

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Stinky-Dinkins said:

So, was -1 aware that Joe had previously agreed not to disseminate Pete’s print under any circumstance?

I literally was just about to ask this myself, as it seems like it’s the main issue here. If -1 was not aware, it’s hard to blame him along with Joe.

It’s also hard to believe Mike would be this pissed at -1 if the answer was “no.”

The other question I have is how -1 found out about Joe’s scan of Pete’s print, which may also help answer the question of if -1 knew Joe was not supposed to distribute the scan.

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Stinky-Dinkins said:

So, was -1 aware that Joe had previously agreed not to disseminate Pete’s print under any circumstance? Do you have any problem with -1 using a copy of Joe’s print?

“… and err fuck Negative One also in case that hasn’t been said, fuck you. What an asshole.” - I think that quote should tell you all you need to know.

The video seems to indicate there was no explicit agreement in place that Joe wouldn’t share the scan of his own print, further as the print belonged to Joe in the first place and the scan & drives were paid for by Joe, in the absence of such an explicit agreement between Joe and Mike I see no problem in Joe sharing the scan of his own print with anyone.

TV’s Frink said:

I literally was just about to ask this myself, as it seems like it’s the main issue here. If -1 was not aware, it’s hard to blame him along with Joe.

Agreed, if Negative One knew then he’s complicit and deserves to be punished, otherwise he’s an injured party just like Mike & Pete.

As the scan acquired by Team Negative One was the better scan belonging to Pete, which Joe had agreed not to share I now agree with the Team’s decision to halt work and not proceed with this project as Pete clearly doesn’t give his permission for anyone else to have a copy let alone use it in a project and then release it into the public domain.

Original Trilogy in Replica Technicolor Project
Star Wars PAL LaserDisc Project

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mverta said:

Hello, everyone -

I have made a video for you, so that you may have all the facts and straight from the horse’s mouth. That goes for you, too, Rob, because you keep geting stuck in the middle and it’s painful to watch. Go and view the video, and let us talk about this no more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkiqQq6KfDY

Additionally, I will be on my usual Ustream live-stream channel for a couple hours or so if you’d like to ask any questions or whatever, at ustream.tv/channel/mike-verta

Thanks everyone!

_Mike

Yep, here I am stuck in the middle again. You see that’s my problem - I always believe the best about people. Perhaps Mike had it right all along:

[6/14/2014 8:25:31 PM] Mike Verta: People suck.

Still, at least it sounds like I made the right decision with regard to not proceeding with the restoration based on this scan.

http://www.thestarwarstrilogy.com

http://www.the007dossier.com

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People definitely suck, the trick in all things is figuring out who sucks the least. 😉

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Thank you, Mike, for taking to time to explain things from your point of view. It seems to more or less corroborate what the other side was saying, but there is still the question of whether -1 knew that the print they had was not allowed to go out in the public. You are justified in feeling angry at “Joe” and I’m sorry that he betrayed that trust.

However, I disagree with your view on the “Silver Screen Release” which was never supposed to be a professional restoration and it is unfair to knock them down. I see it as a group of fans, doing their best to clean up a beat-up print and present it as-is.

What’s the internal temperature of a TaunTaun? Luke warm.

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As I said specifically, I don’t care that Joe shared his prints. It’s was Pete’s, which he was explicitly told not to, that’s wrong. As for -1 knowing? I have no idea. However, know he knows, so the question is: Did he pull it off the market himself? 'Cause that’s the litmus test. If you buy stolen speakers unknowingly, you can be forgiven. But once you learn that, if you keep them anyway? Wouldn’t teach my kid that.

As for the “fuck you,” that for being ungrateful and shitty, even after I helped them out. As for their edition looking amateur and pretty shitty, it does. So what?

_Mike

View the Restoration and join the discussion at StarWarsLegacy.com!